Given the recent crash of the 737-MAX and a few airlines grounding them again, I was wondering if you guys thought it was safe to travel in?
The original crashes and grounding coupled with recent events has me on edge.
I have a flight booked on one for VA in a few weeks and was considering canceling it given what’s transpired.
The FAA on Saturday had ordered all Boeing 737 Max 9 aircraft to be grounded until they are carefully inspected.
Inspection takes 4-8 hours and will be a huge priority to the operators. It will be a schedule glitch for less than a week at a guess.
No 737max crashed recently.
One had a go-bad however
That what happens when the accountants run a highly technical engineering / manufacturing company (re; MDD and Boeing merger back in the day, theres a good doco about it all)
I voted no because I can’t fly any type of plane.
It would probably be my last choice of aircraft from the Boeing/Airbus options. But would still fly one.
I'd love to fly a B737 MAX but a Jabiru J170D is more suitable for my level of piloting skills.
I bet the Boeing C suite don't get about in a MAX.
the Max is obviously a seriously flawed design, having said that you are still more likely to be killed in the car on the way to the airport than in the plane itself.
You’re statistically very unlikely to die regardless of what plane you fly on, but it doesn’t take a genius to read a few articles about the behaviour of engineers and executives at Boeing designing their new plane, and whilst 2 of them crashed and killed hundreds, to question how much corporate rot is going on in that company.
ill go with an a380 coz bigger planes have a sense of security, on a side note who watched society of the snow on netflix, meat was definitely on the menu..
Would you trust a CHINESE airbag or ABS system?
Chinese ABS system
I guess i have to if others decide to use them on the roads.
The takata airbags which killed people were Japanese.
Chinese, Japanese. Same same. Rice is rice.
hehe never, I always try to fly on Airbus, only flying Boeing unless there is other choice (mostly for Domestic).
Until recently I have only been on a single Boeing flight, which was a Emirates 777. But had to fly 3 domestic 737 (not max) then :/
I'm surprised people even check what plane they're going to be on.
I just rock up to the airport and jump on.. if it was anywhere near inherently risky it would be a lot more obvious.
If you're scared of being on one of these planes then I hope to God you're not driving any car as cars will be significantly less safe.
I always check what plane I am on, nothing to do with safety though, the seating configurations differ and for any longer flight I try to position myself in the best possible seats (tall and wide shoulders). sometimes I choose different flights simply to get the better seat.
What are you on about? The Max 8 issues were software related and from memory Boieng being too cheap to pay for training for pilot's or other but they eventually had to fix the Trim software and that is now compliant worldwide, was crap but it's done now. Certainly was a boardroom error not engineer or design and the loss of life should have hit the execs harder, we all know how that tends to go though. The Max 9 fleet I know don't much on, but so far its grounded worldwide until root cause is confirmed. When they do this, it's a good thing. They literally stop flying and determine the issue and rectify/ remedy it thus potentially making the entire frame design safer…
The software issue arose because of the poor design. The Max was a rushed design utilising old body to stop Airbus stealing all their sales as they could not design and build a new plane fast enough to compete and hence it had to have changes to compensate for the now poorly balanced plane after the larger engines were mounted.
Ultimatley though they knew this prior and could have issued training to all pilots but made a board choice not too due to cost. Also the rush and stagnation of new designs was exec. mismanagment, don't try and call it anything else.
of course, it was also a FAA failure for allowing it, it was also a design issue for an engineer to come up with this as a viable idea.
I'm really surprised they didn't just change the name when they had all the issues a while back (and release it as a "new model").
that was the point, it was to mitigate re training and endorsements
Err, it didn't crash. All -passengers and crew safe.
Where did you get that idea from?
Well the plug certainly crashed. Don’t think it’s normally supposed to do that.
Surely having a door plug blow out, and at a low altitude, reflects a lack of care, standards and competency within the company (installation by Boeing).
I think because the issue happened on US territory coupled with its patchy history you can be fairly certain Boeing/FAA/NTSB and other will get to the bottom of the issue this time in a prompt manner.
Their reputation is on the line and every time an incident like this occurs, its nothing more than free advertising for Airbus.
Did you hear about the Alaskan Airline pilot who was told he had blown a seal?
Turned out he'd just eaten an icecream.
The 737 is one of the most modded and mutilated airframes around.
I've flown B737 Classic, NG's and BBJ's. The NG should have been a more modern aircraft, but they needed specific commonality with the Classic to make the type rating cross-compatible. Something to do with an American Airlines request.
The BBJ 1 and BBJ 2 were just different modded NG's.
The BBJ 1 had a 737-700 body with an 800 wing. More fuel tanks, less luggage and bigger engines. Flew almost the same just a little harder to land in cross winds.
The BBJ 2 was pretty clunky. We had one that the owners glammed up the interior so heavily that it couldn't make Dubai to Morrocco in one leg. Most of our BBJ 1's could fly 15 hours but were still equipped with standard shorthaul config for the crew. Wasn't comfy at all.
Despite everything I think they're great as long as you have a properly trained crew. I used to do a lot of sim training, and the differences in countries and airlines are phenomenal.
TLDR:
Don't worry about the 737MAX, worry about a reputable airline and their training standards. That's where the danger is
Heard in recent news that none of the Australian airlines use this plane model. Someone confirms this?
Technically correct - no 737-MAX 9s are in use in Australia, though there are quite a few MAX 8s care of Virgin and Bonza.
we are so blessed to have so many aircraft manufacturing gurus on this forum what a coincidence they are all here
I'm more interested in what the person thought when they saw a 737-Max Door Plug crash-land in their backyard and what transpired after it crash landed.
I'm sure that's a core memory for that home-owner and a good story to tell around the campfire. I wonder if that home-owner got a 'Sorry for the Airplane Door Plug in your backyard' with monetary compensation.
Bob is a legend. Be like Bob.
No. I dont have a pilots licence.
boeing is really dodgy, They have been cutting corners and risking people lives. They prefer profits over safety, so would not recommend boeing. Talk about door being blown off mid flight https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/what-to-know-about-boein… and Mcas system which controls the plane, even after pilot taking over the plane controls manually, Mcas system override any adjustment made by pilot and this caused nosedive and extremely horrific crash.
The specific issue with the emergency exit plug doesn't concern me. However, I think the greed, rot, and incompetence of the Boeing organisation has and will continue to affect the quality of their products.
That said, even if you're 2, 5, or 10 times more likely to die due to mechanical failure or design flaw on a Boeing aircraft, that only translates to a small change in the chance of being involved in an incident of any kind (since most are caused by other factors). So it might be something like, 1/100,000,000 versus 1.5/100,000,000. We take far bigger risks for everyday convenience, so I don't see myself going out of my way to avoid flying Boeing.
As opposed to flying on a Chairbus or a Russian ground seeking missile?
737-max is a key lesson in giving safety in design too much control.
When a plane's computer wrestles with the operator for control you know you've gone too far.
Safety is the new PC, has to go too far before we dial it back.
When a plane's computer wrestles with the operator for control you know you've gone too far.
just look at a multitude of reasons why Airbus's have crashed
This is just wrong. Regardless of what you think about safety in a workplace setting, the 737 MAX absolutely was not a case of safety too far. MCAS existed because without it pilots could end up in a situation where they had no control over the aircraft. It was safety related corner cutting with respect to this system that caused the accidents.
Another good example is their refusal to develop an ECAM/EICAS style system on 737 MAX. A system proven to significantly improve safety outcomes - left out as a pure cost saving measure.
What a stupid question. Off course I would, and going by the poll it seems like the majority is in agreement. Surely everyone knows by now that the aviation sector is the safest means of transport…this little fact gets quoted over and over again. The rigours that nearly every plane goes through in maintenance in testing is almost insurmountable. Nothing in life is a 100% effective, but we are getting dam close to it in various engineering fields. Grounding a fleet as in this case is pretty standard until FTSB understands and rules what extenuating circumstances where present at time of the accident. It is just a further safety precaution.
I waste enough time searching for the best fares, the shortest connection, comfortable seats and decent food/service.
If I also have to exclude 737s, that will make my life too difficult.
"If it's Not Boeing I'm Not Going."
“This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys.”
Having watched the documentary Downfall about the 737 Max 8, it's development and it's disastrous MCAS system that killed hundreds of people it's a no from me. While the MCAS system is now fixed the corporate culture behind it was pretty horrifying. Some Boeing exec's should have gone to jail for some of the shit they pulled.
We are beta tester for Boeing.
This is scary -
News:
“United Airlines has confirmed that it has found loose bolts and other issues affecting emergency exit door plugs on at least five Boeing 737 MAX 9 aircraft in its fleet after it began FAA-mandated inspections following a blowout on Alaska Airlines flight 1282 on Friday evening.”
The Chicago-based carrier only began properly inspecting the 79 grounded 737-9 aeroplanes in its fleet on Monday after Boeing finally released a so-called ‘Multi-Operator Message’ which outlines what inspection process affected airlines must carry out to ensure the exit plug is installed correctly.
Shortly after industry publication, the Air Current revealed that United discovered potential issues on five of its 737-9s. United said in a statement that it had “found instances that appear to relate to installation issues in the door plug”.
The airline said examples of these issues include “bolts that needed additional tightening.”
“These findings will be remedied by our Tech Ops team to safely return the aircraft to service,” a United spokesperson explained.
United canceled at least 200 flights due to be operated by its grounded 737-9 fleet on Monday, and the embattled carrier has already proactively axed 121 flights on Tuesday, although further cancellations are expected to be announced in the coming hours.
Alaska Airlines is yet to begin the inspection process of its ground 737-9s and it is still too early to tell whether issues on other grounded aircraft at both United and Alaska will be discovered in the days ahead.”
Source: PYOK website
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12982275/Terrifying…
'Mayday, mayday, we have an engine fire': Moment Atlas Air pilot frantically requests clearance to land as flames shoot from Boeing 747 jet after Miami take-off - as inspectors 'find softball size hole' above engine
Only if the tickets were cheaper
737MAX-RISK
The Boeing CEO has acknowledged.. was thier fault with the doors.
So…. I guess there'll be a software patch to tighten the bolts? /s
They are tightening their procedures though.
No, I'm not a pilot.
That's a shame, would love to see some dashcam footage.
My take on this is not whether you will fly on a MAX.
Will you fly on a new BOEING jet? Because god knows t hat their 787 QA have also been not the greatest for years well before any of the MAX debacle and their constant delays in delivery for 787s is because they keep finding new problems they have to rectify.
If you're ok with flying new BOEING jets in general, then there shouldn't be anything stopping you flying the MAX.
Yet another.
Even the one they sold to the US government isn't any good.
https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/17/business/sec-of-state-ant…
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12982275/Terrifying…
'Mayday, mayday, we have an engine fire': Moment Atlas Air pilot frantically requests clearance to land as flames shoot from Boeing 747 jet after Miami take-off - as inspectors 'find softball size hole' above engine
Are 737-800 the same with 737-Max ? If not, are 737-800's safety records any better than the 737-Max that's been copping a fair bit lately?
Boeing built a whole new factory for the MAX in another state to avoid union labour/lower production cost.
Local labour force is largely unskilled/inexperienced apart from supervisors with tight schedules.
Yeah, nah I wouldn’t be found dead in one.
Dreamliners are made in both factories. The good one in Washington state and the other one where unions are banned and unskilled workers put together the planes.