Ford Dealer Not Refunding Deposit

Lmomuncher on 22/01/2024 - 22:36
Last edited 01/02/2024 - 14:28 by 1 other user

Hi everyone, wanting some thoughts/suggestions on what to do in my situation please.

I basically signed a contract and paid a deposit to get in line for the new generation Ford Ranger in January 2022. The contract was prepared based on indicative pricing as Ford Australia has not confirmed pricing at that point. The contract even had a condition saying that "pricing not yet confirmed, indicative pricing only and will be clarified once known".

More than a year goes by and I hear nothing from the dealer with any updates about the car. At that point, my financial situation had changed slightly and I ultimately decided I wouldn't go ahead with the purchase. So, in April 2023 I emailed the dealer stating that I wouldn't go ahead with the purchase and to please refund the deposit.

The contract had an estimated delivery date of October 2022, and it was now April 2023 and no word of the car arriving at the dealer. So I exercised my right as per point 2.3 of the terms of the contract where it says:

"If the Dealer has not delivered the motor vehicle to the Purchaser within thirty (30) days of the estimated delivery date, the purchaser may by notice in writing to the Dealer rescind this Contract."

I hear nothing from the dealer for several months even after regular follow up emails. Then finally in November 2023 they reply with the following:

"…you have 2 options re this contract.

1, Take delivery of your Wildtrak when it arrives with the new 2024 pricing

2 Pay the 8% as per page 2 section 5 of your first contract date 21/01/2022 Amount owing $6700.00.

3, Your deposit will not be refunded as per the contract terms and conditions."

I directed them to point 2.3 of the contract and they stopped replying. They won't answer calls. Every time the receptionist picks up and I ask for the salesman/sales manager/dealer principal they are always "busy".

What are my options here? I have since moved about 2 hours away from the dealership so dropping by hasn't been possible at this point, but I aim to do so at some stage if required. Would putting in a complaint with Fair Trading do anything? Are they any good?

Any help would be appreciated!

UPDATE: So I sent an email to Ford Australia last week outlining my situation. Took them eight days to respond to me and all they said was:

"Hi, thank you for the email. Please be advised as your query is related to sales, we do not have access or involvement in it as, we are only the manufacturers, and the dealers are independent businesses. Please liaise with the dealer to discuss further on your concern or the sales team. Thank you."

Just as utterly useless as I expected them to be. Next option is to head down to the dealer and make some demands.

Automotive Ford Ute

Comments

  • Wiadro on 22/01/2024 - 22:52
    +1

    right, so you have been waiting for the car since your deposit in Oct 2022, so 1 year, 3 months, and 20 days ago.

    have you spoken to the dealership principal?

    • momuncher on 22/01/2024 - 23:27

      Yup, since January 2022, which is when I also signed the contract. Apparently the decision to not refund the deposit is the dealer principal's decision. Every time I ask for him he is never available.

  • Dollar General on 22/01/2024 - 22:55
    +16

    Go there in person and speak to the dealer principal. If they still refuse to talk or return your deposit speak with ford head office

    • thatonethere on 23/01/2024 - 17:58

      Yeah big pants time to go visit the principal about an (unnamed) issue in person.

  • TheMindsetTraveller on 22/01/2024 - 23:01
    +4

    name the stealership please

    • momuncher on 22/01/2024 - 23:37
      +1

      Certain dealer in Tuggerah NSW

      • darvian22 on 23/01/2024 - 09:04
        +1

        They're all a bunch of scabs along that stretch in Tuggerah

  • Almost Banned on 22/01/2024 - 23:13

    How much is the deposit?

  • Sye on 22/01/2024 - 23:16
    +12

    Every time the receptionist picks up and I ask for the salesman/sales manager/dealer principal they are always "busy".

    Tell the receptionist your name is Joe Bloggs and you want to buy a Ranger.

    • singlemalt72 on 23/01/2024 - 08:25
      +3

      THIS

      They will never let a prospective sale go hanging.

  • geech on 22/01/2024 - 23:43
    +11

    If it’s played out like you say, I’d bypass the dealer and contact Ford Australia

    https://www.ford.com.au/support/how-tos/support-search-only/…

  • Benoffie on 23/01/2024 - 02:14
    +13

    Go straight to Ford. Give them 10 business days and tell them itll be a Fair Trading case or whatever if it's not refunded.
    They wont want the hassle. Even if you do end up at FT, theyll refund just to get them off their back.

    • apsilon on 23/01/2024 - 07:56
      +7

      Lodge with fair trading anyway. They're so far behind it'll be several months before they even make contact. If you resolve it before then you can cancel the complaint anyway.

      • Sinnerator on 23/01/2024 - 08:24

        it's almost as if the govt has short-staffed FT so that business can treat customers like crap

  • djkelly69 on 23/01/2024 - 08:19
    +1

    How did you pay the $1k? Might be able to look at a chargeback if on card.

    • WoodYouLikeSomeCash on 23/01/2024 - 14:57

      Not a year later.

      • djkelly69 on 23/01/2024 - 15:46

        It can depend on the bank's wording - if OP is only providing notice now/recently that they want to rescind the contract, then they only become entitled to the refund of the deposit now.

        • sam-1966 on 24/01/2024 - 12:37

          It used to be '100 days from expected date of service or delivery'.

          Friends used the term to get chargebacks from the 'Jim's Water Tanks' debacle when initially refused.

  • Ocker on 23/01/2024 - 08:20
    +6

    Name and shame the dealer on the Ford Australia Facebook page - that will get their attention.

  • cashless on 23/01/2024 - 08:44

    Walk into the stealership and demand your money back.

  • CurlCurl on 23/01/2024 - 08:50
    +2

    Don't know if this is it but it's in the suburb mentioned by OP.

    https://www.elnford.com.au/

  • ifyareckon on 23/01/2024 - 09:09
    +3

    Give the dealer one last option to resolve with a timeframe for resolution outlined by yourself. If you don't have the dealer principals email, should be easy enough to obtain so include them to make sure they see it and are not relying on someone passing it on. Outline a full timeline of what has happened, lack of responses etc. Keep it all concise and factual with exact dates etc. Make sure to cc the Ford Customer Relationship email into the chain and point out in the email that they have been cc'd in as well for their records. If the dealer sees that it has been escalated, they are likely to respond very quickly. From experience, Ford Dealers seem to be particularly worried about bad feedback getting to head office.

  • Youfah Mizzum on 23/01/2024 - 09:09
    +3

    Point 2.3 makes no mention of refunding a deposit

    "If the Dealer has not delivered the motor vehicle to the Purchaser within thirty (30) days of the estimated delivery date, the purchaser may by notice in writing to the Dealer rescind this Contract."

    Rescind the contract does not necessarily also imply refund of any deposit.

    • try2bhelpful on 23/01/2024 - 09:40
      +7

      Perhaps, but you could put up a pretty good argument that this line should’ve included that this would result in the forfeiture of the deposit. It could be argued a reasonable person would assume the clause meant the conditions would revert to pre contract including the return of the deposit. Otherwise the dealership can hold onto the deposit, indefinitely, until the customer gives up in disgust and walks away. What is the point of that clause then?

    • momuncher on 23/01/2024 - 10:03
      +3

      Point 6 on the contract states:

      "Where the Contract is lawfully rescinded, the Dealer shall refund any monies
      paid by the Purchaser and where possible return the trade-in vehicle
      PROVIDED THAT the Dealer shall retain from any monies due to the Purchaser
      the actual costs of repairs and any improvements, including GST, to the trade-in
      vehicle and any payouts made or to be made by the Dealer to clear any
      encumbrances. Where the Dealer has disposed of the trade-in vehicle the
      Purchaser shall accept"

      I would assume I have lawfully rescinded the contract per term 2.3, and therefore the dealer is liable to refund my deposit.

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 10:10

        Now post page 2 section 5 they refer to, along with the whole contract with your deets redacted.

        • momuncher on 23/01/2024 - 10:24
          +2

          Not sure how to post a picture, but this is what section 5 says:

          "Where the Purchaser refuses or fails to take delivery of the motor vehicle or is
          otherwise in breach of his obligations under this contract, the Dealer may
          terminate this Contract by written notice to the Purchaser.
          If that occurs any deposit paid or payable by the Purchaser to any amount not
          exceeding 8% of the Total Purchase Price of the vehicle shall be forfeited to the
          Dealer. Both parties acknowledge that the Dealer shall be entitled to claim by
          way of pre-estimated liquidated damages from the Purchaser an amount equal
          to Total Purchase Price 8% of Total Purchase Price less any deposit forfeited."

          • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:03
            -2

            @momuncher: Well that certainly contradicts s 2.3 that you say you're relying on. Hazard a guess there's a bit more to s 2. And the email you received but only snipped part of.

            As with most OzB posts, physically walk in there. Too far way? Decide if 1k is worth the drive.

            • momuncher on 23/01/2024 - 12:32
              +3

              @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: Where's the contradiction? How can I take delivery of a motor vehicle which doesn't exist. If my car had arrived at the dealer and they advised me of the same, but I chose not to take delivery, then they are within their right to enforce section 5 of the contract. But they're not. And that is why they have stopped responding to calls and emails.

              I can assure you that I am not "nitpicking" clauses from the contract to use to my advantage.

              • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 15:45

                @momuncher: Then post the whole contract redacted. Otherwise nobody can legitimately help you or troll you.

                • momuncher on 23/01/2024 - 16:22

                  @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: For your viewing pleasure. This is all the terms of the contract:

                  https://files.ozbargain.com.au/upload/291550/110027/screensh…

                  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 18:16
                    -2

                    @momuncher: Lmao read cl 2.4 friend.

                    Hazard a guess there's a bit more to s 2.

                    Morgan Freeman narrating - "and indeed there was"

                    • cookie2 on 23/01/2024 - 18:48
                      +3

                      @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: I still think they've got a point. A contract can't have an open ended date. Just because it does, doesn't mean it's legal or can hold up under scrutiny. So someone could have a price increase and it is delayed for 10 years and you still couldn't cancel without penalty? Nope.

                      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 18:55
                        -2

                        @cookie2: That's the sort of thing you obtain advice before signing, or just don't sign that waiver. Nobody put a gun to OP's head.

                        OP's off to the Tribunal for $1k if they want to try and get it back. In response dealer will likely go for the full 8% then.

                    • momuncher on 23/01/2024 - 19:24

                      @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: LOL that clause wasn't signed, "friend". So clause 2.3 still stands. That section contains the name of the dealer and my name, but that section was not signed by either party. If it was signed then the dealer would surely rely on that at least. But they haven't.

                      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 19:37
                        -1

                        @momuncher: Well there's a talking point, they obviously think you have signed (without seeing the rest of your email). It was redacted and your signature isn't in the bottom right either. Didn't sign electronically perhaps?

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 10:06
      -6

      There's probably a reason OP is nitpicking and posted only the clauses of the contract that suit their prerogative

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 18:18
        -4

        You can all retract your negs now. I was 100% spot on. See just above. Thanks OzB friends.

      • Dollar General on 23/01/2024 - 19:56
        +3

        Your year 12 legal studies is very rusty.

        • follow on 23/01/2024 - 21:44

          I'm pretty sure they're a lawyer irl

      • CurlCurl on 24/01/2024 - 12:36

        There's probably a reason OP is nitpicking and posted only the clauses of the contract that suit their prerogative

        Pardon? Who's doing the nitpicking?

    • GourmetFoodie on 25/01/2024 - 17:27

      This. Usually my understanding when I was looking at a bunch of different cars with different brands with long lead times is you forfeit the deposit if you cancel the contract.

      • try2bhelpful on 25/01/2024 - 17:53

        So why doesn’t the clause about cancelling the contract not, explicitly, state the deposit will be forfeit to ensure this is clear? So how long can they not deliver a vehicle before the person who ordered it should get their money back? This could go on indefinitely. Surely these clauses are to hold the dealer to some sort of delivery date or to give back all the money? I would be interested to hear how the authorities view this.

        • GourmetFoodie on 25/01/2024 - 18:07

          Yes it isn’t a great contract as good contracts should be explicit about these kinds of things but given it doesn’t mention deposits at all, the argument is really he said she said.

      • momuncher on 25/01/2024 - 18:41
        +1

        That's what the dealer tells you, but most people don't read the fine print.

        In this case it's relatively clear what happens in which situation. If the contract is cancelled lawfully then the purchaser is entitled to their deposit back. One of the lawful ways to cancel is if the car is not delivered within 30 days of the estimated delivery date (unless they signed section 2.4).

        Conversely, if the dealer advises the purchaser that their car is available for delivery, but the purchaser refuses to take delivery of the car, then the purchaser is liable to pay the dealer 8% of the contract price less the deposit.

        • try2bhelpful on 25/01/2024 - 18:48

          Who put the names in with section 2.4? If it was them then it isn’t really a signature. If you did it gets murkier. However, the fact you didn’t get it struck out might play against you. Talk to the authorities and find out where you stand. I would be interested to know.

          • momuncher on 25/01/2024 - 18:52

            @try2bhelpful: The names generate when they prepare the contract. That, in no way implies that that section is signed as section 2.4 specifically says it needs to be signed. And neither parties signed.

            • try2bhelpful on 25/01/2024 - 18:56

              @momuncher: Get that confirmed by the relevant authorities it might not be that clear cut because you didn’t get it struck out. However, if the dealer does this automatically, and it is determined they shouldn’t be, it might go close to fraud. That improves your position. Keep us across the outcome. Best of luck.

              • momuncher on 25/01/2024 - 19:02

                @try2bhelpful: Sure, will post an update. I have sent an email to Ford Australia so let's see what they come back with. I presume they will be just as useless as the dealer.

  • holdenmg on 23/01/2024 - 09:31
    +2

    Make a complaint to:
    https://forms.office.com/Pages/ResponsePage.aspx?id=dC2v7fTm…

  • payless69 on 23/01/2024 - 10:24
    +1

    Perfect advertising for Ford. I get the feeling they are drifting from customer satisfaction.
    Your situation is complex. I made it I a strict rule that every 5k or so I make purchase arrangements I take additional steps to mitigate any possible issues. Been thrown out of many $tealerships but it is my money, I DO make the decision on how much to pay for what I do get when.
    NEVER sign anything over 10k without taking the contract to an expert and clarify every step or clause. If it is like 50k+, go to your bank and ask for a conditional bond. Worth all it costs, they may want to finance you and make sure their lawyers have larger rectal openings than your dealer has.

  • Drakesy on 23/01/2024 - 10:41
    +1

    Yeah
    May need to get a bit more heavy handed

    Dealerships just give me the sh1ts, literal leaches

  • TheBilly on 23/01/2024 - 13:33
    +1

    Reading your snippets. It is an open and shut case, they didn't deliver the vehicle in time, you get to rescind and request a refund. I would send them an email stating that if I don't get a formal refund within X (reasonable amount of time) days I will be contacting fair trading and escalating the matter. Then if they don't refund, I would just escalate it to them.

  • WoodYouLikeSomeCash on 23/01/2024 - 15:02

    Looks like this is the place OP is referring to, apparently they have a lot of issues with service too.

    ELN Ford Google Reviews

  • try2bhelpful on 23/01/2024 - 21:54
    +1

    https://www.service.nsw.gov.au/transaction/make-a-complaint-…

    It might be worth chatting to these people to see where you stand. You need to find out the real situation rather than we amateur lawyers here. Don’t be put off pursuing this.

  • momuncher on 01/02/2024 - 14:43

    Got a response from Ford Australia:

    "Hi, thank you for the email. Please be advised as your query is related to sales, we do not have access or involvement in it as, we are only the manufacturers, and the dealers are independent businesses. Please liaise with the dealer to discuss further on your concern or the sales team. Thank you."

    Useless doesn't even begin to describe it.

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