Can the ozbargain community shed some light on how I can contest this?
$282 is very painful!!
$282 fine for reading TXT at red light
cateyneow on 22/11/2012 - 00:18
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I'd wager Highway Patrol…even my cop mates hate those pathetic bastards!
Thank you gotbean sweety.Thank you xo.Yes,it was a bit cruel and heartless (i was more upset for my husband than anything else.He had just as yucky a year as i did…he was there too )
What a bastard cop. What happened to protect and serve the people?
You must have felt like snapping his neck off for that act of betrayal and dishonour.Oh wolfenator87…you have no idea how much i wanted to do that (amongst other things ) to him.He didn't give a s#*t about protect and serve…he wanted a good day on his books AT OUR EXPENSE.I was really emotional (still had pregnancy hormones swirling around)and so wanted him to get his Karma.BASTARD INDEED.
The key bit here is that you were given a specific instruction not to tow it unregistered, you failed to abide by it and you got caught again. It is your fault for what happened. Regardless of personal issues that has nothing to do with the application and enforcement of registration laws. Do you actually have evidence that he radio'ed another car? I'm guessing not unless you have the new digital handsets they have.
maybe im being cynical, and im not expecting to be proven wrong, but you say your personal dramas affected your ability to remember to pay your regstration for the trailer, yet your picking up ebay purchases on christmas eve?
YES TAL-SHIAR,I AM.I am not going to go into dates etc,but rego was earlier than Christmas.Also,the item (perhaps the date there was lost on you)was a CHRISTMAS PRESENT…FOR MY HUSBAND.And no,your cynicism has no part in your comment…..however your compassion speaks volumes.MERRY CHRISTMAS.
Why do you deserve compassion? It's the drivers responsibility to ensure the vehicle they are driving is registered, it only takes 5 seconds to check the lights working and the rego label. No sympathy here.
No more rego labels here in WA. They figured it would save a couple hundred thousand. Personally, I'd rather pay an extra couple bucks and get one to remind me, in case my mail goes astray.
None here in NSW either as of Jan, but even after then you can still get them, they just aren't legally required to display one (like what WA is now)
God Copie, show some compassion. Regardless of all the personal issues, what kind of cop books someone twice within the space of 1 km? Obviously she had to tow the trailer home - what was she supposed to do, leave it lying around in the middle of the road until the next day when they got their rego?
If you want to live in a country with draconian laws such as these - go for it. Otherwise, stop ruining someone's day who already has enough problems up her sleeve and is just trying to share and show some empathy.
This seems like a pity party, not ozbargain.
It's the forums, your deals are in the usual place.
Besides if it prevents someone else getting fined and avoids accidents, isn't that a good outcome?
I don't know what state you are in, but you may be able to obtain a fine option order (or similar), particularly if you are truly hard up for cash.
This would enable you to discharge the fine by performing unpaid community service. The attractive aspect is that your fine would work out to about ten hours. Even I would take ten hours of shoveling sand at the local leagues club over forking out $240-odd dollars. But then again I'm an Ozbargainer.
Disclosure: I'm a lawyer.
edit, sorry, your fine was 280 dollars, that would probably work out to more like fourteen hours or so.
A lawyer on Ozbargain! What's the world coming to? :-)
Must be the lowest paid solicitor in Australia, I couldn't see mine giving up 14hrs of highly paid legal work to cut out a $282 fine…
You'd be surprised mate. Its not all fast cars and leather pants. I heard on Sunrise a while back that 75% of lawyers are paid less than $75,000.00.
Its not all fast cars and leather pants.
LOL, good call…I'll bet you do get more than the $20/hr that you're advocating here though.
$75,000 that is tripple my paid
free legal advice = nuff said lol
its fast pants and leather cars
We all would bro, I remember my own labouring days fondly; but those whinging clients pay the bills…
My point is, rather than cut out the fine doing community service @ ~$20/hr; even without the benefit of a tertiary qualification; doing the same work as a casual labourer on any building site would net you ~$40/hr. Even in blue-collar land that's a profit! ;)
I'd think about doing it just so I wasn't actually handing over any doughnut money.
Plus if your able to fit it in around your usual work then your not really losing any money (just a bit less socialising and TV time)
14 hours of shoveling sand, to save $280. I think that's worth it.
Well, think of this as an exercise that's good for your body!
Should be a front page deal.
Maybe we could all cut a deal to do 4 hours a month in anticipation of fines. That way the exercise would be evenly distributed and "the man" would have a steady supply of labourers and would thereby be able to plan public works more efficiently.
Oops…it hurts. Though being a Ozbargainer - you would have and will keep saving over few months in other deals to offset this…..So think this is some charity you gave this year…and keep smiling.
Sympathise with your situation. However, I actually agree with the law in this case. A few years ago, in crawling traffic, my car was hit by a van driver who was reading a text message. And ended up through a lot of hassle with the insurance company as the van driver drove off before I had a chance to get his details.
You can buy a phone holder off eBay for $5 or less to avoid this in future. Not sure about Vic, but in NSW, I think you can use the phone to answer calls if it is in a phone holder.
You are only technically stopped once you are pulled over an remove your keys from the ignition.so your fine will still stand
Have you ever told a 5 year old off for doing something wrong?
There defence … Such and such does it too, how come they did not get told off?
That makes it ok for me to do…
It's simple, what you did was wrong
arguing like a 5 year old about it means you have zero remorse
Pay the fine, have a hard think about it, don't do it again
And move on
Everybody does dumb things, just be thankful yours was a cheap lesson
curious to know how u got caught too
Not hard to tell, the head down or eyes down in the rear mirrors is a pretty big give away.
no @#$% sherlock
obviously i was asking about where the cop was
obviously i was asking about where the cop was
Watching on from outside the OP's car someplace, or so one would presume! ;)
obv
Watch the video…
What The FUQ? - Frequently Unanswered Questions of the "Australian Government" from http://www.truth-now.net/Then contact him for advice. http://www.facebook.com/FUQAG
DAFUQ???
Most people are saying the same thing!
Please take a look at this…
http://truth-now.net/secus.htmActual page: http://sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-edgar?action=getcompany&CIK=00…
Good point.
Contest it and enjoy the added on court fees because you deserve it. Police have more important things to do than waste a day in Court to hear how you knowingly broke the law
My suggestion. In future, carry your ipod/mp3 player in the car. If it happens again just say you were changing the song and not looking at your phone. There is no law against using an mp3 player in the car whilst driving.
If someone else was in the car you could say you were passing it to the other person.
Get a Sony smart watch and read txt and email on your watch, no more problem! :-)
Next thing you know, we won't be permitted to wear watches.
rolls eyes
That is a good suggestion, though. Even if you just use it for notifications, since incoming calls and texts can easily be missed, if you're not allowed to have it on your person or next to you. They would also be a better means for operating the stereo (if it's powered by your smartphone), since you wouldn't have to reach across to touch the controls.Or, get a smartphone with car mode (or voice assistants like Siri or Google Voice command) which reads out text messages. Then buy a cradle and bluetooth car kit.
True, but personally, I find driving mode dictation software to be terribly annoying and inaccurate. Half the time, trying to figure out what the damned thing is saying takes longer (and more concentration) than actually looking at the phone. For me at least, a simple vibration from the watch, and maybe the caller ID, would be perfect.
ITT: people have an overzealous sense of justice.
I'm not trying to say what the OP did was right, nor am I attacking the validity of these laws, but people are taking this a bit too far. A simple 'what you did was wrong, but you could attempt to lessen the financial impact by doing (a), (b) and (c)' would have sufficed. But seemingly everyone with an opinion or abuse to dish out is taking part in this thread solely for the sake of it. When the OP is accused of being an immigrant, you know the thread took a wrong turn somewhere along the line.
Wasn't 'accused' - it was stated by the OP
There was no "When the OP is accused of being an immigrant, you know the thread took a wrong turn somewhere along the line." The op mentioned they were an immigrant, thats it
Actually read the thread before getting all high and mighty!
By italicising 'accused', I was attempting to convey that the OP was being accused of possessing the negative attributes of Finde's immigrant generalisation. ('They always think they deserve to be treated differently to everyone else and this is a perfect example.') - which was a highly irrelevant comment and little more than a racial slur (obviously encouraged by other posters' negative attitudes towards the OP). Therefore, the thread took a wrong turn.
If I had have meant that Finde was just randomly calling the OP an immigrant, the italics would not have been necessary.
I apologise for being unclear, but not for 'getting all high and mighty'.
The OP played the immigrant card as if that has ANY bearing on the case, and was (rightly) shot down for this.
I agree it was irrelevant, but I don't think he deserved that particular reply, nor that much of the negativity directed towards him. He's not exactly helping his own case, but still.
shrugThe OP has also implied that the enforcement of laws is somehow akin to being pushed around. WTF.
It is being pushed around when you are penalised for doing things that are not illegal. It is not being pushed around to be given an infringement for what an officer believes is a breach of the traffic code. The OP has admitted the act, but has tried to minimise it and has implied that enforcement is somehow pushing him or her around.
As an aside: just because the legislature says something, that doesn't mean it's right.
That said, I happen to agree with this particular law.
TBH, the OP IS possessing the negative attributes of immigrants - I'm Asian myself but what annoys me is people coming here and not respecting the rules. Simple as that.
I am also an immigrant and think that you get less "pushed around" here than where I came from and most places I've been. Australia IS the land of milk, honey and OzB.
I'm Asian myself but what annoys me is people coming here and not respecting the rules. Simple as that.
In contrast to the angels that were born here and do respect the rules.
LOL.
???
merely replying to his 'immigrant' argument. Can't say I respect all the rules all the time but if I'm caught I don't complain like this.
From someone NOT used to driving in cities I can tell you that simply USING a gps (not adjusting it while driving) is a darn site less distracting than not having the slightest idea where the heck you are, or where you should be going.
How did they see you reading a text? Did you hold the phone up high like mr magoo?
If the OP knows how much of a hassle it is to contest this sort of things in magistrate court (and the cost involved in getting a real lawyer), then he/she may think twice. Also, Victoria police has really strict guidelines about touching your phone whilst driving (even stopped at red light is considered driving). Magistrate also frown upon people using their phones, and give you a 5 minutes speech about this. Finally, you will probably be sitting in the court room with 10 other offenders whom are contesting the same thing.
Obviously Police will also access your phone records from the mobile company and look at everything you did, even your SMS messages if they want.
Obviously Police will also access your phone records from the mobile company and look at everything you did, even your SMS messages if they want.
That's ridiculous. They would never bother wasting their time and resources for such a small matter.
Even if it gets further (which I doubt it would) it would involve a simple written report from the police officer involved.
The initial case taken to court would 99% likely be a 5 min hearing at most and the person involved ending up ordered to pay the fine by the magistrate.
If the person decides to take it further than more is involved of course.
It's not about safety but rather revenue raising through their myriad of stupid laws and complete control of the australian population(aka sheep). The nanny state is in complete operation now. baaa baa.
Best advice : get used to it and pay the fine because more civil liberties will be vanquished soon and your personal freedoms will be hampered, which equals more future potential fines or imprisonment.$282.
see if OW will pricematch?
they won't, You have 31 days to pay with Victoria Police whilst OW has 14 day policy.
I'm a p plate drive , and not once have a used my phone whilst driving.
People think oh I will just send a quick text or take this call, It won't hurt me. That's how accidents happen, I don't care if you kill yourself , it's the other people you kill in the process that bothers me.
The accidents I've seen that were caused by phones have scared me enough to make me smarter by not using my phone.
There is no need to use your phone in the car.
What ever it is can wait until you have parked the car, or pulled over to the side of the road.
What is on your phone, isn't worth someone's life.
People think they have the right to use there phone.
People need to realize it's a privellage to drive not a right !There is no need to use your phone in the car.
What ever it is can wait until you have parked the car, or pulled over to the side of the road.You've never seen Speed?
I know a person who got fined for talking on the mobile while the car was stationary in the car park. but not in a parking lot. The key is in the ignition, the cat was running. You are considered driving.
I was fined for "not having my foot on the footpegs on my motorbike" when I was going between the lane while traffic was stopped at the light. Traffic was stopped. there was more than adequate space between cars for me to safely go between cars. Even for me to roll around on the road. There is no law against motorbikes going between lanes when traffic is not moving. So he hit me with not having my foot on the footpegs. $178
Police on a power trip. What to do about it? Sometimes you get a cop who is cool. sometimes you get a total dick.
Depends on the state, some states lane filtering is illegal, some not. Sounds like your not telling the whole truth, I've been done for standing on the footpegs while riding along but was overturned in court after evidence was submitted that full control is maintained in that position.
That was the whole truth. nothing to hide. I do still go through traffic, even in front of police cars.
$282 seems very steep for looking at your phone at a red light. I wonder what the fine is if you're actually driving/moving.
I love the OP's argument "but i've got a perfect driving record" with a response "well now you don't".
And also, "i'm an immigrant, i didn't come here to get pushed around". LOL, well you should have checked the laws of the country before you decide to live in it, if you weren't preppared to get "pushed around" (law enforcement).
At a red light you deserve it. I had a friend that got fined in SA for being on the phone while pulled over on the side of the road with the hand break on and the engine running (was legal to park on the side of the road) - that I think is very unfair, I actually do this all the time: phone rings -> pull over -> answer phone -> if call is quick don't bother turning off engine
I personally find talking on a mobile phone incredibly distracting while driving - even with a proper hands free kit. I think talking on the phone should be illegal full stop - no hands free no nothing. Talking on the phone requires way more of your attention than talking to someone in the passenger seat
I remember when I got my first and only speeding fine - for doing 61kmph in a 50 zone which I swore I thought was a 60 zone. I was mad as hell and desperately wanted to find some way to get out of it (ozbargainer in me) in the end I finally conceded that it was absolutely and completely my fault and that I should just pay it and move on.
It's yet another revenue raising stream for the government. Friend at work had the same problem - red light, reading a text. Similar fine. Common sense should prevail on safety here. If you're an aggressive / arrogant driver without a phone, you're 9x more dangerous than someone reading an SMS at a red light but the aggressive driver isn't obvious to the naked eye at all times to the cops.
I reckon we should probably screen people with a Texting while driving test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Hbj…Link to source on 9x more dangerous findings?
Good to hear the OP got caught. I drive for a living and these days you are counting people who are not on the phone. It's very easy to tell who reading messages/Internet when the phone is in the lap. People have been killed on our roads by distractions caused by phones. Invest in a hands free kit.
Invest in a hands free kit.
I can't +1 that enough times.
Both of our personal cars have the bluetooths, but for when I get stuck in one of the work cars that hasn't got hands-free I bought a solar powered Milkshake one from Officeworks a couple of years ago for the princely sum of $23. These things are so cheap there's just no excuses anymore.
Plus, I can't imagine a text message important enough to require reading it on the road…most folks call me for urgent matters! ;)
Maybe you should contact the mods to lift your limit on +1s?
hahahahhaha
but yeah definitely agree with your last one. Anything urgent would be a call, not a message hence it can wait.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_phones_and_driving_safet… just because it's legal doesn't make it magically more safe. Hands free should be against the law too, probably isn't because too many cops and politicians reckon phone calls are more important than lives.
Its less distracting to operate a hands-free kit than it is to fiddle with a mobile phone.
With modern BT kits all you do is press a single button to pick up a call and you simply speak as if you were talking to someone in the car.
With a phone, most of the time you keep it in your pocket or purse meaning you have to spend time rummaging to pick it up, and you have to hold it up to your ear or use loudspeaker mode which still requires at least another button press to activate.
If your phone is sitting in your center console answering it would be about as distracting as changing a radio station. For the majority of the conversation you have it against your head so you can't see the screen. Numerous scientific studies have shown that it is no more dangerous than hands free. Making a call is however more dangerous with a regular phone because you need to look at the screen, don't understand why anyone would start a call while driving though.
It's less distracting to not talk on the phone when driving, fullstop!
Though where would we draw the line between no talking on phone/no talking to passengers?
@chiefbodge, who said anything about making calls…like you I rarely have a need. I can also receive them without touching a single thing. Auto-answer for car mode, auto-disconnects when the other party hangs up. Audible tones confirm each, but these things can also have LCD displays…easy-peasy lemon squeezy.
Whilst we're on the subject of making calls though, it's far less distracting as the others have already noted…keep your hands-free at eye level, voice tag dialling with a single button press at eye level…simple, legal & safer than the rummaging the other guys have said. If the person you need to call hasn't got a voice tag, pull over…not rocket surgery! ;)
People are missing the point here. Hands-free or not, the actual act of listening and responding to a conversation on your phone, whether be it bluetooth, handheld, or speakerphone—is distracting and takes some of your focus off the road.
Before somebody once again repeats that it's no less distracting than talking to somebody next to you in the passenger seat, everyone of you have detailed some kind of extra interaction needed with the technology, even if it be minor.
If we are serious about reducing the road toll, all mobile interaction should be banned while driving, regardless of the technology used.
A passenger can actually be a safety advantage, basically a second pair of eyes and somebody to pull you up if you miss something on the road or are operating the vehicle dangerously. Someone on the other end of the phone can not do that.
Perhaps the point you are missing is that using a GPS and changing stations or cds on a car stereo is also distracting but these things seem ok to do.
This is a case of revenue raising, pure and simple, but I understand it is the law, so I suppose the OP has to suck it up.
Some people shouldnt even talk to passengers while driving. My sister is one of them!
what a video!
Don't listen to Wedge, we all know he gets distracted by his targeting computer while flying!
stay on target
AMEN.If this doesn't change the stupidity of people who think it's ok to text,talk or whatever,then i weep for humanity.As a nurse,my comrades and i see this every day,and think that a little walk from emergency to the morgue to see their very dead,VERY MESSED UP victims should be part of the treatment process…THEN TEXT ABOUT THAT.If YOU feel the need to die,go ahead (a little less publicly though)BUT DON'T TAKE MY OR OTHERS FAMILIES WITH YOU.Cmdwedge,that video was horrific,graphic and not for the squeamish,but absolute reality and a reminder that it's NOT about revenue raising,"nanny states" or dictatorship as some here believe….THANK YOU FOR POINTING IT OUT.
hello everybody i just returned from Broome this evening.
so many comments, so happy!=D
Centrelink payment today - booyeh!Prepare for the negs.
Y'all postin in a troll thread.
thank you Copie.
I apologize to all the readers here. i met somebody at the resort and told them about my fine and me asking for help on a forum. I realized because of culture difference, I got it all wrong now that I live in Australia. I swore to be more Australians after getting my certificate and the lady at the resort was right, I need to change my values. No more bending rules, just suck it up, pay the fine and say g'day mate next time I see the police. No more cash, everything on credit so there is record.Someone called me "a new low" before which was very insulting. People bow to me when I go back to Beijing ok and just because I told him I was an immigrant, I was cyber bullied. I already expected to come to this country to have a hard new start, even tho I passed IELTS tried to make Aussie friends, this is always the end - I get hated, bullied because I am in my transition period from completely changing my values upside down.
I will definitely pay the fine and more if they want bc I know I am an intruder to the country. People you don't like always get an inflated price - I understand. Now that I have only one passport, I cant go back. Hopefully people are nicer to me in the future. I will not go on this forum again. It is never nice to be bullied and I think people here could have said, just pay the fine and not add anything nasty beyond the scope of this topic. Nonetheless, I know one day people will treat me nicely bc my country is doing heavy investment in this country and Australia needs it.
You aren't being bullied here. The root cause of the problem was that you asked on how to evade a fine that was fairly being issued.
The problem was exacerbated when you argued against the technicalities of the law. Unfortunately, legislation is like that — its very explicit, and if it says that you can't hold a phone when you're driving, then it means the officer has the right to fine you if he sees you holding one.Saying that you're an immigrant as a justification for your error doesn't hold water because the rule applies to EVERYONE in Australia — you're not getting special or unequal treatment just because.
Its also an invitation for the classic racial ad hominem attack, something that you'd want to avoid whenever engaging in an open discussion in a forum. Ever heard of the "Veil of ignorance"?
will not go on this forum again.
That's just silly.
The comments of a few idiots on Ozbargain is not representative of the community as a whole.
^ couldnt be said any better
First you say you are being pushed around because you received an infringement notice that appears to be deserved. You do not deny breaking the law. You just don't want to endure the consequences.
Now you are saying you are being cyber bullied. No one said anything about your immigration status until you stated that you did not come here to be pushed around. It is not "just because" you said you are an immigrant. It is because you act like you are above the law in your new country.
If no one pushed you around in China and if "People bow to me when I go back to Beijiing", why did you come here? Australia would allow you to keep your original citizenship, so I do not believe your story of "one passport".
Your reference to Centrelink in the same diatribe with a "resort" is highly offensive.
Some people are getting too worked up about this whole thing.
Australia would allow you to keep your original citizenship.
Are you sure? I thought that you had to give up your citizenship and passport of your home country. Or does it depend on the country that you originally came from?
I'm sorry to hear that. What a cruel cop.