It’s recently come to my attention that here in Victoria “the first day of Term 1 each year must be a student-free day in all government schools to allow for appropriate planning to take place for the arrival of students”.
Maybe I’m missing the intricacies of teaching but didn’t teachers just have 5 weeks of student free days over the Christmas break? What’s the go with this lark? Why is an extra day required? Do they really just take 5 weeks off and do absolutely no work?
Sounds like you don't have any kids
PO's entitled, probably scoring govt aid to use a private school. Doesn't like the idea of parenting on days he has outsourced the responsibility to teachers.OP's money and time is more important than yours,mine anyone's.
It’s weird that you’ve concocted such an elaborate fantasy in outrage because I’ve asked the question of “what can’t the fifth week of school holidays be used to prepare for the upcoming school year?”
@[Deactivated]: Not quite as weird as continually trying again to rewrite your own words They're all there, I'm not cutting and pasting to help remind you. Just review your own comments.Hint, count the negs.
@[Deactivated]: Before the introduction of student free days, one has to wonder when teachers did prepare for the upcoming school period.
Shitty kids often have shitty parents…
It's been a while since I've had to use my daily quota of neg votes in one post. I'll be back in 24 hours to comple the task.
Got a good chuckle out of me.
Maybe when a post is awarded x amount of negs in a nominated (short) period of time we get a recharge of neg votes.If they also run out in the same time period, the thread gets closed.
Or better still a report option of dead set shite thread, whereby if a repeat offender crosses that line 3 times,in total, they can't start a thread for 12 months.
I thought the cap was 5 per day, happy to see it is 10.
Platinum membership to unlock the extra neg votes.
Enjoy your extra day off before school starts again. What grade are you in now, have you made it past the 6th grade yet?
Are the teachers in VIC even paid to do work on the prior weeks? Maybe the VIC education department doesn't want to start paying till that first week of the term, in which case, a pupil free day on the first day is highly reasonable.
Yes. Full time teachers are paid all year round and even over the holidays. She is already starting to prepare for the year ahead, albeit from home. But she will be going into school a few times ahead of the year to prepare and be ahead within her classroom prep.
Heck, I have even gone in with her to help set up and decorate the classroom.
Source - My Wife is a Victorian Teacher
Thanks for advising. Is this public or private?
My wife's an early learning educator who runs a specialised art program for the centres she works across. I've had to go help out a few times myself so I can understand your situation… though, in my case, wifey isn't paid if she's not at work and all the hours of prep work she does at home is entirely unpaid (thus why I was curious if full time teachers are paid over holidays).
Public.
@geekcohen: A system OP has admitting having no kids in, therefore no viable reason for this thread or the baseless trolling whinge about all things teacher. OP is probs a janitor wannabe
Source - My Wife is a Victorian Teacher
You couldn't nab one from the current era?
Hahaha. My wife did do some intern work at Sovereign Hill whilst studying in Ballarat.
What about contract teachers? It seems like their payment date begins first week of term and goes until the last day of school.
Depends on the contract but generally annual leave for the summer break is on accrual basis. So if you work all 4 terms you should be paid the entire summer break.
There are however some scummy schools which intentional make the contract end on the last say of term 4 and get no leave entitlements.
I work in education and have a friend who was doing contract work.
She'd be paid typically until the start of the next term if she had been a significant amount of time like a complete term or 2 .
A commentator above said during Xmas holidays is annual leave, is this correct?
Looking like the most likely explanation. That would suggest the State Govts approach to funding education is basically “if we make you work less can we pay you less?” which is…. disappointing
tell me you've never been, or known a teacher, without telling me.
If you really think teachers clock off at 3PM then I got news for you.
They should get hazard pay for having to deal with all the germ infested brats parents just dump on them as if it's daycare.
If you really think teachers clock off at 3PM then I got news for you.
100% and if you think that teachers clock on at 8:45am (or there abouts), that isn't true. My wife leaves home at 7am and is at work by 7:20am. She is the first there almost every day. Most teachers are required to arrive and be there by 8am.
Not sure why the neg? Just adding to what coffeeinmyveins has said.
Not quite right about required arrival times - at least not for Vic for teachers under the Victorian Government Schools Agreement 2022.
They are required to be at school no less than 10 minutes prior to their first class. There may however be other duties that a full-time teacher may need to undertake outside those times.
Finish work at 3pm? Surely this is a troll comment? This isn’t “why do teachers only have a X hour school day” this is “why is a pupil free day scheduled for the first day of class?”
Some work all the way through to 4:30 or even 5pm!
100%, my wife is at work/school until 5pm most days. So from about [7:20am[(https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/887818?page=1#comment-1613…) until 5pm, plus then hours at home. It is a long day.
If the conditions and pay are so good, why is it so hard to get enough teachers?
It's not hard to get enough teachers in areas where teachers want to teach. There are people still competing for jobs.
Perhaps the more remote locations are struggling to get teachers but I think there are certain perks for teaching in some of these areas too.
I would genuinely like some real data on this competition for jobs because there are a number of reports out there saying headmasters having difficulty filling their rosters. The gap between the increase in teachers and the increase in population seems to be widening. The number of teachers who stay in the profession for short periods seems to be increasing. No young person I know is going into teaching and the older ones I know will retire in the next few years.
There are perks in some remote areas but there are also a lot of disadvantages to being remote from the city. Far from hospitals, entertainment, public transport, etc.
If got news for you. Even inner city schools in VIC are struggling in high socio-economic areas too.
^Misspells the word paid.
Then proceeds to bemoan the number of kids who supposedly can't read and write properly.
Lmao.
You don't need to be educated to make a fool of yourself.
Many of you work in private industry. If these were your results in your job how long would you last for?
Err what? In your private job are you judged based on how an entire national industry is going?
If teaching is so well paid - why aren't you a teacher?
you havent looked at the stats. More teachers are retiring at the end of their careers than are graduating each year, and of those graduating, lots will leave the profession.
I work in the sunshine coast, and we have a hard time securing teachers…..we must be an undesirable area…..
PFD.. what a scam.
Classroom prep….. LLM will take care of that.
My teacher wife is going to love this hot take. Fortunately she has a little free time to be told at the moment, because she'd bite my head off for the after hours interruption to her work at home.
It’s horrible that she’s working on what is nominally her holiday. That fifth week should be allocated for prep work so people don’t need to work on their holidays.
Yeah I'm talking about all the extra work she does in the evening, during term, to deal with the day-to-day of the job. They earn their breaks and then some.
It’s horrible that she’s working on what is nominally her holiday. That fifth week should be allocated for prep work so people don’t need to work on their holidays.
If you have a job (god only knows who would employ you) would you lose a week from your holidays to prep work for when you return?
Pupil free/staff development days allow staff to prepare for the term/year.
This 5 week break is our annual leave where no work should be (but is still sometimes) done.
The other 'holidays' throughout the year are relief from face to face teaching, and teachers are often (in my experience, anyway) working during this time. This time is often used to mark and give feedback on assessments. Some of this simply isn't possible during the term, especially in a high school environment, where reporting schedules are staggered to make processes feasible e.g. report marks are due on X date, report comments due to a supervisor on X date, final corrections from supervisor done on X date, but imagine this for 6 year groups.
In my experience teaching a HSC (VCE in Victoria) class in 2024, the way their assessments are scheduled (as they finish in Term 3 and sit final exams in terms 4) mean that their assessments are often scheduled for end of each term, so that teachers mark the assessments and provide feedback during the breaks and ensure students get it all back day 1 of the next term ready to implement the suggestions.
Others have already debunked the 9-3 working hours myth above so I won't repeat it all, but this really is the one time of year where we can mostly switch off like other industries when they are on leave.
Another reason why these days are needed, especially at the start of the year, is to prepare classrooms, familiarise ourselves with the students we will teach (based on collaborative documents/discussions from teachers of the previous year), and set up any start of year events.
In a high school setting, there could be major events like sport carnivals, preparation for the distribution of timetables/diaries etc. I work in a school of 1200+ students, and it is a significant effort from members of staff to create cohesive and efficient processes for all involved. These processes do change from year to year depending on fluctuating enrolments as well, so it is not just a 'set and forget' process.
Curriculum and syllabus documents are often evolving, with revisions or entirely new syllabi being released for teachers to prepare for and deliver to students. This takes time to plan for and implement, so these days are often used for those purposes. Before you say let ChatGPT etc do it all, there are regular news stories about how these platforms give incorrect/inappropriate responses so even if we do use it, we would still need to fact check/adjust it to suit our students, so it doesn't reduce our workload as much as you think.
To wrap up, the pupil free days are quite necessary for all sorts of reasons, and yes, teachers don't do (or shouldn't be doing) much at this time of year because it is our annual leave period without work responsibilities. Note that some still end up working for all sorts of reasons (new school, extra keen, teaching new subject etc)
teachers don't do (or shouldn't be doing) much at this time of year because it is our annual leave period without work responsibilities
Looking at the NSW school calendar it looks like you have 5 weeks and 4 days of continuous leave for Christmas (not including other breaks), followed by 4 school development days. I guess I just don’t understand why 5 or even 4 weeks of leave isn’t enough, with the other days allocated to “school development” so that nobody would have to work on their leave?
Don't quote me on this, but there may be a set number of school weeks per year (~40?), and as the year isn't exactly 52 weeks, with the addition of leap years, there will be years where the length of the holidays will fluctuate. It's probably in our award somewhere.
School calendars at an individual and state level are quite a delicate thing, with many annual events booked a year in advance for the corresponding week/day, so this may also influence why we just have 4 X 10 (with 11 once in a while/year) to keep things stable.
The increase in development days in NSW was negotiated by the union in the recent deal. Personally I think 4 straight days at the start of the year is too many, and we could have done with two of those going to the end of the year so we have time to clear/move classrooms and do other tidy up as necessary.
The late announcement of the extra development days at the start of Term 1 also affected the planning of many schools, as they now can't stagger start dates (7, 11 and 12 on day 1, all students day 2 etc) to allow for smoother transitions, and bookings for things like swimming carnivals and even some camps could no longer run as the extra mandated development days were announced.
P.s. I didn't neg you, by the way.
i used to work in a school as the IT guy and i can tell ya, that the day the kids go on holidays so did the teachers at 3:30pm Friday arvo… and not back til the thursday or friday before the pupil free day to start planning the year. so yes to answer your question yes. they went on 5 weeks holidays and did not work. but saying that the other working teaching weeks they work their arses off, sometimes they start at 6am and dont go home til 9pm because of the before and after school extra curriculm work they do, so i always appluded them over summer when they take off on friday! they work fraking hard!
I think we need a OP-free day.
In fact, make that a couple of years
Yes, they are on a great wicket! And they got there by being the most whiney victims of any profession.
Constantly complain about low pay and poor conditions.
I used to feel sympathy for them until I realised, they chose their profession, and they choose to stay.
If it wasn't worthwhile, they would move on and do something they enjoyed.
They're supposed to be "programming" during most of the school hols, but from what I've observed, little real work goes on during those periods.
Not to discount the horrors they have to work with, but again, if you can't handle the heat, choose another job, don't constantly whine and expect parenting (aka daycare workers) to suddenly improve.
There are many good teachers out there, but the bad get paid the same as the good. Apologies to the good teachers out there (and just because you think you're a good teacher, doesn't mean you are!).
Constantly complain about low pay and poor conditions.
they are on a great wicket!
Wow it's almost like collective bargaining works.
They're supposed to be "programming" during most of the school hols
Yeah okay any further comment from me is a waste.
They do move on, hence why we have a teacher shortage
https://www.heraldsun.com.au/business/work/australias-teache…
People forgetting they also have a couple weeks "off" between terms also, so much downtime, so much complaining.
It's like you haven't read any of the comments. Those "down times" are to finish all the necessary admin work to allow them to continue to teacher students.
The only complaining I see is from ignorant people who know nothing of the profession.
I find it amusing that there's always comments about needing/deserving "down times" to finish all the necessary admin work etc but I have yet to see any mention of
A full-time primary teacher teaches 21 hours and 45 minutes face to face teaching
each week. A full-time primary teacher also receives 2 hours of relief from face to face
teaching.
(from Clause 16 Allocation of Duties in High Schools in the school teachers award from a couple of years back)
Teachers - 28 periods per week plus up to 3 periods per week for sport. (This equates to 20 hours and 40 minutes per week)
A “period” in a high or central school is defined in clause 2.46 of the school teachers award as a 40 minute teaching period
To me that looks like around half of the day at work is allocated as face to face teaching with the rest for admin etc.
Have you done marking before? Have you made lesson plans? Have you called parents to raise concerns about kids? Have you had to stop assaults occurring? Deal with emotionally hurt children? Random injuries? Etc??? You have no idea how many hours all this takes but (profanity) yeah they only do "half" of their time face to face.
You have no idea how many hours all this takes but (profanity) yeah they only do "half" of their time face to face.
Have you actually taken the time to read what has been written before replying with your butthurt feelings?
Find me any other 'professional' job that that gets half their work day to do their non-core functions.
I don't disagree that a teacher's job is filled with way too much admin/box ticking but at least don't try claiming that the'downtime' is needed for admin without mentioning that half of the day is already allocated for exactly that.
Your comments about 'have you done this/that/the other show a clear lack of understanding on your part of what is involved in many, many 'professional' roles. Maybe if teachers had spent some time outside the 'education bubble' they may realise they are not the only ones taken advantage of.
Teachers do pretty good these days. Their salaries are decent, they get 12 weeks a year annual leave (3 months!) and their long service leave is accrued regardless of where they work or how often they change schools. What other job offers these perks? And they are still whinging that they are hard done by because kids suck?! Talk about entitled. Go work in an office and you quickly realise that your coworkers are just as bad an unruly kids.
Absolute rubbish on so many levels. My brother is a STEM teacher and I went into IT. There is absolutely no way I would do his job. Not only do they do face to face teaching they are required to do a massive amount of work outside hours. Class preps, marking, policing the grounds during breaks, school camps, counselling students, parent teacher nights, dealing with entitled and even abusive parents, etc. Jobs like mining have amazing perks. Politicians only gave a short number of sitting days in parliament as well.
One of my uni lecturers said I would make a great teacher but there was no way I was going to cause myself that sort of grief.
If your office job goes away who is going to suffer? If teachers go away then society is stuffed. As they say. “If you are reading this then thank a primary school teacher”.
You never fail to make me laugh. Most of the "extra" work you describe is within normal working hours. Dealing with abusive parents is no different than dealing with abusive customers. Jobs like mining have amazing perks because they are difficult and dangerous jobs. Spending your time in and air-conditioned classroom is not difficult and dangerous.
Teachers in effect have "gone away". One third of kids can't even read and write properly let alone tackle anything advanced. That's a complete disaster. Our idiotic governments have tried to fix the problem simply by throwing tonnes of money at teachers and it has just made the problem worse.
"that sort of grief" <— This just shows us that you've never worked a difficult or dangerous job before.
Please get a clue your opinions are terrible.
No, this extra work isn’t done during “normal business hours”. A lot of it is done outside normal business hours. Ask a teacher about their work instead of assuming. You think when they go on school camps they go home and leave the kids on their own? If you think teachers jobs aren’t difficult and dangerous you haven’t been following what is happening out in the schools.
It is your opinion that is terrible because you make a lot of assumptions with no real knowledge. But that isn’t very surprising.
@try2bhelpful: Do you think I don't know any teachers? I know quite a few indeed. I've also worked in schools before. I liked the kids, most of them were great.
No teachers jobs are not difficult and dangerous. Not even close. I have worked in difficult and dangerous jobs. You're dreaming if you think they are.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: There are lots of jobs in mining that aren’t dangerous or difficult but you are still paid a lot of money to do them. Frankly, give me mining any day over teaching. I could do with amassing the money and the FIFO days off.
Please specify which jobs you consider difficult and dangerous so we can see if we agree with your assessment. it would be nice to compare them to actual list. With mining the issues tend to be well known and you are following safety protocols. With teaching you could be faced with a child with a weapon or being physically attacked and this could come with little warning. Teachers have classrooms full of immature people going through a myriad of emotional issues. Parents require the teachers to deal with this whilst still having the discipline over the kids to teach the curriculum.
There is variation between schools and the issues are getting worse. There are increasing reports of aggressive behaviour from students and parents. Schools are having difficulty filling teaching positions. Young teachers are leaving the profession after short periods and older teachers are reaching retirement age. I dint think most teachers are in it for the good “conditions” and perks.
Yes there are more dangerous jobs but they tend to pay more and have better perks. I would argue that teaching is up there in difficulty because of the baggage that comes with certain pupils and the expectations on teachers. If it was just turn up and give a lesson to people eager to learn it then a piece of cake. The reality is not so much.
@try2bhelpful: I don't think you would last very long in mining lol.
The fact that you even have to ask what a difficult or dangerous job further demonstrates you have no idea what you're talking about. You say so flippantly that it's fine there's safety protocols. They exist because if you don't follow them you die. You can also die even if you follow the safety procedures. This is not to mention other shit industries where there is no safety at all. These places tend not to get many visits from worksafe and the pay can be truly awful too.
It should never get to the point where somebody could get physically attacked in a classroom. It's because problems get swept under the rug and absolutely no repercussions that these situations happen. You make it seem like teachers are just completely helpless. The teachers are the system. The teachers are the hierarchy.
Eject the problem kids from the system. Many of them are beyond help and will never be educated. They will simply traumatise and interfere with other kids.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: As I said there are plenty of jobs in the mining industry that aren’t dangerous or difficult. They also tend to be well paid. Just a fact. They aren’t all out there with their spades ya know.
The teachers might be the system and the hierarchy but they can’t control what the kids or their parents decide to do at any given time. Personally I prefer not to blame the victims of violence rather than the perpetrators.
In relation to “problem children” please answer all of my questions rather than a simplistic comment that provides no solution. So would say a child that stole a credit card and committed fraud was beyond being educated? That would be news to Stephen Fry and his Cambridge education. We need a better solution than just throwing away children.
WCON
@try2bhelpful: Yes not every job involves going underground but you have to be willing to go to remote locations and do the shifts. People who have families will probably not want to do this. I don't want to do that.
No-one has to control what others do. You screw up, you find yourself in front of a panel of people (maybe staff and parent council I don't know) and you prove to them why you get to stay. The parents will be embarrassed, the kid may feel some remorse or embarrassment if they're not already a sociopath and the show goes on till they screw up again. Next time it will probably be the look-for-a-new-school-time or if no school will take them the parents will have to figure out what to do with them. They are the ones who created the problem so they can take responsibility. The rest of the kids know that they are now protected (as they well should).
I have great sympathy for any child that suffers abuse particularly from those whose job it is to protect them. That sympathy follows a sharp end when they pass that abuse on to other children. At that stage they are probably beyond help. It is not within the scope of the education system to be fixing those kinds of problems. All they can do is to alert the authorities when they feel the child is in danger. The priority is to protect the kids that have a chance at gaining an education.
The credit card example has nothing to do with school. The parents will get a knock on the door from the police and they will have to go in and explain themselves.
If you feel so strongly about "throwing away children" then maybe you should put your money where your mouth is. But that might be too much "grief" for you.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Wow… I just went back and read a second post.
"Eject the problem kids from the system. Many of them are beyond help and will never be educated. They will simply traumatise and interfere with other kids."
Yeah, you're really showing what kind of person you are with comments like this.
Holy crap…. Let me guess we should just mince the elderly up into soylent green as well?
Damn, you a special kind of something aren't ya lad.
Can tell exactly what kind of person you are with comments like this. Jesus mate, if you haven't already never breed.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: I'm curious what "difficult and dangerous" jobs you've had in mining if you're complaining about teachers earning $100,000. I'd be pretty surprised if there was such thing as a dangerous mining job sub-$100K.
@johnno07: Not sure why people are obsessed with all the mining job details? There are many jobs in society that are dirty, dangerous and low paid.
Our idiotic governments have tried to fix the problem simply by throwing tonnes of money at teachers and it has just made the problem worse.
governments have tried to solve the issue by disempowering teachers, adding more legislation and guidelines that prevents teachers doing their job and standardised testing.
If you have a kid who doesn't want to be in the classroom and constantly disrupts everyone, and you aren't allowed to discipline them, you aren't allowed to fire them, what do you think happens to learning? This isn't the same as an office job at all
@greatlamp: I agree with you on all of these points.
The bullies and classroom clowns don't get removed from the classroom and often get protected status due to their sometimes traumatic background. Of course these kids should be removed and either channeled into an appropriate situation or simply ejected from the system to become the parents' problem. However they are kept where they are to keep the numbers good on paper for the school and the system in general.
I will agree that teachers do not receive appropriate backup from the higher ups due to the above. However, the higher ups ARE teachers as well. The leading teachers, the vice-principals and the principals etc.. They get paid very highly to fix these problems.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Just wondering exactly what you think the principals can do to fix these problems.
What defines a problem child in the first place? Where do you intend to move the problem kids to? Children don’t have the intellectual or emotional maturity of adults so how do you find discipline that is effective when they act up? How do you deal with parents that are struggling themselves with mental issues? Take the kids off then, perhaps, but fostering services are already over stretched. Care homes have an appalling reputation.
We can all see there are problems but the solutions are complex and difficult to address. If it was easy it would already be fixed. The rules are generally a reaction to something that was badly handled previously.
Imparting knowledge is the easiest part of being a teacher, it is the baggage of expectations that happens outside this brief that is the real work.
@try2bhelpful: Well for a start they could stop covering up the problems. These principals are on huge money so it's no wonder they want to protect their positions.
It is well beyond the scope of the education system to interfere in familial problems. It can do nothing to improve the lives or mental health or whatever of parents and families. The education system is not a baby sitting service where all kids automatically have a place regardless of their conduct. It exists to educate young people in the various disciplines they will need and that is it.
Once a student starts to abuse their schoolmates or interfere with normal instruction then it is up to them and their parents to demonstrate why they should be allowed to remain at school. If they are not there to learn then what are they there for? As I said it's not a baby sitting service. The exact details of how many chances they are given doesn't really matter. All that can probably be decided on by the school council or whatever.
Children from traumatised backgrounds are probably beyond reach by the time they start passing on their abuse to other children. The mental well-being and academic progress of the school poplulation should never be sacrificed to try to save these kids. It's simply not realistic.
I guarantee you that once these useless parents figure out that they will have to look after their kid full time you will get some very well behaved kids in the class room.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: So you still haven’t provided the headmasters with any practical solutions on how to deal with these issues when it comes to children.
There are a lot of reasons why kids are disruptive and problematic. You don’t’t just dump them like garbage. They learn violent reactions from those around them, so start with fixing that. In an ideal world parents would be teaching their kids to behave properly but if they don’t the child shouldn’t suffer for It. You would stack rejection on top of the violence they might’ve experienced through their lives?
I guarantee you that your comment on parents is a load of bullshit. The kids are much more likely to suffer more than be well behaved.
@try2bhelpful: I literally just said to stop covering the problems up. That would be a start.
It doesn't matter why kids are disruptive. It is not baby sitting. The education system cannot fix broken kids. It is well beyond the scope of teachers to be fixing these problems. You seem to be focus on the suffering of the child but not the suffering they are causing for others.
We don't dump them because they are garbage. We remove them from the system because the system cannot solve their problems. Maybe somebody else outside of the system can but that is up to the parents and extended family to solve.
If the child is afraid of rejection then they will toe the line. If they are not afraid of rejection then it won't matter.
The comment about the parents is valid. I don't expect broken kids to be well behaved. I don't expect them to improve or change.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: The headmasters are trying to deal with the problems you are just trying to sidestep it.
I don’t think headmasters are covering it up.
At what point do you throw these kids out? If they talk in class, if they lose their temper and swear, if they can’t stop crying. There is a spectrum of behaviour involved and a number of ways to address it. The last thing should be throwing them out of school.
What happens to them after they are thrown out? They are part of the education system even if it isn’t the mainstream. There will be a headmaster involved somewhere.
Children are all our responsibility. I do not expect children to be broken beyond repair. I also don’t think telling them to behave or they will be rejected is helpful either. We need to understand their backgrounds and determine what presses their buttons to change their behaviour.
@try2bhelpful: Remember how I said I worked in schools before? I have some experience around this. The reason these problems don't get dealt with is because either the problems get covered up so it all looks good on paper or the dysfunctional kid gets protected status because of their traumatised background. They are more or less free to continue abusing other kids at will.
I'm not talking about minor transgressions. I'm talking about kids who will never receive an education and will just drag the others down with them.
I do not expect children to be broken beyond repair. I also don’t think telling them to behave or they will be rejected is helpful either. We need to understand their backgrounds and determine what presses their buttons to change their behaviour.
You are expecting teachers to do all of this? They are not child psychologists.
There are some very traumatised kids out there that are a direct danger to other kids around them. How far do you let it go before somebody gets beaten half to death? As I have said many times repeatedly the system cannot fix these kids' problems. It is well beyond the expertise of teachers to do this yet this is what you want from them?
Children should feel protected when they are at school. They should know when the finish they day that they will be ok. This can only be a possibility if the dangers and distractions are removed. Stop pulling on the heart strings for children that can't be helped by the system.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: You have an ironically uneducated view of education. Wtf happens to a kid when you "dump them"? Just go happily home and play videogames until they reach life expectancy? No, these are the kids most likely at risk of anti-social behaviour. But I guess you need something to bitch and moan about in your local Facebook group.
Funny… I've had bricks thrown at me (one went through a window and I got covered in glass), once copped an apple thrown full speed when I wasn't looking in the side of the head and have been assaulted many times (one kid punched me straight in the nuts).
But please tell me that teaching is all peachy and easy with no chance of being dangerous.
You absolute uneducated fool you. Spoke like a person with no actual clue to the reality of what happens at schools.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Read one post and it was enough mate. Let's pick 2 of your ingenious quotes -
"Spending your time in and air-conditioned classroom is not difficult and dangerous." and ""that sort of grief" <— This just shows us that you've never worked a difficult or dangerous job before." - My post is in direct response to these two quotes, since you seem to think teachers just stand at the front of the class and the kids all just sit there listening to what they say.
Why would I bother reading any more tripe. You're not a teacher. You have no idea what it's like to be a teacher. You're just the typical armchair warrior who gets his news from the Murdoch press and think you know better than everyone else.
Frankly, the only thing I will agree with you on is that in your case, yes your teachers failed you. But hey, they can't get it right everytime.
@OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Yeah, I'm the one who needs luck "bro".
Absolute clown mate.
I'd say good luck, but you've already shown you're kind of trash so it is what it is :)
Have fun though being that scummy :D
@Ruddaga: What the hell sort of school do you teach at?
That seems like you are being targeted as opposed to some random attack. I know a few teachers and I dont recall any off them having that sort of issues like that.
so what is the cause of the 1/3 who cant read and write?…..just general teacher incompetence you think?
What level of literacy are you benchmarking it against and what are your sources?
what most people don't get is kids don't suck.
it's the entitled parents that do.
Kids can suck as well. They might get it from their entitled parents, the peers they hang around with, the sites they visit, etc.
Nice joke.
If it wasn't, oh boy… you're a joke
You forgot leave loading. Most/all public service and agencies get the very-transferrable leave and LSL but not the time off (at least officially, but you know what they say about the diligence of government workers).
I'm sure any business with multiple locations under the same entity will have ongoing LSL accrual and portable leave balances.
Those school holidays include public holidays. There's no catch up for that.
So do people in other jobs have annual leave counted when it falls on those?
The effective holidays is therefore reduced.
You’re talking about maybe 4 days out of the 5 weeks of Christmas holiday. There is still another 6 weeks of school holidays throughout the year so it’s not as if they’re running out of holidays.
You forget public holidays that fall on term holidays - Easter a prime example.
I’m been talking specifically about the Christmas break.
This thread right here is why, as a contract teacher (so currently unpaid, living off the money I squirreled away last year), Im applying for non teaching jobs.
I would rather go back to corporate 9-5 permanent hell and gain the luxuries of flex and OT and not have to take home work or have to move jobs from threats and abuse than to continue to put up with this tripe.
I have never been so underpaid, over worked, undervalued and abused in all my working life. And that says a lot considering I was a female IT worker in the 90s-00s and that was toxic.
Y'all just delusional, disconnected and contributing to the exodus. Let me know how it goes when more imports take on your kids classes (because thats now the new 'solution' to fix the 'shortage')
Im out.
I don’t have any children going to public school in Victoria lol.