I am sure most are aware of the news spreading like wildfire across the globe after manufacturing factories in China exposed that most luxuary goods parts are manufactured in China and then shipped to countries and have them put together and stamped made in Italy, what are your thoughts on this, are we people getting ripped off?
What's Your Say about Luxury Goods Made in China?
DEvok on 22/04/2025 - 00:52
Last edited 22/04/2025 - 00:53
Last edited 22/04/2025 - 00:53
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In Australia the employees were paid award wages, however the factories were small businesses. The factory manager/operator was able to earn a middle class income. That is what has disappeared.
This is the same argument people use when they talk about uber and completely ignore the business operators. 1 company has replaced hundreds of Australian small businesses that operated 5-10 taxis.
Imagine if every takeaway food shop was replaced with McDonald's and KFC and all the profits go overseas. That is what has happened to the textiles industry.
I know it's easy to say Chinese factories producing low quality products don't have the same quality control as Japanese factories. The Japanese factories produce branded products. It's not a valid comparison.
Compare Chinese cars to Ssangyong, a South Korean manufacturer that also sources parts externally and doesn't control the supply chain. Surprise surprise, BYD has better quality.
Compare Chinese workplace culture to American factories, there is no difference. In fact Chinese factories produce better quality, today, not in the future when they more more upmarket.
You are trying to say China cannot produce high quality products by looking at examples where they aren't aiming to produce high quality products.
If WAHL quality is lower in China, that is intentional. They moved production to lower costs. They aren't going to pick a manufacturer that has the highest quality control, they are going to go with the lowest bid that appears reasonable. If they sent their staff over (like European car manufacturers do), they wouldn't have these issues.
Have you ever purchased a Chinese branded product? TCL? Hisense? Xiaomi? You are going to say the quality is terrible when it is $100-$1000s cheaper and basically equivalent. If the price was equivalent, the quality would be superior. Try and pick faults with a top model TCL TV, not the cheapest model they make, and tell me it is terrible quality.
@[Deactivated]: I agree that these factories and retail shops and whatnot were run more by local individuals instead of global conglomerates, but I don't see this as a big L if at all.
The steelworker I know I mentioned, even though his boss got fairly wealthy, the business itself went bankrupt after paying his workers minimum wage and part cash-in-hand for years. This steelworker I knew was an Australian citizen who had been working there for decades, and was still on minimum wage. Many of his more recent co-workers were from places such as the Philippines working here illegally, getting less than the minimum wage cash-in-hand from the boss. So minimum wage was what you might call a seniority privilege there. I heard a millennial recently describe how his boomer boss would try to guilt trip him to work harder and longer for less, because he was deep in debt to keep the business afloat and was giving this young worker an 'opportunity'.
I don't think we should mourn the loss of small time bosses per se, but the loss of the anglo worker that they kept around in the low-end. It has meant less survival options and lower quality for the less well off here. Because now we get Indian pizza hut workers that have no qualms about using a pizza base that has fallen on the floor, and where all the hires are fellow Indians shipped in, and dodgy homes constructed by Moey DW Constructions Ltd that don't last.
That said, this whole situation is much better than that of China. If you hope to return to the age of quality, start demanding quality and you might eventually get it. I used to buy Chinese stuff myself, only to realize not only is it immoral, its not fit for purpose. If I've woken up to this, so are others. Even if we don't get an Australian industry going, one can buy Japanese or German made.
I'm hearing again you say 'Chinese factories produce better quality', but I'm not hearing any examples, aside from Chinese electric cars. I gave a bunch of examples which you have not negated. I'll add another now, which is more niche, but demonstrates the point - metal detectors. Even now, the metal detector market is still dominated by Minelab and Garrett, which can get away with charging thousands for their highest end products because no one is competing with them. The Chinese have got as far as falsely claiming a VLF detector as a Pulse Induction one, trying to steal some of the mid market. They simply can't produce anything at the higher level, probably because all they can do is copycat older models.
I addressed Xiaomi and Chinese electric cars. It's just promising an abundance of features for cheap to capture the mid market. Sometimes these Chinese brands don't live up to what they promise, either bad software or just lying about quality of their features (like how they lie about using 'VG10' steel). If the China cheerleaders and sycophants want to drive their car into a lake to roll the dice on the water flotation gimmick, or sitting on top of an explosive Chinese made giga battery, all power to them, but I ain't chancing it. About high end TVs, I wouldn't know, as I don't buy any high end TVs. But we've all heard stories about the low end TVs, washing machines, dishwashers, and so on. Everyone of us is well acquainted with the 'made in China' experience. Putting foreign overseers in Chinese factories doesn't solve anything, because they typically have no oversight over the raw materials coming in, are overruled/hookwinked/turn a blind eye in regards to the work that goes on in the factory itself, and probably have no qualms about doing whatever is cheapest anyway (if only for the fact that they might get out-competed by other unscrupulous chinese who copy them). The reason why Xiaomi phones, or 'Japanese steel' hairdressing scissors are viable in the mid-market, is because they're using largely foreign raw materials where it matters (i.e. the semiconductor, the steel). There's simply not much to stuff up. But you'd be surprised how many products can be stuffed up by the chinese. It's not because they're making mistakes, its because they're deliberately doing it wherever they can to save money and time without any moral boundaries. I'll repeat the fact again, that Chinese people are literally lifting up sewer manholes and ladling up the floating oils to then boil in vats and on-sell to restaurants and supplier businesses their fellow Chinese consume as cooking oil. I know a person in North China who gets milk delivered, and a quarter of the time the milk will be mixed with a fraction of expired milk making it all taste bad. The tap water there is undrinkable, everyone has to buy bottled water or other beverages. This is all going on today, I'm not even talking about 10 or 15 years ago. And I'd even venture to posit that they're also looking to kill you, as a lot of Chinese and of course the CCP itself have a big chip on their shoulder about the west. It doesn't have to be the Chinese remotely blowing up your BYD the moment war over Taiwan kicks off, which is nonetheless a disquieting possibility you can't 100% rule out, it could be just say the gradual deliberate infiltration of toxins into the clothing you wear, the food you eat, and the medicines you take. Obviously this is just extra speculation, but it's at least something you don't have to consider when you're buying your fully western-made luxury goods, and I'd say it's generally not a good idea to trust someone who hates you and wants revenge on you.
it's generally not a good idea to trust someone who hates you and wants revenge on you.
This is worth keeping in mind. Cheers
You must live in the 80s.
I'm talking about current chinese products, not even products 10 years ago
You are so lost in your own bubble. You realise that some is the best cnc machines by Yamazaki Mazak are made in China. If you have been to international trade shows, some of the best stuff comes from China. The top zipper company YKK has the majority of their parts made in China now. BMW and Merc parts are mostly made in China.
Certain things aren't even a question of "does China make good quality [insert product]." They are literally the only people making it because they're pioneering manufacturing technics.
As someone who bought custom cnc parts, textiles materials, and custom plastic parts, the quality, customer service and turnaround time is amazing. This stuff isn't even cheap anymore, they are just reasonably priced.
You said to buy Japan and Germany made. Do you even know what that means? Find me one everyday electronic product that is completely made in Japan or Germany. You can't because it doesn't exist
Admit it, you are living in the 80s and you are also a racist. Your time has come and left. Time to move on old man.
@thispasito: I give examples that are accessible to the common man. Anyone can buy and compare a Chinese knive to a German or Japanese one. And you can also find out, with a bit of googling, why the Chinese product is inferior.
You give examples that are obscure, in that they are unaffordable to purchase, would only be purchased by a specialist, and don't have plain explanations. The website of that company doesn't even specify where their machines are made, only that they have 5 factories in Japan and 2 in China and several others in other countries. I suppose we're just supposed to take your word for it that some of their best machines are made in China. Personally I'd guess that they produce some lower end machines in China, and that this has lowered the quality of these offerings, based on what I've seen in other domains. They have a factory in India.. does that mean that India is producing top quality stuff in your view?
Obviously the source of semiconductors today is Taiwan, who use American designs with European machines, which in my view is in the same category as Japan and Germany in that domain. The Taiwanese are Chinese but they are not run by the CCP and that is what makes all the difference. Ethnocultural differences do exist, but this doesn't mean the Chinese are genetically incapable of putting a halt to gutter oil production.
In some domains, the Chinese have undercut and bankrupted all competition to the point that all that remains is Chinese made. But this is all just typically low-level knick-knack crap we can do without or get 2nd hand. I think I'll live without a source of manufacturer certified plastic brackets for car batteries and Squishmallows Plush Bluetooth Headphones. And if there is an alternative, it might be some other 3rd world country. Some things just don't last or work as well as they used to and we just have to put up with that until maybe Trump's novel efforts or Xi deciding to go to war forces a reshoring of industry, but most things you can find western/1st world sources which are invariably superior quality.
People are so hung up on crappy Chinese made goods… when they buy it from Amazon/Ebay from companies sellers who's names a random letters/words
They're no different to the small and big companies who "drop ship" goods from China.
We all love Kmart, why because its good quality of its cheapness… the margins on these products must be abysmal. I assume Kmart has made some good deals or have sone over seer in China to keep the good enough quality.
My mate who works as an expat in China, confirmed this, he buys the quality version in China that are not sold here, because we (importeres and consumers) dont want to pay
ie
a company will buy a $1 product from China, after additional costs of say $2 will sell it for $10They could buy a better a version for say $1.50 The additional costs are still the same $2.. so they should sell it for say $13-14…. nope they will want to sell it for $20 instead
It’s always pleasing to remember that these luxury brands the masses aspire to buy from are commodity luxury - there’s a reason they’re priced at the upper end of what the middle class can reasonably afford and why there’s actual showrooms in most cities. Really real luxury products aren’t accessible to the normal man income-wise and often don’t even advertise. Your mate who took out that loan to get a low-mid Merc hasn’t heard of them…
This has been happening for years in the bike industry.
Pinarello (the Lamborghini of racing bikes) would build their carbon frames in China because it was far cheaper and ship them to Italy where they'd be painted and get their "made in Italy stamp"
The debate existed weather painting them was enough of the manufacturing process to warrant the sticker. Pinarello went to court over it and won because they successfully argued that something like 70% of the frames value came from the paint process…
Although it doesn't help their case when you can buy essentially the exact same painted fram for peanuts out of China with very similar QA/QC
I actually find it funny thay Ozbargainers arent all up in arms to know that the same factories producing the same goods offer the same products. Buy the inflated end result or direct without the wrapper or ceremony. Surely Ozbargain would be more about value for money rather than brand gimics?
There is a difference between "buying direct from the Chinese OEM" and "buying a fake from China." The problem is it's almost impossible to figure out which is which, but when your goods arrive, you can tell immediately: funky smelling items that are mis-shapen/crumpled, poorly packaged, improper accessories, mis-printed logos, dodgy stitching, etc. Even basic materials are all misidentified. Metal, leather, wood - often turns out to be plastic.
If you can identify who is the OEM selling quality items, you would be mad not to buy from them and waste your money. But how can you identify them? People say "check the reviews" - but they're all fake! Photos are all fake/copied from the name brand website. People on social media are not posting links because they're either being censored by the platform, or they're dropshipping/affiliate-linking, or just plain gatekeeping. Trial-and-error to find quality goods can be extremely costly. Some brands might simply not even be made in China at all.
There are some funny stories where China "faked" omega x swatch speedmasters. The replicas were better quality and lasted longer than the genuine thing. Sapphire crystal glass, straps that were indistinguishable all for less than the real thing.
So many people are about to get scammed with this whole “buy direct from OEM facotry” every Chinese seller on TikTok are calling themself OEM factory.
I know someone who sell fake goods overseas who jumped on this hype and start posting they are selling bags directly from OEM factory but those are intact cheap fake. Her business 10x since this whole saga began. She said the buyers are fully happy with the products thinking they are real because most of the customers never touched the real one before so there’s no way of them knowing if it’s fake or not.
Manufacturering precision is now top class in China. Most cuts, joints, stitching, welding procedures etc are done by robotics in China. The western media will want you to believe that its low cost labour in a dull factory somewhere, with no QC, but the reality is that China has long shifted to automation. Time to wake up rather than throw around stereotypes that arent relevant anymore. Getting ripped off for parts made in China? You're more likely being ripped off paying for something that isnt because it would more costly and probably worst in quality.
I wonder how much of it is real. Sure there might be the same OEM factory but are they using the same materials or something that just looks the same? Or is there someone faking pretending 2b the OEM factory?
Oh yeah plenty of sellers on dhgate are now claiming to be OEM factory when they are not and poeple are actually buying into it. A friend of mine is in this business and she said business is booming because of this. For example something that is used to sell for $120 are now selling for $180 by just putting a new product picture up with something like “direct OEM factory” or “genuine without the logo”
That is what I worry about. Although for fashion when literally is just about the looks it's not a huge problem but for other things
People don’t buy these luxury good for “quality”. They are buying it because of the name of the name of the brand and the social status that come with it.
wear a real rolex or carry a loui vutton bag but sits in economy or take public transport = you buy fake stuff
Wear fake Rolex and carry a fake LV bag but drive a Ferrari and fry business class/first class = you buy real stuff
If eff up way of thinking but it’s just how the world works
and fry business class/first class
Burn the rich!
Heuheuheuhe
I just came across a packet of HONG KONG Dim Sims.
Says on the packet that they are made in Australia.
Wild times!
I'm sure luxury goods manufacturers have always existed inside China. Its just its easier for suppliers to service their local population first before export. As China's middle class grows and their expendable income grows so does their local appetite for luxury goods.
There are documentaries on the Chinese wine industry that show Chinese wineries winning international awards.
Its just a well kept secret. Luxury brands are created by marketing. I think of Mercedes and Coca Cola marketing in Australia. In their home countries Mercedes are used as Taxis in Germany. Pepsi easily are market leader in the USA. It shows how effective advertising is on Australians.
If you count Taiwan as China then Apple chips and Nvidia chips are luxury products manufactured from China. Just marketed as designed in the US.
Applying occam's razor to the wine awards, one would assume those awards come from bribes or western entities trying to appease the Chinese to get market access
You ever go to China? Almost the entire country is covered in choking smog half the time, and every square inch of soil has been used as farmland and treated with toxic chemicals or used as a dumping ground for decades.
Maybe pollutants make wine taste good though, I don't know. I'm not a wine expert.
If you count Taiwan as China then
Yeah they're China, but nothing to do with the current mainland incarnation of China that everyone thinks of when you say "Made in China".
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didn't know you're still into tin hat….welcome to the world boomers