Trouble with Getting Back The Bond Amount

snowcold on 30/01/2017 - 21:02
Last edited 31/01/2017 - 09:52 by 1 other user

Hello All,

I have recently moved out from my rental property after long 4.5 years. As long as I was there, my agent / landlord gave me any trouble. And I did keep my end of the rental agreement fair by maintaining and looking after the property well. However, when I mentioned that I am moving out, he was insistent on me using his own cleaner. I found that person really expensive, so I went on to OneFlair and found a cheaper cleaner. And I was really happy with the outcome. It was not impeccable, but it was more than good.

I returned my keys on Friday and today I got a call from my agent stating that the property is 'not livable' and he is getting his own cleaner for $160 once again. I told him that I am not paying for the cleaner and I did not agree with his statement that the property is 'not livable'. I told him that I am happy to either pay $50 for whatever cleaning left, or get my cleaner back and ask them to go through the areas in which he is not happy with. We agreed that he will check with the Landlord and get back to me.

Didn't hear from him for the rest of the day and he did not answer my call as well. Around Seven o clock, I got a handful of emails with pictures of dirt from extreme corners (He pulled out the dishwasher, hard to reach corners etc.) and another mail stating that he has employed his cleaner to do the job tomorrow even without giving me an option to employ my own cleaner.

As far as I know, in Victoria, I do not have to live up to his extreme standards. I did give the house back in a respectable state.

I have no idea what my options are. Could you please help me with it if you had an experience like this?

Home & Garden

Comments

  • tomsco on 30/01/2017 - 21:13
    +1

    Did you do a final inspection with the agent?

    • snowcold on 30/01/2017 - 21:19

      He did the final inspection by himself around noon

      • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 08:00
        +2

        Did he give you the opportunity to attend the inspection with him?

        • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 09:59

          We did not specifically talked about it. But I am sure he would have been happy for me to be there.
          He is not a bad person. Either is has extreme standards and want to benefit the landlord or he wants commission from the cleaner

        • stirlo on 31/01/2017 - 15:04
          +6

          @snowcold: If he's scamming you to get a commission from his cleaner mate he IS a bad person

      • thatonethere on 31/01/2017 - 14:56
        +5

        From my experience never let an RA or landlord do the inspection without you present.

        Often you can resolve issues on the spot - eg missed wiping down a cupboard you can sort it there and then without them saying entire kitchen is filthy and working themselves up into an angry lather.

  • jelko on 30/01/2017 - 21:18
    +3

    You thought paying $160 was too much for an exit clean? How much did your cleaner charge? Do you think it was worth saving a few dollars?

    • snowcold on 30/01/2017 - 21:22

      I have already paid $150 for the cleaner + $120 for a steam clean, and I had been cleaning the property bit by bit for the past two months as well. I was very happy with the results and I wanted to return the property in a good condition since I had no trouble with these guys in the last 4+ years. However, it is impossible to clean the house spotless and the place is right next to a busy street. So it gets really dusty

      • Randxyz123 on 31/01/2017 - 22:29
        +8

        You saved $10 by using your own cleaner? Are you insane?

        Yes you have rights but why make things difficult for yourself.

        If his cleaner was $160 and yours was $60 then yeah that's worth it but $10 isn't worth saving to go through this s****

        Good luck OP.

        Try the tenants union iPhone app.

        • tomsco on 31/01/2017 - 22:52
          +2

          Guessing $160 would not have been the original quote, but the quote to fix up the things still outstanding.

          Even so, adding the steam clean on to it, couldn't imagine it being significantly more than $270.

        • Kangal on 01/02/2017 - 16:38
          +1

          @tomsco:
          Not sure, but I'm guessing the OP did tidy the area and spotted $270 for his cleaner.
          For him to say this and stand by it, I think the landlord's cleaner may have wanted to charge in excess of $450+.

          If that's the case, then I agree with the OP.
          Sounds a bit scammy from the landlord's side. But no-one here can honestly know since we don't really know the state of the mess left by the OP and his cleaner.

  • mgh4me on 30/01/2017 - 21:30
    +11

    Claim the bond money back before they do which will force them to chase you for the money rather than other way around.

    • snowcold on 30/01/2017 - 21:40

      Can I lodge it online? I am looking at the https://rentalbonds.vic.gov.au website and it is allowing me to lodge a claim without a VCAT order number. Or am I looking at a completely wrong website?

      • 2jzzzz on 30/01/2017 - 22:15
        +1

        That looks like it. You should have that number in your original paperwork. You won't have a VCAT number if you havn't gone yet.

    • 2jzzzz on 30/01/2017 - 22:14
      +4

      100%. If there is even a tiny sniff that they will try to unfairly keep some money, lodge the return yourself first. They then have to take you to VCAT (or your state alternative). Take photos and write anything down as evidence.

      • elliebargain on 31/01/2017 - 12:37
        +2

        YES! What they said! Seriously! My housemates and I were in a similar situation:

        Five college students / just out of uni, two of them wanted to just pony up for a cleaner, two of them didn't want to pay and said they'd rather we all pitch in and clean it ourselves. I wouldn't have minded paying, but didn't mind cleaning either. So just the three of us cleaned our huge, old, five bedroom Queenslander (which somehow never looked spotless due to peeling paint, dust ect) It took us three days straight of trying to get it gleaming, and the landlady still was unhappy in the end, even after we went back to redo the garden and a few other things. They didn't say they were holiding the bond, but they didn't release it either - they stopped returning phone calls - eventually we put in the form to the bond refund form to the rental tribunal, and basically they had a few weeks to respond - they missed their cut off date (which wasn't surprising - to get simple things fixed in the house used to take months of chasing her) and we finally got our bond back in full.

        If I could do it over I would just hire whatever bond cleaner they recommend and be done with it. The three-four days of sweating it out wasn't worth it when we could have just split it for $80 each or whatever. But you live and learn… In my experience unfortunately usually rental properties seem to be handed over in not great shape, and expectations for it to be completely spotless.

        Anyway, ramble over - What they said - Take photos, put in your refund request for the bond and they will have to cough up :)

        • Jalif on 01/02/2017 - 01:16
          +6

          I had a landlord quote a $200 for a clean after we left a rental.

          The reason for the fee?

          We left a biro on the kitchen windowsill.

          I sorted that out myself.

        • elliebargain on 01/02/2017 - 08:52
          +2

          @Jalif: Insane!

        • Kangal on 01/02/2017 - 16:41
          +10

          @elliebargain:
          I know right! Who would leave a biro in the kitchen windowsill??

    • lgacb08 on 01/02/2017 - 11:22

      Nah, don't think in Vic you could do that. If you don't have agent/ll signature then you've to have vcat decision to have the bond released

    • goms on 01/02/2017 - 12:13

      This 100%. In NSW you can lodge claim of bond money without agent's signature. If they don't agree, they will be the one who needs to lodge the application to the tribunal. If they have claimed the bond money first, then you will be the one who needs to lodge the application to the tribunal if you don't agree. Application fee is $50.

      Check the laws in VIC and see if you can make a claim without the agent's signature.

      I went through the same situation a couple months ago and ended up going to the tribunal but settled by conciliation without going to the actual hearing. I hired a cleaner for $330 but the agent / landlord was not satisfied and hired another cleaner to do another cleaning. Some agents are really an ass and they will do anything to squeeze out of your bond money.

      I'd say fight as much as you can and even make complains to the dept of fair trading which was advised by the conciliator. My matter didn't go to the hearing because the amount was "small" and not "economically worth it" to pursue…

    • d86 on 01/02/2017 - 22:54

      ^ THIS.
      I was in the same situation as a TS. After a week long dispute with an agent I decided to lodge this form via email http://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/pdfs/about_us/forms/claim_… . The agent won't take you to the tribunal, as it will cost him more than the cleaning.

  • cinnamink on 30/01/2017 - 23:02
    +2

    Just curious is there only dirt behind the dishwasher and corners? My sister owns a rental property and there was a time she asked me to clean the house for her after the tenants moved out. I also pulled out the furniture and electronics just so I could clean the dust behind/under the appliances, only to find out there were all sorts of rubbish: empty bottles, cigarette cases, candy wrappers, receipts… So I don't think your landlord is being unreasonable for checking behind the dishwasher/corners, since you said you already hired a professional cleaner for the task.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 07:02
      +1

      I'll share some photos in the evening. No bottles or cig butts

  • voteoften on 31/01/2017 - 02:58
    +3

    I probably would have gone with the $160 clean, that way if they had an issue, it would be their cleaner who was having to come back.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 06:58
      +2

      $160 clean is after I spent $150 on my cleaner. I'm sure he would have quoted way more than that if I would have engaged him initially.

      • ChickenTalon on 01/02/2017 - 00:46
        +9

        In your original post you said

        I found that person really expensive

        now you're saying

        I'm sure he would have quoted way more than that if I would have engaged him initially.

        So what is it?? He was expensive, or you thought he would be more expensive??

  • Geewhizz on 31/01/2017 - 06:21

    If you're paying someone to do an exit clean, they should be doing things like pulling out dishwashers etc to clean beneath them.

    It was not impeccable,

    It should have been. Given that your bond was at stake you shouldn't have settled for anything less, but I think you've worked that out.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 07:01
      +1

      I had a lot going on and I wasn unable to sit on their head. And I am sure the Victorian law says that the property should be cleaned well and presentable; not impeccable.

    • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 08:16
      +11

      It should have been

      Rubbish. This idea that end of tenancy cleans need to leave the property in "as new" condition is simply wrong. It needs to be reasonably clean, not impeccable. That's the tenants obligation.

      If the landlord wants it cleaner they can pay for it. That is NOT what a bond is for.

  • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 08:14
    +8

    You have to leave the property in a clean and presentable condition less regular wear and tear. Here it is directly from the Tenants Union of Victoria:

    When you move out, you must leave the property in a reasonably clean condition. This doesn’t necessarily mean that you must steam clean the carpets, although landlords and agents often try to insist that you do this. What is considered ‘reasonably clean’ can depend on how long you have lived in the property and what state it was in when you moved in.

    You have evidence showing a professional clean. If your landlord has further issues (eg dirt behind dish washer) ask them to detail the issues in an email and arrange a time for the landlord to let you in so you can fix the issues yourself.

    If they have hired their cleaner without giving you an option, refuse to pay, stating that you'd already cleaned and you're happy to fix up any minor issues yourself but the expense of a second cleaner is excessive.

    If it seems like they're not going to play ball, lodge your bond application asap so the onus is on them to dispute it.

    This kind of thing happens way too often and so many tenants are too scared to stick to their legal rights. Landlords know this so they try to bully bond money out of everyone, often successfully. I keep the properties I stay in immaculate and yet still twice I've had a Real Estate try to claim a portion of the bond. Both times I've politely but clearly stated my obligations, both times they've backed down when it's clear I'm happy to go to tribunal to exercise my rights as a tenant. Both still provide me with great references.

    I'd suggest you make contact with the Tenants Union of Victoria as they'll have dealt with this a million times before and will even give you template emails to send.

    Good luck and don't be bullied into paying more than you're required to.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 08:57

      Thank you for the response. I don't intent to be bullied into paying for what they want.Especially when I had to throw underwear and socks from the shelves after I moved in.

      If it seems like they're not going to play ball, lodge your bond application asap so the onus is on them to dispute it.

      How do I do this without a VCAT order? Or you are suggesting that I go to VCAT before them?

      • tomsco on 31/01/2017 - 09:59

        Especially when I had to throw underwear and socks from the shelves after I moved in.

        This is a whole new ball game. What was the incoming condition report like? Do you still have a copy?

        I don't know if this makes me a slob, but dust behind the dishwasher is a non-issue for me (rubbish as cinnamink pointed out is different), but another person's socks and jocks is just gross - especially considering they are much more visible than a bit of dust behind a dishwasher.

        • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 10:28

          They did a condition report and I have noted down the main things - like marks and scuffs. However, I ignored some dust and things like that and cleaned it up myself. At this point, I am sure the condition report they gave me did not have the most recent photos since they reused (at least) 4.5 year old photos for relisting the property when I was vacating it this month.

          His points are:
          1. oven is not clean, contains residue of the cleaning products - I agree and happy to clean it again. However, he expects it be excellent. The oven is old and was not in a great condition (inside) when I got it. I do not have any pictures of the
          2. Sliding door grooves contains dirt - he has got a photo proving that and I have a photo proving that it was cleaned. May be it got dusty after I cleaned it.
          3. Dust underneath dishwasher, gas stove, bathroom ventilation windows etc. - Agree, but I am not planning to do a deep clean according to his standards.

        • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 11:53
          +2

          @snowcold:

          1. oven is not clean, contains residue of the cleaning products - I agree and happy to clean it again. However, he expects it be excellent. The oven is old and was not in a great condition (inside) when I got it. I do not have any pictures of the

          Buy some Oven Cleaner from Coles/Woolies. A few bucks. Spray it, use gloves, clean it out after 10 mins. It'll take 15 mins to clean - take pictures during and after the clean.

          1. Sliding door grooves contains dirt - he has got a photo proving that and I have a photo proving that it was cleaned. May be it got dusty after I cleaned it.

          If your photos differ and yours predates his then you're fine. If you're already there cleaning the oven then take 2 minutes to wipe them with a damp cloth. 2 minutes, zero effort, problem solved.

          1. Dust underneath dishwasher, gas stove, bathroom ventilation windows etc. - Agree, but I am not planning to do a deep clean according to his standards.

          If he can take a picture of it then you can get your hand there - no need to move any appliances, just wipe underneath with a damp cloth as far as you can reach. 5 mins tops. Done.

          That fixes his 3 problems with ~20 mins effort. Just make him agree in writing upfront that these are his only concerns. 20 mins effort is certainly better than a VCAT hassle or a $160 cleaning bill. Just make sure he writes down his issues in an email prior so you have it in writing.

        • tomsco on 31/01/2017 - 14:15
          +1

          @snowcold: Did you note stuff like the socks and jocks.

          Defs try to follow up as the-mal has suggested, if that's it it shouldn't take long, but if they want to cause problems and it ever got to arbitration, I'm sure if you could show stuff like jocks/socks and scuff marks being included, you could try arguing there was dust as well, you just didn't feel it was significant to the other major concerns thus didn't list it.

          Seriously… a bit of dirt in a sliding door track (assuming external door), what a petty complaint.

        • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 14:25
          +1

          @tomsco:

          As you have guessed, I did not note down such things when I moved in since I thought it was silly.
          If you think that him complaining about the dirt was petty, he complained to me - verbally over the phone - that there is a hair in one of the shelves :P

      • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 11:48
        +9

        How do I do this without a VCAT order? Or you are suggesting that I go to VCAT before them?

        If you can't agree, initiate VCAT yourself. I'd let the landlord know their options in writing - something like:

        Landlord,

        1) If you note down the areas that need further cleaning to become reasonably clean as per my obligation then I will happily arrange a mutually convenient time to come and clean them myself to ensure the full return of the Bond.

        2) I do not agree to having any further professional cleaning done. Please do not engage any other cleaner at cost as I do not agree to be liable for this costs. As stated above I am happy to do the cleaning myself in addition to the professional cleaning I have already had completed.

        3) If we can not agree that the condition is left reasonably clean as per my obligation as a tenant then we should go to VCAT to have the situation resolved. I'm hopeful we can avoid this inconvenience by agreeing to the two steps above.

        Kind regards,
        snowcold

        Here it is as per TUV:

        If you and your landlord/agent or owner cannot agree on the division of the bond, you may apply to VCAT for a hearing to resolve the matter. Application forms are available from the VCAT website (see the Related information section below for details) or by calling 03 9628 9800.

        As a tenant or resident, you may apply to VCAT for a hearing relating to bonds at any time after the end of the tenancy or residency.

        If you receive an order from VCAT directing the RTBA to release the funds, a Bond Claim form must be completed with payment details. The complete VCAT order must also be attached to the form. You do not need the signature of the landlord/agent or owner.

        • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 14:01

          @the-mal

          thank you so much for your help. Will give it a go.

  • bobbified on 31/01/2017 - 09:29

    I told him that I am not paying for the cleaner and I do agree with his statement that the property is 'not livable'.

    This sentence doesn't quite make sense. Did you mean to say that you did NOT agree?

    Because if actually do agree that the property is not liveable, then you definitely need to get it cleaned properly so that is IS liveable.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 09:52
      +1

      Yes. My bad. Fixed it

  • urahara on 31/01/2017 - 10:32

    Just curious here , what if the property has damages which needs to be cleaned/repaired and ones which cannot be cleaned/repaired.
    For ex : I've mat which I was unable to clean even after going for steam cleaning

    • the-mal on 31/01/2017 - 11:43

      If it's reasonable wear and tear then you're not liable. If it's unreasonable (burn marks, holes, large stains etc) then you're liable.

    • Gronk on 31/01/2017 - 11:45

      In most cases that will fall under 'fair wear and tear' because it is expected that the property will incur some damage - ie: scuffs on walls, carpet discolouration and wear, minor chips and dents as a result of moving in or out.

      The owner can pursue you to pay for damage if it's deemed negligent or willful, so if it's obvious you haven't looked after the property or that you've intentionally damaged it then you may end up having to contribute toward or pay for repairs in full.

      In between those statements is a bit of a grey area, because there's no black and white definition of exactly what constitutes fair wear and tear, it's all open to interpretation.

    • Cheeper on 31/01/2017 - 11:54

      If it is regular wear and tear nothing more you can do than having it cleaned.
      If it is damage from a stain or burn that cant be removed then just replace it with one of equal quality.
      Ask the agent when they do their next inspection.

      • urahara on 31/01/2017 - 18:17
        +1

        @all
        Thanks for the info
        As I said my carpet/mat is not as clean as it should be and has few wear and tear sign. I tried steam cleaning but didnt work out really well.Paid $250 bucks for nothing.
        But since I'm not moving as of now hence doesn't really matters.

  • Gronk on 31/01/2017 - 11:52

    Did you take photos of the property after cleaning? This is probably going to be your only hope, without them I'm not sure if there'll be much you can do that won't result in a 'he said / she said' type scenario because you don't have anything which proves your argument.

    The owner can recommend a cleaner but they have absolutely no right to demand that you use a specific cleaner to clean the property, as long as you provide a receipt to prove that the property has been cleaned by professionals then you've done your bit. Most cleaners who offer end-of-tenancy cleaning services will offer a 'bond gaurantee' where they will return to the property and address any issues raised by the owner or agent - did the cleaners you used not offer this? Because if so I'd be asking them to return and finish the job.

    • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 14:18

      I do have photos and some videos. They are not extremely detailed since I wasn't expecting this argument. I am hoping what I have is good enough to prove that property was cleaned properly since it shows the entire rooms.

  • John Kimble on 31/01/2017 - 12:38

    I was advised to always go with one of the cleaner(s) that the real estate agent recommended. That way you avoid this issue in the first place because they have a good relationship with the real estate agent and in the off chance they do not do a good job in the first place (which they should because they know the standard required), the real estate agent will liaise directly with the cleaner to get it sorted without you having to get involved again.

    • FW190 on 31/01/2017 - 16:15
      +4

      the cleaners have a good relationship with agents because they get kick backs, and that is the only reason why they insist on using their own people

      it is a sad way to survive, but not my issue if they didn't work hard during school/want to make a quick and easy buck.

      I learnt my lesson early on, and would pick a cleaner who offers guarantee to come back and re-clean the place until the landlord/agent is happy, that would usually shut these bottom feeding scums up (but looks like in the OP's case, the scumbag is trying to force the OP to pay for cleaning eitherway)

      • John Kimble on 31/01/2017 - 16:38

        Huh? As per below, that's pretty much what I said (except for the kickbacks); the end result is the same.

        …in the off chance they do not do a good job in the first place (which they should because they know the standard required), the real estate agent will liaise directly with the cleaner to get it sorted without you having to get involved again.

        Who are you referring to below? The cleaners? Not sure if cleaning is a quick and easy buck…

        Also, pretty sure partners, referrals, commissions etc is how the would works in lots of industries. As long as it is not illegal (ie kickbacks) and they do a competent job at a reasonable/market price, I don't see the issue.

        it is a sad way to survive, but not my issue if they didn't work hard during school/want to make a quick and easy buck.

        • FW190 on 31/01/2017 - 19:03
          +1

          Who are you referring to below? The cleaners? Not sure if cleaning is a quick and easy buck…

          the property managers, low/no skill, don't want to put in an effort, willing to sell their integrity (if they had any to begin with) just so they could extract another $50 out of you, at least the RE agents have to put in some effort to make a sale.

          I don't have issues with the cleaners doing a honest day's work for a honest day's pay, and paying kickbacks to these scumbags just to start afloat.

  • bs0 on 31/01/2017 - 15:56

    $160 is not too bad… One previous agent suggested a cleaner that charged $300-400 … And my roommates' said yes

    • John Kimble on 31/01/2017 - 16:13

      Yeah, I guess it depends on the location and size of the place…

      • bs0 on 31/01/2017 - 16:51

        Yeh fair point.
        For context, small townhouse with three bedrooms, 1 bathroom + 1 ensuite. And rural, not metro.

  • KaTst3R on 31/01/2017 - 16:19
    +3

    The trick when leaving a property is to use the agent's recommended cleaner (although he/she might have a kickback arrangement) because the agent cannot fault you for not cleaning the house properly as the cleaners are recommended by them. If you have used your own cleaner, it is almost certain the agent will try their best to find issues with the house. There are like a thousand possible areas to check that most people wont think off. Examples like the corner of the dishwasher, air vents above the stove, top of doors, glass door of shower have water stains, AC filter dirty, kitchen cabinet doors have oil stains which cannot be seen in low light, etc. Some of my friends learned it the hard way.

  • snowcold on 31/01/2017 - 16:59
    +2

    Well, I am not planning to be bullied into paying him whatever he wants. I intent to fight back and I have legal rights to do so. Wish your friends did the same

  • msmhw on 31/01/2017 - 17:16
    +1

    As far as I know, in NSW you are not required to hire someone to clean the apartment and neither the landlord or the agent can force you to do so.
    As long as you clean it by yourself that's fine (you don't even need to do steam cleaning).

  • benderz on 31/01/2017 - 17:37

    My old landlord was a nightmare and I knew there would be issues so I used their recommended cleaner.
    Sure enough, the landlord wasn't happy. The cleaner went back once and still not happy. She wanted to take the whole bond due to issues I picked up and noted in the initial property report, nonsense e.g. watermark on the bath and some minor stuff which I believe counted as normal wear and tear considering I had been there 5yrs.

    I decided to go to Vcat. 1 week before the hearing she came back with an offer to take half the bond. I refused and said I wanted to proceed to Vcat but offered $150 to avoid the inconvenience. She accepted.

    • jlogic on 01/02/2017 - 21:32

      What a bi*tch. All that for $150. She must have health issues being so strung up like that.

      • benderz on 02/02/2017 - 14:48

        She was just a difficult landlord. There were a lot of niggling things she did to annoy the rental agency and myself during the lease so it was no surprise when this happened.
        I was a bit disappointed she accepted the $150 as I wanted to go to Vcat because she was so unreasonable.

  • Shame on 31/01/2017 - 18:33

    There is an Android and iPhone app put out by the Victorian state government which is an easy way to find out what the laws are when it comes to renting. See RentRight. The app also has email templates for common things like repairs, etc.

    Another good source of information is the Tenants' Union of Victoria

    To your bond, you must leave the property in "a reasonably clean condition" according to the tenants' union. You best option is to threaten to take them to VCAT to get your bond back because if they are rational they won't waste 3 hours out of their day just to make $160. Also, applying to VCAT for a bond dispute is free.

    • goms on 01/02/2017 - 12:29

      My agent was not rational and he pursued going to the tribunal to make $100. I think they just hasn't got anything better to do other than crushing their tenants.

      • tomsco on 01/02/2017 - 14:59

        And I guess they also bill the LL for the hours. So, $100 for the landlord, but possibly hundreds of billable hours.

        I could be wrong, though.

  • theguyrules on 31/01/2017 - 18:55
    +5

    Classic.
    We've moved into places that aren't that clean, and then been told our bond clean wasn't good enough after making it considerably cleaner than when we moved it.
    They're so dodgy.

  • Mrgreenz on 31/01/2017 - 20:13
    +3

    Just go with whoever the agent reccomends unless its like twice as expensive. Cleaning yourself takes too long and if you have to go back/pay remedials your already behind just paying the agent recomended clean.

  • Hirolol on 31/01/2017 - 20:54

    shouldnt it be left the way it was when you moved in?

    • snowcold on 01/02/2017 - 05:37

      Better than that

  • AlanHB on 01/02/2017 - 06:44
    +3

    Wow looks like a lot of people have fallen into this rental trap before and have the same advice. I'll just restate/add my own spin.

    Ask the landlord who they want to do the end of lease clean and use them. If they have an issue with the cleanliness of the house after, tell them to discuss it with their nominated cleaner.

  • thriftybunny on 01/02/2017 - 08:50

    Did you take photos of the property where it was clean? That usually helps with your side of the story if you chose to take it further.
    I think the idea is that as long as the new tenants are OK with it, because new tenants can request for a clean up if they are not happy with it, but if they were happy then usually the landlord don't care.
    PS, Sorry if someone already said this, I don't have time to read through the entire thread.

  • bocca on 01/02/2017 - 08:57

    more importantly do you have the before photos?

    also yes, always inspect with the agent.

  • mp3police on 01/02/2017 - 09:18

    I cleaned exit rentals for the realestate for a bit and average around $300 a job easy.
    If u want blinds cleaned hand cleaned just because of the amount of time it takes can go way up.

  • OzzyOzbourne on 01/02/2017 - 12:36
    +3

    Landlords / rental agencies are "beep". We were great tenants, no issues, and left the place spotless. The agency inspected without us there and found a single empty plastic drinks bottle in a kitchen cupboard. Instead of just picking it up and dropping it in the bin on the way out, they told us to drive a total of 150km to get the keys off them, drive to the house and put the bottle in the rubbish and drop the keys back with them otherwise they'd withhold the bond. Their attitude stinks towards tenants.

    I'm not surprised some tenants forgo the bond and just leave the place in a mess

    • tomsco on 01/02/2017 - 15:01

      Wow, new low.

      Don't tell me you went?

      I'd like to see them dispute that -

      "We are wanting to withhold bond as we hired a cleaner to clean up the one piece of rubbish you found."
      "Did you think to just throw out that one piece of rubbish yourself?"

    • username999 on 01/02/2017 - 19:55

      That's such a scumbag move if its true. I can't believe there's people like that out there. Geez

  • Shira on 01/02/2017 - 13:47
    +3

    I would suggest that take them to the VCAT. It is not compulsory to hire professional cleaner to clean the house. House should be reasonably clean.

  • CHIEFMEGADETH on 01/02/2017 - 15:27
    +3

    When we left our last place. agent wanted to use their cleaner? So we did? and they still tried to be dodgy. They said cleaner didn't clean properly, So they need to get another cleaner?
    We where like lol WTF no no no no nooooo we used your cleaner, If you want it cleaned again. then we ain't paying shit. Then they tried other options to try and get money out of us. lucky my wife knew someone one who owned another real estate of the same company. So he told us what to say. Even than they kept pushing. in the end they gave up and refunded our bond.

    They where scumbags the whole way. lucky my wife kept all her emails and pictures.

    • tomsco on 01/02/2017 - 16:04

      Did you report to Fair Trading?

    • theguyrules on 01/02/2017 - 16:59
      +3

      This thread is making me angry. I should stop reading it!

    • AlanHB on 01/02/2017 - 18:40
      +1

      Wow what scumbags dude. I had one that altered the payout figures on the bond form AFTER we had signed it, and then filed it with the court.

      Obviously we objected, but even at the risk of being found guilty of fraud they wouldn't drop it.

      I then filed a complaint with our Territory's equivalent of Fair Trading.

      They immediately gave up and we got the original payout figure we agreed to. Pretty ridiculous when you think about it.

  • cst on 01/02/2017 - 21:09

    It has been my experience in Victoria that they can't take money from your bond unless you sign a written agreement to have the amount deducted from your bond. I have seen terrible tenants be really difficult and refuse to sign and then just get their bond back in full.

  • wallet72 on 02/02/2017 - 11:23

    Wow, deja vu - I had the exact same issue when I moved out after 9 years, but I was in Queensland.

    The matter ended up going to court where I get screwed, and there is no way to appeal it so make sure you use all avenues to solve the problem before hitting court.
    Here's a real quick summary of what the ruling against me was for…

    1. Yes, my cleaner guaranteed their work, and went back once. But the agent was not happy still. My cleaner signed a stat dec stating that she was there when the agent walked through the house and said the cleaning was fine. Magistrate would not accept the stat dec. I asked for photos when the agent complained, which I never got, and the magistrate said it was not up to the agent to provide photos or give any extra chances to clean. I was ordered to pay for full clean.
    2. My cleaner was not a licensed carpet cleaner. When I pointed out there is no licensing scheme for carpet cleaners, the magistrate disagreed. Ordered to pay for carpet cleaning
    3. Pest treatment not done.I pointed out that the owner had paid for one to be done two months earlier. Magistrate said it didn't matter, ordered to pay for pest treatment.
    4. I had written agreement from the agent that I could hand the keys back a few days early and get a rent refund for those days. Magistrate said I did not have the owners' agreement so refund was not happening.

    At the end of the hearing the magistrate said we were great tenants and had kept the property in immaculate condition but there are higher standards of cleanliness and inspections when moving out, and in her experience agents are the best judge of cleanliness and cleaning companies.

  • sovereign01 on 02/02/2017 - 14:30
    +1

    I was in the same situation - I just replied and stated the place is 'reasonably clean' as required by the law and I would not be paying for any further cleaning as it was unreasonable. Never heard back.

    I had a video of me walking around the entire house just before I handed the keys back, so I was prepared to fight it on principle, but it never went beyond that.
    It struck me as a default response to anyone ending their tenancy and a pure cash grab - Don't let them get away with it.

  • z0s0 on 02/02/2017 - 15:11

    Just refuse and take them to VCAT it's easy, cheap and you will most certainly win.

    • snowcold on 02/02/2017 - 21:20

      Thank you. That is what I intent to do. Registered a case with VCAT

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