I have been to specialist doctor number of time and had lot of out of pocket expenses (private hospital+normal check -up)….are these out of pocket expenses tax deductible?
thanks
EDIT:
The post was created to talk about tax relief for those who might have to pay unplanned medical expense. However it seems that people started talking about how much doctor's get paid. it was never an intention to talk about doctor's wages or compare that with other country.
@SydBoy: Nope, she's well informed and unlike most people researches prior to spreading misinformation.
@regenade: Hope you will do well in the school and when you complete schooling make sure you continue your study so that you can make million a year and stop putting your nose into someone's completed conversation…Good luck with school exams!
@darkb: There is no misinformation here, she corrected herself by giving me the link and telling me that it is $160 not $140 what i said above….so don't waste time just check your next patient!
@SydBoy: Nope, not a GP, although unlike you I have nothing but respect for them. There are set criteria for management plans, so while they have different styles, the criteria are unchanged.
Also, you have a strange definition of hysteria ;)
I didn't know that. Can you please tell me what the item number is? Thanks
@DKC: missg already provided the link above, just go through that !
To be honest it's been a very long time since I've had to know the item numbers, before I went to university I was a medical receptionist and had to know them. It may not exist anymore, you'd have to check the schedule. But regardless, a simple script repeat would be a level A consultation which attracts about $15.
Some of the best (and most accessible) health care is in Cuba, one of the poorest nations in the world. So the pay them peanuts and you get monkeys scenario, doesn't hold water. 85% of private health care is aimed at non-urgent, non needed medical intervention (like breast enlargement and liposuction) Virtually none of the money created in the private health system goes towards preventative medicine (like vaccinations and public health education) it goes back to foreign owned health conglomerates like BUPA (which is Indian) Private health care also does NOT alleviate or lessen the burden on the public health system (this is a myth that has been created by this industry) as the majority of private hospitals are NOT set up to take emergency or complex medical cases. So if you are in a life threatening medical situation and in an ambulance you are going to go to a public hospital for assessment and stabilisation, BEFORE you go anywhere near a private hospital.
Bupa (originally the British United Provident Association) is an international healthcare group, with its origins and headquarters in the United Kingdom but now serving 32 million customers in 190 countries. It is not an Indian company.
Some of the best (and most accessible) health care is in Cuba, one of the poorest nations in the world. So the pay them peanuts and you get monkeys scenario, doesn't hold water.
Except thats not the complete cost of health care. THe total cost of running a health system is made uip of many components above and beyond simply the cost of doctors or other staff wages. Machines and blood work isnt free. Cuban hospitals cannot be compared to those in Australia.
We often have our Internet speed compared to Kenya or some 3rd world country…
I never said everything was perfect, but if you want everything to be perfect or the best it costs money.
People want everyting for free, but they forget the world demands money for these things.
Im a training orthopaedic surgeon. So perhaps I can give some input.
Study: Undergrad (3 years), medical school (5 years): basically not working/ small part time job.
Internship: 60-70k. Compared to most other uni grads, we get paid a lot less. I still remember nurses laughing at how they earntbmore after 3 years study. Often we would work 60-70 hours a week. E.g 20-30 HOURS a week of unpaid overtime. Unfortunately our system makes you seem “weak and not efficient” if you claim overtime.
Resident years (years 1-2/3): realistically 70-80k. Again doing average 70 hours a week so I should be getting 100k but I don’t. During resident years you are doing extra courses/degrees to build your CV to get onto a training program. These courses and exams are expensive :( exams:$4000 each, fail, pay again. Average 2-3 day course is 3-5k. Often we do at least 4-5 of these e.g around 20k in short courses. Chuck on a masters degree ( probably 50% of my friends do this), throw another 20k for that. So as a junior doctor unfortunately that 70k (which you did 60 odd hours a week for) quickly depletes with all the post grad courses.
Registrar (specialist training) years:100-110k: start thinking I’m earning some good money! Again though I’m working nearly double my friends who are engineers at the moment and they are easily on 120k+ (perhaps I have high earning friends but even my tradie friends laugh and joke about how little I get paid for working nearly double them). Don’t get me wrong, I’m not complaining of this money, it’s still above average (probably above a lot of ozbargainers here as well) but that 110k has taken me at least 7 years study of earning little money, and on average 30-40k extra on post grad courses and as usual, working 60-70 hour weeks (start work 6.30 finish 1830-1700). Thankfully we get paid overtime for weekend work because frequently we do this (as do residents) so sometimes that makes a 80 hour week. For some reference I work 12 days on, 2 days off.
So when your consultant or private specialist charges you a certain amount, just remember that they have studied nearly a decade of their good years, worked at least 10-20 hours unpaid overtime a week, and sacrificed weekends and family to get to that position. I’ve missed the last 2 Christmas family meetups, missed my best mates birthdays numerous times and blah blah blah you get the idea. Then you need to include the fact that a surgeon/specialist needs to pay for overheads which include reception staff (80k per year per person) rent for office (no idea on that sorry), power ect, theatre room hire, theatre staff hire, and lastly but certainly not least…. insurance (50-100k a year). So it all bloody adds up. So that high fee isn’t all going into the surgeons pocket.
I hope it didn’t turn into sounding like a cry me a violin story. Just making the point that going into medicine for the glory and money is long gone. I could have stayed as an electrician earning 80-100k per year, charging for my actual hours and would be in front a mill or so by now.
Wouldn’t change it for the world, I enjoy helping people and that’s the real value in medicine.
I did read it but unfortunately didn’t have much input there. Sorry :)
The above post was in reply to half your thread being now about exorbitant wages ect. Naturally you defend your profession where warranted. That I’m not sorry for :) but apologies your thread was hijacked!
@sypboy I would take you seriously if you didn't insult people's professions through the comments or insult their literacy skills when your English is sub par in itself. I almost don't feel sorry for your exorbitant medical fees anymore.
Completely agree. If he spent half the time he spent to research whether or not there were tax offsets for medical expenses as he did whinging about the health system, he wouldnt have needed to make this thread.
Simple supply and demand model guys. If you dont want private specialists getting you in reasonable time but charging you what they think their time is worth, wait on the public wait lists for 3 years.
Curious, how much would you be looking at making after you're fully qualified?
It does sound like a rough and expensive road to be in your field! Hopefully you're making a heap at the end of it to make it all worth it.
Wow, you only needed 3 years residency before getting in a training program? Good work. Some of the unaccredited Ortho trainees I know are postgraduate year 10 and still can't get on, many have given up trying in the process.
As someone who has worked for Medicare, I can tell you that specialists here do indeed earn far, far more than their counterparts in Europe (our best man is a specialist in Western Europe). Not only that, but they earn far more than pretty much any other occupation.
Based on what I saw, I think the current Medicare system encourages greed. In the end it is the public that pay for all of this via the Medicare levy. Sure some people will shoot me down, especially those with vested interests in the industry, but the whole sector needs reform. Unfortunately the medical lobby is so powerful, that no government wants to take it on. But as things are at the moment, especially with an aging population, things are unsustainable.
"Not only that, but they earn far more than pretty much any other occupation."
There are so many other occupations that you would do less study and earning a good coin. But the difference is in some other jobs you might have a better work life balance, better conditions, and better benefits.
People in Finance can earn a lot of money (when you include bonuses) within a few years of finishing a 3 year undergrad degree. Programmers that work at the top Internet firms (ie. FB and Google etc) can earn massive coin. Sales people at Google (and even all kinds of top companies in the world) and the like earn a lot.
The list goes on.
The point is that doctors are fairly compensated for the work they put in. The ones that you see personally when you go into emergency department and the like probably earn less than most good wage jobs (they are directed by a well paid doctor though). Only when you have a serious problem (which you don't want) will you see a doctor that earns a big wage (and then his orders will be carried out by a cheaper doctor).
I think it is a shame when GP/Specialists earn 200k/500k and try and max out the wage they can get out of the system to earn maybe a 100k/200k more. But this is the system they are forced to work in and have no free range of what they can chose to charge (and be rebated for). There are always money grubbers in all fields of work.
If you think doctor's earn too much you should sit in with a GP or specialist for a day and see for yourself how much they have to deal with.
There's plenty of specialists coming up who are bulk billing but the ones who charge a large gap still do very well. There's a reason for that, whether it's word of mouth, trust, experience or simply the fact that $5000 to save your life is much more worth it than the $20,000 car you bought anyway
Unfortunately there lies part of the problem. Many GPs don't actually really bother to deal with the issues at hand. Just go down to any large bulk-billing centre (there are plenty around) and time some of the patient visits. In my humble opinion, 5 minutes or less simply is not long enough to get all the information required to make a correct diagnosis. The vast majority of Doctors there rush their patients through, in order to maximise their earnings by seeing more patients. Then of course when the patient has to come back because their issue was not adequately dealt with, they or one of their colleagues, make more money still. Also from the experience of some family members, even many specialists are not really up to scratch. I know there are good Doctors out there, but the system currently does not work properly.
It's a depressing discussion about the greedy uncaring world we live in.
Dunno, I've never claimed on my house insurance, touch wood. Can I claim tax back?
If I was the Minister of Health for AU, I would fire 70% of GPs in Australia.
Most don't even care to ask you any questions that show any sign of real concern or a commitment to fighting the symptom.
The typical scenario is as follows:
@SydBoy: Thats why you are still a Sydney Boy and not yet a MAN !! Grow up, upgrade yourself, study and train for 10 years, you can also make a Million a year, if you have the Brains and IQ, you can do it too.