Should We Allow The OP's Referral Link in Deals?

Is this really something that we need to do? I'd say it is better to remove the ability for OPs to add in their own referral link to a submission.

It is unfair that people who make lots of submissions for non-referral posts get nothing and there is a fierce race to be the first poster on referral posts as there is a huge benefit for only one person (the OP). Second place by seconds gets nothing.

Having only one person get a huge amount of referrals also draws suspicion to referral systems as companies will see it as suspicious that a single user is getting a huge amount.

I think it would be more fair to prevent the OP having their own referral link as the preference in a post. Instead, you could change the referral system algorithm to give slightly more preference/air time to users who submit more posts. Or at least give them at least a tiny advantage over a new user who just joined and added no value in to the site yet.

Thanks!

Comments

  • Thanks all for the discussion. Following analysis and moderator discussion we will be making some changes to the referral system going forward (to be rolled out soon).

    Currently the system shows random referrals only, until the deal hits the front page (30 votes), then the system shows the OP's link and the random links next to it. The idea being that users who post good deals receive additional reward, without forcing users to use their link (the majority of users click the random link). This system evolved over years as mentioned here.

    From comments and analysis, we have found the advantage to the OP can be higher than what is ideal. Going forward the referral randomiser will show random referral links only, no matter how many votes the deal has, however the OP of the deal will have a higher chance of being picked in the randomiser (once the deal hits front page). Similar to what nurries has suggested. This will use a formula that will adjust depending on how many people are in the referral system, to ensure the OP's link isn't shown too many times when the number of users in the referral system is low. If the deal has not hit the front page, there will be no increased chance for the OP in the randomiser, compared to other users.

    This change will also be better for privacy, as a referral link can sometimes contain personal information which can be attributed to the OP's account.

    The change will be rolled out within the next week or so.


    TL;DR: The referral randomiser under deals will no longer contain the OP's link as well as random (once it hits the front page), it will show random only, but the OP will have a higher chance of their code/link being shown (once the deal hits the front page).


    Edit 10/2: This is rolled out now.

    • however the OP of the deal will have a higher chance of being picked in the randomiser (once the deal hits front page)

      Have a figure for that one or is it hush hush?

      • We'll keep it private, it's a formula which isn't very easy to explain, not just a flat multiple or %. Also we may update/tweak the formula in the future, so not having it written in various posts/comments/wikis will avoid obsolete information.

        • That's fair. Though unlikely you wouldn't want people to try and cheat it either I would presume.

  • It needs to stay. It's like a reward for finding and posting the deal the fastest and that's what it's all about, isn't it? Getting the deal out there the fastest. It is in no way unfair as everyone has the same platform to post on. Sounds awfully Karen of you to post this.

    • I think the reward is too large. The could get a little bonus for being first but not such a significant amount.

      And it doesn't give any rewards to people who are the fastest to post non-referral deals.

  • +2

    You mean people make money from posting here?

    Well I'll be a monkey's uncle.

    • +1

      Are you saying you aren’t already?

  • +6

    Having only one person get a huge amount of referrals also draws suspicion to referral systems as companies will see it as suspicious that a single user is getting a huge amount.

    Completely agree from this perspective. I like the idea of a weighting system where the OP's link has a considerably higher chance of showing up when you click on "Random" compared to others.

    • ING voided referrals from OzBargain because of this back in the day.

  • Ah, the meritocratic approach suggestion over the current egalitarian approach.

    How would this work when some referral systems have a referral limit per account per day? No one gets anything?

    • "egalitarian"

      If that is the mindset, may as well take away our badges and voting system too.

      I think gamification, is what made this site, what it is today. Same for many other sites where people volunteer their time.

      • What would you call the current system?

        • WAD :)

  • Just to clarify, for the sake of discussions. Wiki.

    If the OP of the deal has their own referral code for that merchant, it will show up as the first link in the Referral Block (but only after minimum front page votes are received, until then only random referral links will be shown).

    So the OP's referral code will only be show once the deal has hit 30 votes, until then it is random only. It was introduced to reward those who post popular deals, without giving someone who is just posting an unpopular deal for the sake of having their referral link shown, a way to do so. It came from this suggestion, initially it was minimum 5 votes, we then changed it to minimum front page (which is currently 30 votes).

    Anyway feel free to continue discussions, I just wanted to clarify how it works as most members would probably be unaware. If you opened a random referral deal on the front page you would not know that the OPs referral wasn't there initially.

    • +2

      It was introduced to reward those who post popular deals,

      All it does it reward people who are technically first to post popular deals that are for a site that has a referral system in place. And the rewards can be huge.

      Posting a popular deal for a non-referral site not only gives nothing to OP, it actually means they get less referrals in the overall eco-system because for the referral system in general, a larger percentage is going to the top referral deal posters.

      So I suppose the system in place now will aggressively encourage people to post referral deals. It will hugely reward a single person per deal and the rest of people get less. And then anyone who posts a super popular non-referral deal and is first to post gets nothing for the privilege.

      • So I suppose the system in place now will aggressively encourage people to post referral deals.

        So this referral randomiser system has been in place for around 9 years, and it gives the OP the least reward for posting referral deals since OzBargain was started.

        2009: OPs referral link in the description
        2012: OPs referral link in the description & referral randomiser with OP's link and random link
        2015: OPs referral link in the description & referral randomiser with OP's link (once 5 votes are hit) and random link.
        2017: Referral randomiser ONLY with OP's link (once 5 votes are hit) and random link. Referral codes/links banned from all deal descriptions.
        2017 later: Referral randomiser only with OP's link (once frontpage (was 25, now 30 votes) are hit) and random link.

        When I say "It was introduced to reward those who post popular deals", I meant opposed to the previous system which rewarded everyone who posted a referral deal regardless of popularity/votes.

        We are happy to consider further restrictions/different options, as we previously implemented with the referral system, but just wanted to give full context as most would not know the history.

        • +1

          Personally, I think the current system works fine. We've had so many discussions/arguments in the past about referral links, and particular members who posted deals just purely to get referrals (when Groupon was actually popular). Current system rewards OP's only if the deal is popular, not for just simply posting the deal.

          It's a way of rewarding a poster for posting a deal, so what?

        • +1

          Yes it has been in place a long time and I have disagreed with it for a long time.

          The bigger ozbargain gets, the more upvotes and popularity deals will get and the worse the problem becomes. Eventually, the person who gets in first on a good referral deal will make thousands and thousands of dollars. Is that fair? I don't think so.

          • +3

            @watwatwat:

            Eventually, the person who gets in first on a good referral deal will make thousands and thousands of dollars.

            LOL, I know one storyteller member here would claim those figures but you are way off the mark.

            • -1

              @nocure: Idk, some of those American Express deals a few years ago were super lucrative.

              As for nowadays, hundreds to a thousands still seems viable.

              How much do you think Up bank guy is making? 200 upvotes and $15 per referral.

      • -4

        All it does it reward people who are technically first to post popular deals that are for a site that has a referral system in place.

        Alphas are always rewarded. They eat, sleep and have the first choice to mates. It is as nature intended. Anyone that wants this title has to work harder and faster.

  • What about ones that are not really ‘deals’ per say - eg spaceship and recently, stake.

  • How much do we think this guy made in OP? Thousands? https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/601089

    • +1

      The exact example I thought of when this was posted. This guy could have made bank, although there might be limits in the TOCs

      • +4

        It's insane. It really sucks for the others who contribute to this site.

        I know it is sus when people are arguing in the comments about trying to beat each other by 4 seconds because the rewards are HUGE.

        ie. this discourages people to write up a nice description in the submission because that wastes time. Get it in dirty with minimal info to beat others.

        Sounds like a cut throat business but it is surely lucrative.

        ie. get your referral code to appear first and on that submission forever, so any future visitors coming in from google search etc. weeks later will still be using it after the initial surge.

    • +2

      https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/601234 327 votes, 6000 thousand clicks and $70 per referral.

      Even though against the terms and conditions
      https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/601234?page=2#comment-1002…

      It would definitely be smarter to go with the weighting idea - https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/601607#comment-10027965

      before more companies catch on and ban codes from being shared online.

      • Wow I would love to know how much kt made from referrals. Purely for curiosity not mad because I don’t use hello fresh.

    • -1

      But you had the choice to go random referral, what's the issue?

  • Ok - from the new comments. It sounds like the game system should be fixed to prevent edge cases, so that everybody loses? :/

    Wait, this is just capitalism.

  • What’s the difference between posting a deal with a referral code and then making a comment in a thread telling someone to use your referral code? Hardly anything, besides seeing the deal and posting it first, which I agree hardly deserves a reward. Yet one is not allowed? Right… Upvotes are good enough IMO.

    Fact is though life isn’t fair. People can buy all the houses they want if they have the money, if someone has a referral code they should be able to spam it out everywhere. /s

    I liken this to someone getting to the supermarket first and being able to buy all the roast chickens. Just buy them all and leave nothing for anyone else. It’S jUsT cApItAliSm.

    Sincerely,
    A sOcIaLiSt

  • Can't help looking at all the spaceship 'deals' which are posted every month/14 days. When it's always the same repeat people posting the same deal. How many thousands have been made and the way the bonus is structured, it becomes permanent marketing on ozb.

    • Those "repeat people" posting deals are what keeps this site going. People do an awful lot of whinging around here because they don't like the deals people share and yet they don't go around finding their own deals to share.

      • Except the difference is it's the same product with the same offer. If uber and deliveroo changed their referral codes to expire every 14 days then the site will just be constantly advertising their products? Your analogy is frankly incorrect. You really think they are looking to find new deals rather than profit from relisting existing offers??

        • I'm saying those who are always so critical of the deals being posted should start finding new deals to post themselves if they don't like what others are sharing.

        • +1

          Your analogy is frankly incorrect.

          Says the guy who posted 7 deals in 13 years.

  • Damn it! I enjoyed getting the occasional US$5 off US$10 vouchers for posting AliExpress deals.

    • You still will, just probably not as much as previously.

      Going forward the referral randomiser will show random referral links only, no matter how many votes the deal has, however the OP of the deal will have a higher chance of being picked in the randomiser (once the deal hits front page).

      • Yeah I know… it's all good :)

  • Thanks ozbargain for taking on this feedback and working to implement the changes!

    Good job!

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