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Wusthof Epicure 6-Piece Block Set $481.89 + $42.50 Delivery ($0 Prime) @ Amazon US via AU

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I'm not sure if there's a catch here, but I was looking for a set of knives, and found this deal. Bought once, still in the crying process. Includes:

  • Solid acacia wood block
  • 20cm Cook's knife
  • 17cm Santoku knife
  • 9cm Paring knife
  • Scissors
  • Sharpener

From their higher-end line of knives, the Epicure normally has a RRP of $460 for a cook's knife alone and don't often go on huge Baccarat/Global type sales. This set is great in that it includes all the knives you'll use for 99% of the average home cook who has the above-average budget for a set of knives.

FAQ:

  • How does this compare to global?
    It's better.

  • What is the rockwell hardness rating of their steel?
    58

  • Will this make me a better chef?
    Bold of you to assume you're a chef.

  • Is there a review of this?
    Sure is.

Price History at C CamelCamelCamel.

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closed Comments

  • +4

    Pricecamel has the lowest price as $445 on July 1st, 2021

  • +12

    This seems really expensive for what you get…?

      • +1

        Looks like there's something fancy about the epicure ones. Probably some fine quality that 0% of users will notice a difference with. That being said, looks like a great set.

        • +1

          If looked after properly, this set will last for generations and always be razor sharp. IF looked after PROPERLY. I got a set of Henkels (similar to these) 20 years ago, a great investment.

          • +5

            @Wardaddy: Will always be razor sharp if never ever used.

            As good as these knives are, all knives need sharpening to stay razor sharp, and the Rockwell rating of 58 suggests these will be no different and will quite likely hold their edges for a shorter duration than man Japanese knives with hardness ratings of 61+…

            • +1

              @UncleRico:

              IF looked after PROPERLY.
              Includes sharpening. That's why it's in caps, most people can't use a sharpening steel. And 59 versus 61 = ease of sharpening versus reduced frequency of sharpening.

              • +12

                @Wardaddy: The steel is for honing not sharpening.

                • -9

                  @tomlut: Ah, you're one of those.

                • -5

                  @tomlut: The steel in this set is trash, and will damage and weaken the knife's edge, to the point where the edge will crumble after re-sharpening (because of the stress fractures and work hardening caused by the "hone").

                  Sharpen and Hone are effectively the same word, your deciding they're different and policing their use doesn't help anyone learn more about sharpening.

                  • @Tunblor: I'm new to all this and quite confused - what would you recommend? For example buying this set, and buying a different/better sharpener? The idea of damaging and weakening a $400 knife set doesn't sound appealing!

                    • +4

                      @DaiShan: Doesnt matter if you spend $400 or $4000.. in the end all knives get dull and will need to be sharpened.

                      In terms of damage, these knives (58) are easier to look after than harder strength metals (60+). The problem with Japanese knives (60+) is they will retain the edge longer but they are also more prone to chipping because the material is more brittle and will petina (change colour and look like the metal is ageing.. Google it).

                      Personally I prefer Rockwell of 58 which is stainless steel (what this set is made of). They will not petina, less prone to chipping. Yes they won't stay as sharp as a Japanese knife but they also dont require special tools to sharpen the blades either.

                      I like this set and would recommend it. You dont need heaps of knives.. most people dont use that many and a good chef knife is really all you need.

                      • @vash5: Thanks very much for the info - appreciate it. Cheers

                        • +1

                          @DaiShan: My pleasure 😊👍

                          If you have more questions feel free to ask.

                  • +3

                    @Tunblor: I would argue strongly they are not the same.

                    Honing: you are simply moving the already defined sharpening edge.

                    Sharpening: you are redefining the edge and or creating one.

                    You cant sharpen a knife with a honing rod that doesn't have an edge that was created during the sharpening process.

                    You are better off buying a strop and using it frequently instead of a honing rod if your not sure how to hone.

                    • +1

                      @vash5: You could simplify it further in saying that sharpening intentionally removes material from the blade to re-create a new edge whereas honing does not.

                      • @abadacus: True.. but then it might confuse people as to what honing is. Thanks for the tip 👍

                    • -1

                      @vash5: You're just creating your own definitions of words, and I don't think there's value in that, but I could be wrong.

          • +3

            @Wardaddy: Bold of you to assume there will be generations left yo use this.

            • @bargainparker: Why is everyone using this wanky rhetorical “bold of you to assume”? I think people parrot phrases they read online to make them look smart, or to seem able to actually express themselves.

              • @Meconium: Yeah, I wonder why I see more and more 'brought' instead of bought.

                People are essentially parrots. We still vote for the same 2 political parties since ancient times, just parroting between each other.

    • +1

      Not doubting the quality, but I really think it is better to buy more knives for the money.
      And only 3 Actual knives at that?

      • +8

        I disagree. I have had a Global knife block for many years now and I only really use the chefs knife, pairing knife and bread knife. If I were to buy new knives I would spend my money to get the best quality chefs knife and pairing knife instead of a lower quality knife set. If the 17cm Santoku knife were replaced with a bread knife then this would be the perfect set, in my opinion.

        • +1

          Have the ten piece global kit and agree

          • @corbz: What is the point of having more knives if you'll likely only be using two at most anyway? Seems like a waste of money

        • +4

          This is the correct approach. Fewer, but higher quality knives is the way to go.

          I have a full set of globals and 1x wusthoff chefs knife, and can tell you the wusthoff gets used the most and is leagues ahead.

          Made in Germany, solingen stainless steel - and it holds its edge unbelievably well. Has no nicks or dings in the edge, unlike the globals.

          And the kicker? This wusthoff was purchased in 1964. The globals in 2015.

        • Spot on, I only bought those 3 and paid much more for MAC. No regrets.

          Edit - actually didn't buy a bread knife, just 2 santoku big and smaller.

        • +1

          I think there still some value with having a beater knife which can be abused, but yes would stick with good ones for every day

        • Strongly agree with you mate!!

      • @marcozmitch I see you have much to learn*.

        many knife posts and discussion to look back on

        • Incorrect.
          I have the 3 piece Global set and the recent Aldi copy and the nasty set in the clear plastic block.
          I think the Global brand are actually pretty good.
          I do think professional sharpening is the way to go
          I also think the 6 piece from Aldi for $30 is actually a good buy for the price.
          I think $500 is a lot of money and I look at wood blocks and worry about the hygiene.
          The Global set are rolled up in cloth or can be attached to a magnetic metal bar.
          I think there is a lot of knife snobbery about.
          A bit like in other things.

        • An example of Global for the same price point:
          https://www.victoriasbasement.com.au/p/global-ikasu-x-10-pie...

      • But, you get 13 slots in the wood block 😅

        • @bargainparker where else were you planning on putting all those victorinox steak knives :P

      • What is the point of having more knives if you'll only be using two at most anyway? Seems like a waste of money

    • +1

      From what I remember, the steel properties are pretty much same as all other Wusthof. The expensive parts are Epicure has a sort special coating, the handle is firbre materiala and a new design. There is not a lot of performance difference than the classic or Ikon Wusthof knife in my opinion.

      • Correct!! You are paying more for the look and shape. Performance wise its on par with Ikon range.

    • +1

      Yeah I don't understand these prices

  • +5

    Interesting that it doesn’t include a bread knife.

    • +17

      Yeah Wusthof with that?!

  • +11

    The extra knife holes bother me an unreasonable amount.

    • The steak knife hole set? Further to that point, i've never understood why someone would want a kitchen block with utility knives with a full set of steak knives. In this case it could be filled with 4 utility type small knives, maybe like the victorinox - pairing, pairing serrated, serrated steak and tomato; and boning.

      • +2

        It could. I prefer a magnetic knife block on the wall. I have a 6 piece Wustof set and the knife block is HUGE. That bad boy takes up way too much bench space in my small kitchen.

    • use them to sure your existing knives

  • +3

    How well do these cut through fibreglass home insulation? This will be a secondary use for these off course.

    • +2

      That's what electric knives are for.

    • +2

      🤣🤣🤣 the screams of a 1000 knife enthusiasts cry out after reading this comment.

      • I’m speechless

  • Made from?

    • I think it said Mars.

    • +5

      Hattori Hanzo steel

      • +3

        But will it kill?

        • This knife smile will kill

          (forged in fire reference)

        • Try using a spoon or spork??

        • Cannot bring myself to watch this show. Too kitschy, too American

  • +3

    why are you crying?

    • -3

      Because he/she couldn't afford 'Miyabi'?

    • +5

      Buy once cry once.

      Admittedly I’m not a chef, or even a pro cook. And I could probably deal with $20 knives or cheaper. But these seem too good to pass up.

      • +1

        This is a beautiful set of knives and well worth spending money on.

    • He’s in the club rn

  • +3

    I thought someone with two wives would be happy

    • +4

      No you're thinking of someone with two knives

    • +1

      I see your not married then.

      • Double the pleasure…

        Double the pain…

        • +1

          Double wives, not double gfs.

          There is no pleasure, only pain.

          Especially if they become double ex wives.

  • +1

    i had this and switch to shun. gave it to my brother. really love my new samurai swords.

  • +1

    Thanks but no thanks, so expensive !

  • +7

    Expensive? You'll likely never need to buy these knives again* so amortized over the rest of your life the annual cost is LOW!

    I can't speak exactly to this model: mine are all "classic". I have maybe 17 Wusthof knives of varying sizes and I can not recommend the brand highly enough*. My 20cm chef's knives, bread knives, and tomato knives get used all the time; the other knives not as much.

    • Why? Anecdote time: I bought a 7pc set of Wusthof knives around 20 years ago. Wusthof recommends washing knives by hand. I put my knives through the dishwasher because if I can favourably trade time for money then I will. Shock! Horror! ( My knives: I'll do what I choose with them )

    A few years ago I noticed what I presume are aluminium fasteners holding the scales to the tang were deteriorating (probably from the dishwasher detergent, completely my fault). The scales actually came off my tomato and paring knives eventually (probably because they are the smallest fasteners).

    I emailed Wusthof Australia, telling them what had happened (fasteners deteriorated, presumably from detergent) and asked them to quote me on supply of replacement fasteners or to let me know where I could buy them.

    They asked me for photos of all my old knives showing the model number. Then they sent me new versions of all the knives - now I have 2 of each (yes, I repaired the old ones).

    I don't think the current models are as thick in the spine as the old ones were, but they seem to hold their edge better. I'll let you know in another 20 years whether the new ones are as good as the old ones are.

    I'm seriously considering buying this set (for the santoku, scissors, and different profile chef's knife) and I already own way too many cooking knives…

    • -6

      Weird flex, but ok.

      • +9

        zero flex - recorded my experience/opinion for the benefit of the ozb community - but ok.

        • +2

          I appreciated it - cheers. Good story on the quality of the knives and the level of support from the company

    • I agree on the after service is great, and they also do free sharpening (which is essential for that stupid bolster that gets in the way of hand sharpening).

      Though, there are other brands/knives that are in my opinion a better option than at least this specific set. The biggest drawback from this set is the chef knife, which is by far going to be the most used knife in this set is the addition of a bolster. Honestly, it has no purpose these days aside from making every sharpener curse.

    • concerned about cost amortised over life but wilfully damages them by putting them in the dishwasher…

  • +3

    Full bolster is holding me back but otherwise so tempting

    • Yes!! Not a bolster fan myself 👍

  • +2

    I feel like unless you specifically need these, better off buying a proper Japanese knife.
    They will have a harder HRC which will mean a sharper edge that will stay sharp for longer.

    The Chefs knife had a bolster, which will make sharpening a pain in the ass (if not, almost impossible).

    • +2

      Something like this would be a much better purchase imo.

      https://www.knivesandstones.com.au/collections/gyuto-chefs-k...

      It uses better steel (VG10) and had a HRC of 60.
      Lack of bolster will make it so much easier to sharpen as well.

    • -2

      Harder does NOT equal better edge retention. This knife myth appears to be spreading more and more, and there's not a bit of truth in it.

      Even the cheap Kiwi knives will stay sharp for MONTHS if they're sharpened properly, and then looked after, and they're much easier to sharpen. They cut better because they're thinner too.

      • +2

        Hey mate, if you could provide some sources for this statement, it would enlighten me. As far as I know, the general consensus is the higher HRC, the harder the material is. Obviously, there are a lot of factors to what makes a knife retain it's edge well (heat treatment is essential).

        https://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/11/12/rockwell-hardness/

        Summary
        "Hardness is a measure of strength, but is not a perfect measure of it. Higher yield strength means better resistance to edge deformation but rockwell hardness does not always accurately measure yield strength. Eliminating retained austenite increases the yield strength of steel even when the hardness is the same. Retained austenite can be reduced by ensuring the austenitizing temperature is not too high, or using cryo or high temperature tempering. Knifemakers should be careful when selecting very low tempering temperatures (<400°F) when trying to increase strength because the higher hardness may not mean a higher yield stress. While higher hardness correlates with lower toughness and better wear resistance, other factors such as carbide volume, size, and type are often more important than hardness. Knifemakers, buyers, and users all have a responsibility for ensuring the strength is sufficient for supporting the knife geometry for its intended use."

        • +1

          For the vast majority, any benefits of owning a Japanese/high HRC knife won't even apply because:
          -They have no concept on how to look after such a knife, and are generally unaware of the significantly higher level of care that they demand;
          -and will use it to do dumb **** like opening cans and driving screws and whacking it against hard foods & bones.

        • "higher HRC, the harder the material is."
          Agree, because HRC is a measure of hardness.
          The higher the Km/h, the faster the car is going, of course.

          The issue I have with higher Hardness being automatically associated with higher edge holding, is that the mechanism of dulling for knives is not a linear relationship with hardness, it's more complicated than that.

          I'm not saying harder knives always dull faster (although they sometimes can, when they chip out) just that increased hardness does not ALWAYS mean better edge retention.

          A higher Hardness knife just dulls differently, through chipping, rather than deformation. Knife lovers are mislead by the correlation of hardness with carbide volume and edge geometries, thinking a thin knife with fine carbide structure stays sharper for longer, because it also happens to be harder, but this isn't necessarily true.

          Have a look at Cliff Stamps experimentation with edge geometries, edge finishes, and edge retention. Edge geometry, what is being cut, and proper sharpening are the most important factors for edge retention by far, hardness and steel chemistry are comparatively insignificant.

        • Your source basically agrees with me, I am not sure you're using the precise engineering definitions of strength and hardness.

          The source is saying the grain structure, and other factors( carbide volume, carbide size, carbide type: vanadium vs chromium, etc) are critical when determining if hardness increases the resistance to dulling in the knife, or decreases resistance to dulling.

          Knifes almost NEVER dull through wear. They dull primarily through deformation and chipping.

    • +2

      Japanese knives are good but require more care, harder to sharpen and are easier to damage because they are more brittle.

  • I mean….. I've enjoyed using my cheap knives from daiso.. so my main question is: how nice do these feel in use? Do they make cutting through meats easier/smoother? Hardness/sharpening aside:

    Does it feel good using these?

    • -1

      Probably not, Wusthof knives are too thick in my opinion, the bolster on these means you can't use the heel of the blade as well, harder to sharpen, and there's an unusable portion of blade approaching the bolster, and it catches on things, and these are so expensive I'd be worried about them

    • +4

      So do you throw your knives away when they go blunt? Have you tried sharpening them?

      • -2

        Well if I am not happy I just don’t keep them, they just take up space, it’s trial and error, I’m
        Glad I finally found what works I use a global knife and a knife I bought in Japan they stay sharp for minimum of 4 months. I use a whetstone to sharpen.

        • +5

          Don't want to sound like a prick, but Global uses pretty much the same steel as Wushtof, and they are the same HRC.

          Global uses CROMOVA 18 while Wusthof uses X50CRMOV15 and they are around 56-58 HRC

          Any knife will dull over time, which is you should hone it regularly to keep it sharper for longer. I recommend using a steel with these guys, a good steeling before use and the average sharpening you'll have to do will be every 2 months for the average user.

          • +1

            @Crimson Shinigami: Can I ask what brand/type etc of steel are you using for this purpose?
            TIA.

            • +4

              @Chris Farley: I actually don't use a steel anymore because of my knives that I use. My Japanese knives are all above 63+ HRC, and the use of a steel can actually cause chips in my knife edge because of it's high hardness rating.

              Though honestly, any steel from the big brands like Victorinox, Wusthof, Mercer, etc will do just fine (Just make sure they are not a diamond steel, as they actually remove a lot of metal from the edge). I would argue the technique is the most important part when using a honing steel.

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsfbStV7pqE&ab_channel=Ethan...

              This video is a great start to honing with a steel.

  • Just to let people know and perhaps to save them some money, I bought a Kmart knife set 20 years ago, use it nearly every 2nd day to chop, slice and everything in between. I basically sharpen them on a $10 knife sharpener from eBay once every 2 years. Best knives ever, still sharp, still great.

    • +2

      You should have the knives sharpened professional once or compare the sharpness to a new blade. I think you will be surprised at how different you may find them.

      Electric sharpening is practical but performance usually falls quite short when using a whetstone.

      But thank you for sharing 😊

      • Try some of the Kmart knife sets, you will be surprised how great and durable they are.

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