as if your rent mortgage petrol groceries werent rising hard enough
the govt needs more money
also i love the dbl demerits on repeat offenders
i would also think other states will want to 'get in line' with their fines so there's 'parity'
QLD Cops Turn up The Screws on Speeding, Seatbelts after July 1
tonyjzx on 18/05/2022 - 19:21
Comments
Speeding and someone's stance on abortion are not remotely similar and are a faulty comparison.
Comparing the right to speed with a woman’s right to abortion? You are an idiot.
@Vote for Pedro: In what way? Why should a woman get to end a human life based on her choice but my choice to speed (which merely endangers a human life rather than ending it) is unthinkable?
@SlavOz: A variant of something Mark Twain once said “ Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
My earlier comment stands.
we should be offering services and options for these people to help them speed safely
I'd absolutely LOVE to see more (toll-free) highways / motorways instead of sitting at a traffic light every 300m. The rest of your post is bonkers though and misses the point
It should be between the driver and their passengers to decide what the safest conditions are.
So the crashes on road, or even near hits, was based on their judgement of what was best/safest?
Part of me wants to agree with you, as id love to drive 80kmph in 60 or even 50 areas. But the other part of me knows not everyone has good judgement or same care level, otherwise collisions wouldn't occur. There needs to be consistency and reasonable predictability on the roads to reduce likelihood of accidents.
So the crashes on road, or even near hits, was based on their judgement of what was best/safest?
No, drivers currently don't have discretion in the way they drive. So we don't know.
My point is that we shouldn't trivialise driving down to a arbitrary number. Driving is a complex skill. We need to move to a system that actually tests and appreciates the complex thinking required. Strictly enforcing speed limits down to 1-2km/h is just stupid. Any monkey can be trained to follow a speed limit. Most accidents occur due to a lack of awareness, confidence, and reactionary skills.
Following the rules won't keep you safe. Eg - most people see a green light and assume it's safe to proceed, but what if there's a car running a red light from the other side? The rules don't account for that. It's very little consolation to have been following the rules when you're 12 feet underground or in a coma for the rest of your life. Driver training and enforcement should focus on teaching people how to drive safely, not how to avoid getting fined.
No, drivers currently don't have discretion in the way they drive. So we don't know.
So when someone decides to drive dangerously, they didn't have discretion?
Following the rules won't keep you safe
I agree with you on that. But rules are there to keep things in order, to create consistency and predictability. Like anything in life, it's not 100%, but it's hell better than not having any traffic lights and letting people figure it out themselves. Do you think a road with some drivers going 20kmph and some going 100kmph is safe? What if that driver going 100kmph thinks he's a talented driver, when he's far from it? You're not factoring how one's actions may impact and put other innocent peoples life at risk.
You're also assuming everyone has the same skills to drive and make good judgements. Training and education is easier said than done.
Eg - most people see a green light and assume it's safe to proceed, but what if there's a car running a red light from the other side?
I would say this should fall under common sense, especially for an adult. Unfortunately common sense often isn't so common. How do you teach or train someone to use their brain?
Some people are only alive because laws, rules and regulations exist.
And in other news. Sky is blue.
Are the mobile speed camera owned by Macquarie bank like NSW? Totally not revenue raising and no profit motivated. Number of fines increased ten fold here and road toll pretty much the same.
Fixing the roads, better public transport, making signage less confusing, roadways less confusing, helping younger drivers get into safer cars would be a start. Nah too hard
If it's safe for police to speed, why not give all citizens the same level of training? That would mean it's safe for everyone and anyone to speed.
Reminds me the Seinfeld joke - why they don't they just make the whole airplane out of the same material as the block box?
I wish they would crack down on people who zigzag across lanes and drive recklessly. $287 to go over by 2?
I got fined for going 2kmph over the speed limit 7 minutes before the variable speed limit was meant to go back to normal.
I agree and I wish they would also crack down on tailgaters
I would be happy with the fines if the money from speeding fines went to a list of reputable charities. This would remove the excuse of fines being for revenue raising and I'm sure would immediately lower the number of fines being given out as quotas wouldn't be important anymore.
Pretty sure a country in Europe does this but I can't remember which.
Unless you live in SA, fine revenue goes back into management/maintenance/improvement of your state road network and driving-related education.
Targetted deal
I know this post is specifically about Qld, but just noted this info from RACV today.
The most common traffic offence committed in Victoria is for speeding 15km to 25km over the legal speed limit. Speeding infringements over 15km but under 25km (over the limit) recorded a total of 170, 231 incidents between the 2018 and 2021 financial years, and were the most common type of road rule broken every single year. The second most common type of speeding offence recorded was for speeding between 10km and 15km over the limit (recorded 129,347 times).We can complain about these fines, but it would appear that a lot of us don't seem to mind paying the $$$ just to get somewhere a little sooner. And not just a little over the limit.
Defund the police. The police are the ones who enforce all the unjust rules imposed upon us by politicians. Without the police, leigislation would just be impotent words on paper.
Maybe you should go visit a 3rd world country that has no police, and see what fun it is living in such an environment.
What surprised me was the quiet change in VIC last year, 25 km/h–29 km/h is now $500 but includes 3 month license suspension.
Given how many 40 zones (not just school zones but heaps of other areas) which are time based (7am-7pm etc) in Melbourne that wouldn't be that hard to go over if you're on the fringes of time for the speed change and not paying 100% attention.They need to throw the book at these queenslanders. Chuck 'em in the slammer and fine them. If they don't pay, take their super.
Ok, as long as there are the same fines in reverse, drive up to 10km/hr too slow, drive up to 20km/hr too slow!
So is this a indicator that the message is getting through and less people are speeding, hence revenue is down and a need to bring it back up to past levels?
This was my thoughts too.
Like the time in the media in NSW one of the politicians said one area where the speed cameras are were fining people and the other area had minimal fines and he indirectly admitted it was for revenue and not safety.
Instead of saying "good on you 'other area' for not speeding" he said something like, I am worried that the other area camera is broken because were not seeing enough fines….
I mean…… we all know it's revenue raising
Palachook has bankrupted the state … and you're surprised she'll milk anyone and anything she can rather than rein in spending?
Remember, if the penalty for a crime is a fine, then that law only exists for the lower class
This is insane, and wholesale offensive given the conversation currently around cost of living going up exponentially. There is some little n*zi in the transport department, between the mass increase in cameras that sit along stretches of road where it is virtually impossible to do something that endangers someone else and the huge yank upward in fines for non-dangerous activity.
Makes me sad that
Well said but too many brainwashed users of this forum.
imho the offense-demerit-suspend cycle needs to be much shorter.
Something like one demerit for every km over the speed limit. Then at 20 demerits you lose licence for one month, starting immediately. (time could increase for repeat offenders)
Other traffic offenses would have some demerit value from 5-15 which adds on.
The idea is that the punishment is shorter but you get there much quicker, even in a single incident if you're going 20km over the limit.
This punishes everyone, rich and poor, in a balanced way, and will be more effective than the threat of a longer suspension some time in the distant future.
If only there was a way to drive safely and avoid these fines…
Equating generic speed limits and safety is probably a good sign that you are not a very contextually safe driver.
I'd much rather prefer someone who understands the road and drives accordingly than someone who looks at a sign and goes "tHaNk GoD nOw I KnOw HoW 2 b SaFe".
Obscure speed limits are much easier to follow right? Good luck out there cowboy.
Who said obscure speed limits?
Just drive to conditions. Admitting you can't do that is more of a crime than slightly exceeding a signed speed limit.
Just be happy you are not in Finland. Aside from sharing a border with a militant Russia, it has progressive speeding fines.
"This has, of course, lead to some of history’s biggest speeding fines. Back in 2002, former Nokia director Anssi Vanjoki was caught driving 47mph in a 30mph zone on his motorbike and was fined $103,600. More recently, in 2015, Reima Kuisla, a Finnish businessman, had to pay $62,000 for driving 15mph above the 30mph speed limit."
https://www.boredpanda.com/finland-progressive-speeding-tick…
All female government being irritated by a man shortage. The principle comes from Sweden where socialism has created mass crimes and no go zones in Stockholm where police stay out for their own safety. Lie for money even if you can put somebody like Assange into jail.
Btw I was doing 130 in a station wagon at a time where they were limited to 80 in Lapland. Cops eventually agreed that that law hade zero sense and let me off the hook.
Would not count on my luck on female coppers!
The very best kind of tax - a completely optional one
Good
also i love the dbl demerits on repeat offenders
This has been a rule for at least 15 years.
back in the 1970s Brisbane (a city built on many steep hills) cops used to hide radar traps behind bushes at the bottom of steep hills
so unless you put your foot on the brake and kept pressing it all the way down the hill, simply by gravity, your car (even a bicycle) would be 'exceeding the speed limit' by the time it got to the bottom of the steep hill
this deliberate and unfair entrapment is just one of the reasons they were called 'pigs' …
This makes little sense to me. It should be obvious from physics that a given speed down a hill is less safe than on the flat due to increased stopping distance from the same speed, and to a greater extent again vs uphill. Down hill should therefore be enforced the most strictly, or set to a lower limit, to maintain the same sighting/braking performance expectations appropriate to the design and use of the road
Give people the option to send their fines to registered charities instead of government & enforcement would vanish.
QLD CopsYou mean, QLD Labor Govt and Anastasia Pallet-Jack?
Totally beyond reallity personality failure even having build a concentration camp!
Btw Max from Autotop.nl youtube fiddles with his mobile doing 210 km/h and prooves it to be 100% safe!!!!!!!!!!!!
ITT: tons of people who either don't care about their time, or have never driven single-lane terrible 'highways' where the only way to promote traffic flow and overtake someone is by 'doing illegal things' (speeding) for 5 seconds in absolute safety.
"Your Honour, I was merely trying to promote traffic flow when I did these so-called 'illegal things' for only five seconds"
I'm all for this type of "cash grabbing". It's certainly better than increasing taxes for everyone to fund the public services like policing. Just "tax" the speeding law-breakers.
I wish these fines were in proportion to someone's wages.
Someone who is a billionaire would not care about fines.
Those on the lower end of the scale would be more cautious.
If you are using a business you don't even need to take the points, you just pay a larger fine and say you aren't sure who was driving, no questions asked…
I think it is in Finland or whatever, I'm sure I remember reading about a millionaire who got a fine that was hundreds of thousands of dollars. I'm probably remembering it wrong, so don't give it as your final answer on Hot Seat or anything.
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland…
Damn! I’m all about this! I think they also publish everyone’s taxes. Sounds good!
A speed camera van doing about 110/120 in a 100 zone passed me the other day. Who fines the finers?
If it was really about discouraging people or to save lives, make the fines $100,000 and loss of licence for 5 years. Better yet, just put people in jail. Wanna make people REALLY learn? Yeah, let's go. Otherwise, it's revenue making.
Perhaps to disassociate from "revenue raising" and "targeting working class" , revenue/money should be completly removed from the picture. Instead of monetary fines, fingers toes and limbs should be cut off. You won't offend again if you constantly see your half thumb on the steering wheel.
Wait I've got a better idea how about we have a certain number of "points" and every time you do something wrong you loose a point? Now that would make sense we should do it!
Every local area is becoming 40 or 30km/h. Everyone just sits back and lets it happen.
https://www.change.org/p/maribyrnong-city-council-revert-the…
I went 9kms over the other month. So glad it was only 30au and not 60au phew!!! (Europe)
Imagine if when you got caught using a phone they used the money they fined you to pay for a hands free kit installation and if you got caught speeding over 10km/hour they installed a GPS situated speed detector that just beeped to warn you when you were speeding?
I can't imagine it either, fines will just go up another 100% every 5 years. It's just blatant revenue raising that self-righteous people will cheer for. I don't get fines anymore because I don't work on the road anymore but when you drive as part of your job 10+ hours a week, it's just a matter of time until you slip up.
Edit: They might as well just raise taxes against specifically drivers. Put yourself in the shoes of a father of small kids, expected to help at home and also be perfect at work. You'll be tired from helping at home with slower than normal reactions and be watching the speedometer more often than the actual road because of the fines. I can guarantee you that this is already happening and some people will be thinking "wel'll just make it illegal to be tired", which of course would already be the case. Shit just rolls downhill on people down on their luck. There's a reason truckies are turning to meth, the law is almost pushing them to it.
Wear your belt properly too. People who complain that the automated system wrongly sent them a seatbelt fine were actually caught with the seatbelt strap under their shoulders. The algorithm can detect this and it's automatically given to a worker to verify before sending out the fine. Having the strap under your shoulder is as good as not wearing a seatbelt at all, as far as your head is concerned.
How about mind your own business? I don't give a shit if you wear a seatbelt or not and it doesn't effect me.
I don't care if you get fined either. I hope you do get fined for wearing your seatbelt improperly.
You understand that leaving someone alone, and stealing money from them are different things right.
Who says I wear my seatbelt improperly? All I said is I don't like nosey control freaks sticking their little fingers in other people's business.
@AustriaBargain: I wouldn't complain about it if someone else did, I'd actually just prefer that the government respects your right to privacy in the first place though.
@Scantu: Well I don't want to get into a car accident with someone not wearing their seatbelt. I don't want to have to deal with the trauma of me and my family who might witness some horrific shit as a result.
Unreasonable revenue raising
Many Amazon and delivery van drivers leave the seatbelt buckled in and sit over the top of it so they can save 5 seconds on every delivery. They are being squeezed by Amazon to deliver faster and faster or they will have to finish their remaining packages for free at the end of the shift. Hopefully these people form a union or something because it’s dangerous and I care more about the people who work at Amazon than sending another billionaire into space.
Just don't buy from amazon
You're on fire tonight!
I got Lotsa solutions 💃
He he he
Data from Revenue NSW shows more than a million speed camera fines totalling $201 million were issued in 2020-21 – double the 479,489 speed camera fines worth $105 million in 2016-17.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/speed-camera-fines-hit-200m-…
The whole system is back to front.
Everyone knows that the best way to train a dog is to reward it, not smack it. They should be setting up speed cameras that give people money when they are going the speed limit. Then get rid of every fixed speed camera, and triple the number of mobile speed cameras.
I'd definitely be going the speed limit more often.
Speed limits are fine, but there should be some room for driver discretion. If you're cruising at the same speed as a truck with a full load, it's far safer to speed up so you can pass him than to follow the speed limit and stay directly next to him.
Like I said, people who hold the pro-choice stance on abortion should agree with me here. A driver knows what's best for the conditions. Why can't he make his own decisions around safety and welfare?