Can someone tell me if I screwed up somewhere?
My tenant was apparently using a portable gas cooker connected to a large cylinder and the whole thing blew up and caused a fire. The main stove is an electric stove and I would have not thought this would be something that I would need to worry about.
I have landlord insurance and strata has purchased insurance. Neither are willing to help with the bill… Was I supposed to buy some other type of building insurance?
If a tenant kicks the walls in isnt the landlord covered by insurance? So if damage is done by tenant using a gas cooker without landlords permission shouldnt they still be covered?
If a tenant kicks the walls in isnt the landlord covered by insurance?
Depends on the PDS.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-05-21/camp-cooker-placed-on…
This the incident? Seems they may not have turned the stove off when the electricity went out and were using the cooker on the stove?
This the incident?
I'd say not as that refers to a home — not a unit or anything else inferring that it was a unit.
Maybe OP thought they bought an apartment, but it was actually a house. Tassie's cheap. More likely just lazy reporting, they probably smashed out the 'article' in 5 minutes with little concern for the details, it's pretty small.
Or it's just a coincidence that someone else had pretty much the same thing happen around the same time.
A couple of things.
The insurance company will have its own internal dispute resolutions process which will kick off if you lodge a complaint direct to the insurance company.
Altetnatively you can apply direct to Afca.
The insurance policy for landlord insurance has been taken out in good faith.
It's the insurance companies role to determine ultimately who has liability to recover their own liability, not yours. So it's their pursuit.
Spending money in legal counsel could result in a further sunk cost imo as the amount isn't significant and you could be throwing good money after bad.
There is a policital appetite for insurance reform btw as many people who were affected by bushfires and floods have had terrible experiences dealing with insurers who walk away from their responsibilities. Demonstrate a willingness to follow the process and complain to your state MP if you get no where and ask for support.
Consider the following when making a complaint to Afca or direct If you can calculate the total amount of insurance premiums paid, and if no other claim made, they may refund you all of those premiums to remove the fact you were insured.
You can complain first and then complain to Afca with the additional weight of following their internal dispute process.
However unlikely to recover the amount lost.
Asking for the copies of the rental inspection reports for the last few periods since the tenants where their is good homework to keep during the dispute process.
Been involved with body corporate in Queensland for over 15 years. My take..
Strata corporate building insurance is compulsory in Queensland and levied by lot in your body corporate dues each quarter. Your levies have 3 components : administration fund, sinking fund and building insurance. Strata building insurance covers all common area facilities, services, structures etc. It covers the building structure itself for damage or loss. The caveat for services such as sewage, water, power it must affect more than one unit. If the service is servicing your own lot and within your lot boundary then the repair or damage to the service is the lot owners responsibility. For damage to the building caused by leaks to the roof, bathroom leaks, plumbing issues, fire damage, etc the responsibility to fix the problem rests with the lot owner but any consequential damage caused by the issue is claimable against the body corporate strata building policy. Example, burst water pipe - lot owner is responsible for the inital repair and strata insurance is responsible for damage to carpets floorboards, walls etc under strata building insurance. Roof water leak situation means the owner is responsible for the locating and repair of the source of the roof leak and strata building insurance covers the damage caused consequent to the leak such as ceiling, wall repairs. Of course when strata insurance company looks at the claim they make a decision as to whether the original cause of the problem was avoidable and whether the problem was dealt with in a timely manner in determining to accept or deny the claim. Case in point, bathroom upstairs toilet was leaking, tenant did not do anything to notify real estate. 9 months later ceiling downstairs collapsed, water staining on walls, tenant had decided to shower and toilet in the rear courtyard for 6 months, toilet and shower totally unuseable.
Full bathroom replacement, floor, walls and ceiling replaced $70,000 in repairs, strata insurance refused claim due inital plumbing issue not attended in a timely manner. This is actual experience i have been associated with. Landlord did not have landlord insurance which would have covered tenant not paying rent (3 months in arrears), loss of rent for the period it was not habitable and being restored. Another roof leak known for a year or so as evidenced by the staining on the ceiling, claim refused due not being attended to quickly when noticed.
Landlords insurance primarily is of value in ensuring loss of rent, unable to rent out property due damage and time taken for repairs. Also ruined carpets by tenant, stolen curtains, appliances and so on, read insurance pds for landlord cover as it differs between companies. It may assist in covering damage caused to the unit structure caused by the tenant although it would be an argument between insurance companies namely the strata building insurance company and the landlord insurance company. I know, again from experience drug lab units must be forensically cleaned, officially certified and kept vacant for 6 mohths in Queensland before being able to be relet. The loss of rent would by covered under landlords insurance but big arguments between insurance companies about replacing walls, ceilings, carpets etc that have been contaminated with meth lab fumes.
Hope thats a bit of clarification in Queensland, no doubt similar in other states
TLDR?
In a nutshell:
"Been involved with body corporate in Queensland for over 15 years. My take..
Strata corporate building insurance is compulsory in Queensland and levied by lot in your body corporate dues each quarter. Your levies have 3 components : administration fund, sinking fund and building insurance. Strata building insurance covers all common area facilities, services, structures etc. It covers the building structure itself for damage or loss. The caveat for services such as sewage, water, power it must affect more than one unit. If the service is servicing your own lot and within your lot boundary then the repair or damage to the service is the lot owners responsibility. For damage to the building caused by leaks to the roof, bathroom leaks, plumbing issues, fire damage, etc the responsibility to fix the problem rests with the lot owner but any consequential damage caused by the issue is claimable against the body corporate strata building policy. Example, burst water pipe - lot owner is responsible for the inital repair and strata insurance is responsible for damage to carpets floorboards, walls etc under strata building insurance. Roof water leak situation means the owner is responsible for the locating and repair of the source of the roof leak and strata building insurance covers the damage caused consequent to the leak such as ceiling, wall repairs. Of course when strata insurance company looks at the claim they make a decision as to whether the original cause of the problem was avoidable and whether the problem was dealt with in a timely manner in determining to accept or deny the claim. Case in point, bathroom upstairs toilet was leaking, tenant did not do anything to notify real estate. 9 months later ceiling downstairs collapsed, water staining on walls, tenant had decided to shower and toilet in the rear courtyard for 6 months, toilet and shower totally unuseable.
Full bathroom replacement, floor, walls and ceiling replaced $70,000 in repairs, strata insurance refused claim due inital plumbing issue not attended in a timely manner. This is actual experience i have been associated with. Landlord did not have landlord insurance which would have covered tenant not paying rent (3 months in arrears), loss of rent for the period it was not habitable and being restored. Another roof leak known for a year or so as evidenced by the staining on the ceiling, claim refused due not being attended to quickly when noticed.
Landlords insurance primarily is of value in ensuring loss of rent, unable to rent out property due damage and time taken for repairs. Also ruined carpets by tenant, stolen curtains, appliances and so on, read insurance pds for landlord cover as it differs between companies. It may assist in covering damage caused to the unit structure caused by the tenant although it would be an argument between insurance companies namely the strata building insurance company and the landlord insurance company. I know, again from experience drug lab units must be forensically cleaned, officially certified and kept vacant for 6 mohths in Queensland before being able to be relet. The loss of rent would by covered under landlords insurance but big arguments between insurance companies about replacing walls, ceilings, carpets etc that have been contaminated with meth lab fumes.
Hope thats a bit of clarification in Queensland, no doubt similar in other states"
Strata insurance covers the shared structure. For internal damage OP needs landlord insurance, which they have, this has nothing to do with strata insurance..
This depends on your state laws right?
NSW strata have a legal requirement to ensure a current building insurance which covers the building, common property and common contents managed by the owners corporation.
Non common contents is owners sole responsibility but the actual building cover is part of the strata fees.
some strata insurance covers loss of rent
Possibly if you own a hotel room apartment? Otherwise it wouldn't make sense
It's quite common but some people know or have and some don't
@Poor Ass: Body corporate insurance is paid by all the shared owners. Unless the building is commercial, where all the owners expect to rent out their share (such as a hotel), why would body corporate include tenant default? I don't see how it is common at all
@[Deactivated]: that type of loss of rent due to defaults would be landlord insurance I do agree
in this situation not the loss in rent because you can't find a tenant or tenant defaults but because loss in rent due to damage / unliveable which strata insurance can actually cover loss of rent up to a certain amount or even pay for the accommodation for the tenant up to a certain period. I've got this.
Sue the tenant. For $80k defintiely worth it
Hand on, don't u have building insurance??
Building insurance is separate from landlord insurance.
Don't you need to sign up for building insurance and landlord insurance?
Building insurance is of no use to an individual lot owner in a strata building.
i said the same thing and i got negged
Ah, Poor ass
If the tennant was negligent, I thought the landlords insurance would pay out, then they sue the ex-tennant.
IIRC, my landlords insurance covered negligence by tennant, but not malicious acts.
Rules vary by state. OP needs local legal advice.
OP needs to provide more information about the property, incident, policy, and insurer responses.
This should be covered by landlord insurance surely…. ? better check mine lol
But you still can sue the tenant for this even if there is no insurance cover.
Don't we all cook on our 25% off Weber Q in our kitchen? Am I doing it wrong?
No, i cook in my bedroom with my $100 yellowglen promo baby q. So much more convenient. /s
Wow your ceiling must be nicely seasoned.
So we don’t know the detail of the circumstances (how did it explode), we don’t know the PDS, AND we don’t know why it was knocked back.
But we are supposed to weigh in. Hrrrm.
accidental cover, tenant damage should cover this - this is included in most policies nowadays. make a complaint, get another internal team to review, they still dont cover it go to AFCA
None of us have enough information to make determination.
who was the insurer? I've heard horror stories with Budget Direct…not them again?
In fairness, they are pretty good if the neighbour's dog runs around destroying stuff with a light sabre in its mouth.
Damn I hate Insewerants companies. You pay them in good faith that they will be there when something goes really wrong but in reality, they take your money without providing any service and then fight tooth and nail not to pay out when you try to make a claim. Should just do away with the whole damn industry. It is a scam.
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Sounds like he was cooking meth
Asking for a friend
like…i know everybody's jumping to the "sue" option….but try to communicate with the tenant before doing this.
- Find out the cost of repair
- Send that bill to the tennant and ask them to pay it (i'm assuming they will refuse), if they agree to pay it then happy days
- More importantly when asking them to pay it, listen to what they have to say, you might find out something else about the situation that you don't already know….who knows, perhaps the built in cooktop wasn't working and they let the property manager know and nothing happened? Not saying this is the case, but its essential to get their point of view on the situation, as this will help in next steps.
- assuming they refuse, and assuming after hearing their point of view you still believe they are completely at fault, tell them you will need to pursue legal action.
- If they don't do anything after you saying you're going to pursue legal action….well, start pursuing legal action, If your money is tight, and you know you are in the right it might be worthwhile seeking one of those lawyers that only earns if you win, They tend to only take the case if they are confident they can win it.
Just remember though, there is not guaranteed win, and even if you do win you won't get it all back, you are truly in a shit situation, i was in a similar one that involved my tenant mistreating the place (holes in the wall, rubbish floor to ceilling, copper ripped out of walls, drawing on walls, torn up lawn), then insurance wouldn't cover it either….even though i escalated things, i was able to recover SOME of the costs, but it wasn't event 1/4 of the total damage.
OP went cold like the BBQ their tenants were having indoors.
They have just found out that they are responsible for finding alternative accommodation for their tenant.
provide a link to the insurance company pds so we can check the wording ?
How was nobody injured? Holy (profanity).
Scummy freeloading renters. The only fair and just thing you can do now is to sue your tenant for all they have, and then make them your slave forever.
Just looked up RACV landlord insurance PDS and it specifically says:
• any damage caused by a tenant or their guest or a pet kept at the site, including:
– vandalism or a malicious act
– intentional and deliberate damage
– unauthorised alterations
– contamination caused by the manufacture, storage, or distribution of illegal drugs
Sounds like worth pay extra $.
Not sure if has been mentioned, this would be perfect time to write the "no gas appliances/BBQs etc" clause in to the lease agreement.
You are not telling us the main thing. Why is the insurance company not paying out.
you would think you would know that, and include it in your post.
OP has done an impulse post and now f'd off
OP setup the account specifically for this post … based on their user name at least
Ya I know
Use and abuse use
First things first. Name the insurance company. I want to avoid them.