Upgrading Families PC's to Later Models?

• 

  Transient on 21/10/2022 - 16:13

  If my mum is only using a PC for the most basic things, would it be sufficient to buy her a cheap 10th or 11th gen intel CPU?
  Yes. If there is no dedicated GPU, make sure you buy a CPU with onboard graphics. I'm still using a i5 8400 with 8GB RAM and game occasionally without problem. If you haven't would suggest migrating from HDD to SSD - at least the OS, as it makes everything load quicker. Even starting Chrome is quicker than when using HDD. Win 10 starts in a few seconds. Also SSDs are getting cheaper.

  What is a sub $500 option in this instance to help my mum out? ill need a case, PSU, CPU cooler, RAM, and CPU. I have the motherboard.
  If you buy a basic CPU, eg, x400 intel series, already comes with stock cooler which would suffice.

• 

  JimB on 21/10/2022 - 16:24

  +3

  I purchased a Lenovo ThinkCentre M700 Tiny - i5 6400T | 8GB | 128GB @$169 from https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/718376

  Came with Windows 11. For Web Browsing, word processing etc.. it's more than powerful and quick enough. Compact and very quiet. I'm super impressed by it.

  If your mum's machine is still working fine.. save yourself the hassle and just let her continue to use it, that way you won't have suffer helping set up 2 new PCs.

  Just get your aunt the Lenovo ThinkCentre M700 Tiny or similar.

• 

  elusive on 21/10/2022 - 16:39

  +10

  Honestly, the only thing in that list that needs an update is the "Windows 7 Dell inspire". I'm guessing you mean Inspiron, and if it came with Win7 that's probably pre-2012 so getting on in years.

  1. A 3700X + RTX 2070 is a perfectly fine combination. Assuming they're running bog standard 1080p60 for the display. On a really demanding game (like Cyberpunk) you may want to consider lowering the graphics settings to ~medium-ish and turning off raytracing (RT).

  2. An i5-8400 is a bit underpowered for modern gaming and may be worth considering an update for. But if they're fine with the performance right now, just leave it - you'll almost always get more bang for your buck by upgrading as late as possible. The GTX 1080 is, again, perfectly fine - heck I was running one up til this week, and on a 4k display at that. If at some future point you do decide to upgrade, you'll get a huge jump heading into even low-end Intel (e.g. i3-12300, or the 13th gen equiv probably launching early next year). I wouldn't bother with 10th or 11th gen Intel unless you can get a second-hand CPU real cheap.

  3. For non-gaming/business purposes the 11th gen Intel i3+ is perfectly fine. About the only thing is I'd make sure it has at least 8 GB RAM, maybe 16 GB. Should be a fairly simple upgrade if it's not soldered. As a NUC it probably takes laptop style SODIMMs. If you're doing heavy spreadsheets etc. the CPU may be worth looking into a bit more, maybe.

  4. i7-4770 is quite old at this point but still a solid performer. If you're just doing web browsing, checking emails, watching videos, etc. you're unlikely to have much trouble. Only real downside vs something more modern is the relatively high power consumption - that's an 84 W TDP chip that you could probably outperform with a modern 15 W TDP chip.

  5. As said earlier, an Inspiron that shipped with Win7 is probably the most problematic of the lot. Worse if it's a laptop.

  For 4 and 5 I'd consider looking at one of the Optiplex refurb deals. Ideally you want something at least 8th gen so you get official Win11 support like https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/723346. Otherwise, 6th gen like https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/730617 and https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/728846 are still decent and very cheap. Mostly a sidegrade vs a i7-4770 but they'll be somewhat more power efficient. If it's less RAM it might be a bit of a downgrade (careful, the weird 6th gen ones that take DDR3L are not compatible with normal DDR3 or DDR4). Maybe not worth it vs your #4, but probably a good step up vs your #5.

  • 

    PiratePete1911 on 21/10/2022 - 17:35

    I agree with everything here, I just wanted to add that for Cyberpunk they should make sure to use DLSS as well as it makes a massive difference in performance.

  • 

    harshbdmmaster718 on 21/10/2022 - 18:37

    I was going to say. All these specs are way better than what I have so I don't really see any need to upgrade unless you want to install Windows 11 or something.

    Also thanks for sharing the power consumption information. Wow 84 watts consumption from just the CPU? That's crazy I need to look up the TDP of the chips in my PC because I think it is even older than the machines OP mentions.
    And the modern equivalent only consumes 15 watts? That's giving me some motivation to upgrade to a more power efficient new machine.

    Edit: Ok weird. New processor specs don't include a TDP spec. Just a Base and Max spec. So my CPU is similar to OP's and has a 84w TDP. The new equivalent in a Dell machine I was looking at has Base 65w spec and Max 117w spec. So maybe TDP is in between? Not as much of a difference as I expected?

    Ok I am an idiot I shouldn't be looking at equivalent models. Should be looking at equivalent speed in Ghz.
    Couldn't find an equivalent in Ghz 12th Gen CPU, so I bumped it down to 11th Gen. The 2 or 3 models I found had the TDP spec and are all 35w TDP. That sounds a lot better.

    • 

      elusive on 21/10/2022 - 19:54

      Should be looking at equivalent speed in Ghz.

      It's not as simple as that: there've been some pretty extreme architectural improvements in the meantime too. Not to mention core count has crept up over the years.

      And TDP is only a vague indicator of power consumption at best, too. Modern chips will boost well above base TDP, for quite extended periods of time too. The other thing to keep in mind is modern chips have lower idle states, and even the higher TDP ones will typically complete jobs much faster and then drop to idle. It still wins at 150 W TDP if it only needs 25% of the time to do the same job and just idles after that.

      That said, my basis for that comparison was along the lines if an i7-4770 (desktop chip) vs an i7-1165G7 (laptop chip, can be found in NUC form factor): https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare/1907vs3814/Intel-i7-477…

      Generally what you're more likely to encounter if you're after efficiency in a typical desktop is around 65 W TDP, down to 35 W TDP on the ones intended for office SFF PCs (Intel model names ending in T, not sure what AMD has). NUC form factor gets you into laptop chip territory.

      • 

        harshbdmmaster718 on 22/10/2022 - 15:45

        "It still wins at 150 W TDP if it only needs 25% of the time to do the same job and just idles after that."
        Alright thanks makes sense.

  • 

    ToxicCrusader on 27/10/2022 - 17:57

    thanks for you help!
    ill definitely look into a 2nd hand 10th or 11th gen CPU. that's a great idea.
    my PC is ok you're right.
    kid1's pc is getting more and more complex stuff thrown at it.
    kid2 mostly plays robolox and doesn't seem to care.
    the nuc has 32 gb of ram, it seems ok but its complains of memory warnings when too much is going on? idk

    • 

      elusive on 27/10/2022 - 18:34

      We're probably a good few years off 10th or 11th gen being affordable second hand. You might be better off just doing a AMD 5xxx (5600G? 5700X?) or Intel 12th gen i3-12100/i5-12400 mid-range build new. Worth comparing prices on those.

      32 GB RAM is more than enough for almost anything outside a few rather special uses. You should probably check what exactly it's complaining about (RAM or storage?) and then check what's using that - if one of your applications has a memory leak then more RAM just delays the problem a bit.

      P.S. the Microsoft news and weather widget is known to leak over 12 GB RAM at times. I'd recommend disabling it.

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  freefall101 on 21/10/2022 - 16:46

  +1

  What is a sub $500 option in this instance to help my mum out? ill need a case, PSU, CPU cooler, RAM, and CPU. I have the motherboard.

  Give mum Kid2's machine sans GPU (assuming it has onboard)

  does Kid2 require an update? they mostly play Roblox. I know it's not very taxing. but they might move on to some other more intensive games when they get a bit older. Sometimes they'll play Five nights at Freddies and the sims. Would you wait until that happens? they have a GTX 1080.

  Give Kid2 the Aorus with a new machine. 11th gen i7 with all the bits and the 1080, then upgrade whenever they get into gaming. Nothing mentioned there should tax the 1080 for now, prices should come down next year once there's a bit of competition in the market actually happening.

  Kid1 plays a lot of Roblox too but also likes COD, overwatch etc. somehow they got their hands on cyberpunk and play that too, however it seems to lag on their PC. is this a simple case of buying a faster GPU? Should I be on the lookout for a decent-priced 3000 series RTX?

  Cyberpunk is basically the worst title around optimisation, often need to tweak settings to get good game play. What resolution do they game at? If it's 1080p I'd stick with the 2070 and turn ray tracing off in Cyberpunk, it should run fine. If it's high, then look for a second hand 3080. They're starting to drop to around $600-700 these days. Expensive for a kid, but really there's not going to be a huge benefit otherwise.

  Depending on usage, would an iPad or laptop be better for aunt and mum? Also aim for 8th gen or higher intel if you're worried about software updates, Windows 11 doesn't support anything lower (it'll run, but there's the risk some future update will break it).

  edit: Basically what the above post says!

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  19199090 on 21/10/2022 - 16:49

  +3

  Upgrading either of the kid's PCs seems pretty unnecessary. I have a 6700xt, similar performance to a 2070 and managed to play cyberpunk through on ultra easily. As well as this, the GTX 1080 is definitely capable enough for now, being similarly powerful to a 3060. Assuming your mum does not plan on gaming, I would say just pick up an old mac mini. I don't think the lack of z490 in her machine will be a big problem for her. Picked up 3 for free from my school a couple years back, ~2014 i5 models. My mum uses one now and has had no issues as they came with ssd+16gb ram. I'm sure your Aunt could also enjoy one. Don't throw money away for no reason, if they don't need computers now, wait until they do need them.

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  thatonethere on 21/10/2022 - 19:24

  +2

  The questions to ask are:

  1. any of the PC's unreliable? if so replace
  2. any of the PC's out of support - eg the Windows 7? if so replace asap
  3. any of the PC's need more resources for gaming? If so replace.

  Otherwise just run them until 1/2/3 happens.

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  Daabido on 21/10/2022 - 20:13

  +1

  This should have come with a spec whore warning.

  • 

    ToxicCrusader on 27/10/2022 - 17:52

    sorry my bad :(

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  juzza87 on 22/10/2022 - 15:52

  You get the highest end gaming rig you can for yourself, then every time you upgrade the parts/whole lot they go to your wife, your wifes parts go to the kids, kids parts go to extended family, etc.

  Everyone gets an upgrade when you do!