Ordered (Will Soon Own) an MG ZSEV on Novated- AMA

Lseannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:24
Last edited 02/03/2023 - 14:52

Inspired(?) by PegXS's BYD thread and by the various EV discussions etc, I thought I might throw my use case into the ring. I have ordered an MGZSEV through Novated lease (fully salary sacrificed)- an Excite model. Inviting questions and discussions around my use case if anyone wanted information before diving in, so ask me (almost) anything.

My use case- I'm female in a household of one. This will be my only car- taking over from a 13-14 year old Prius. I have a combination of working from home, PT commuting and drive-commuting with some longer distance site visits for work. Commute depends where I am working on a particular day, but will be 30-60kms each way with longer runs being around 100-250kms (Melbourne to regional towns). This plus the usual run around trips of course.

I will not be getting a home charger initially and will granny charge overnight. No solar. I also have access to free fast charging at work (when you can get in- though parking is paid) and potentially trickle charge (not sure yet). No aftermarket anything going on except a dashcam and a seat cover/floormat package I got at Supercheap. The car has an ETA of late March-early April (I am working on a mid-April assumption in this case).

I say ask me (almost) anything because I'm politely asking you to leave geopolitical (read anti-China) stuff at the door- I'm here to talk about a car.

Fire away!

Automotive Car MG SUV

Comments

  • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 13:25

    What is the expected delivery date?

    • teacherer on 02/03/2023 - 13:26
      +2

      ETA of late March-early April (I am working on a mid-April assumption in this case).

      • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 13:26
        +1

        I missed that. Cheers

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:41

          Unfortunately I don't know if I'll have a more exact date until my backside is in the seat since everthing goes through the lease company.

    • Euphemistic on 02/03/2023 - 13:39
      +1

      When was it ordered?

      • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:41
        +2

        Order was submitted Jan 30

  • teacherer on 02/03/2023 - 13:25
    +11

    Cool, thanks for being an early adopter for when i'm ready in 10 years

    • Ghost47 on 02/03/2023 - 13:29
      +3

      Make that 20 years.

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:48

      No problem- I said the same to my folks when they bought a first gen leaf (ho boy :p)

      • Speckled Jim on 03/03/2023 - 11:14

        Is it the short range, the battery sag, or combo of these?
        Asking because I saw one for 16K at a dealer last year.

        • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 11:47

          The leaf? The ho boy was mainly cause I didn't find it to be that great of a car. I was also a poor undergrad at the time so never considered it beyond that as it was well of the cards.

  • juzza87 on 02/03/2023 - 13:26
    +4

    What is your annual income and how much are you saving through Salary Sacrifice, and does it include all costs (fuel, insurance, rego etc.)

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:32
      +2

      Income is just shy of $130k pre-tax. According to the quote calculation, savings over 5 years is $32918 over the life of the lease. It includes full comprehensive insurance, roadside (on top of the MG basic one), servicing, 6 tyres, consumables (globes etc), redundancy cover (a consideration in my field I'm afraid), minor damage repair subscription, rego (not sure about the VictoriaTax yet), and carbon offset of 4.5tonnes/year (this is automatic on this company).

      The lease company isn't set up for electricity running costs yet, but they said they are working on it through a reimbursement on public chargers model since home charging is harder to calculate.

      • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 13:36
        +1

        Intersting. I used to think that 1yr novated leases were the best as you pay most pre-tax and least post-tax, but with ev, your post tax contribution is $0 right? in which case the 1yr novated lease maximum savings no longer applies.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:39

          Post tax is $0 yes, but because the lease is pre-tax your taxable goes down so you then pay less tax. They are also negotiating cheaper insurance etc because its technically a fleet vehicle for the duration.

          Not a tax agent and maths isn't my field TBH, but I ran A LOT of different scenarios on my budget and this came out to be the best option to get the car as I don't have a car-amount saved up just yet.

          • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 15:34

            @seannami: thank you.

          • scallywagmcgee3 on 03/03/2023 - 09:55

            @seannami: Do you have a spreadsheet that you used to run these scenarios that you could share?

            • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 11:03
              +2

              @scallywagmcgee3: Unfortunately I don't have the original calculations because I redid the budget spreadsheet to the final, but it basically came down to comparing the novated outgoings with what I current have and what it would be with a car loan.

              Novated fortnightly outgoings (effect on take home pay) was $343, taking out what I am paying in running costs per fortnight (anything covered in the lease) and the HR admin fee, the car is costing me roughly $150/fortnight above what I am paying now with an unfinanced car.- I would also be saving $120/fortnight to cover the residual, but I am saving more than that anyway into an offset so it comes out in the wash.

              On a car loan (green car loan through Bankfirst at 5,6% then and 6.2% now- I'll use the now calculation) and assuming a 5 year loan, $430/fortnight without accounting for running costs. Taking out petrol per fortnight, it'd be roughly $400/fortnight more outlay than I am currently paying for the car (that's the same car) and my available set-aside savings would be lower.

              If I wasn't going FBT I would have looked at other options like a hybrid Corolla or something along those lines, which is $322/fortnight on that loan, but the running costs wouldn't change (or may actually go up a bit if insurance on a newer car is more expensive), so $322 over current outgoings.

              Also baring in mind the car loans are variable and the RBA just keeps coming, and I have a mortgage, it starts to get a bit tight.

              On finance, the Corolla through Toyota access would be $300ish/fortnight without running costs over 4 years with a $16000 residual (give or take, I don't have the detailed information to calculate it properly). so $300ish more than I pay currently.

              So TL;DR

              Novated: $150 more than I pay now for car+running
              Loan on ZSEV: $430 more than I currently pay
              Loan on hybrid Corolla: $322 over
              Corolla on finance: $300ish over (plus some saving on residual, but I'll assume that's a wash like the FBT, but with less time to save and less going into offset)/

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 16:51

          They also quoted me a partial post-tax contribution option (they do it as default), and the savings were only $14500ish instead of $33000ish, so its definitely a good difference if you can fully package

          • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 17:22
            +1

            @seannami: The ev 0% post tax also negates the 1/3 depreciation on the cost base after the four full FBT years have elapsed.
            It's quite fascinating.

            IF i were to buy a new car, i would be an EV and with NVL.
            it would also reduce my income so i save on childcare fees as the subsidy value would increase.

            Alas, my cars are from 2018 so they've got a long way to go before they are replaced. Hopefully the perk remains then.

            • 911r on 07/03/2023 - 02:42

              @FoxJump: I'm pretty sure your reportable salary actually goes up as you have reportable fringe benefits, so watch out for that with childcare subsidy etc.

              • seannami on 08/03/2023 - 14:45

                @911r: RFB is added to your salary but only for calculating certain eligibilities- I didn't see the childcare subsidy on the list, just family benefits, health concession for seniors and carer allowance, and the amount paid on the Medicare levy surcharge. What it counts toward is a bit opaque, but at least its not on taxable wages!

      • apple2016 on 02/03/2023 - 13:47

        savings over 5 years is $32918

        does this take into consideration the lower tax rates that should be applicable from 2024?

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:47

          Not so far, but they recalculate everything yearly. I also don't think my pay bracket is on the tax break list?

          • freefall101 on 02/03/2023 - 14:46
            +1

            @seannami: Everything you earn over $120k will drop from 37% to 30% and everything else over $45k will drop from 32.5% to 30%.

            So savings a year will drop by about $500, assuming you're paying about $10k on the car per year. Still makes it worthwhile.

      • star-ggg on 02/03/2023 - 16:01

        What's the cost if you leave the company within the 5 years? Are you able to give an estimate of cost saving from RRP (ie not including the insurances, maintenance etc)

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 18:32
          +1

          If I leave voluntarily and any new employer can't take over the salary packaging, it would be roughly $25900 more for the entire five years (if I quit the day I pick the car up)- so an extra $199/fortnight if I keep the lease going (including all the fees, running costs and all that jazz- and assuming I keep the car). Not that I plan to leave!

          Cost saving from RRP without running is a good question, I've mainly focused on running costs included, but RRP excluding onroads and rebate is $48416 (we can assume the rebate negates the onroads). I'll use my bank's loan calculator just to save my headspace on interest calculations

          On the lease, minus GST the onroad cost is $44474- $13367 residual= $31107+$8154 interest+fees and add back the residual $52628 EDIT: forgot to include that the interest is also paid pre-tax, so need to drop the interest and fees to $5700 (as a rough calculation)-> lease total for car and fees only: $50,174, so essentially adds $1758 on the car alone.

          So doesn't save anything off flat RRP if you only consider the car and can buy it outright, and it comes out around $6000 less than a green car loan over 5 years (6.29% interest currently).

          This is of course assuming my maths are right- you guys are really stretching my brain today! It also made me realize that the savings over the lease wasn't calculated including residual in the quote

      • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 19:02
        +1

        Cause my calculations were late to the party, once you add residual the savings based on the quote would be $19551 if I buy it outright at the end compared to unpackaged finance

      • md333 on 03/03/2023 - 15:09

        Is the $32,918 just the reduction in tax, or is it the net benefit after the extra costs of the Novated Lease? Sounds really good, but I suspect you are not actually getting a $50,000 car for $20,000. If you are I might do the same.

        • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 15:22

          It is the net benefit of going salary sacrificed novated lease vs equivalent post-tax payment with finance. The benefit over post tax buying outright is much less, but still a decent benefit because you are paying the running costs pre-tax

          That also doesn't take into account the benefit of being able to save more to put in an offset account that will partly go toward the residual.

          I'll see if I can post a screenshot when I'm on my computer next.

          • md333 on 03/03/2023 - 15:45

            @seannami: Thanks, I'm comparing with buying outright. Seems hard to find out what the real savings are from the NL company webpages. No mortage so I suppose I should also factor in lost interest on the purchase price if paying up front, is that what you mean by offset or can you offset the lease finance somehow?

            • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 16:12

              @md333: I'm offsetting a mortgage.

              On some very roughshod maths, with tax savings, the car proper on a NVL is $35250, then you have (in my case) 9.6%/annum on the novate, which I think is about $5000 when you account for that also being pre-tax, then there is around $1800 in total fees or so (including HR fee), so when it boils down, on the car only the car still comes out cheaper on NVL (a little bit). You would also not be paying lease over and various other things that come with a lease.

              I realised in my previous posts with similar maths I had a postGST car cost in the NVL calculations. It does come out cheaper as a NVL, by around the cost of GST (roughly $6000 over 5 years and after paying residual)

              It's also worth baring in mind you may have access to better insurance extras (e.g full exemption from glass excess rather than one claim, 3 years new for old instead of 2, roughly double the payout caps for rental cars, death or injury payout, alternate transport etc in my case- the premium was also cheaper), I also had access to a minor damage membership that, for $1250 over 5 years, gave access to scratch and dent repair for $50 a time, which would save a bit over time, but you also wouldn't need redundancy cover and all that fun stuff

              • md333 on 03/03/2023 - 21:09
                +1

                @seannami: $6000 savings is a lot less compelling than $30,000 headline figure they wave about.
                Probably a few thousand extra by investing the purchase price.
                Still seems quite worthwhile if buying. Probably not enough to convince my wife we need one now rather than next year.

                I've heard the savings can be bigger on a one year lease too, which would suit me as I don't want to commit to working for much longer than that.

                • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 21:30

                  @md333: I found the NVL companies very happy to give detailed quotes, could be worth getting one to get some more solid numbers, might be more compelling for your wife than some random woman in the internet;)

    • Drakesy on 02/03/2023 - 13:32

      Agreed, the state of novated leases these days only really (barely) make sense from $120k+

  • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 13:27
    +2

    Were the FBT benefits a deciding factor?

    What is the interest rate of the novated lease?

    Are the SCA seat covers airbag compliant?

    Are you expecting poor mileage on your regional trips?

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:36
      +2

      FBT was a factor for purchasing now and going straight to EV, yes, but I was considering getting a car in the near future since the Prius was a loaner from my parents for my poor student days.

      Interest rate is 9.66% with 28% residual. I could have gotten a car loan on lower interest, but the maths are definitely in favor of novate when you can go fully SS.

      Covers are airbag compliant yes (but now you made me need to double check ;))

      I expect some drop just cause that's the nature of the beast, but I also don't like doing long drives in one sitting, so I plan on coffee/top up stops along the way.

      • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 13:37
        +3

        Cheers.

        Also, thanks for not posting and ghosting on an AMA. It's very refreshing.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:40

          You're welcome! I can't promise how often I'll be back on to reply, but I'll try to be regular :)

  • Pecan on 02/03/2023 - 13:30
    +1

    Did you test drive any other EVs before landing on this decision?

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:44
      +2

      Yeah, I tried the Atto- was a close race but preferred the MG for my driving style. The atto also felt a bit crowded- I have long lanky arms and whacked the center armrest whenever I moved.

      I'd also been in/around EVs with family (parents have a Kona, and before that a first gen leaf), and was a passenger for an Ioniq test drive. Budget was a factor in terms of how much I could spend/fortnight on top of mortgage etc.

  • Drakesy on 02/03/2023 - 13:36

    My question would be why the MG over the (better on paper) BYD?

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 13:46

      Better on paper, less better on backside was my experience ;).

      It was a close race, but with my drive style (quite slow and cautious), I felt the MG was a better drive and a more comfortable feel. It also helped that the dealer is one suburb over rather than a one hour drive away if I need servicing etc. Admittedly if the Atto drove like the MG I would probably have gone that way.

      • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 14:57

        In to add that I also was keen not to have a sunroof of leatherette seats, which the Atto seems to have no matter what.

        • dcep on 02/03/2023 - 16:49

          Does MG ZSEV has better warranty coverage and lower servicing costs over the BYD Atto ? (Probably won't matter on your circumstances)

          • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 16:55

            @dcep: I think they are fairly equivalent, though BYD asks for annual service and MG asks for every two years- though looking at it the MG comes out to more as the prices alternate each cycle. BYD's vehicle warranty is 6 years/150k kms, MG is 7 years unlimited.

            • dcep on 02/03/2023 - 18:45

              @seannami: BYD Atto 6yrs* General warranty / 150k

              12 months on:
              Charging systems/EQ.

              3yrs / 60k on:
              Infotainment / Media system
              Shock Absorbers
              Wheel Bearings
              USB ports

              4yrs / 100k on:
              LED lights (headlights, etc.)
              Suspensions parts
              Ball Joints

              8yrs / 150k on:
              Battery Drive unit

              8yrs / 160k on:
              Battery Pack

              BYD Atto - Total cost of servicing over 7 years = $3,100

              MG ZS EV - Total cost of servicing over 8 years = $1,600

              • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 18:46

                @dcep: Thanks :)

                • dcep on 02/03/2023 - 19:09

                  @seannami: Appreciate if you could find out whether MG's 7yrs warranty is blanket cover everything or comes with many *** like BYD's.

                  • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 19:19
                    +1

                    @dcep: 7 years is Vehicle, perforation and main battery. 12v battery is 2 years unlimited kms, bulbs is 3 months, key fob battery is 6 months, and any aftermarket decals are 2 years. Exclusions are the usual wear and tear, problems due to negligence etc.

    • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 21:57

      Don't forget to ask about the Battery Warranty in detail. As an PHEV owner, this is one crucial differentiation factor.

      Tesla warrants 8 years minimum 70% battery capacity (that is, the battery capacity SoH won't go below 70% over 8 years). This is worse than I was previously quoted 2 years ago where they warranted 80% over 8 years.

      BYD warrants 8 years minimum 70% battery capacity as well.

      Just fyi, my Outlander PHEV is nearly 10 years and sitting at 77% SoH so the battery warranty is really rubbish as it will never touch below 70%. Mitsubishi used to warrant 80% over 5 years and it did go below 80% in my 4th year (nearly 5th) so I got a new battery. Looks like people learned from that.

      • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 16:16

        Thank you, I couldn't find anything about the capacity in the warranty, I'll make sure to check when I collect the car and report back (I may need reminding)

  • djsweet on 02/03/2023 - 13:41
    -4

    Fire away!

    Thats what China will be saying when they invade

    • Leadfoot6 on 02/03/2023 - 22:51
      -5

      Just as well I went to the trouble of checking through the thread before I made a similar comment.

      Well done djsweet.

      The OP does not seem astute enough to recognise the irony in her statement.

      Further:

      Keen modern historians will recognise the focus of the article(Dr. Richard Overy) from which I draw a famous quote:

      “You may not be interested in war, but it is interested in you,” runs a quip attributed to Leon Trotsky. Overy…..

      https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/04/books/blood-and-ruins-ric…

      It is easy enough to wave away concerns about the unpleasant consequences of potential war and potential enemies, but it is much harder to secure ironclad guarantees that the consequences will not ultimately hit home.

      I.O.W. "You can run, but you can't hide".

      • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 08:40
        +1

        Just to address this before moving off it entirely: I am asking to leave the geopolitical issues out if this thread to stay on topic and avoid massive slinging matches that have occured in other threads and achieve nothing but frustration, NOT because my head is in the sand about the situation.

        I have created a thread to discuss novated leasing and a car for those who may be interested in either item. You are clearly not interested in either, and so this is not the place for you.

        • Leadfoot6 on 03/03/2023 - 09:02
          -3

          Just as the VERY famous figure of history alluded to in the immediately prior post, attempting to wave away the geopolitical issues does not actually make them go away.

  • spiff on 02/03/2023 - 14:01
    +1

    How much was the insurance through novated lease, and did you get your own quotes to compare?

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 14:05

      $170 (give or take)/ month. Current insurance company quoted the same car and excess at $204/month with fewer benefits, even after the rating one and multi-policy discount. The lease company also has some extra added benefits like no limit on glass excess waiver and higher payout caps that are only available for "fleet" vehicles

      • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 17:44
        +1

        keep in mind that the NVL company may charge an 'insurance management fee' ie: their comission for selling you an insurance product. Include that in your maths for comparing insurance costs.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 18:03

          The commission and administration adds about $10/month, so still comes out better in comparison, especially given the extra-extras for fleet insurance

  • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 16:21
    +1

    A few weeks ago, I asked for a novated lease quote for a BYD 3 Atto.

    One of the ways to work out whether you have been ripped off is to ask for a one year Novated Lease and then you compare between the price of the car after deducting GST and the amount you would have to repay.

    So in my case, I will have to pay $30k in lease fees. At the end of the year, I would have to pay a balloon of $35.6k. So total outlay is $66k roughly for a car that is worth $49k (after GST deduction). $30k of that $66k outlay would be pre-tax but let's forget that for a moment.

    So a $66k repayment (albeit partially pre-tax) out of $49k car means a near 135% (1.35) premium. Your interest rate would have to be 20%.

    I worked it out in the end the after tax benefit for me would be around $2.5k and I would be hit with RFB of over $30k.

    So the answer is no.

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 16:47

      Was that for the car only? For the $66k, does it also include registration, insurance, roadside and all that on a one year? I can see how it wouldn't be that great on a one year lease, but spread across 5, on my maths including all the running costs etc it came out much better. Taking into account what I currently pay for insurance, running costs etc I'm only really down $150 a fortnight for that five years from my current outgoings. Having also calculated the possibility of car loans or dealer finance, this was a far better option in my circumstances, which was more like $300ish a fortnight down from current outgoings.

      I think novated lease is best compared to purchasing the same car with a loan or finance, really.

      On the five year, pre-GST car cost $44500 after onroads and rebate, $18500 worth of rego, insurance etc- $63000 worth of inclusions (excluding fees etc).

      Post-tax outlay of $46500 (including HR admin fee which don't even get me started) then $13600 residual. So overall $1700 better off after the residual is paid (give or take). Compared to a car loan that is a fair deal I think, but I understand the circumstances may vary.

      • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 17:47
        +1

        Also … keep in mind that with a 5 year lease, if you get made redundant or lose your job during that period, you're liable for the whole of interest that was meant to be paid ! + residual + gst.

        so well done for redundancy cover. What does the PDS of redundancy cover say about redundancy? ive never heard such of such a thing.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 17:58

          I'm in a sector that restructures on the regular and was fairly decimated by COVID (thanks Scummo), redundancy cover was a no brainer!

          There are various caviats on the cover, and my employer also has a redundancy contingency in their novated lease policy. Basically the insurance covers your payments for up to 11 months of unemployment- including GST- as long as the unemployment is involuntary. My employer also has a policy of covering the remainder of the lease (up to 12 months) and and lease break fees if I hand the vehicle back to the lease company if I lose my job involuntarily. So the best course of action would depend entirely on when the redundancy happened and if the next employer could take over the salary packaging. My severance and term of notice is fairly good too, so I feel confident in my safety net.

          • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 21:22

            @seannami: involuntary and redundancy cover are different afaik

            please be sure you're covered for redundancy and not just involuntary. my dad had involuntary and it did not help when he was made redundant.

            check the pds explicitly has redundancy in it

            :)

            • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 21:32

              @FoxJump: Yep, covers redundancy, retrenchment, or "forced early cessation" as well as medical loss of employment. They will also pay all break-lease if you hand the car back after 3 months but before 6 months unemployment.

              • [Deactivated] on 19/03/2023 - 19:13
                -1

                @seannami: Is this part of Eric Lease Protection Insurance in your NVL agreement?

                • seannami on 19/03/2023 - 19:15
                  -1

                  @[Deactivated]: It's LeaseGuard which is an in-house insurance from SGFleet with Marsh as provider

      • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 21:44

        $66k includes all onroads which were worked out to be $4k.

        By the way, I also asked for 5 years quote. Here is what I was given
        $701 x 26 fortnights x 5 years = $91,130. Out of $701, $159 is running cost portion of the lease includes rego, insurance, roadside, tyres, servicing.
        Then add $15,262 for the balloon after 5 years. Total outlay $106,392. $91,130 of this outlay would be pretax over 5 years.

        Again, car price is $49,323

        So about 115% premium over 5 years. Take away 20% (because 20% of the total outlay relate to running costs) then you would get roughly 18.4% ((115 / 5) x 0.8).
        This is rough estimate interest rates.

        Obviously you would still be better off overall but not as much as you think by far and you will get hit with RFB every year (this is the biggest factor why I said no).

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 21:53

          $701 per fortnight on a $50k car is really a lot- that sound like they are calculating it based on post-tax contribution. I got a combination salary package and after-tax contribution quote and the fortnightly was $485/fortnight with an assumed car cost of $48500, while full salary sacrifice was $343/fortnight. Reportable fringe benefits on an EV only applies to calculating eligibility and contributions for medicare levies and family benefits, so you aren't really being 'hit' by it every year.

          Can you confirm that you NVL provider actually included the FBT exemption for the EV in both quotes, cause they do really seem very high.

          • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 22:03

            @seannami: They do. But just because they are FBT exempt, doesn't mean there isn't any RFB.

            My Novated Lease is Maxxia if it helps.

            This is how it is presented for 5 years quote.

            Fortnight deductions - $701.57 ($542.90 Lease + $158.67 Running Costs)
            Financed Amount - $57,522 ($49,323 BYD Atto 3 + $437 Financier Fee + $2,455 Insurance + Optional Protection insurances - Lease Guaranteed Buyback and Total Loss - $5,100).
            Residual $15,262

            No FBT.

            • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 22:11

              @burningrage: That is fairly strange since the running costs should be included in the price. A friend of mine also has investigated through Maxxia with a similar car (MG4 $55k) and they are getting $373 for the lease per fortnight (when all is said and done, so the effect on take home pay essentially) including running but excluding insurance (so probably $420). I don't mean to be a pain, but yours sounds off to me. Are the calculations list for before GST and tax adjustments are removed, or sans GST & tax?

              There are RFB, but its not used to calculate tax, its just an adjustment to how they calculate certain levies and benefits:

              "The amount of RFBA reported for an employee is not added to an employee’s taxable income for determining income tax and Medicare Levy liabilities. However, it is added to an employee’s taxable income for calculating Medicare Levy Surcharge liability, and is included in income tests for family assistance, child support assessments and some other government benefits and obligations."

              I apologize if I have misread something in here, I'm not trying to argue, I want to make sure we're both on the same page

              • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 22:28

                @seannami: I think different company got different deals. I am not sure myself why it was so high.

                But yeah, I just wanna help and share my experience with NVL.

                EDIT: GST already removed. I mean if the car is ex GST ($49k is ex GST) then why wouldn't the incidentals?

                I wish I know how to post a screenshot but here is my best try

                YOUR ESTIMATED TOTAL FORTNIGHTLY DEDUCTIONS
                $701.57
                This amount covers everything from your car’s finance to your running costs and is based on an annualised figure.
                Hide
                Why your package is more valuable than the car

                Your running costs, finance arrangement and the car itself are all packaged up for you in your deductions. Meaning you can hit the road with the peace of mind a convenient budget brings. Plus, with the ease of novated leasing, you'll enjoy a smoother on road experience.

                Your total package

                Car lease payments
                $542.90
                Ongoing running costs
                $158.67
                Scheduled servicing
                Replacement tyres
                Roadside assistance
                Incidentals
                Comprehensive insurance
                Annual registration

                • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 22:31

                  @burningrage: I appreciate it :). Hopefully you can get a better deal somewhere, or maybe talk to your HR if Maxxia is giving you all a bum deal!

                • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 22:36

                  @burningrage: Hmm, looks like it might be after GST but before the tax calculation, so roughly $490 from take home pay, which sounds a little more reasonable, and if you have all the extra redundancy insurances and stuff tacked on (and if they are calculating the VictoriaTax into the rego)- my quote was presented as that too, but then had the little (-tax adjustment) calculated at the bottom.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 21:56

          Actually- was the quote through an agent, or just using the online calculator? The online calculators on some companies (the one I'm using included) won't include the EV FBT exemption

      • seannami on 03/03/2023 - 16:13

        I forgot to add the GST in the "better off" maths, it's more like $6000 better off on a NVL from outright :)

    • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 17:27
      +1

      some NVL companies will tell you the interest rates.
      Then some will add a hidden comission on top. Compare the balloon payment for finance, with the interest rate advertised, and monthly replayments for finance against one of many balloon-repayment calculators online.

      if it does not match.

      Ask the NVL to explain where the hidden fee is.

      • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 17:59

        The NVL I'm with outlines all their fees in excruciating detail, including my company's HR administration fee. But thank you for your advice, it is good to have the extra heads up

    • FoxJump on 02/03/2023 - 17:37
      +3

      @burningrage
      so you can buy a 54k car (inc gst) and buy it (with your own money - cash, gold coins, etc)
      or you can novate lease a 49k car. (ex gst), finance 49k, with a residual of 32k (ex gst). so the actual amount repaid of the finance amount being 16k
      say interest rate is 10%, and doing it super simple and naive $4900 of interest for the year (10% of 49000)

      so … finance expenses for the year are:
      4900 + 16000 = $20900

      so at the end of the 1 year, $20900 (from pre-tax, all of it, since an EV), plus $32k(+10% for gst) == 56100
      + expenses like insurance (guess $2k), ctp, rego (guess $1.5k), no tires, a "service" (guessing $500)

      so all up $60100 (with 25100 being pretax and 35000 being post tax (the residual inc gst))

      Assuming 30% tax rate
      out of pocket = 35000 + 25100 * 0.7 == $52570

      So

      you can buy a car with your own money for $54k + pay one years worth of maintenance and running costs, and maybe miss out of mortgage offset interest, or cash interest
      or buy one with someone elses money for $53k including a years worth of maintenance and running costs

      Assume your loss-of-earnigns from savings or mortgage is 3%. thats $1620

      so really it's

      Your cash: 54k + $1620 + $4k running costs = 60k
      vs
      novated lease of 53k for a year.

      $7k of savings for 1 year.

      • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 21:50
        +1

        The key word here for most people would be the interest rates. For my novated lease, this interest rate was hidden and the only way to pull it out is by asking for a 1 year quote and did the calc I did above. It came up about 20% interest. Probably a bit less but confidence between 18% - 20%.

        If it was 10% or less, Novated Lease would probably be more worth it.

        For me, the key word here in addition to interest rates was RFB. I cannot afford to be hit with massive $30k RFB.

        • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 22:30
          +2

          The interest rate I am getting (SGFleet) is 9.6%

  • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 16:56
    +1

    Witch Which colour did you select?

    • seannami on 02/03/2023 - 16:57
      +1

      Red :)

      • Muzeeb on 02/03/2023 - 16:58

        Diamond Red Metallic at $700.

        Because it goes faster?

      • burningrage on 02/03/2023 - 21:50
        +1

        I like red!

  • WreckTangle on 02/03/2023 - 19:28
    +2

    Sounds exciting OP, Well done for being an early adopter

    • Leadfoot6 on 02/03/2023 - 22:56
      -2

      Or for helping fuel the geo-political ambitions of a militaristic, aggressive China.

      Actions have consequences.

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