Which 2.0 Speakers for TV and Music?

samo on 14/03/2023 - 14:25
Last edited 14/03/2023 - 18:28

Looking for advice on speakers to be used for watching TV and also streaming music. Currently using the built in TV speakers for movies and a Google Home Mini for music in the living room.

I have an Apple TV connected via HDMI for streaming video.

What I'm after:
1. Control volume using the Apple TV remote.
2. Stream Youtube Music to the speakers - either through the Apple TV, from a phone, or directly from the speakers themselves.
3. Ideally no amp/receiver or something small if needed as space is limited. It would be behind a closed cabinet door with no line of site for IR volume control.
4. Prefer 2.0 speakers instead of a soundbar and don't like the look of Edifiers.
5. Around the $500 mark but willing to stretch to around $1k.

Some options:
1. Klipsch The Fives
2. Kanto YU6 - Connect via optical out the TV and teach the IR codes to the Apple TV remote.
3. Homepods
4. Passive speakers with a small receiver/amp. Is there something that can take HDMI from the Apple TV and output to the speakers and then pass through the video to the TV?
5. Anything else?

Thanks!

Electrical & Electronics Speakers

Comments

  • spackbace on 14/03/2023 - 14:45

    Prefer 2.0 speakers instead of a soundbar and don't like the look of Edifiers.

    Why? Always ideal to have a separate speaker for voices

    • Murkymerv on 14/03/2023 - 16:57

      Dialogue !

    • rumblytangara on 14/03/2023 - 18:27

      Always ideal to have a separate speaker for voices

      Is there a source for this? First time I've ever come across this idea.

      • spackbace on 14/03/2023 - 18:28

        To have a centre speaker for dialogue? No different to having a sub for bass, definition. Common sense really rather than getting muddled in with other sound effects

        • rumblytangara on 14/03/2023 - 18:30

          I don't think that's how it works. You have a sub because a smaller radiating surface just isn't capable of moving enough air for the low frequency stuff, it's not about 'definition' so much as smaller drivers simply not having the power and mass.

          In terms of 'definition' for voice (mid frequency stuff) then that's more down to high quality drivers. You don't need separate sources just for voice.

          Edit: I mean, maybe there is a bunch of theory that really supports it, but I'm oblivious to AV so am genuinely asking. I figured that having high quality drivers would be more important than simply a dedicated voice source- thought the centre channel thing was more for direction of sound.

        • rumblytangara on 14/03/2023 - 22:52
          +2

          Uh, that's just a Dolby marketing page. There's nothing research-based or informative in it.

          • sumyungguy on 14/03/2023 - 23:00

            @rumblytangara: Uh, what am I missing here? If you set your decoder to 5.1, each channel (speaker) gets different components of the soundtrack. Dialogue gets mixed predominantly to the centre speaker which is why it's good to have a qualty one

            The channels in a 5.1 audio mix serve distinct purposes. The three front channels (Left, Center, and Right) provide crisp, clean dialogue and accurate placement of onscreen sounds. The twin surround channels (Left Surround and Right Surround) create the sense of being in the middle of the action.

            • rumblytangara on 14/03/2023 - 23:29

              @sumyungguy: Oh, I think I get it now. If you're using Dolby mixing then it's optimised for including a centre channel.

              I don't really put much credence in Dolby as a standard and prefer just to concentrate on high-ish quality drivers and stereo audio. As a result I don't use 5.1 at home.

              But right, thanks for pointing out that lots of people do use 5.1/

  • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 14:47

    New HomePods will let you get stereo. Not a bad option at all. And apparently you can somehow get sound output from your TV itself to the HomePods, so you can use them for Playstation or DVD players and such.

    • sumyungguy on 14/03/2023 - 15:06

      … and Atmos too. HomePods (new model) are definitely the way to go for someone who likes music and doesn't care for a centre speaker. I have them perched atop my Yamaha NS-777 home theatre mains - they're great for ambient music thanks to the room compensation

    • apple2016 on 14/03/2023 - 15:36
      +1

      Either apple Home pods or a pair of Sonos one etc will do the job.
      Wireless speakers still need to be powered.

      • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 15:47

        I use a pair of Harmon Kadon Studio 6 speakers and they are great, except there's no remote to control the volume. But they are very powerful and sound quite good, wall shakingly loud and great clarity. They don't work in stereo natively so I had to source a Y splitter 3.5mm cable, which is harder than you'd think. And earthing it is even harder. So actually I wouldn't recommend my setup.

        The "bluetooth speaker" has come a long way since I was a kid.

        • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 16:32

          The "bluetooth speaker" has come a long way since I was a kid.

          I wouldn't say just that. It's the standard of audio quality in general. That's why so many people are satisfied with bluetooth audio/phone dongle these days.
          Spending extra $$$ just doesn't get you a big jump in quality because the base level is so good now. That's my opinion anyway I just can't relate to people who spend $$$ for that X% improvement.

      • AngoraFish on 14/03/2023 - 16:37

        2x Sonos One is definitely the go-to option without stretching OP's price range, in my opinion.

        • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 18:41

          OP could get just two Sonos Era 100's and still be within budget. They are the "new" Sonos one's.

          • AngoraFish on 14/03/2023 - 18:49

            @harshbdmmaster718: Sure, except that OP said that he wants something around the $500 mark, and yet most of the suggestions, including yours, are hitting closer to his 'stretch' budget.

            • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 19:37

              @AngoraFish: Quote from OP.

              willing to stretch to around $1k.

              I took this as budget being $500 to $1k. e.g. suggestions welcome below $1k.

              Even OP was considering Homepods which are $479 each.

              The only suggestions below that stretch over $1k are the Sonos suggestions. Both ELAC Connex and Edifier S3000 are below $1k.

    • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 16:30

      New HomePods will let you get stereo.

      They can do spatial audio as well, so that might help make movies more immersive.

      And apparently you can somehow get sound output from your TV itself to the HomePods, so you can use them for Playstation or DVD players and such.

      How does that work? I haven't heard of this feature. The Homepods have no inputs only wireless audio via AirPlay. So the only way it could work is the Apple TV is going to be capturing audio that's output from the TV via HDMI?

      • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 16:31

        Yes actually iirc you do need Apple TV and it must use ARC to get audio from the TV by HDMI.

        • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 16:35

          Interesting. I know TV's must be able to output current source HDMI audio because pretty sure that's a common way to connect an AV receiver to handle the TV audio. So looks like Apple TV has enabled a feature to reverse the HDMI signal (from Apple TV->TV HDMI to TV HDMI->Apple TV).
          I wonder if it's a software/firmware enabled feature (works on older Apple TV's), or if it works only on the recently released Apple TV's.

            • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 16:41

              @AustriaBargain: Damn mine's a 4K Gen 1 😓.

              Also I think the Apple TV's "latency correction" won't work (it's pretty noticeable with Airplay to homepods) because it requires the Apple TV to delay the video stream, which is upstream of the Apple TV when it's receiving the TV audio. I think that's an important point people should keep in mind.

              I don't game but it would be annoying as hell especially for gamers. Would be interested to see a review on this feature with a PS5. Heading to youtube now.

              • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 17:25

                @harshbdmmaster718: I do know when my TV isn't in "game mode" that the lag in games is extremely bad. Which combined with the lag Quick Resume can introduce in some games becomes intolerable. I don't know if slightly audio lag would be as bad though than visual lag. I'd be interested to what people say. Bear in mind that when using ARC or eARC to pass audio from the TV to your HomePods that you aren't using the Apple TV for video at all, so the Apple TV delaying the video stream wouldn't be a factor. The only question is how much lag does the wireless audio from the Apple TV to the HomePods introduce. It's 2023 so I'm guessing it's a non issue?

                • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 18:05

                  @AustriaBargain:

                  so the Apple TV delaying the video stream wouldn't be a factor.

                  Yeah that's what I mean. Apple TV needs to delay video stream to align the delayed audio. e.g. wireless audio (Airplay) introduces audio latency. The audio delay is bad enough that mouths move before you hear the person speak. Apple OS devices get around this by delaying the video stream by exactly the amount of delay is caused by the wireless audio Airplay, so you will experience zero latency.
                  I experience this same thing with my iPad because it only does the correction or "video stream delay" when using AAC bluetooth devices (Apple's official supported codec which is also used in Airpods etc). I have a headphone which is SBC/AptX only and when I use them I experience audio latency.

                  But if the video is upstream of the Apple TV, it cannot delay the video stream.

                  The only question is how much lag does the wireless audio from the Apple TV to the HomePods introduce. It's 2023 so I'm guessing it's a non issue?

                  I found a review demonstrating it. Was able to timestamp the link https://youtu.be/bYgbMtIR6JY?t=1307

                  It's actually not as bad as I thought from the Game console, but as they say it is noticeable. Clearly in the MacOS example it's pretty bad. Weird how MacOS doesn't correct it though, I am thinking it depends on the software. e.g. if you watch a youtube video in Safari it should correct it by delaying video, but maybe the video editing software in the video does not support it.

                  • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 18:14

                    @harshbdmmaster718: It should be no more lag than playing a game on your Apple TV from the App Store. His test showed 0.17 with TV speakers and 0.29 on TV to HomePod, that's not too bad is it? Rhythm games might have issues but those games tend to let you adjust the lag in the game settings, presumably letting you have the upcoming sound play 0.29 earlier than the video.

                    • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 18:17

                      @AustriaBargain:

                      that's not too bad is it? Rhythm games might have issues but those games tend to let you adjust the lag in the game settings, presumably letting you have the upcoming sound play 0.29 earlier than the video.

                      Yeah to be honest I am not a gamer so I don't know how bad it would bother me. But one example I could think of it being and issue is first person shooter type games??
                      I just notice even the slightest bit of latency with my bluetooth example and movies. Even when I watch the latency test video on youtube and my SBC headphones show a miniscule amount of latency, I notice it when people speak in movies and the voice is not aligned with the lips. I have gone through a couple movies doing my best to try to "forget that it's there" but I still notice it. If I switch to my AAC bluetooth headphones there is zero latency because the Apple TV corrects it (delays video) for AAC codec devices.
                      Why does Apple only support video stream delay with AAC? Most likely because that's the codec Apple headphones use, so they want to have a premium experience for their own products.

                      Sorry I can't say anything on the technical side of things I don't know how many 0.XX is noticeable, but I heard it's different for everyone.

  • revheadgl on 14/03/2023 - 15:09
    +1

    ELAC Debut ConneX DCB41 has hdmi arc. They are at the top end of your budget at $999.

    • Rockets84 on 15/03/2023 - 11:01

      Excellent recommendation. I use Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2 speakers and a matching C5.2 centre speaker with a Yamaha amp. Great speakers for the money.

  • garetz on 14/03/2023 - 15:37
    +2

    Ive had Aktimate 2.0s for close to a decade, shame they went out of business. Havent been able to find anything comparable since for the same price point.

    • Cheaplikethebird on 14/03/2023 - 15:42

      Yeah I've been enjoying mine for probably over 10 years now. There's still a place selling them on eBay here $250 for the micros.

    • AustriaBargain on 14/03/2023 - 15:48

      I used to use Actimate Mini, which were actually quite large bookshelf speakers. Those would shake the walls too. Probably on par with the KH Studio 6 I use now.

    • Rockets84 on 15/03/2023 - 11:32
      +2

      I've still got the original Akitmate Mini's with the iPod 5th Gen dock. Had them for about 14 years now I think. Use them as my desktop speakers now connected to a Schiit DAC.

  • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 16:14

    Some options:
    1. Klipsch The Fives
    2. Kanto YU6
    3. Homepods
    4. Passive speakers with a small receiver/amp. Is there something that can take HDMI from the Apple TV and output to the speakers and then pass through the video to the TV?
    5. Anything else?

    Out of that list only Klipsch the Fives (HDMI) and Homepods (Airplay) will "1. Allow volume control with Apple TV remote".
    Another recent option with HDMI is the ELAC Debut Connex (Just within your $1k budget).
    Edit: By the way I have seen the Klipsch The Fives drop to $1k before. I think it was just before The Sixes came out.

    Is there something that can take HDMI from the Apple TV and output to the speakers and then pass through the video to the TV?

    Yes there are cheap small devices that strip the audio from HDMI, but feedback says they are finicky and made poorly by no name brands. e.g. I have heard it can mess with the HDMI control feature (how your TV auto turns on when you power on your Apple TV) and others have issue with how it strips the audio making the sound muffled and sounding like it's coming from the wrong channels as well as it intermittently stop working. You are better off doing it properly with the Klipsch or Homepods type options.

    • sumyungguy on 14/03/2023 - 17:02

      Is there something that can take HDMI from the Apple TV and output to the speakers and then pass through the video to the TV?

      Isn't this what every home theatre amp/receiver does?

      • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 18:11

        From reading the post since the top 3 on the list were "powered speakers", I think OP was looking for something cheap and small to do the job of connecting HDMI to non HDMI input speakers, because there are much more options for powered 2.0 bookshelfs when you only need ones supporting analog inputs. Most "small amp" options also do not have HDMI inputs, although some might have optical inputs I don't think those small amps will allow volume control from Apple TV remote.

        You are quoting OP by the way.

    • samo on 14/03/2023 - 18:20

      I think the Kanto YU6 and others with optical in and an IR remote should be able to be controlled by the Apple TV remote - it can learn the IR codes from the remote and that's how I'm controlling TV volume with the remote now.

      Any other bookshelf speakers with optical in I should consider? Forgot to mention the Q-Acoustics M20 HD as well.

      • harshbdmmaster718 on 14/03/2023 - 18:24

        it can learn the IR codes from the remote and that's how I'm controlling TV volume with the remote now.

        I just had a look and my 4K 1st Gen remote also looks like it has a IR blaster on the top. Didn't know that. I assumed Apple TV was sending the volume changes through HDMI to the TV like it does with soundbars.

        Any other bookshelf speakers with optical in I should consider?

        Edifier. But as you said you aren't interested in those. Did you look at the S3000? https://www.ozbargain.com.au/product/edifier-s3000pro
        Seems to be their most expensive and within your budget.

        As an alternative to Homepods, Sonos just released their "version" the Era 300. https://www.sonos.com/en-au/shop/era-300
        They are designed to be "immersive" speakers kind of like Homepods.
        Buying two of them now will be a pricey option though.
        I can't speak on how they will function as Apple TV speakers, but I assume similarly because the Era 300 supports Airplay 2. Might want to do some research and look up feedback on that though.

        Alternatively you can consider two Era 100's and a Sub Mini for a similar amount, but arguably better bass performance for movies. Era 100's are just the new version of Sonos One's, they are bookshelf speaker design inside.
        https://www.sonos.com/en-au/shop/era-100
        https://www.sonos.com/en-au/shop/sub-mini
        And again, worth looking up how they will perform latency wise with Apple TV. You could ask Sonos support via email.

        Edit: I just remembered Apple TV added "latency calibration" with the ability to correct latency for audio outputs. You do need a iPhone to do it though because it uses the iPhone microphone (a friend's will work) and it will only correct the latency for content played on the Apple TV.

  • Drakesy on 14/03/2023 - 16:46
    -1

    Honestly i'd get a soundbar, it'll look better than a 2.0 setup and admittedly if it's atmos supported the movie performance would be streaks ahead. Music from anything above $600 is also decent.

    I have a dedicated 5.1 setup and the only reason i'm retaining it is because space isn't an issue.

    • sumyungguy on 14/03/2023 - 16:56

      But compared to your 5.1 setup don't you think the soundbar is not as good for music? They're great for movies but generally a bit thin in the midrange. Captain… ye cannae change laws of physics!

      • Drakesy on 14/03/2023 - 17:44

        The soundbar i have (Samsung Q650) actually does a good job at replicating the midrange and bass - anything below this model will struggle to get proper definition.

        Was presently surprised. I'd test one in store and see.

  • DannyC on 14/03/2023 - 18:08

    Sonos Beam Gen 2?

  • Void on 14/03/2023 - 19:29
    +1

    Go used for this stuff. People like the ones commenting on your post think that speakers are 'for boomers' and that plastic shitboxes are the way forward, resulting in some very nice AV equipment going for low prices compared to what it would've gone for in the market before soundbars.

    Pretty much any modern receiver with HDMI ARC (e.g. Yamaha RX-V473, Pioneer VSX-528) and some decent passive speakers will do. For $400 + $100 receiver you could have a whole HT sub and all. For $1000 you could do really well. Obviously you don't have to get a whole surround setup, just two 6.5"+ towers, or bookshelves/small towers and a sub will do very well too.

    I did this with a $300 set of Wharfedale Crystal 30s and it blows any soundbar many times the price out of the water by virtue of them being properly sized wooden boxes with real 6.5" drivers.

    • samo on 14/03/2023 - 20:51

      Yeah that would be a good option but I don't have the space for a full size receiver or large floor standing speakers.

      • Void on 14/03/2023 - 21:36

        Like I said, even bookshelves would do, even a subwoofer wouldn't be necessary. And what do you mean by not having space for a receiver? What's your TV on if it's not a TV cabinet?

  • Cohey on 15/03/2023 - 07:58

    Shame you don't like edifiers look (not a fan of standard speaker look?) Because I've got the r2750db and they sound great, use for tv games and the turntable. Might upgrade and add a sub because as expected nothing compares to a dedicated sub.

    Find it funny people recommending 600+ soundbars, so expensive .

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