Is Speed Enforcement in Australia Absurd?

Lspeedingftw on 21/03/2023 - 17:39
Last edited 21/03/2023 - 17:53 by 1 other user

Just recently got back from a trip to California, USA and one thing I noticed is that despite the speed limit being technically 65 mph on the freeways, most drivers did around 80-85 mph, even straight past cops and they didn't care one bit. Whereas in Australia, doing such speeds would usually result in a heavy fine and licence suspension in some states.

Every year more and more hidden speed cameras are being used in Australia, yet the road toll is around the same. Other countries, for instance the UK, has a road toll substantially lower than ours, despite it being common (haven't driven there but from friends who have driven there) it's also common to do 80-85 mph in the 70 mph motorways. Australian governments and police are hell bent on speed being the biggest killer in road accidents, when we only need to look at our European counterparts to see it's not the case.

Automotive

Comments

    • Sinnerator on 22/03/2023 - 08:09

      In QLD when I was younger and smarter, I got a speeding fine.
      I paid by cheque in the mail, I folded cheque tightly several times, stapled the cheque a few times, and wrote on the back of cheque

      "By cashing this cheque QPOL and SPERS acknowledge they are a bunch of clowns"

      • deme on 22/03/2023 - 08:37
        +3

        "By cashing this cheque QPOL and SPERS acknowledge they are a bunch of clowns"

        In QLD when I was younger and smarter,

        Just imagine they said oh well we don't accept this and then it was considered you didn't pay the fine.

    • Ocker on 22/03/2023 - 08:55

      Gotta stay off the weed late at night.

    • Mikeool on 22/03/2023 - 09:14

      You have a son-in-law!?

      Geez, I thought you were 12

    • JimmyF on 22/03/2023 - 09:23

      Photo was stamped 52kph in a 50 zone.

      52kph would be the alleged speed. The detected speed would have been higher.

      Either way, have you seen the fine? as 2kms over doesn't seem right. Even in VIC you have to be 3kms alleged over the limit.

    • Wiadro on 22/03/2023 - 09:45

      Bad boy you speed too much

      • Jugganautx on 22/03/2023 - 10:34

        Living life a quarter mile at a time .

    • pharkurnell on 22/03/2023 - 10:46

      The fishing is great today….

    • Protractor on 22/03/2023 - 10:50

      This thread reminds me of what the grass on the oval looks like after the main parade at an agricultural show.
      Full of …..

    • Seraphin7 on 22/03/2023 - 11:13

      Thanks and noted.

    • USER DC on 22/03/2023 - 11:16

      on Australia Day

      Why the heck was he not careful that day ?

      One needs to be super careful on such double demerit point days. I guess police etc. are really gonna pursue this, because it was a double demerit day in NSW.

      I mean you could try appealing it for an internal review.

      But the law certainly doesn't say that doing 1/2 km over speed limit is fine, sure allows some minor speed adjustment errors in measuring devices, But i think it doesn't say that if you are doing 51 Km/hr on a 50 zone, you cannot receive a ticket. May be the camera had registered speed over 53 Km/hr, but enforcement police reduced it slightly on paper ?

      • CurlCurl on 22/03/2023 - 11:21

        May be the camera had registered speed over 53 Km/hr, but enforcement police reduced it slightly on paper

        I believe the speed is automatically put on the image when the camera fires.

  • SpicyStew on 21/03/2023 - 22:08

    they call it the land of free for a reason or two

  • Protractor on 21/03/2023 - 22:12
    +1

    At least the US immigration rules are superior to their policing of speeding

    • Emerald Owl on 23/03/2023 - 21:29

      Like having a lottery?

      • Protractor on 23/03/2023 - 22:12

        Filtering dead heads

    • payless69 on 24/03/2023 - 09:32

      Also pay taxes till the end of your life regardless of residence!

  • rlf on 21/03/2023 - 22:32
    +2

    I drove from Las Vegas to Los Angeles in December, most people were going 130-140km/h !!!

    • speedingftw on 21/03/2023 - 22:54
      +2

      yup
      similar experience here, driving all throughout SoCal

    • Leadfoot6 on 22/03/2023 - 04:26

      I know I did the same over the same route some years ago.

  • 2024 on 21/03/2023 - 22:40
    +1

    Simple physics really.
    Kinetic Energy = 1/2mass * velocity²

    Or put another way:
    The cost to the health system to fix your stupid face after a crash raises exponentially with the velocity, because the kinetic energy raises exponentially.

    • Rob-4x4 on 22/03/2023 - 11:16
      +2

      The unfortunate reason we carry bottles of coke on firetrucks is that it helps clean the human remains off the road when we are cleaning up after MVAs :( .

      When you see the result of Kinetic Energy = 1/2mass * velocity² on the human body in MVAs it does make you not want to speed …

      Also there are things incorporated into road design such as visibility distance from intersections that are designed around travelling not much more than the speed limit.

      But the sad thing about over use of speed cameras is that the Education part of policing is not applied. When a cop pulls you over you also get the lecture as to why you are being a idiot…That does not occur with speed cameras ..

      • 2024 on 22/03/2023 - 13:13

        Perhaps they could send AI generated, graphic pictures of an MVA at speed (with the licence holder’s photo as the victim, incorporating the car make/model from the registration) to remind people about the stakes - complimentary with every fine….

  • OzzyOzbourne on 21/03/2023 - 22:59
    +3

    Road toll is getting worse, despite cars getting safer, more active safety features and a heavily enforced LOW speed limit.

    Best way to make money….
    1. don't teach people to drive properly and don't enforce other driving rules which actually would reduce the road toll and ease traffic
    2. Blame the road toll entirely on speeding
    3. Set unually low speed limits where uneccessary
    4. Heavily enforce speeding rules with indiscriminate cameras everywhere
    5. Reap the rewards

    • Protractor on 21/03/2023 - 23:14

      Best way to lose money….
      1.(One) don't drive properly and blame driving rules which actually reduce the road toll and ease traffic

      2 (Two) Reap the rewards

  • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 00:10

    USA car death rate 12.9 per 100,000, Australia 4.4. Says it all really. The UK is also strict on road rules and speed, the UK also has a high compliance to road rules. The UK also has around 4 times more speed cameras than all of Australia.

    • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 09:05

      The UK population is around 3 times Aus
      And the speed cameras there are clearly visible, unlike ones in Aus (many hidden ones in Aus too these days)

      • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 11:16

        what has population got to do with it? The UK is strict on road rules and speeding. I don't think you have ever driven their? I found people generally stick to the limits there as you will get nailed for speeding.

        • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 11:19

          On suburban roads in the UK yes, it's strictly enforced and it should be, there's pedestrians, cyclists, schools etc

          • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 11:20

            @speedingftw: yes it is strictly enforced on suburban roads and EVEN MORE strictly enforced on expressways and highways. If you ever watched top gear it was always one of clarksons big complaints about how strict it is in the UK. multiple driving holidays in the UK and time spent working their and I have to completely agree with him, Australia is tame on enforcement compared to the UK.

            Or to put it another way, for every speed camera you pass in Australia you would have passed 10 in the UK travelling a similar distance.

            • speedingftw on 31/03/2023 - 09:19
              -1

              @gromit: there are multiple thread on whirlpool, reddit and here on ozgargain which says uk speed limits are not enforced stricly by cops
              and speed cameras only activate at 79+ mph on a 70 mph motorway in the uk
              here, they activate at 113 in a 110 zone and 103 in a 100 zone

        • speedingftw on 06/11/2023 - 17:33
          -1

          lmaoooooo

          I just recently drove in the UK and outside of the average speed camera areas on the motorways, people do 90mph
          Their fixed speed cameras and mobile speed cameras are clearly marked and I didn't see a single cop

          Are you sure you've driven in the UK?

          • kerfuffle on 06/11/2023 - 17:35
            -1

            @speedingftw: Oh, so that's what you did while you were blocked from posting on OzBargain over the past few weeks aka in the Penalty Box.

            • speedingftw on 06/11/2023 - 17:37
              -2

              @kerfuffle: I was replying to Gromit's post about the UK being strict with speed enforcement, as he's clearly taking the piss, as my recent driving in the UK says otherwise

            • speedingftw on 13/11/2023 - 13:14
              -1

              @kerfuffle: Why downvote my post?
              Perhaps you can't drive to save your life so you're jealous that I drove at 90mph on a uk motorway

      • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 11:57

        and FYI NO speed cameras in the UK are not all cleasrly visible, the mobile cameras are allowed to be obscured or hidden and frequently will be. From memory though the mobile ones don't operate at night there (or at least didn't use to) whereas here they do

  • bargaino on 22/03/2023 - 00:13

    Australia, like the US, has a federal system. Traffic fines are done by the states.

    So please do not lump us all in with the draconian regimes in NSW and Victoria.
    There is plenty wrong with WA (we have no idea how to keep left or merge), but our traffic enforcement is substantially more sane. Maybe due to the iron-ore revenue.

    • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 09:10

      Doesn't WA have a lot of hidden cameras too?
      But atleast no points for low level speeding in WA so it's a good start XD

  • Stromae on 22/03/2023 - 00:54

    Living in Switzerland, points based driving licence does not exist here. We dont have to worry about double demerit long weekends and whatever garbage nanny state Australia tries to impose. As a matter of fsct Switzerland was a few weeks ago recognised as the country with the most freedom.

    • ass3ts on 22/03/2023 - 02:04

      But there are cameras everywhere too, and in some circumstances they could even potentially send you to jail for running the red light. They also have hefty fines based on your incomes for certain speeding offences like Finland.

      • Stromae on 22/03/2023 - 03:37

        Are you referring to Sweden maybe? Different to Switzerland.

        • ass3ts on 22/03/2023 - 11:17

          Finland

        • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 11:20

          When did switzerland change? last time I was there (admittedly about 5 years ago now), speeding was heavily enforced with large fines and suspension of license and court summons as well as criminal charges for the speeds the OP is talking about. Also switzerland has more speed cameras per mile of road then Australia by a wide margin.

          • ass3ts on 22/03/2023 - 16:11
            +1

            @gromit: It didn't change, still the same as of last week and I went there quite regularly.

            • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 16:14

              @ass3ts: So they are still insanely strict and you get escalating fines and suspensions for repeat offenses. So why claim Australia is a nanny state and switzerland free while switzerland is even more strict?

              Edit apologies that was not you, that was the OP. my bad.

    • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 09:06
      -1

      So in Switzerland, you can keep speeding as long as you can afford the fines XD

      • ass3ts on 22/03/2023 - 16:44
        +1

        No; if you keep getting caught speeding in Switzerland you may face criminal charges, lose your licence, and receive eye-watering fines if you're a high-income earner living there; all at the same time. Their thresholds for those are comparatively low too.

    • misu p on 22/03/2023 - 09:51

      depends on your definition of freedom right? didn't somebody get a fine for throwing a pan in the correct garbage bin, however, that garbage bin was across the road from his own canton? You can call anything a nanny state … if speeding laws are a nanny state than surely that is as well.

      • Stromae on 22/03/2023 - 16:56
        -2

        You get a 100 swiss francs ($150) fine for using your phone while driving. In WA the fine is $500 +3 demerit points for making a call or $1000 +4 demerit points for sending text messages. Pray to god you dont get caught on a double demerit point long weekend. And in Australia they seem to come up with creative ways to catch people using their phones now.

        • misu p on 23/03/2023 - 12:53
          +2

          sounds good… STOP USING YOUR PHONE WHEN YOU DRIVE. Make it $1000, sorry I have no compassion for phone zombies. Catch them all I say. Invent more ways to catch people using their phones.

  • ass3ts on 22/03/2023 - 01:57

    "look at our European counterparts"…obviously you haven't driven in France or Switzerland.

  • Thaal Sinestro on 22/03/2023 - 04:15

    Autobahns for Australia. Say no to these asinine speed limits.

    • Poor Ass on 22/03/2023 - 08:44

      Hahaha it won't work because some slow ass will always clog up the fast lane

      • Bypass on 22/03/2023 - 09:36
        +1

        Imagine hitting a Roo or Wombat at 200km/h

        • Poor Ass on 22/03/2023 - 10:09

          possible but so are many other things

        • Leadfoot6 on 23/03/2023 - 12:59

          I'm not sure that there is anyone here advocating for increased speed limits reflecting modern day improvements built into cars and recent road construction is advocating for a 200km/h speed limit.

          I certainly know I'm not.

  • Breno785au on 22/03/2023 - 06:10

    I don't drive much now that wfh but when I do, the traffic conditions don't let me go over 60 anyway.

  • illusion99 on 22/03/2023 - 06:50
    +2

    Regardless of safety or not the speed limit is the law of the place you choose to live in. So either obey it or don’t and cop the penalty if you choose not to. Plenty of laws I don’t agree with but I don’t whine about obeying them. Plenty of times I just want to have public sex but it’s against the law so I don’t. And I don’t whine about how I can’t.

    • Poor Ass on 22/03/2023 - 08:45

      Hope you build up the courage to have sex in public

    • crentist on 24/03/2023 - 04:03

      So when you say “regardless of safety” do you mean that you’ll follow any dumb law even if there isn’t actually any reason for it, and youd encourage others to not question it either?

      What if the law wasn’t no sex in public, which you might personally consider reasonable, but no sex at all on certain religious holidays, or after 8pm, which you might consider outdated, intrusive, and irrelevant to both yourself personally and the greater public?

      I’m not saying you should disobey laws you don’t agree with, but don’t preach apathy over understanding

      • illusion99 on 24/03/2023 - 08:09
        +1

        Generally yes. All the lockdown and curfew and distance restrictions laws were dumb in hindsight but I and the majority of the community obeyed them. I found that intrusive and irrelevant to both myself personally and the greater public but didn’t have a problem following them.

        I have no issue if you want to break the laws. Just stop whining about the penalty if you get caught

  • jerjergege on 22/03/2023 - 07:15
    +3

    Australia is pretty low in international ranking for death in car accidents. That correlates to something right?

    https://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/cause-of-death/road-traf…

  • ilikeverycheapstuff on 22/03/2023 - 08:00
    +1

    Just came back from NY. I concur with OP.

  • Odin on 22/03/2023 - 08:00

    Yes. It's awful.

    We're a joke compared to other countries

  • Poor Ass on 22/03/2023 - 08:51

    Gov will always find ways to fine people and justify it no matter what it is

  • afah0447 on 22/03/2023 - 09:04
    +2

    It's easy revenue for State Governments and our speeding fines here are also way more than other countries.

  • Aureus on 22/03/2023 - 09:08
    +1

    Funny seeing all of the people who feel so entitled to speed also complaining about "revenue raising".

    If there is one tax I can get behind, it is a tax on selfishness.

    • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 09:11
      -1

      If the speed limit on a major highway was 40 km/h, would you obey it?

      • Aureus on 22/03/2023 - 09:28
        +1

        All speed limits are a trade off between safety and speed. The government wouldn't have the science to back such a limit. Any government who introduced that would be swiftly removed.

        Thanks for your contributions to the optional selfish tax. 👍

        • illusion99 on 22/03/2023 - 09:44

          I’m more angry about the high amount of income tax I have to pay over a penalty revenue raising “tax”

          • Aureus on 22/03/2023 - 09:47

            @illusion99: Well you can thank the libs for the upcoming massive tax cuts.

  • HelpMeiCantSee on 22/03/2023 - 09:09
    +2

    Yes, it’s all absurd. But it’s also well known it’s about revenue not safety.

  • luffyex2010 on 22/03/2023 - 09:29
    +2

    This shows that our government/police officer does give a rat about saving lifes.

    AU
    In 2020, 1,094 people died on Australian roads. This dashboard shows monthly data on Australian road deaths reported by state and territory transport authorities.

    US
    Speeding was a factor in 29% of all traffic fatalities in 2020, killing 11,258, or an average of over 30 people per day.

    You really cannot compare everything especially speeds in mph…. until you yourself experience the crash at…85mph (136kmh). Then do let us know what you think about the speed increment after that but do be warn that you might never make it to tell us the story.

    • Bypass on 22/03/2023 - 09:58
      +1

      The US has heavier vehicles, they drive 70% more km a year(on average) and from observation less vehicle maintenance. I agree with OP at play that Australian's take speeding too seriously(specifically low speeds), you'll get no sympathy when you get a $300 fine for 6km/h over the speed limit. Whereas most countries don't care about low grade speeding offences.

      OP shouldn't want us to imitate the US, a better example would be Canada. They have a similar density and fatality rate, far less camera's and don't care about speeds <10km/h.

      • JDMcarfan on 22/03/2023 - 11:21
        +1

        they don't care about exceeding speed limits until you're at least 40 over (at least on the 4xx highways in Onatario). Everyone, including the police knows the 100 speed limit is insanely low (and designed for much higher speeds) and the flow of traffic when unobstructed is at a minimum 130-140.
        I've driven past a provincial police officer at 145 and they couldn't care less.

        • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 13:19
          +1

          Seems even more liberal than the USA lol
          And Canada's road death toll seems similar to Australia

          • JDMcarfan on 22/03/2023 - 13:26

            @speedingftw: ill caveat this in saying that this leniency only applies on the main highways with more than sufficient design capabilities.
            However as there are no speed cameras (except outside school and other shared spaces) there is a culture to speed regardless.
            Haven't driven there in winter but presume the low speed limits are implemented for the winter months and are more strictly enforced then

            • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 13:28

              @JDMcarfan: But in all honesty, if everyone does 130/140, and the cops are ok with this, why don't they just increase the speed limit to 130/140?
              Same with the USA, if everyone including the cops accept 80-85 in a 65 mph freeway, just raise the signs to 80-85 lol
              Makes it much easier and avoids confusion with what the "actual" or "unofficial" speed limit is

              • JDMcarfan on 22/03/2023 - 14:07
                +1

                @speedingftw: lol honestly I think its revenue raising. Defacto speed limit is 130/140, but having a 100 speed limit allows for bigger fines.
                I have quite a lot of family there and the premise is that anything up to 30kph over is a moderate fine (like $150), beyond that it jumps.
                For example 40 over is $300, and 50+ is a court sanctioned fine. I've had cousins go to court a couple times and been given $500+ fines for going 10kph faster than flow of traffic, and in turn plenty of people negotiate with the cops to have 49kph over written on ticket.
                There the police are dis-incentivised to issue fines for anything less than 30+, and given the large number of 'speeders' they wait for people at the top end of the fine scale to pull to over.
                Basically you can do any speed as long as you're doing about the same as the rest of traffic.

    • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 15:56
      -2

      blah blah
      speed is not an issue in most cases
      bad driving is

  • 2esc on 22/03/2023 - 09:49

    Highway conditions are much much better than ours in places like the UK and Europe they have much higher population therefore a greater revenue to spend on their roads which they have a lot less of.

    Death rates the US are much higher than ours in 2021 there was 42,915 traffic deaths in that year in the US. In Australia in 2021 there was 1,123 deaths of course got to adjust for population difference.

    In 2020 in the United States there was 38,824 deaths.

    • Protractor on 22/03/2023 - 11:07

      In 2020,there were 45,222 gun deaths in the U.S.,the highest number of gun
      deaths ever in the U.S.
      This is why people drive fast, like there;s no tomorrow. In America there's a more than likely chance, there isn't.

      • gromit on 22/03/2023 - 11:44

        yeah I always find it amazing that yanks spruik how safe guns make them, yet even though they have insanely high death rates for car crashes in the US you are actually slightly more likely to be shot and killed than die in a car crash.

        • Protractor on 22/03/2023 - 11:49

          and you'd think in a country with more lawyers per sq mile than there are guns, at least one of them could interpret their own constitution. I find it bizarre, that the place that calls itself, modern,free brave etc, is happy to mutilate the tenet of their own doctrine and not have the social cohesion to review and update it like adults.
          America has become the very model of what NOT to emulate. Democratically it's voting system is structured to divide at every single election. More and more over time.

  • misu p on 22/03/2023 - 09:57

    It is absurd yes… bring on the self-driving cars (that communicate with each other) to get rid of all the stupid drivers (all of them) and get rid of the speed limit and stoplights too.

    FYI: 80% of drivers in the US think they are safer than the average driver and 40% of Americans think the best driver they know - is themselves.

    Also, I do not get it…. of course everybody here is an excellent driver…. I mean outstanding by any definition… but how about the guy that will lose control at high speed from the other direction and that will slam into you?

    • Protractor on 22/03/2023 - 11:02

      100% of Americans think God made guns so they could kill each other and go to heaven to check out Gods gun collection.
      And, I once saw a doco once called Blues Brothers. Those Yanks are terrible drivers.

    • Leadfoot6 on 24/03/2023 - 04:49

      That's what freeway divided roads are for.

  • t_c on 22/03/2023 - 09:57
    -1

    When it works out cheaper to have a accident than to be caught speeding, that's probably not a good thing.

    Miss a school zone sign, 20km over is $646 fine in Qld.

    How much is your insurance excess?

    • tonka on 22/03/2023 - 11:40
      +4

      $646 is a lot and we all can make a mistake. But also miss a school sign, kill a kid and go to jail! Makes the $646 deterrent seem cheap and being real, our roads are infested with people who need the deterrent as are dumb.

      • speedingftw on 22/03/2023 - 13:24
        +1

        In NZ the same fine for 20km over the limit is around $200
        And no points from camera offenses
        Even NZ takes a more relaxed approach on speeding than Aus

        • Leadfoot6 on 24/03/2023 - 04:52

          Except for the petrol prices, I loved driving on the south island of NZ.

          I didn't see a police car for about 8 hours & covered lots of ground without worrying about licence points.

          It was a pleasure.

      • t_c on 22/03/2023 - 13:25
        +2

        But if the driver didn't have their eyes glued to the dash speedo, and payed more attention to the road, that kid would never have been hit in the first place.

        • Ughhh on 22/03/2023 - 13:32
          +2

          If you don't know how to maintain your speed without your eyea glued to the speedo, I think you have a bigger issue.

          • bobbified on 22/03/2023 - 14:18
            +3

            @Ughhh: I don't think any human is capable of being able to feel the difference in the speed they're travelling to an accuracy of +/-3 or so kph. The tolerance for speed cameras should be a little more forgiving so that people can drive by "feel" a little bit more.

            • Ughhh on 24/03/2023 - 08:33
              +1

              @bobbified: You shouldn't (and don't need to) use feelings and eyes glued to the speedo to maintain speed for that level . Both of you failed to mention the main body part that actually controls the acceleration (and thus speed) of your car!!!

          • Leadfoot6 on 24/03/2023 - 04:58

            @Ughhh: I've been driving legally since 1978 without an at fault accident since 1984, and I still can't accurately judge speed without looking at the speedo.

            My priority is keeping my attention on the conditions around me, not slavishly observing an arbitrary limit.

            As I said, almost 40 years without an accident, including half that time driving for a living.

            • Ughhh on 24/03/2023 - 08:34
              +1

              @Leadfoot6: You shouldn't (and don't need to) use feelings and eyes glued to the speedo to maintain speed for that level . Both of you failed to mention the main body part that actually controls the acceleration (and thus speed) of your car!! 40yrs of driving too!!!

              • Leadfoot6 on 24/03/2023 - 08:57

                @Ughhh: And without an at fault accident, whilst accumulating a huge distance.

                • Ughhh on 24/03/2023 - 09:27
                  +1

                  @Leadfoot6: My aunt has the same record, but she can't park or steer for shit. Good/obedient driver doesn't mean skilled driver.

                  • Leadfoot6 on 24/03/2023 - 13:11

                    @Ughhh: My mother is the same.

                    99 next month and never lost a single point, not even a parking fine.

                    No at fault accidents.

                    She is nearly blind now and handed in her licence 6 years ago, knowing that she was becoming "at risk".

                    It is heartbreaking for her, now needing to rely on others for transport.

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