Did You Build or Buy Your Own Router and Why?

OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 25/04/2023 - 10:23
Last edited 25/04/2023 - 11:43 by 1 other user

I do a bit of gaming and some 4k streaming through a stock Telstra router and as we all know the results at times can be lackluster. This is made worse by other people in the house streaming video to other rooms etc. I have heard that even the more expensive "gaming" routers are underpowered. I did some research on building your own high performance low power router but I'm still not entirely convinced that it's worth all the effort given the time to learn, expense of hardware and remembering how I set it up when it eventually screws up in some way.

I'm interested to know what approaches people have taken to keep the data flowing.

Update: Nobody has talked about QoS stuff yet? Bandwidth limiting, traffic shaping… pfSense?

Poll Options expired

  • 93
    Pre-built router (ASUS, Ubiquiti, Netgear etc...)
  • 13
    Custom built router
  • 16
    ISP supplied router
Computing Wireless Router

Comments

  • avoidfullprice on 25/04/2023 - 10:29
    +2

    Install OpenWrt on compatible router. Why build your own?

    • Boioioioi on 25/04/2023 - 11:59

      Finding an openWRT compatible router is quite hard in aus, at least I found it to be. PFsense is much more straightforward

    • GordonD on 25/04/2023 - 14:12
      +1

      Even easier. Get a router that comes with openWRT already on it, standard. Like from GL.iNet. You don't have to pay extra to cover the manufacturer developing both hardware and software, just the hardware.

  • Twix on 25/04/2023 - 10:43
    +4

    You can purchase routers with quad-core processors and 1GB RAM. They are not underpowered for gaming and 4K streaming.

  • inherentchoice on 25/04/2023 - 10:48
    +2

    I have free internet from a $20 used router which can pick up the free WiFi down the street and make a new WiFi from it. Certainly not sufficient for 4k streaming but it's a cheap old router running OpenWrt and probably saving me around $700 per year if I got NBN.

    • jackary on 25/04/2023 - 11:07
      +4

      This is the way

      • EightImmortals on 25/04/2023 - 12:52

        This IS the way, what do you use for an antenna?

        • inherentchoice on 25/04/2023 - 13:43

          The internal antenna is sufficient but I have one on order from China.

    • Shekster on 25/04/2023 - 14:48

      and make a new WiFi from it.

      Could you explain this, or perhaps point me in the right direction to learn?

    • AustriaBargain on 25/04/2023 - 18:52
      +2

      How do you know the wifi isn't compromised and some freak isn't tracking all your prons.

      • inherentchoice on 26/04/2023 - 14:56

        No prons on free wifi anyway. Unless you do VPN I guess.

  • pharkurnell on 25/04/2023 - 11:21
    +2

    but I'm still not entirely convinced that it's worth all the effort

    Nobody does.

  • boomramada on 25/04/2023 - 11:29
    +1

    Build your own and let us know the stats and the cost.

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 25/04/2023 - 11:38
      +1

      Lol! That's what I wanted you to do.

      • boomramada on 25/04/2023 - 16:05

        I thought about it, using pfsence then again if I hit by a bus, other half wouldn't be able to configure it.

  • AndyC1 on 25/04/2023 - 11:44
    -4

    Building one is very hard as most PCB schematic/layout apps take a long time to learn and then the cost of getting a multi layer PCB is expensive for a small quantity and then there is getting the BOM right and getting the parts and then stuffing of the PCB.

    Love to hear how you go about building a router instead of hacking/rooting & side loading fw in an existing router.

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 25/04/2023 - 12:07
      +1

      No I don't mean getting the soldering iron out. I mean using some kind of lightweight machine and installing/configuring software.

      • AustriaBargain on 25/04/2023 - 18:55
        +2

        Is there enough time in the day to bother doing that?

        • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 26/04/2023 - 20:11

          Probably not. The more I think about it a gaming router is probably going to be the way.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 26/04/2023 - 09:48

      Building one is very hard as most PCB schematic/layout apps take a long time to learn

      And then you need to make your own soldering iron so you need to source the materials for that as well.

      And then you need to make your own mining company to get said materials.

      It's pretty clear OP wasn't talking about going to this level of DIY..

  • Boioioioi on 25/04/2023 - 12:02
    +4

    I built my own by running PFsense in an LXC container on my home server which runs proxmox. I used an intel quad port network card and gave the container full control of it.

    I have FTTP so I do not need a modem as the NBN NTD does that.

    I did it as I was hosting a lanparty and wanted to segregate my friends onto a seperate subnet. To be honest I think I will go back to using a regular router. PFSense is too much work to do things sometimes. E.g. block websites. And I do not need it nor the extra power usage of running the network card.

    I currnetly use an asus router for my wifi, I will let that handle the routing too soon I think.

    I do prefer PFSense over some premade routers. E.g. TP Link Deco had a shit user interface with very limited controls. However I find asus user interface is pretty good

    • Boioioioi on 25/04/2023 - 16:28

      to add to my comment, I made a typo, i run it in a VM not an LXC container

  • lachhelix on 25/04/2023 - 12:09
    +4

    a bit of gaming and some 4k streaming

    Imo this really doesn't sound like you need the flexibility/upkeep of a DIY router - just buy a good router if you've been using a rubbish Telstra one and call it a day

  • Nillionaire on 25/04/2023 - 12:20
    +1

    gamers are wild

  • GordonD on 25/04/2023 - 14:24
    +3

    Want a powerful router using pfSense? Install it on a cheap used HP thin client like a T620 or T630. And maybe even a T640 with its 15W quad-threaded Ryzen processor, laptop RAM, NVMe M.2 SSD. Hardware $150, software free.

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 25/04/2023 - 16:15

      If I was going down tbat rout i would like a machine that has dual ethernet and enough power to do some kind of traffic shaping.

      • GordonD on 25/04/2023 - 16:56

        dual ethernet

        That is an issue, you have to choose either a wifi card or a second ethernet card (up to 2.5Gb/s) to go in the A+E M.2 card slot. The T740 actually has a PCIe slot for a standard card as well. Then there's their 10 Gb/s USB3 ports.

        And you don't think a quad core 1.6GHz (T620) or 2.0GHz (T630) x64 processor has enough power, or the 2.4GHz Ryzen in the T640? How much power do you need?

        Yes, of course they're not ideal hardware for routers, because they're not built to be routers. But the subject here is building one (without a soldering iron).

    • [Deactivated] on 25/04/2023 - 17:52
      +1

      PFsense OPNsense

  • payless69 on 25/04/2023 - 14:30
    -1

    Your Question: Did You Build or Buy Your Own Router

    My first network used BNC plugs and a coaxial cable.

    Twisted Pair TP came later, wireless much later.

    First wireless security was called WEP, wired equivalent privacy!!! Oh yeah was it secure?

    After router number 69 went into the bin I use Telstra 5G tower to phone on to all endless devices.

    Works well outside school holidays….

    • GordonD on 25/04/2023 - 15:42
      +1

      My first network used BNC plugs and a coaxial cable.

      My first network used vampire connectors. The coax cable had a terminator on each end, and wherever you wanted to connect something along it you placed a connector with a short tooth and a long one. When you fastened it in place the short one punctured the outer insulator and made electrical contact with the shield, and the long one bit in all the way to the centre and made contact with the inner core wire.

      IBM tried to sell us a dinky LAN architecture called "token ring" they had invented that used star-wired twisted pair cabling, but we didn't fall for that, real networks need coaxial cable. They won the battle over what the best of cable was, but lost the war to ethernet.

      • payless69 on 25/04/2023 - 18:37

        Interesting! Now my FTTP sits idle, why limit to 100Mbs when 5G goes 3-5x faster?

        • Twix on 25/04/2023 - 19:31

          FTTP is not limited to 100Mbps. FTTP goes up to 1000/400Mbps with room to increase further.

          • payless69 on 26/04/2023 - 04:05

            @Twix: Sure: Aussiebroadband: pay $799 plus GSt and we will fix it!!

            • Twix on 26/04/2023 - 09:59
              +1

              @payless69: $799? They charge the bargain price of $429 for 1000/400Mbps.

  • AwesomeAndrew on 25/04/2023 - 16:54
    +1

    I use Ubiquiti access points (3 total, U6-LR, U6-Pro and UAP-AC-Pro) scattered around the house and they work great and I get LAN speeds of above 300mbps around the whole house. They are connected to a Switch Lite 8 PoE and a USG router. I think adding WiFi access points in the correct locations will make a bigger difference to your internet experience than changing the router, unless your current router is really old (like if it only has 100mbit Ethernet old) and is bottlenecking the internet connection or the LAN. I have never seen an underpowered router that can't saturate the gigabit Ethernet port, even ISP provided routers from many years ago are able to do this.

    The router really doesn't matter much unless you want advanced features like QoS, DPI etc. For 99% of people these are unnecessary. Even though my router has QoS, I leave it disabled as in my experience it doesn't make a difference when enabled. When using Ubiquiti gear bandwidth limiting is done on the access point / switch side and the router is not involved in this. I guess if you want a device to have full LAN speed but slower internet speed it would need to be done on the router. But for me this is also unnecessary as I don't need to intentionally limit the internet speed of my devices. If some device is hogging the internet it is probably faulty and should be fixed or replaced.

    For firewalls, the standard firewall is good enough for me. I only need port forwarding for ipv4 and the ability to whitelist a device for ipv6. Then I just use windows firewall for the rest. Works perfectly for web server, RDP, email server, and VPN. I also have RDP brute force attack blocking software installed on my PC, which reads the log files and adds entries to Windows Firewall. I don't think any router based firewall would have this feature.

  • rumblytangara on 25/04/2023 - 17:54
    +1

    I've been running my own routers-in-a-box for about 7 years. Prior that it was always something like Merlin or DD-WRT.

    I do it because I enjoy tinkering with tech, and moved to low power industrial PC form factors because I think that consumer routers are built to be cheap and disposable. Hardware built to hit a price point, and with some brands you end up with really shitty software/firmware.

    Going to industrial PC also separated out router functions from wifi provision, so I can mix and match my preferred routing with wifi instead of lumping them into one box and control panel. I'm fairly opinionated on wifi equipment.

    The vast majority of people don't need to do this. It's just an enthusiast thing.

    > Update: Nobody has talked about QoS stuff yet? Bandwidth limiting, traffic shaping… pfSense?

    I've run pfSense, OPNSense, Sophos (briefly), EdgeOS. They're all good, all totally more than necessary for home use. NBN here is…. a total ripoff PoS compared to what I am used to (where the budget option was 300/300). But as far as I can tell, there is already some degree of traffic management within the network. I've had friends across Oz do bufferbloat tests and their ISP connections handle them pretty well, so as long as your upload/download isn't totally swamped, you're generally good. I've run traffic shaping when on much higher network speeds just for laughs. Haven't had the need to bother with it on my much slower NBN connection.

    Caveats: We're not big on gaming and if we stream, it's just a single device as we're not big media consumers. My understanding of streaming though is that it's really pretty adaptive, even in my prior location where I created some really silly use case tests, I could barely get download speeds to 120Mbps. My suspicion here is that if you're really having network issues, the first thing to look at is wifi vs wired. Wifi is just total crap compared to a wired household.

  • ihfree on 25/04/2023 - 18:17

    Asus routers for the last two upgrades - TM-AC1900, GT-AX6000.

    Next iteration will likely be a purpose built tiny-pc or tiny-pc with a four port NIC.

  • p1 ama on 25/04/2023 - 18:30

    I do a bit of gaming and some 4k streaming through a stock Telstra router and as we all know the results at times can be lackluster. This is made worse by other people in the house streaming video to other rooms etc.

    What exactly is the issue you mean by "made worse"? Is it a bandwidth problem? There's only so much bandwidth that can go around. I also don't quite get how others streaming video (which is downstream) will impact your streaming (which is upstream). I suppose an easy fix is to stream in 1080p instead of 4K. How many of your viewers actually watch your stream in 4K?

    I have heard that even the more expensive "gaming" routers are underpowered.

    Yes and no, a lot of manufacturers slap "gaming" labels on things just to try and sell them at higher prices. However, I'd be surprised that an average modern router is not enough for you unless you have a really large number of clients.

    I did some research on building your own high performance low power router but I'm still not entirely convinced that it's worth all the effort given the time to learn, expense of hardware and remembering how I set it up when it eventually screws up in some way.

    If you don't have any interest or knowledge of networking, building your own router is just not really something that makes sense. There are potential benefits to building your own router, but they are not really benefits that you would see in a home environment with only a handful of clients.

    Update: Nobody has talked about QoS stuff yet? Bandwidth limiting, traffic shaping… pfSense?

    Most modern routers can do all of this stuff pretty easily. Otherwise, you can step up to a "prosumer" level router, e.g. a Ubiquiti UDM-Pro, which will be as feature rich and powerful of a router that you could ever need in a home environment.

  • figsquirrel8 on 25/04/2023 - 19:02
    +1

    OPNSense on a atom mini-itx with a small ssd, 4 port gb intel card & small sfx psu, connected to a tpg 100mb fttb. Originally was going to use qos but dont really need it. OPNSense has dashboard with some traffic graphs, not comprehensive but nice. Can configure dhcp / dns etc. I limit steam / epic to 7MB/s & no issues. OPNSense has updates every 3 or 4wks, click upgrade, easy. Also does openvpn / wireguard. Finding a lower cost onboard dual nic mobo is harder now, but check out ebay / ali for 4 port celeron / i3 / i5 passive cooling mini / tiny-pc for $200-300 or just go for the 2 or 4 port gb intel card … I have a basic wifi AP for a couple of devices. Have been using this for 5+ yrs, will prob upgrade when i move house next. The fttb is very reliable, fast and will be hard to give up … :(

  • scotty on 25/04/2023 - 20:58

    Mine has been a Netgear R7000 running dd-wrt for the last 8 years, and it's a bit long in the tooth. I have also been looking at home network replacements, coming down to either:

    1. Asus AX routers running Merlin & mesh so my APs also get an upgrade.
    2. ARM SBC running OpenWRT (i.e. NanoPi R5C which would be more powerful than R7000) + dumb switch
    3. x86 PC with 4x i225/i226 running Proxmox + OpenWRT in a VM, and that would host some of my apps as well.

    Looking for something that would work for the next 5-8 years. (1) would probably mean least amount of work, but not sure how Asus/Merlin would maintain updated software for old hardwares (can't be worse that dd-wrt at this point).

  • hsp on 26/04/2023 - 08:09

    I couldn't be bothered to full configure my home network. Just a Asus TUF-AX5400 router running ASUSWRT-merlin, QoS works great, 40+ devices, VPN over wifi

  • trankillity on 26/04/2023 - 08:45

    Not a network admin, but still wanted a fair bit of power, so I opted fort he Unifi Dream Machine route. Helps that my other AP is Unifi, and I have a Unifi POE switch.

  • DarkTurtle on 26/04/2023 - 11:16

    Prebuilt router from Protectli and I’ve installed Opnsense on it. I’ve got Ubiquiti switches and AP attached to it.

    My main use case for Protectli/Opnsense is to protect my internet facing services which are Plex and VPN at the moment.

    I would like to configure QoS at some point in the future, but it’s not a high priority for me.

  • Rockets84 on 26/04/2023 - 11:32

    I've run pfSense on PC Engines boards (ALIX / APU) for well over a decade now. That combined with Cisco Catalyst switches and various brands of Wi-Fi access points over the years. Currently using UniFi Wi-Fi 5 gear but looking to replace it with something else, probably some Cisco SMB 150AX WAP's when they become available for the Z regulatory domain. Generally speaking pfSense has been rock solid stable and handles everything I can throw at it. I'm a network engineer so I don't find it complex at all but my setup is for WFH so I need it to be stable. I have FTTN NBN, so use a bridged Draytek VDSL2 modem with the pfSense box. I run multiple VLAN's with multiple Wi-Fi SSID's with full dual stack IPv4 & IPv6. QoS is all setup, I just used the built-in wizard and it's good enough for my use case. I don't game these days but my son does and we in the evening or weekends will have at least one or two streams going most of the time with my daughters and wife and no complaints from anyone.

  • gyrex on 26/04/2023 - 13:40
    +1

    I bought a 4x10GbE mini PC (Intel N5105 CPU/16GB RAM) so that I could run pfSense and a bunch of other VMs (docker, NAS etc) on it using Proxmox. It consumes around 12W and is a much more capable router than any of my previous routers. Total cost: $220. I then bought a bunch of cheap AX3000 WiFi 6 routers ($90 each) for around the house which are connected to the router via ethernet backhaul. This is the best solution for me and cost less than those router packs.

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 26/04/2023 - 18:04

      Care to share which model it was?

      • gyrex on 26/04/2023 - 18:10

        I bought it off Aliexpress. I think there's newer models available now but they're very capable and versatile mini PC's and are perfect for a multifunction router by using proxmox.

  • ColtNoir on 26/04/2023 - 14:16

    I managed to get a 3 point google mesh system for $249 so I just use that. Speed tests says 9ms and 2ms jitter on wifi so that’ll do me.

  • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 26/04/2023 - 20:13

    Is anyone running a router with DumaOS? I believe it runs on some netgear routers? It looks pretty friendly to setup and manage.

  • Helios504 on 26/04/2023 - 22:05
    +1

    I've been running Opnsense (PFsense fork) on an old Dell 9020 with an intel quad gigabit NIC for around 5 years.

    The main reason initially was to tinker, as well as I was sick of the crappy netgear stuff I had at the time (Slow, unstable and no updates, terrible logging).

    Running something like Opnsense, PfSense, Sophos, Openwrt etc can give you a stack of flexibility and way more configuration compared to a standard consumer router. But its only really worth it if you need it.

    I currently use it for the following

    Firewall with NAT
    OpenVPN for remote access / site-site VPN with family
    Dynamic DNS
    IPS
    VLan and IOT segregation
    QOS
    Probably some other stuff i cant remember.

    A big reason is security updates. Most vendors stop updating their routers or are slow to release security patches, the mainstream routing OS developers releases updates quite frequently.

  • Trysaeder on 27/04/2023 - 00:19

    It's hard to recommend a path with little information on the requirements. No one knows whether an all-in-one router can be adequate or if a custom setup is necessary.

    What aspects of your current internet performance are lackluster?

    What's your current plan's bandwidth? What's the maximum usage you want to accomodate? Are any upgrade options economically feasible?

    How many priority devices have ethernet? How many devices need high bandwidth via wifi? Can you add ethernet wiring near to those devices?

    How many walls and meters are there between devices and your current router?

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