Recommend Me a "Dumb" Car

Lglenr on 24/07/2023 - 18:56

I'm so over cars telling me how to drive.

Current car tech makes so much sense and no doubt it helps a lot of people, I get it, but it feels so intrusive and frustrating to live with the false positives:

  • lane keep assist: beeps/moves the wheel when I have to merge lanes to avoid a parked car
  • autonomous emergency breaking: slamming on the brakes to point of lock-up to avoid going through a spoon drain @ 5km/h is more dangerous than just going with it
  • blind spot monitoring: I don't need to be alerted to something that doesn't impact me unless I want to change lanes

I guess just want to drive a pre-2010 tech level of car but one that's new(ish).

My guess is most new cars will have some/most of the features above. Are there any cars (preferably mid-size wagons) that allow you to switch these features off and keep them off? Even if it means going in with an OBD tool?

Automotive

Comments

    • glenr on 24/07/2023 - 19:54

      Sedan-based wagon ideally, but could live with an SUV

      • brendanm on 24/07/2023 - 22:30
        +1

        VW Touareg. I will wait to be bombarded with negs. Other vag group cars will be similar, or at least will have the ability to turn them off with vcds or obd11

        • glenr on 24/07/2023 - 22:50

          I like this suggestion. Current model included?

          • brendanm on 25/07/2023 - 07:23

            @glenr: I haven't driven a current one, but if you mean whether stuff can be switched off, I believe so, they are all very customisable. Passat alltrack would probably be a good thing as well for a traditional medium wagon style.

          • BartholemewH on 27/07/2023 - 15:31
            +1

            @glenr: Skoda Superb wagon. Has everything, but all can be turned off.

  • randomusername2017 on 24/07/2023 - 19:51

    2010 Mercedes C220 WKR edition relatively new (250km -150km) $15k Upfront pvt $50K "maintenance" - under budget

  • BewareOfThe Dog on 24/07/2023 - 20:29
    -1

    Any Ford. ;)

    Yes, I owned 3 of them. :(

  • ECE on 24/07/2023 - 21:53

    You can all disable those things if you want to 🤣🤭

    • glenr on 24/07/2023 - 22:02
      +4

      They come back on each time you turn the car back on.

  • jv on 24/07/2023 - 22:18
    +7

    Recommend Me a "Dumb" Car

    Tesla

    • [Deactivated] on 24/07/2023 - 23:39
      +2

      Who is more dumb dumbs - Musk or Dan?

      • jv on 24/07/2023 - 23:55

        Well one of them has never had a real job outside of politics.

        • [Deactivated] on 25/07/2023 - 00:07

          Well, at least Danno got certified for his job

          • jv on 25/07/2023 - 00:33
            +2

            @[Deactivated]:

            Danno got certified

            I'd always thought he was certifiable.

            Thanks for verifying…

      • idonotknowwhy on 25/07/2023 - 10:05
        -1

        Dan talks for a living and does it a lot more than Musk, so I guess Musk is more dumb than Dan.

        • [Deactivated] on 25/07/2023 - 11:12

          It's more the things they say & Musk has said a number of doozies.

        • Gnostikos on 25/07/2023 - 14:15
          +4

          They both talk for a living.

          Musk's sum total of life experience before founding SpaceX and assuming the role of CEO at Tesla is daddy's emerald mine seed money and being a PayPal CEO. He knows the absolute square root of jack sh*t about rocketry, space travel, cars and pointless infrastructure projects. He's the outer space/automotive equivalent of Stockon Rush but even then, Stockon actually came from an engineering background whereas Musk has a been corporate, tech-grifter since day one. He is firmly an Edison/Steve Jobs marketing or salesman archetype as opposed to a Tesla/Wozniak genius-level innovator not to mention Musk's personality literally varies based on whatever flavour-of-the-month is trending on Twitter, he has no actual core values/beliefs other than whatever appeals to his fanbase.

          • [Deactivated] on 26/07/2023 - 20:17

            @Gnostikos:

            ….. Musk's personality literally varies based on whatever flavour-of-the-month is trending on Twitter, he has no actual core values/beliefs other than whatever appeals to his fanbase.

            I get that impression too. There is a people-pleaser side to him.

            • BartholemewH on 27/07/2023 - 16:53

              @[Deactivated]: Yeah, but only toward fans of his personality cult. Doesn't seem too keen to please when firing thousands of workers with a tweet/email/flaming dogshit on their desk (j/k).

              • [Deactivated] on 27/07/2023 - 17:16
                +1

                @BartholemewH: Humans sure are complex. He definitely isn't an empath.

      • smartazz104 on 25/07/2023 - 12:01

        Musk just (tried to) rename Twitter to X so…

        • [Deactivated] on 25/07/2023 - 12:02

          Is it a rename or a logo update?

          • smartazz104 on 25/07/2023 - 12:02

            @[Deactivated]: Well once upon a time he wanted to rename Paypal to X and he got pushed out of that company…

            • [Deactivated] on 25/07/2023 - 12:04
              +1

              @smartazz104: He must have a thing for 'X' - didn't he include it in one of his kiddo's names?

      • May4th on 26/07/2023 - 08:55

        I'm not victorian so I can't care less but I see so much Dan bashing everywhere yet he keeps getting voted in. Where are these voters?

    • Protractor on 26/07/2023 - 19:09

      That's a penis extension. Not quite at the scale of (Dodge RAM) schlong substitutes,though

  • nephilim on 25/07/2023 - 00:08
    +2

    Most pre-2023 Nissan/Renaults/Mitsubishi's at base level.

    They are the kings of crappy base level cars with no features/

  • Xistn on 25/07/2023 - 08:10
    +6

    Braking - the action of slowing down or stop by using a brake.
    Breaking - separate or cause to separate into pieces as a result of a blow, shock, JV's head.

    • JIMB0 on 25/07/2023 - 08:42
      +8

      Thanks for the spelling advise.

  • David 1969 on 25/07/2023 - 08:16
    -4

    It's 2023 soooooo:

    Anything requiring a service station 😂🤣😂🤣😂

    • kerfuffle on 25/07/2023 - 08:26

      Which is pretty much all ICE cars since they need to get petrol from a service station?

      • smartazz104 on 25/07/2023 - 12:02
        -1

        Just call them a petrol station, they don't provide any service any more.

        • BartholemewH on 27/07/2023 - 16:56

          The one around the corner from my house has driveway attendants.

      • David 1969 on 26/07/2023 - 10:54
        +1

        Correct.

        They wanted a 'dumb' car, so using fossil fuels which waste 60%+ of energy created to move the wheels makes ICE the dinosaurs of the road.

        Model 3 around $40-45k fill up for about $30 at a supercharger gets you around 400kms. I imagine most ICE cats cost over $100 per tank, let alone constantly wearing parts & lube requiring constant attention & maintenance.

        Evs are a no-brainer.👌

  • Brick Tamland on 25/07/2023 - 08:24

    Brand new WRX sedan in manual doesnt have these annoying features. Neither does my new BRZ but thats like the opposite of a wagon. I watched a review that remarked buying a new BRZ is like buying a brand new car 10 years ago.

  • spurf on 25/07/2023 - 08:30
    +2

    My wife's 2019 Skoda Kodiaq you can definitely turn those off and they stay off between starts and it doesn't warn you. It was turned off on my profile when I thought they were on. Took nearly changing lanes into another car which was driving with their lights off at night on the freeway to find out! Having tech that can "see" in the dark is worth the occasional false actuvation IMO

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:05

      Thanks for that - I'll have a look at the Skodas, I've liked their range for some time now.

    • BartholemewH on 27/07/2023 - 16:57

      Same with the Skoda Superb, which, in sedan or wagon is…. superb.

  • Benoffie on 25/07/2023 - 08:58

    RAV allows you to turn these things off as you please. I certainly find lane assist a pita in Adelaide along some of the major roads where carparking is still allowed (Magill Rd 🙄).

    Id hazard most of the Toyotas would have the same functionality.

    • kerfuffle on 25/07/2023 - 09:02

      They do. But some of them turn back on next time you start the car (I have a Corolla)

  • imnotgoingtopayrrp on 25/07/2023 - 09:25

    2015 - 2016 GLS or Exceed Mitsubishi Pajero. You'll thank me later (i.e. in 30 years' time when the car still runs like new).

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:06

      A friend has one and suggested similarly. Appreciate the reply.

      • dutch on 25/07/2023 - 15:45
        +2

        This is my suggestion too - love ours. It's big and dumb so I relate strongly to it.

    • JimB on 26/07/2023 - 10:30

      30yo GLS still runs like new?

      • imnotgoingtopayrrp on 26/07/2023 - 12:19

        My 7 Y/O does. And there are plenty of people with 400K plus kms in Australia that vouch for the long term performance.

  • 2esc on 25/07/2023 - 09:27

    Dont have a problem having these safty features as long as they can be adjusted and people dont rely on them too much.

    As it is 90% of people drive too fast for the conditions in just too much of a hurry for no reason. I am happy for other people to have cars with these features less chance of someone hitting me.

    I have a older car but have never had a accident in my 32 years of driving but its going to happen with the way most people drive these days someone will hit me.

    Most people are not as good a driver as they think they are..

  • hedge on 25/07/2023 - 09:53

    I guess I am weird because in my 2020 Honda I quite like all the driver assist features, but my irrational car gripe is when they beep at me for basically anything except headlights being left on as I leave. I can therefore share that a 2006 Astra has too many annoying beeps, while a 2002 Pajero has the exact right number. In fact, aside from its thirst for expensive diesel, the Pajero might be the perfect car.

  • saltypete on 25/07/2023 - 09:56
    -2

    I think there’s a specially modified Delorean that you want. Not sure how you acquire one.
    Failing that, learn to live in the 21st century.

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:07

      Perhaps it's more that I expect the tech to work better more of the time. As I mention, it's the false positives which are the problem and for me, they are intrusive enough to be more pain than they're worth. Each to their own.

      • saltypete on 26/07/2023 - 09:58

        My experience is for my 2020 Nissan Patrol with all of the safety stuff has worked flawlessly for almost 50,000 km, no problems at all. The adaptive cruise control is great for trips, the cross traffic and lane warning are also pretty useful.
        I recall similar sentiment when cars started dumping carbies and the Kettering ignition system. Only a masochist would go back to this set up for every day driving.

  • ReaperX22 on 25/07/2023 - 10:16
    +5

    Mazda 6 Wagon brand new, I believe you can turn off assists and they'll stay off even after you restart the car.

    • Gdsamp on 25/07/2023 - 12:09
      +1

      Great car. not sure theres a simple fix to disabling the auto start-stop permanently though, which i'd consider a 'smart' feature (annoying, intrusive, legislation box-checking feature)

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:08
      +1

      Thanks for the suggestion - good looking car as well.

    • Ghost47 on 25/07/2023 - 19:34

      Just watched a review on this, looks like an amazing family car.

    • Stripes on 25/07/2023 - 22:56
      -2

      The looks of a camry just without the reliability or resale value!

  • Poor Ass on 25/07/2023 - 10:25

    Pre 2005 you even get to roll the window up in some :)

    • KaTst3R on 25/07/2023 - 15:09
      +1

      Roll up windows are not great for shouting at other drivers. Imagine rolling down your window and shouting "F you muthaf***er", and then rolling up your manual window again. It is so uncool.

  • Waltervp on 25/07/2023 - 10:49
    -7

    If you don't care about safety features just get a second hand older car but what it tells me is that you are one of those people that would refuse to get electricity into the house because why have life wires that kill everywhere if your kerosene lamp works so well, not have a phone because people can visit me if they want to talk to me, not have solar because those panels add to landfill, and don't talk to me about climate science,…. get used to it man, learn to drive safely using the technology and you'll never look back.

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:03
      +2

      I did make comment that "current car tech makes so much sense" and that it's "frustrating to live with the false positives".

      Perhaps you need to turn the wick up in your kerosene lamp to read the post fully?

      • Waltervp on 26/07/2023 - 09:10

        I am an early adopter wherever possible. I may have missed you saying these features make sense, but please use them and get comfortable with them! Two people i know died in separate car accidents last week. Don't turn off any safety feature as annoying as they may seem in the beginning.

        • glenr on 26/07/2023 - 13:21

          That's awful - sorry for your losses.

  • leiiv on 25/07/2023 - 10:53

    I thought that the cheapest of the cheap models without any add-ons would not come with all that bell and whistles?

  • pegaxs on 25/07/2023 - 10:57
    -2

    I'm so over cars telling me how to drive.

    Oh, boo hoo… You know cars only "tell" you how to drive when you are doing something wrong or are a shit driver. So, if a car is "telling" you how to drive to much, maybe consider a driver's education course.

    I have a shit load of driver's aids in both of my cars and I barely hear a peep out of either of my vehicles when I drive…

    • lane keep assist: beeps/moves the wheel when I have to merge lanes to avoid a parked car
    • autonomous emergency breaking: slamming on the brakes to point of lock-up to avoid going through a spoon drain @ 5km/h is more dangerous than just going with it
    • blind spot monitoring: I don't need to be alerted to something that doesn't impact me unless I want to change lanes

    A: Easy fix. Use your indicators to change lanes. It lets the car know you are not drifting all over your lane and actually moving from one to the other.
    B: Easy fix. Stop driving up the arse of other cars. Leave some space. Also try braking early and/or covering your brake. (Also, your example is an example of "Things that didn't happen for $1000, thanks Alex…)
    C: Oh no! Not a little orange light on your mirror. Easy fix. Ignore it unless you are changing lanes, OR take note of it to let you know a car is beside you and that they may be trying to make a stupid lane change…

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:00
      +7

      Quite the aggressive reply for an opinion post. Hope your day improves.

      • gromit on 25/07/2023 - 13:18
        +5

        it may be aggressive but it does seem pretty accurate. For drivers aids to be annoying and get in the way all the time you have to be doing a lot of things wrong constantly. The only one I find annoying is the seatbelt warning as having a bag on the seat or something similar can trigger it, solution I disconnected the sensor under the seat, can reconnect when I sell it, none of the other warnings are intrusive as they only happen when you are really doing stuff you shouldn't be in which case you probably need them.

        • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 13:40
          -1

          With respect, the way in which a manufacturer implements the software/hardware will often be the root cause as to false positives. Which is what I did originally state, my problem is with the false alerts, not the driving aids per se.

          Until they get to a point where the software/hardware is more accurate more of the time, I want to be able to permanently turn them off… kinda like what you have as that's also a false positive, yeah?

          • gromit on 25/07/2023 - 14:00

            @glenr: really what sort of false alerts are you seeing, beyond the seatbelt one I basically don't see any false alerts. your examples in your main post are simply driver error, correct use of indicator would prevent driver assist alerting. As is approaching a spoon drain at speed that requires a lockup to slow down. these are not technology issues, they are driver issues.

              • toomuchdogfur on 25/07/2023 - 14:26

                @xdpx: I agree, as a VW owner with the same aids. The most intrusive IMO is the lane keeping, where it'll nudge the wheel if it thinks you're going out of lane - but sometimes it mistakes the spaghetti lines of ad-hoc tarmac repair as lane lines and does some unhelpful nudges.

                It's easy enough to ignore anyway if you have a hand on the wheel as it's not that strong anyway. And lane keep can be turned off permanently if it becomes bothersome (but I find it works well enough on highways to keep it on).

            • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 16:26

              @gromit: As I say, different implementations yield different results. Perhaps your car's implementation is better than mine. Approaching a drain at 5km/h like my example isn't user error. How would you do it? It's also not every time. It's the false positives that annoys me.

              • toomuchdogfur on 25/07/2023 - 17:28
                +1

                @glenr: Yeah that doesn't sound like a great experience to be fair. You are right in that the implementation can differ greatly between cars.

                I used to have a Subaru Liberty which I loved, but man that thing beeped for everything! The VW implementation is much nicer… it'll only scream at you if emergency braking is triggered, otherwise it's just a dash indicator or light that you can ignore if you know its a false positive.

    • surg3on on 25/07/2023 - 16:21
      +2

      No no no, these people are driving gods with the attention span of a chess grand master. Mistakes and distractions are a foreign concept to them and every issue ever encountered was obviously due to the wrong of somebody else!

      • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 16:24

        haha, I even say I could be a better driver in my first response and I'm currently at negative 11 votes. Can't win.

      • Cave Fire on 25/07/2023 - 17:33

        Yeah… That moment where "lane assist" doesn't trigger and you end up shoulder checking as a car goes past…

        • surg3on on 26/07/2023 - 08:59
          -1

          Sure, if you are not actively driving, passed out at the wheel or distracted it might not trigger and you might hit the car going past. If lane assist wasnt there itd be a 100% chance of hitting the other car. I'll take some chance of being saved over none.

          And before you say 'but people come to rely on it', it beeps and blorps constantly if you are not actively steering. If the driver still ignores that then well… they were always going to be a terrible driver.

          • Cave Fire on 26/07/2023 - 11:11
            +1

            @surg3on: There's alot if passive aggressive statements + assumptions there. But yes, I am talking about shoulder checking, lane assist is clear but a car is just behind the detection area. So you see the car go pass and it still doesn't trigger at all. Eg, a false negative/glitch.

    • pogichinoy on 03/08/2023 - 10:18

      Specifically pre crash system and subsequently autonomous emergency breaking are terrible on Toyota.

      My MY19 Prado suffers from false PCS and emergency quite often as it picks up cars driving on the opposite side of the road. Stupid!

  • GordonD on 25/07/2023 - 10:58

    I get a number of newsletters. One the other day, sorry I deleted it, had a report of new car buyer satisfaction, I think it was the well-known JD Powers survey.

    It reported something they had never seen ever before in all the years they have been doing the surveys. That the buyers of the latest new cars are reporting lower levels of satisfaction with their new cars because of the aggravation they have to put up with all the crap that manufacturers and safety rules are building into cars these days.

    Alerts that they aren't interested. False alarms. Having to learn how to make this work, or turn that off, when there everything is controlled by screens with complicated menus instead of buttons and knobs. Bugs and unreliability in these systems.

  • pogichinoy on 25/07/2023 - 11:40
    +4

    Family Guy gif Good luck everybody else

  • billy72 on 25/07/2023 - 12:10
    +3

    hate the touch screen. With the physical buttons, I don't have to look at the screen to change the aircon.

    • Ghost47 on 25/07/2023 - 16:59

      Some cars seem to be going the way of silly touch screens and removing physical buttons. In the new WRX you need to tap 2-3 times in the laggy infotainment to get to the AC controls. I think the new Golf GTI also has capacitive buttons which give you no feedback if you're adjusting controls in the centre console, and then they also have capacitive buttons on the wheel which if you accidentally brush you could turn something on and off by accident. Very poor UX IMO.

  • PopCounty on 25/07/2023 - 13:10

    These things are like insurance. You hate paying for it. But for once, you would be great ful when actually it serves it purpose.

  • brad1-8tsi on 25/07/2023 - 13:45

    I like AEB. It's saved me a few times. I have mine turned down to "min" and don't get false alarms.

  • dtc on 25/07/2023 - 14:41

    Subaru outback you can turn off everything permanently except for

    • emergency braking (need to turn it off each time)
    • blind spot assist - there is a flashing light on the side mirror, which you cant turn off AFAIK. But is totally unobtrusive and usually not even noticeable even if you are looking in the mirror
  • BargainKen on 25/07/2023 - 15:09

    Corolla ftw

  • Devastator0 on 25/07/2023 - 15:48
    +2

    Hyundai i30N (the hatch specifically). I ordered one of these in June last year because the assists are kept to a minimum, still has a manual handbrake and has a (mostly) analog dash cluster (I have had experience in all digital clusters failing and didn't want any part of that).

  • foxpants on 25/07/2023 - 16:05

    I recently rented a base model Suzuki swift 2023 brand new and was astonished how dumb it is. No active safety tech, lane keep, auto braking etc, not even auto headlights or wipers, in fact it won't even turn the headlights off for you like most cars did before auto lights, just a long continuous beep till you turn them off. My base model 2017 Astra has auto headlights and wipers..

    Felt like a caveman, but hey if you want basic I can certainly recommend it. The 1.2L N/A motor and CVT left alot to be desired in engagement, but it's barely bigger than a go kart and netted us 4.5L/100km combined driving around Darwin / NT for a week.

  • Optimist Prime on 25/07/2023 - 16:54
    +2

    Get a MK7 Golf R Wagon + OBD11 subscription and turn all that shit off. Comes with all the features you need, but real knobs/dials and OBD11 allow you to customise how it works.

    You can easily modify and tune the engine and DSG to make it even more fun.

    Underrated purchase IMHO.

    • glenr on 25/07/2023 - 22:25
      +1

      Thanks for the detail. Exactly what I was wondering. I think I’m leaning this way

      • drprox on 26/07/2023 - 07:26
        +2

        Fair choice, with a side option being the more practical but not as wild (though far cheaper) Octavia RS

        • Optimist Prime on 26/07/2023 - 11:28
          +1

          Great looking car also.

          Anything on the VAG/MQB platform is pretty customizable imho.

          I didn't suggest a MK8 as it's all touch screen and shit, and people dislike it. I've heard the next iteration will revert back to knobs/buttons though.

  • [Deactivated] on 25/07/2023 - 17:44
    +1

    My father never allowed myself or my siblings to listen to the radio when he was teaching us to drive as he deemed it a distraction - the roads required our full & undivided attention. We couldn't get our Ps fast enough.

    • UFO on 26/07/2023 - 09:32
      +3

      He was right though. When you're learning, you don't need the distraction of a radio… you need to be 100% concentrating on the road.

      • [Deactivated] on 26/07/2023 - 15:41
        +2

        We could have also done without the distraction of him falling forward from the passenger seat as he reached out an arm or both to brace against the dash (for dramatic effect) if he thought we stopped too suddenly (we didn't). Old skool Dads are a scream !

  • nicend on 25/07/2023 - 19:29

    I believe that Toyota allows you to turn off every safety feature like lane assist, or adjust the sensitivity. And yes it does remember what you select.

    However all of your examples aren't really an issue if you're competent.
    Lane Assist only activates if you don't indicate before changing lanes.
    Emergency breaking only really activates if you're pretty much certain to hit and really is just there to reduce the severity of the accident.

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