nbn - Multiple Phone Outlets in House?

tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 09:48
Last edited 04/08/2023 - 11:58 by 1 other user

So my mum (75yo but pretty good with basic tech) rang me this morning. She's on NBN 50 with Launtel but has been having issues with dropouts lately. I did a speed test and she's not even getting 20mbps. FTTN.

She rang Launtel and they reset all the settings but it hasn't helped. This morning they asked if she has other phone sockets in the house. She does and was told she'd need to get them disconnected.

Is this likely to be the issue? Most homes I know (including mine) have multiple phone sockets and have not been told this?

Would be quite a costly exercise to get a sparky in to do it.

Internet Broadband nbn

Comments

  • rumblytangara on 04/08/2023 - 09:54
    +2

    So my mum (75yo but pretty good with basic tech) rang me this morning. She's on NBN 50 with Launtel but has been having issues with dropouts lately. I did a speed test and she's not even getting 20mbps. FTTN.

    If these issues are recent and she's had good connectivity for months/years before this, then it's probably got sweet FA to do with untouched phone sockets which have probably been in place with decades which probably have nothing new connected to them.

    The ISP doing a 'remote reset' and then just telling the end user to go and modify their home wiring sounds like an incredibly slack cop out on their part- they're skipping a load of troubleshooting steps, like sending out a bloody engineer for a start.

    • jv on 04/08/2023 - 10:28
      +4

      then it's probably got sweet FA to do with untouched phone sockets

      Not true…

      Wires degrade, short over time…
      Could be due to moisture, rats etc….

    • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 10:55
      +1

      ah thats what my spintel did then.. remote reset and made the previously working fine socket, not working anymore

    • Clear on 04/08/2023 - 11:14

      sounds like an incredibly slack cop out on their part

      Well it is Launtel…

  • soan papdi on 04/08/2023 - 09:58

    Launtel isn't cheap either. Might be cheaper to switch to say Superloop or Leaptel and see if issues persist, then call the new RSP to ask why. If both say the same, then maybe it's worth spending on an electrician.

    • jv on 04/08/2023 - 10:27
      +1

      Might be cheaper to switch to say Superloop or Leaptel and see if issues persist

      It will be an NBN or internal wiring issue. Changing ISPs will not help.

  • GordonD on 04/08/2023 - 10:11
    +5

    Yes, additional phone sockets around the house can slow down an FTTN (or FTTC) NBN connection. If other actions haven't resolved the problem it is quite reasonable that they ask you to do this before they take further action themselves.

    Where the old copper analog phone wiring is being fed a high speed digital signal it was never designed to carry any issues like poor quality wire or poor connections can seriously degrade what speed digital signal it can carry. And the place those sorts of problems often occur is in the wiring to extra phone sockets around the house. So they should be disconnected.

    Most of the cost would be the callout fee, because all the cabler has to do is go to the phone socket where the phone line comes into the premises and disconnect the wire that goes to the rest of them. The rest of the sockets would then be dead, and could be removed.

    It won't make any difference whatever switching to another NBN ISP. The service you would be paying them for is coming through the same NBN equipment and down the same old phone system wires. And their diagnostic procedures are exactly the same.

    • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 10:55

      dditional phone sockets around the house can slow down an FTTN (or FTTC) NBN connection
      wont affect FTTP ?

      • GordonD on 04/08/2023 - 11:03
        +3

        Nope. FTTN and FTTC connections come into the premises using the old phone wiring. Then get distributed around the house using any old phone extension wiring that's already there. And that's where the problems can occur. But FTTP comes to the premises using an optical fibre. The old phone wiring isn't used either to get the connection to the premises, or inside the premises.

        Note that I'm talking about old analog phone wiring. If the premises have been cabled for digital then an FTTP connection may be hooked up to it to be distributed around the premises.

        • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 11:27

          cool i just hold on then instead paying sparky
          one day our area will get upgraded anyway

  • jv on 04/08/2023 - 10:26

    Is this likely to be the issue?

    Could be… or problem might be at the pit/node….

    Also check if she's eligible for a free FTTP upgrade at her address…

    https://www.nbnco.com.au/residential/upgrades/more-fibre

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:28

      I had this exact thought. And I seemed to remember that she had been eligible. But not when I do the check so maybe I just imagined that I'd done the check for her before and she was eligible.

      • jv on 04/08/2023 - 10:32

        Have you tried a different router?

  • David2017 on 04/08/2023 - 10:27
    +3

    It's most likely the issue. Star wiring is a menace with speeds and sync on the NBN and this is how most houses were wired for decades. If you can find where the copper comes into the house the nearest inside point is usually the first one, everything after that needs to be disconnected. If you're not familiar with cabling then your best bet is to get a cabling guy out to fix it up. The speeds will go up and and dropouts will disappear.

  • geek001 on 04/08/2023 - 10:27

    Is the physical connection speed actually less than 25mbps though? Check the connection status in the router admin console. I think NBN had a promise that their connections should be at least 25mps a while back. My ISP managed to get a NBN tech to come out to look at my connection because of this. This was maybe 4 or 5 years ago though.

    My house had extra phone sockets connected pre-FTTN NBN. I complained and the NBN tech came out, did a test, I was getting 33mbps at the junction where the telecom wires come into the house, but only getting 18mbps inside the house. He disconnected the wires from the extra phone socket, it made a slight improvement. He proceeded to clean the corroded wire contacts and the connection speed came up to 26mps. But not sure if this has anything to do with your dropouts though.

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:29

      Good idea. Will check that.

  • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:30

    Also thinking I should investigate what Optus is like there. My GF is on the Optus home broadband (4G) and it's really good and only about $60/mth. Better than paying a sparky to disconnect cables that may fix it.

    • jv on 04/08/2023 - 10:34
      +1

      My GF is on the Optus

      What does your grandfather mainly use the internet for?
      Maybe he doesn't need a fast connection.

      • suzley on 05/08/2023 - 14:35

        But maybe his girlfriend does?

      • sss333 on 06/08/2023 - 12:52
        +1

        The 2021 AFL GF was at Optus Stadium

  • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 10:43

    yup had the same issue with spintel FTTN months ago. i have multiple phone sockets and they said to get them cut.

    it was weird.
    initially, for months i have been using one phone socket say socket A. works fine.
    then i had some floor work to do so i move the router and connect to socket B. works fine. for 4 days.
    work is done so i move back the router to socket A, and it wont work! if move to B, work. same router same cables.
    been moving back and forth 4x, with B, connected within 20 seconds, with A, none in 30mins

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:45

      Did you do this? If so did it help?

      • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 10:46

        nope didnt do it. i thought it will be expensive to call the cabler guy.
        so i just got longer cable and run it from B to A - annoying
        i hope my place can be upgraded to FTTP soon so not bother fixing

  • Gros21 on 04/08/2023 - 10:44

    put modem on first connection. they do not need to remove the other connections just dissconnect them. Its a 30 sec job, I know of "someone' who simply cut 2 outgoing wires and used those crimp connectors filled with gel on other cores that are available at jaycar.

    Shit connections WILL make a fair difference.

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:46

      Was thinking that myself. If she was close I know 'someone' who could do it easily (used to work for Telstra so not as dodgy as it sounds).

      • GordonD on 04/08/2023 - 10:56

        Yes, its as easy as cutting a couple of wires. But the trick is knowing which wires. You have to cut the ones going to the other phone sockets. Not the incoming line.

  • CyberMurning on 04/08/2023 - 10:45

    but multiple sockets are fine if we have FTTP, right?

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 10:46

      Yes but not available to her.

    • Gros21 on 04/08/2023 - 10:48

      then my understanding is you dont use the copper at all. My 'friends' house still had those older 1' tall connectors in the bedroom.

    • Morien on 04/08/2023 - 12:04
      +1

      FTTP won't be connected to any of the multiple phone sockets, so yes. That said, those phone sockets are glorified cups with strings attached to them now. They aren't connecting to anything outside of your house anymore.

  • Morien on 04/08/2023 - 12:13
    +3

    What you're describing is called a bridge tap. You'll find a half dozen articles on it if you type that into google.

    Can it affect your FTTN connection and cause dropouts? Absolutely.
    Is it affecting your FTTN connection and causing dropouts? Dunno.

    I mean, who'd have ever thought that using outdated tech meant to carry low quality audio signals wouldn't be the best option for high speed internet???

    Troubleshooting is all about trying different shit and seeing what works. There is no "on/off" button. It is a troubleshooting step to remove the bridge tap. It isn't within spec, and is probably the last thing I'd try after testing a different router, and making sure I'm connected to the first port from the street, but yes, it is a step.

    If the connection is working fine up to the first point of the house, that's where NBN Co and your ISPs responsibility kind of ends. Your house is your house, so any issues that arise after that point is up to you to make right. But, if you have to spend money to work out where the fault lies… that's annoying.

    Right now it is a Schrödinger's cat type thing. Schrödinger's dropouts, if you will.

    Perform full troubleshooting first, and if all else fails, yeah, you may need to get the bridge tap removed.

    • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 12:36

      She has a mesh router configured as just wifi (was easier to just send it up like that). So will reconfigure this to be the router and try that. She thinks the router is in the first outlet in the house.

  • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 13:02

    So I've gone to change her router and of course the new one isn't VDSL compatible (hence why we were still using the old Telstra smart modem).

    Thoughts on a cheap VDSL modem to replace the aging smart modem?

      • tonydav on 04/08/2023 - 14:22

        Ouch. She won't be using the wifi so that's a bit overkill.

        There's one on Amazon (TP-Link) without wifi that's $50 so will prob get that if I can't find something here spare.

        • GordonD on 06/08/2023 - 14:49

          Its easy to say "she won't be using the wifi". I said that. Then I wanted a printer, and found that none of the cheap ones have wired ethernet these days. They use wifi. So I had to turn it on.

          • tonydav on 06/08/2023 - 15:24

            @GordonD: She already has a mesh wifi setup. So if we get something just needs to be a "modem" into the mesh router.

    • Twix on 06/08/2023 - 19:39

      Telstra SM is a suitable VDSL2 modem for FTTN and supports SOS/ROC. Pickup a Telstra SM Gen 2 if you need a replacement.

  • MASKofTEAM on 05/08/2023 - 12:28

    I had the same problem. After Activ8me tried everything their end, they sent out an engineer who immediately said it was the multiple sockets. He disconnected the unused ones, and it has been trouble-free since. There was no charge.

    • CyberMurning on 05/08/2023 - 13:12

      What is that activeme?

      • Twix on 06/08/2023 - 19:42

        Name of an ISP.

  • The Hawk on 05/08/2023 - 13:50
    +2

    The "it's your wiring" excuse shits me as it's the default answer and has been since ADSL came into being.

    I had a tech assume me it was testing perfectly at the box on the side of the house so it must be my wiring… I walked him to the otherside of the wall where the wire went to a single socket and then into the modem and asked which of those six inches of wire he thought was faulty…

    Turns out it wasn't an issue on my side after all…

  • CyberMurning on 07/08/2023 - 11:55

    damn i upgraded my speed from 50/20 to 100/20 but testing only get me 66 download they said that is because you have bridge tap , you cant get higher.
    hmm then maybe just downgrade again no point paying 100 to get 66

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