Is Anyone Finding Qantas Points to "Not" Be Worthless?

LEnelass on 29/02/2024 - 22:21

I have 500K points and do not know how to make good use of it.

I do not want to use them for a class upgrade: Being in a small metal cage in high altitude even if business class will never as good as sleeping in a bed nor as good as eating in a restaurant.

After searching on OzBargain, buying goods, wine or petrol is a really bad way to use Qantas points it appears. So I'm back at searching for a decent flight in economy class.
My experience has been :

No or Low Availability: Hard to find a classic reward flight unless booking 2 weeks prior to departure date, which sure is extremely convenient to Qantas to fill their planes, but horribly cumbersome for the travelers to plan their trip and give notice to work.

Consistently of (very) poor value: There is almost no value in the "best" classic (economy) reward flights I have found. Example: a trip to Europe would cost me 3,500AUD with either Qatar, Singapore or Emirates, with a classic reward it's 265,000 points + 2100 (so about $4750 is 1 point = $0,01). I would be better off selling these points to then buy a flight at a lower cost.

It feel like Qantas realised how much of a financial liability these points were going to be post-COVID so they made them worthless. For now, goes without saying I am no longer stacking Qantas points, (nor flying Qantas for that matter in light of the various corruption affairs and unethical treatment of their staff…)

As anyone had a better experience with booking classic reward flights or making use of points?

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Comments

  • sumyungguy on 29/02/2024 - 22:26

    Do you not rate the Qantas oneworld Classic Reward?

  • xdivino on 29/02/2024 - 22:35
    +1

    I'm at 1M and stacking virgin now and already found virgin flight redemption much better availability and with United as their partner more routes via USA available too.
    Had to help a friend get back to EU over Xmas and cheapest flight was almost 3k with shitty 48hr layovers in China but Virgin had loads of point seats so Germany via USA was 80k points and $450 or something.

    Qantas i've always been looking to consider the around the world tickets etc. but even weekends away on full points has been easy enough to domestic destinations hotels as well.

    Read pointhacks website and use other services that detail best uses for points etc. Plan out a big trip and have something to look forwrads to, plenty of places to go and reward seats etc.

  • AdosHouse on 29/02/2024 - 22:53

    I've been saving for a while, had nearly 300k points. Booked a holiday in January for premium economy with China Airlines to Seoul, then business class to Osaka China Airlines, then economy to Phuket Cathay Pacific, then business to Taipei China Airlines, then premium economy back to Brisbane with China Airlines. Cost about 230k I think. Not a great deal but I need a holiday.

  • eccaz on 29/02/2024 - 23:07
    +3

    I’m more than happy with Qantas and its rewards program. I have flown nothing but classic rewards for over 2 years apart from big sales (domestic and overseas), and I have free Qantas club membership.

    Points + pay is rubbish and should never be considered.

    • Cyphar on 01/03/2024 - 09:59

      Points + pay is rubbish and should never be considered.

      It allows people to burn points and not worry about classic award availability as it's a general booking. I have used it in the past when I needed to fly out to the UK the same day.

  • djkelly69 on 29/02/2024 - 23:35

    a classic reward it's 265,000 points + 2100 (so about $4750

    Are you sure that's a classic reward for economy? Because it seems more like a points plus pay price.

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:06
      +1

      100% classic rewards. It's a return flight to EU for 1x adult & 1 child with one stop-over in Dubai.
      To my point, the value is rubbish even for (economy) classic rewards, where points + pay is no value at all, just a net loss xD

      • djkelly69 on 01/03/2024 - 10:10
        +4

        Ok, yeah you should probably mention it is for two seats.

        And Emirates is known to have very high taxes on reward flights. Try and find something on Qantas metal. Will be less points as well.

        • Enelass on 03/03/2024 - 17:23

          It's odd the tax from BNE to CDG is <$450 with Emirates, but the BNE to FRA is >$1,000 still with Emirates…
          Thanks for the tip

      • lainey13 on 06/03/2024 - 15:26

        No discount for points when paying for child ticket, never worth burning points on your kid's seat.

  • AussieDaddy on 01/03/2024 - 00:32
    +1

    If they're "not worthless" then they're worthy? 🤔

    • this is us on 01/03/2024 - 00:35

      Came here just to say exactly that…

    • iforgotmysocks on 01/03/2024 - 04:04

      Yes daddy

    • djkelly69 on 01/03/2024 - 06:45

      Yes, OP wants to know if you find them to be 'worthy'.

  • p1 ama on 01/03/2024 - 00:59
    +2

    The whole debacle of what's happened to airline frequent flyer points just reminds me of the quote "given enough time, people optimise the fun out of every game".

    The reality is that QFF points are just way too easy to come by these days with huge credit card sign-on bonuses.

    This just means that you have a huge number of people who just hack their way to a huge point balances without ever actually flying. In other words, it's not so much a system that rewards loyalty as it is a system that rewards people who have the time / patience / wherewithal (or otherwise) to hack credit card bonuses, religiously monitor award availability, and only ever take rewards flights.

    Having previously worked in loyalty, the issue is that Qantas signed a "deal with the devil", by "printing more points" (let's say), they've decreased the barrier to entry into the program, but they've also deflated the value of their points due to the increased scarcity of the most valuable rewards (i.e. classic rewards flights). At some point, this will just make the program unsustainable (too many people with too many points who do not bring in any value to Qantas). It's clear to me that, at some point, there will need to be a rejig of the program, either a devaluation of points, or some tiered system of access to rewards, where high status flyers have priority access over those without status. There needs to be more alignment of value to Qantas and how much they reward someone.

    I can only speak to my own experience as a Qantas frequent flyer (Platinum, on average flying 50+ QF flights per year) - it used to be the case that the 100,000 points or so I would earn per year would be enough to take a nice holiday after doing the hard yards throughout the year being a domestic road warrior, but these days, non-flyers can just easily pick that up on a single credit card sign-on deal, then out-compete me to get classic rewards flights.

    I'm not complaining - obviously I'm not entitled to classic rewards flights over anybody else, but it does feel like the system is broken when it no longer rewards the loyal flyers, and instead, just becomes a hacking game for non-flyers to score cheap premium cabin flights.

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:28
      +1

      I think you got this wrong. Qantas was smart enough to successfully launch an alternate payment method (the points), and that business model improved their customer base and brand awareness, and ultimately drove profit.

      << It does feel like the system is broken when it no longer rewards the loyal flyers>>
      I disagree. As of rewarding frequent flyers, this is achieved with status credits, where you get access to lounges, higher luggage allowance, priority boarding and get to choose classic rewards flights before others who are in a lower tier of the loyalty program (bronze or silver). You get status credits + points for flying business with Qantas. Someone "hacking" the game gets points and not much value except for RTW tickets. I think Qantas Marketing understood that.
      Now to be fair airlines loyalty program is practically NEVER worth it, unless you don't pay for it. It is generally far cheaper to just book a flight with ANY decent airlines (SkyScanner) and have no loyalty status with any…

      << there will need to be a rejig of the program >>
      I don't see why… Qantas really rewards business people, so as long as businesses opt for Qantas as a airline of choice to fly with, there is no incentive for Qantas to tweak that model.
      It's not like people will leave Qantas since the loyalty program is not "worth" it, since they don't pay for it (the business does) and they just benefit from it…
      If you do pay for your business flights with Qantas to get a Platinum membership, then you're either financially illiterate, bad in accounting or… you like burning cash for comfort (why not… I'm not judging)
      Small business might go to competition but as long as corporate stick with Qantas (lobbyist are quite powerful) it won't make a ripple in Qantas revenue.

      • ozbargainsam on 01/03/2024 - 16:28

        you like burning cash for comfort (why not… I'm not judging)

        Err…

        Anyway. I like the toilet paper analogy. Why don't you use the cheapest, sandpaperiest 1-ply TP instead of getting the slightly more expensive 2-ply stuff from Colesworthdi? Because you've decided it was worth it to be more comfortable.

        Then just scale that analogy to whatever income you're at. Homebrand vs. Branded. 2004 Camry vs. 2022 Camry. Rump vs. Scotch Fillet. Economy vs. Business.

        High status with an airline gets you things you can't buy with money. Like easier access to CR seats, and even to request them if they don't.

        • Enelass on 03/03/2024 - 17:24

          I get your point, good analogy, cheers!

  • Hellfire on 01/03/2024 - 07:26

    You are doing wrong if all you can find is 265,000 points + $2100. Should be more like 120k and $700.

    Although it will vary depending on airlines andcroute.

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:33
      +1

      1 adult + 1 kid, so for one it'd be 132,500 points + $1050 at best… which is still bad value compared to selling the points and buying a cheaper flight with an alternate airlines.

      • wackedupwacko on 01/03/2024 - 11:08

        That reads like emirates or another partner flight. QF's own metal tend not to have $1000 taxes. Emirates however are notorious for taxes in Rewards.

        For example i just did a random search for SYD - LHR. 55k +$245 per person one way.

        Emirates: 66k $480 per person per flight

        Also look up one world award. 134.5k points to go around the world in economy.

  • JimmyF on 01/03/2024 - 08:57
    +2

    Being in a small metal cage in high altitude even if business class will never as good as sleeping in a bed nor as good as eating in a restaurant.

    Never as good as a hotel but it is certainly a lot nicer than being in the back with the cattle!

    After searching on OzBargain, buying goods, wine or petrol is a really bad way to use Qantas points it appears. So I'm back at searching for a decent flight in economy class.

    Yes and no, I mean you say so yourself

    No or Low Availability: Hard to find a classic reward flight
    Consistently of (very) poor value

    So while points for goods are not the best value to some, it is a good way to use points and get something you want compared to something of so called better value but you can't find. The points store often has 20% off sales for items. Recently saw weber and karcher having 20% sales. So that does help.

    Basically its either book flights far out in advance, or use the points for goods.

  • apple2016 on 01/03/2024 - 09:23

    I do not want to use them for a class upgrade

    Its Qantas points, ofcourse the best value is redeeming for their own services! If you dont want that , why collect points in the first place?

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:34

      I thought flying economy with Qantas did qualify for "redeeming for their own services". I suppose you didn't my post.

      • wackedupwacko on 01/03/2024 - 11:13

        Economy redemption are "ok" value on Qantas metal. The real value is and has always been business class and above.

        There are some economy redemptions especially domestically that can be bonkers value but they tend to be regional and a monopoly route.

  • parisian on 01/03/2024 - 09:29

    If you are flexible, there are many opportunities to redeem your miles.
    I have been able to redeem J seats 4 times this year on CX J BNE-CDG or MAD - very pleased.

    • Enelass on 03/03/2024 - 17:20
      +1

      Je ne trouve tres peu de BNE <—> CDG donc a mon avis c'est par loyalty status…

      • parisian on 04/03/2024 - 09:31

        Non non - je suis bronze.
        Je suis d'accord - il y a tres peu de BNE-CDG, en faisant une escale ou alors en construisant le routing via multi-city, de nombreuses possibilites sont ouvertes.
        Il faut etre flexible

        Je suis parti en urgence en France deux fois, j'ai fait BNE-SGN avec VietJet et ensuite HKG-MAD-EAS avec Cathay en Business avec mes miles une fois, la seconde, BNE-HKG-CDG avec CX et ensuite CDG-BNE avec CX.

        Au retour, CDG-BNE, il y avait des places en J dispo avec les miles QF.

        Try to use seats.aero - they are all showing up with CX there.

  • Dollar General on 01/03/2024 - 09:50

    I recently used mine to book accommodation in Singapore. May not be the best use of points but one less expense to fork out for on holidays

  • Danstar on 01/03/2024 - 09:59

    I find I can never get any decent flights if booked within 2 weeks. If it's 1 month + out, there's always a range of reward seats at decent flight times.

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:36

      Interesting, it's the exact opposite for me.
      I've been monitoring classic rewards availability for March since last year, and only in the last days, Qantas has released classic rewards seats (purposedly to fill their planes I would assume). Looking well ahead of time, I can find no availability for 2 people return

  • bohn on 01/03/2024 - 10:20
    +2

    I see plenty of shitty economy when looking to redeem QF points , but don't see many Business seats.
    I will not fly out of Australia in economy.

    Prob the most useful thing for QF points are 'free' domestic trips. But even then , you can get ripped off on how many points they want for it - even for economy.

    • Enelass on 01/03/2024 - 10:37

      Yup!

  • richrichie on 01/03/2024 - 10:21

    Depends on the route that you are going, it has been very useful for me between 2022-2023 when price tickets were quite expensive.
    For example, Perth to Melbourne is 18,000 points + $44 one-way, and buying it without points were around $400-$600 back in 2022. Getting around 2-3c/point in value might not the best, but better than the 0.5c/point on gift-cards.

    A good friend of mine regularly fly between Sydney and Jakarta for 40,000 points + $200 tax (Return, half for one way), and there are reward seats for almost everyday, except the usual school holiday, easter, xmas period. Considering non-budget airlines would usually charged $800-$1000 for the same route, that gives him about 1.5c-2c/point.

    It might not be for everyone, but still can't beat the value for people that enjoy premium cabins reward seats though.

  • Drakesy on 01/03/2024 - 10:51

    Why are you collecting if you have no intention of flying business/first, these are the best value use of your points. It's common knowledge that the qantas marketplace is terrible value for money.

  • DingoBilly on 01/03/2024 - 12:04
    -1

    Just sell them, you'd get about $7000 for 500k points.

    Best use for the points by far. Upgrading to business is just throwing away money needlessly despite it being the best value per point theoretically. Domestic flights can sometimes be better but are usually on par in value and you also are the trapped into only using Qantas if you use the points there.

    • ozbargainsam on 01/03/2024 - 12:24
      +1

      Disclaimer: selling points is against QFF terms of service. Everyone always leaves that out. Official means of turning points into cash is about $1 per 155 points, or $3,200 for 500k points.

      I think the argument between cash vs upgrade/business class boils down to how much disposable income you have, and if you like punishing yourself vs liking nice things. I managed to fly to LAX in First for about 330k return + $1,000 in taxes, or about $3,200 if I converted the points into gift cards. $3,200 vs flying in luxury. Economy return is just a bit cheaper than that, but I know which I'd choose.

      The point still stands, though, is being able to find and redeem the Business or First seat with your points.

      • DingoBilly on 01/03/2024 - 15:23

        Yes you can get in some trouble selling points but it's relatively safe as the seller. You keep the money worst case scenario, only real risk is on buyer.

        Putting your post another way re: value, I'd rather have $3000 extra (from selling those points and spending $2.5k on flights, you'd have even more spending money if you spend less on the ticket) to spend on experiences, better hotels Etc. than to make two trips slightly easier. $3000 goes a long way to making the rest of the trip better, but I wouldn't say the plane trip part is $3000 more enjoyable.

        • ozbargainsam on 01/03/2024 - 16:13

          Well, I'll have to take your word for it but I'd rather not risk my status-bearing account to make a few dollars.

          For the comparison, Economy return is 84k ($1170 by your value) + $430 in taxes = $1600. Assuming you're flying with Qantas and not a cheaper airline, that's better than selling your points.

          First is a bad example. Business is 220k ($3080) and $430, or $3510. So it's $1900 more than CR Economy, or $1000 more than Economy cash.

          Again, this comes down to the other part I mentioned: disposable income (and how much you like nice things). I'll 'pay' for nice experience, just like I pay for a nice experience at the destination. There is value in not being miserable for 30 hours, and arriving tired, etc. If you can't have both, then of course, selling points (however dubious) to use at the destination is the wise strategy.

          All, of course, if we're using the dubious method of selling points (also not sure why the value of selling points has increased from 1c/p if points are being devalued)

    • Danstar on 01/03/2024 - 12:38
      +1

      Just sell them, you'd get about $7000 for 500k points.

      Really, that much? Interesting……

      • DingoBilly on 01/03/2024 - 15:49

        Yep. Check out the classifieds here on ozbargain. I can also walk you through the process if you want to message me, but it's pretty straight forward.

    • Enelass on 03/03/2024 - 17:27

      Thanks for your answer.
      Quick one, how to make this transaction smooth?
      E.g. how does the seller know if I'll send the points, and how do I know that I'll get paid?
      Do people exchange proof of ID or have another way to "securely" sell points without being scammed?

      • summer1 on 03/03/2024 - 22:00

        If you were to sell them, the market rate is 1.4-1.5c per point here. Look through the classified ads (sort by date) and you’ll see. Alternatively, selling on eBay tend to fetch higher rates up to 2c per point.

  • MrHyde on 01/03/2024 - 13:15
    +1

    I have had amazing experiences with using Qantas points.
    In 2019, just prior to Covid; we did a round the world trip through Vietnam, India, France, Canada and USA. (about 1.2 million points for all 4)
    Just in July last year (school holiday period); I took our family of 4 on a round the world trip taking in Japan, Hong Kong, UK and USA - all in Business class. (1.3 million points for all 4)
    In 2016, we did another round the world trip in Business for all 4 of us. (1 million points for all 4)
    In December, 2022 - did a single business class return trip to Vancouver.

    The key is to book about 340 days in advance when the seats are first released.

    • Autonomic on 07/03/2024 - 12:45

      Just in July last year (school holiday period); I took our family of 4 on a round the world trip taking in Japan, Hong Kong, UK and USA - all in Business class. (1.3 million points for all 4)

      Which airlines did you fly? Not many release 4x J awards

      • MrHyde on 07/03/2024 - 12:54

        In and out of Australia is Qantas.

        Other airlines I've used in the trips have been BA, JAL, CX, AY and AA.

        Usually the challenge is finding seats in QF in and out of Australia. Once you find those; the rest is usually a lot easier. As suggested earlier; need to look at about 340 days out for availability.

        • MrHyde on 07/03/2024 - 13:32

          I just had a look and can see 4 J Classic Awards available from MEL - LHR for 3 Feb 2025 (on QF) with return on 17 Feb 2025 on CX.

  • md333 on 02/03/2024 - 02:39

    I've had no luck with international, but seemed to be well worth it for domestic flights. Unfortunately the 3 flights I booked that were great value I had to cancel for other reasons. At least the cancellation policy is good for reward flights (points refund).

  • MELso on 02/03/2024 - 05:27
    +1

    Got a flight to Europe coming up in Emirates' first class. 227.5K points plus a hefty $1.8k in carrier charges and taxes (which is a sucky thing about EK redemptions).

    The flight retails for north of $12k, and while I'd never pay cash for it, and the points are basically from two credit card churns and two cases of wine. So why not? YOLO…

    (Coming back, it's in Qatar QSuites - 139K Virgin points plus $770 in carrier charges and taxes.)

    Jump onto sites like seats.aero and pointsyeah.com and see what's out there…

    • try2bhelpful on 03/03/2024 - 11:54

      We are doing similar. Q suites to Paris on the way over using Velocity points. Had more trouble coming back but we did get Vienna to Dubai, economy, Dubai to Sydney - business/first, Sydney to Melbourne velocity money.

      We saved tens of thousands by using points.

      • Autonomic on 07/03/2024 - 09:11

        You didn't save tens of thousands unless you were going to pay that in the first place

        • try2bhelpful on 07/03/2024 - 10:13

          I saved tens of thousands on what these would normally cost. Is that better?

          • Autonomic on 07/03/2024 - 11:06

            @try2bhelpful: I'm sure they're great flights and good value. Just don't get distracted by the marketing.

            • try2bhelpful on 07/03/2024 - 11:30

              @Autonomic: Not getting distracted by the marketing. I have a card, fee free, that gives me Qantas points we also have Woolworths rewards cards. We have velocity because we did the round the world business class with Virgin for $3500 each and we have Fly Buys cards. When the bonus points options occur we look at what non perishables are on special to buy them. This meant when Covid hit we had a reasonable amount of toilet paper in our storage area. We certainly don't buy stuff we don't need. The man has a Virgin credit card that also gives him points and $125 worth of free flight money per year.

              If we are buying the Qantas wine we make sure what we are buying compares with places like Dan Murphy. We don't just buy for the points.

              It is a matter of maximizing points and minimising the cost. We've now got a couple of business class flight to Europe with our points and it is certainly much nicer than the other end of the plane. It is the best way to use points, by far.

    • bohn on 15/03/2024 - 12:07

      which portal did you use to book this flight - and between which cities?

  • aidenh37 on 06/03/2024 - 20:51

    Sydney to Melbourne flights are about 1.2 cents per point for the plethora of Classic Reward seats available, as an example. Less if Jetstar.

    Apart from accomodation (which may be worse value, but necessary if on a trip), why not find domestic flights and go out and see everything Australia has to offer? Not in one go - but over time.

    At the same time, keep an eye on seats on international trips, especially if you're okay with Economy.

  • moredealsmoremeals on 12/03/2024 - 14:22

    I've had good value when redeeming points on jetstar holiday deals, recently got flights and 8 day accommodation at a nice resort in phuket for 140k points. some qantas holidays are also good value but you need to wait for a good sale.

  • michaelTito on 12/03/2024 - 20:19

    you can always sell them on here.

  • sumyungguy on 15/03/2024 - 12:10
    +1

    In the news today: Qantas has confirmed it is finalising a major change to its frequent flyer scheme, with members tipped to be able to book more flights with less points

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