Turn Left at an Intersection When a Big Vehicle on The Other Road Turns Left

darshu on 16/04/2024 - 12:23
Last edited 17/04/2024 - 17:33

Last week, while driving in Blacktown, NSW, I encountered a situation at an intersection where I needed to turn left from a giveaway sign. The traffic light for the opposing direction (where I needed to turn) was green. This road has two lanes. As I waited, a large truck in the left lane began a left turn. However, I hesitated to start my turn because I couldn't see the second lane clearly. I reasoned that if a vehicle in the second lane (right lane) intended to change lanes abruptly, I would need to yield to that vehicle as well. If there were a collision with the lane-changing vehicle, I might be deemed at fault. Was my thinking correct?

During this pause, a driver behind me grew impatient and started honking, but I chose to ignore them. After completing my turn, the impatient driver confronted me, insisting I should have turned because the big truck was turning left. This incident left me questioning whether I was being overly cautious.

I've created a Microsoft Paint image illustrating the scenario: I was the green car (car A), and a big truck (vehicle B) was turning left from the opposite direction. It was a multi-lane road, and I refrained from turning left until I could see both lanes. If a vehicle from the second lane suddenly wanted to change lanes (depicted by the red car- car C), I wouldn't have had enough time or distance to stop my car. Do you think I was being overly cautious?

Edit: edited MS diagram New Image
Edit 2: Added Dcam video, only today I downloaded the dashcam video. I removed the audio, my toddler was singing.

Poll Options expired

  • 29
    Yes, You can turn left using the gap
  • 46
    It is dangerous, one day turning left like this may cause a crash
Automotive

Comments

  • Duckie2hh on 16/04/2024 - 12:29
    +14

    This incident left me questioning whether I was being overly cautious

    You were right.

  • Muzeeb on 16/04/2024 - 12:30
    +12

    It's illegal to cross lanes in an intersection so technically no one should have entered your lane. Eg car c should maintain their current lane through the intersection and beyond any solid lines.

    I've watched plenty of episodes of dashcam Australia and a lot of people don't know the road rules.

    I don't think the lane markings in your diagram are correct.

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 12:34

      Oh I didn't know that.

      • Muzeeb on 16/04/2024 - 12:35
        +1

        Do you have Google map coordinates of the intersection to confirm the lane markings?

        • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 12:41
          +2

          -33.74267933126029, 150.87013061299294

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 12:58
      +1

      I could not find anything in the NSW road rules book saying it's illegal to change lanes at intersections. I thought like in a roundabout, we can change lanes.

      • Muzeeb on 16/04/2024 - 13:03
        +1

        Dang! I can't find anything either. The lane markings at that intersection suggest you can do whatever you bloody want as well. Good one NSW.

        • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 13:24
          +2

          This is from VIC police in 2019 https://www.facebook.com/victoriapolice/posts/poll-is-it-ill…

          "There is no offence for changing lanes in the middle of an intersection.
          However, the driver must ensure they still follow the rules that apply to changing lanes. This includes indicating, giving way to any traffic in the adjacent lane and not crossing any solid white lines."

    • Trance N Dance on 16/04/2024 - 14:23
      +1

      It's not illegal to change lanes in an intersection (at least in VIC and NSW). The lane markings (whilst not marked in the intersection) are assumed to extend through the intersection. eg if the line are dotted. When the lines approaching the intersection are solid, you cannot change lanes in the intersection just like any other road with solid lines between lanes.

      • Muzeeb on 16/04/2024 - 14:34

        The Google view of OP's intersection has no solid lines.

  • JimJim on 16/04/2024 - 12:33
    +15

    You didn't do anything wrong, the other person is just impatient and hot-headed. Better to be cautious than taking a chance.

  • Drakesy on 16/04/2024 - 12:37
    +7

    Sounds and looks likes you were being overly cautious tbh.

    I'd be annoyed as well if you were waiting for a truck that was turning off the lane you're about to enter.

    You wouldn't be a stereotypical driver of a certain ethnicity would you?

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 14:26

      why would you get annoyed (just curious)? you can't see what the front driver sees. I wasn't waiting for the truck to pass ("I hesitated to start my turn because I couldn't see the second lane clearly"), I was waiting to truck to turn more so I could see the second lane.

      • Drakesy on 16/04/2024 - 16:20
        +2

        It's more that you were turning into the truck's lane so no really inhibiting the movement of the second lane.

  • Ghost47 on 16/04/2024 - 12:38
    +2

    How fast were those cars going? Your picture makes it look like they were stopped at a red light. IMO you did nothing wrong, it’s better to be safe than sorry in case the driver decided to change lanes. Don’t trust what other drivers will do on the road.

    Always look early at slip lanes too and drive right through if the coast is clear.

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 12:42

      60 Km/h road. B was probably very slow due to his turn, but C must have being doing 60 Km/h

      • Ghost47 on 16/04/2024 - 12:48
        +6

        Fair enough. If I was stopped at the slip lane I probably would’ve waited too just in case. These days you really can’t trust other people to not do something stupid on the roads.

        • SlickMick on 17/04/2024 - 09:15

          At a slip lane I only slow down enough to manoeuvre the bend and time the traffic, and if there is a gap in the left lane, I'm in it regardless of what anyone in the right lane is doing. This case is the ideal scenario - the left lane is blocked, it's all mine.

          Yes, vehicle C could be a kamikaze and ram me, I'm willing to take that chance. There are always risks when driving, but hesitating doesn't mitigate them.

  • Unbounded4673 on 16/04/2024 - 12:53
    +3

    Depends on which lane you want to enter -

    If you wish to turn into the left lane, then time your gap and proceed when YOU (and YOU ALONE) feel safe to complete the turn.
    If you wish to turn into the right lane, then you have to wait until the lane is clear and it is safe to do so.

    Either way, this experience adds to lesson that you must never operate under stress from external factors, in this case the impatient car honking from behind you.

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 13:02

      True. but in Sydney, people change lanes and then turn ON the indicator or turn ON the indicator for one flash. I have a dashcam, but if the camera isn't clear or it is obstructed. It will be his/her word against mine, isn't it? (probably). That was the whole argument running in my head. I have never had an accident so far.

  • Benoffie on 16/04/2024 - 12:57
    +9

    If I thought people in this country had any level of lane discipline, I'd say it would be fine. But they don't. You can't trust them. Defensive driving is always the safest bet.

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 13:02

      I agree.

  • leiiv on 16/04/2024 - 13:40
    +1

    I reasoned that if a vehicle in the second lane (right lane) intended to change lanes abruptly, I would need to yield to that vehicle as well.

    It really depends on the timing. If you get into the left lane first, then the vehicle changing lane will need to give away to any traffic in the left lane (ie, you).
    Yes you are overly cautious, but the driver behind shouldn't honk as well.

    • askbargain on 16/04/2024 - 13:51
      +1

      Not sure about Sydney but in Victoria you give way to anyone travelling in the same direction (so the red car’s lane). Doing what you have mentioned is very common in taxi drivers and overseas drivers.

      • leiiv on 16/04/2024 - 21:32
        +1

        Are you being serious? How long have you been driving? I don't drive in Victoria, but imagine a busy 3 or 4 lanes main road, you will be waiting forever to make a left turn to that road if you have to wait for any vehicles in all lanes to clear. No one does that, at least from what I know in Brisbane, for example, Coronation Drive.

        • askbargain on 16/04/2024 - 22:40

          nobody said wait. it's give way. as long as you don't interrupt the flow of traffic, go for it

        • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 13:54

          But I think it is illegal to change multiple lanes.

    • askbargain on 16/04/2024 - 13:56
      +2

      When you’re turning left in a slip lane (with or without a ‘Give way’ sign), you must give way to:
      vehicles on the road you’re turning into
      oncoming vehicles turning right into the road you’re turning into
      any other vehicle or pedestrian in the slip lane.

      From NSW gov site. Looks like someone needs their licence revoked

      • leiiv on 16/04/2024 - 21:23
        +1

        That part does not explicitly mention multi-lanes at all.
        In the absence of explicit wordings, it is reasonable to interpret that by turning into a specific lane, you need to give way to any vehicle that is already in that lane. It does not make sense to wait for vehicles in other lanes to pass as you wouldn't interfere with them anyway (that is, you already give way to them no matter what).
        There is also a rule for changing lanes: "You must give way to vehicles in the lane or line of traffic, when you change from a lane marked with lines, to another." Hence, depends on the timing.

        I am from QLD, and the handbook explicitly mentions that (page 75 or 15 of the pdf):
        https://www.publications.qld.gov.au/ckan-publications-attach…

        Can you cite the road rules in VIC that explicitly forbids that from authoritative sources?

        • askbargain on 16/04/2024 - 22:52

          https://resources.reglii.com/VGG.1999.10.28.P2.pdf

          page 53 or 76 pdf

          any vehicle approaching from the right

          can't get more clearer than ANY. it's give way not wait for every car on the right.

          you might also want to look at page 85 of your QLD rules lmao. you actually need to redo your lessons

          you must give way to .. all vehicles (except vehicles making a u-turn) on the road you are entering

          • leiiv on 17/04/2024 - 12:57

            @askbargain: All the references you mentioned does not explicitly mention multi lanes.
            The one from page 75 explicitly mentions it although it is particularly not for the slip road case:

            Turning from a single lane road into a multi-lane road
            You can choose which lane to turn into—unless there are marked turning lines
            to indicate a particular path. You must give way to vehicles in the lane you are
            turning into            . You must also give way to any pedestrians, bicycle and personal
            mobility device riders that are crossing the road you are entering.

            So do you agree that the key is GIVE WAY, that is, by turning to the 1st lane OP does not impede any vehicles in the 2nd, 3rd, etc, lanes?
            Otherwise, how would you think OP should give way to the red car? Wait for it to pass before making a turn to the 1st lane?
            I just don't understand your logic.

            • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 13:52

              @leiiv: Found a discussion on Reddit,

            • askbargain on 17/04/2024 - 23:52

              @leiiv:

              If you get into the left lane first, then the vehicle changing lane will need to give way … to you

              your original comment. just because you're in front doesn't mean you have "right of way". give way means you give way in order to not obstruct the flow of traffic.

              page 75 is about turning, page 85 is about giving way. feel free to ignore giving way. insurers have been refusing to insure certain people who just don't know road rules.

              FWIW if red car decides to change into the lane you decide to turn into and you crash, it's your fault.

              • leiiv on 18/04/2024 - 00:39

                @askbargain: As I said, totally depends on the timing. If you get into the lane first, the other car changing lane must give way:

                148 Giving way when moving from one marked lane or line of traffic to another marked lane or line of traffic
                (1) A driver who is moving from one marked lane (whether or not the lane is ending) to another marked lane must give way to any vehicle travelling in the same direction as the driver in the marked lane to which the driver is moving.

                That statement from page 75 is very clear and it is also the same concept to merging in highway, which is usually a multi-lanes road.

  • star-ggg on 16/04/2024 - 14:27
    -1

    https://www.nsw.gov.au/driving-boating-and-transport/roads-s…

    https://www.nsw.gov.au/driving-boating-and-transport/roads-s…

    Do not assume they can stay completely in their own lane.

    The regulations are very clear. The driver behind you should retake the computer test.

  • billy72 on 16/04/2024 - 14:34
    +3

    overly cautious, quite a big gap. Seeing you turning left there, car C has no reason to change the lanes, unless they want to crash you :)

    • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 14:37

      Wouldn't I have to give way to vehicles on the road, when turning? I could not find NSW road rules, but in VIC drivers can change lanes in an intersection. It wasn't the gap, it was I could not see the second lane far enough to see a vehicle coming or intending to change lanes.

      • billy72 on 16/04/2024 - 14:59
        +2

        of course, legally saying you are correct. I'm just saying it's not practical in reality. As I said, vehicle C shouldn't have any reason to change lanes there, especially when their view of the left lane was blocked by the big truck as well. And if they did want to do that, they should be able to see you turning so would keep their lane and do it later

        • darshu on 16/04/2024 - 15:04

          True.

          • BigBirdy on 17/04/2024 - 08:12
            -1

            @darshu: False. Vehicle C may be intending to turn left or stop shortly after this intersection. They are within their rights to overtake the turning truck then pull into the left lane without fear of vehicles cutting in from a Give Way sign. You'd likely be at fault

        • SlickMick on 17/04/2024 - 09:07
          +2

          Also, Vehicle C has clear view of OP. If OP didn't hesitate, A would be in left lane and C would come in behind A if necessary. The left lane is blocked by the truck, so this is really not a difficult situation to manoeuvre at all.

          • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 17:20

            @SlickMick: I kind of agree except C is doing 60 Km/h. If you check most of the vehicle crash videos at Dashcam Australia, the vehicles would have been stopped, isn't it? As an example, (not exactly an identical situation), this driver had a clear view of the red car, yet they crashed. That day, I may have moved to the left lane safely, but in the future, one idiot driver may do the unthinkable, crash into my vehicle by changing lanes and I may be held liable. That's what I always try to avoid.

  • bobbified on 16/04/2024 - 17:14
    -2

    It's a huge truck. You can see if it's coming your way or not by how fast it's going etc. And even if they slowed down to turn and suddenly decided to change their mind and go straight, a truck that big isn't going to be able to accelerate to your position that quickly.

    • Speckled Jim on 17/04/2024 - 13:25

      The truck wasn't the concern. It was also turning left, into the street OP sought to turn out of.

  • ozbargainsam on 16/04/2024 - 17:42

    The other driver didn't need to personally confront you, though given how long the semis take to turn, I'd hazard a guess it wasn't a short bit of hesitation.

    If you have to ask why someone would be annoyed at behind stuck behind a slow person? Just take yourself out of the driving scenario and into something else like someone in a queue taking too long to decide on their order. Maybe you know what you want, and they're holding you up.

    You may have been that indecisive person in the car. It's fine to be safe, and you should drive to your capacity and confidence, but in this case, neither is wrong or right in their reaction.

    Still you should make every effort in your capacity to ensure you don't impede too much, otherwise you'll slow people down. And it's a bit of a 'we live in a society' situation. Every other person hesitating and driving cautiously would severely reduce the value of driving for everyone.

    Personally, I'd be throwing my hands up going 'why aren't you moving?! There's literally no cars!'. I'd ask how you're able to turn from a side street into a main road. Or how you merge onto a highway.

    Maybe drive outside of peak time? In the middle of the day or after school sports on a weekend?

  • Rako on 16/04/2024 - 21:54

    You were right to wait the driver in the red car C may well have been waiting for a chance to get past the truck & move into the left lane & had you moved out and a collision happened you failed to give way. So no you were not being overly cautious.

  • joshash on 17/04/2024 - 07:34
    +2

    Dude you are massively, massively, over thinking this.
    Get out there - and do what you've got to do to get where you're going.

  • bbinc on 17/04/2024 - 09:08

    In the moment, based on your experience in all sorts of traffic, you weren’t sure you had time not to impede C. You made a decision to be safe. That’s good. Trust your high speed decision making skills. Because someone got upset you are trying to reprocess that thinking - you don’t need to. The dude behind you did not have the same view as you. He went away angry. No one was hurt. We all make split second decisions. My aim is to make a safe one every time.

  • TiredKitty78 on 17/04/2024 - 13:20
    -1

    Where's 'You were being overly cautious, but the other driver should have kept his trap shut'

    Iirc, it's illegal to change lines in an intersection. And those other cars, starting from a stop, need to mind 'oncoming' traffic. So the onus is more on them to mind you and other cars.

    But, we all sometimes pause half a second, to get an idea on whether that car is going to go straight through the roundabout and not give way, stuff like that.

    So quiet annoyance from the other driver. Yes. Acting like you've been sitting at a green light for 20 seconds? No.

    • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 14:02
      -1

      Can you point me to a road rule that confirms "it's illegal to change lines in an intersection"?

      • TiredKitty78 on 17/04/2024 - 16:59

        No, but a quick google should give you a good idea it is, unless many many people are all wrong…

        "It is also illegal to continue straight ahead from a marked turning lane, or to generally disobey markings on the road surface. When travelling straight ahead it is deemed unsafe to change lanes while in the intersection under the Australian Road Rules as developed by the Australian Transport Council in 1999."

        • pegaxs on 18/04/2024 - 09:38
          +1

          No… a quick google should give you

          Then YOU use Google to find this imaginary rule.

          If you say some random shit, and someone asks you for the source of your shit, then you need to supply a source for said shit, otherwise, that’s all it is, is shit.

          It is not up to other people to do your “source” work for you. You can’t just say “WeLL jUsT gOoGLe iT!” Because you just sound like a cooker during Covid telling people, when questioned about their crackpot conspiracy theory crap, to “research it yourself”.

          You also cant use random quotes you find on Google for completely different laws to maintain what you said is right.

          So, again, what is your source for your comment;

          it's illegal to change lines in an intersection.

          • leiiv on 18/04/2024 - 15:34

            @pegaxs: So what is you interpretation of the law regarding the slip lane:

            (2A) If the driver is turning left using a slip lane, the driver must give way to—
            (a) any vehicle on the road the driver is entering, or turning right at the intersection into the road the driver is entering (except a vehicle making a U-turn at the intersection),

            When the road you are turning to is a multi-lanes road?
            If you are turning to 1st lane and a vehicle is coming in 2nd lane, what does "give way to any vehicle on the road the driver is entering" exactly means? Do you have to wait until the vehicle in 2nd lane to pass even if it doesn't indicate to change lane?
            And what about if it is in the 3rd or 4th lane?

            • TiredKitty78 on 19/04/2024 - 14:33

              @leiiv:

              If you are turning to 1st lane and a vehicle is coming in 2nd lane, what does "give way to any vehicle on the road the driver is entering" exactly means?

              Not OP. But i feel like this is a bit of an umbrella law, to give way to already established traffic. The vehicle moving into traffic needs to make sure it is safe. Sometimes that means they see a ute going a little to fast, and wait an extra second or two when they 'could' have gone.

              If there is not oncoming traffic in the first lane you are merging onto, then is it safe to do so.

              And what about if it is in the 3rd or 4th lane?

              I was under the impression it was illegal to cross multiple lanes at once? Or just 'bad practice'.

              You in the left slip lane about to merge onto a main road with 4 lanes.

              So, you indicate and merge into the first lane. That is the extent of what you indicator actually 'does'? if that makes sense? You are indicating a move into the next lane, so that the cars behind you are aware, and can act accordingly. not that you will be crossing the next three lanes. A car two lanes over cannot even see your indicator, it is not a safe manouver to make.

              You indicate merging into the next lane closest to you from the slip lane. Not sure if legal or good practice, you need to have about a time of 5 'indication beeps' so that the cars around you have time to be aware, before you changes lanes. You need to so this for each lane.

          • TiredKitty78 on 19/04/2024 - 14:15
            -1

            @pegaxs: On second thought, i actually did give you a source that you could easily verify: The Australian Road Rules, 1999. But…

            You should already know this extremely basic rule

            The Drive Safe Handbook, Page 72 of the PDF found here

            never change lanes while going through, or approaching an intersection

            Driving Test Wa website here

            never change lanes while going through, or approaching an intersection

            Fair enough you want me to sight the rules with reference. But sometimes there's a reason it's such common knowledge, that a quick google of responses all vaguely affirming what i say is true, might be enough for a person to say yeah, sounds like it's correct.

            So have you seen that i am correct now?

  • Speckled Jim on 17/04/2024 - 13:33

    Anyway, I'd have made that turn into the left lane — the turning truck would not be crossing your path, the lane is clear.
    If I'm struck, it would have been a rear-ender and doubly red car's fault:
    1. Changing lane across intersection.
    2. Rear-ending me.

    • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 13:49

      Can you point me to a road rule that confirms "Changing lane across intersection is illigal"? I found an FB post from VIC police
      In NSW, slip lane rules dictate that "You must use a slip lane to turn where one is provided.
      When you’re turning left in a slip lane (with or without a ‘Give way’ sign), you must give way to:
      vehicles on the road you’re turning into
      oncoming vehicles turning right into the road you’re turning into
      any other vehicle or pedestrian in the slip lane."
      https://www.nsw.gov.au/driving-boating-and-transport/roads-s…

      • Speckled Jim on 17/04/2024 - 14:47
        +1

        Can you point me to a road rule that confirms "Changing lane across intersection is illigal"?

        https://www.carsguide.com.au/urban/hacks/is-it-illegal-to-ch…
        I've only found this so far, but it was certainly the rule when I was learning (a long time ago). I maintain the habit, as I reckon it's safer. I'd only change lanes mid-intersection for an evasive move.

        Slip lanes are slightly different to your MS paint, but the safest method of staying within the same lane also applies. In your example, this line covers me:
        You must choose a suitably large gap in the traffic to get across an intersection, enter a new street or merge with traffic.

        • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 15:09

          Thanks, I checked the articles you shared. Doesn't that article say "You must stay in your marked lane when turning right or left through an intersection, to prevent collisions.". Doesn't that mean it only applies while turning left or right, not straight through an intersection? please correct me if I am wrong.

          • bbinc on 17/04/2024 - 16:28

            @darshu: Except the intersection doesn’t have marked lanes.

    • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 13:55

      I also found this Reddit post

    • jjjaar on 17/04/2024 - 18:22

      No, actually, if you made that turn and there was a collision with a vehicle from the trucks approach, you’d have been at fault, as you failed to give way:

      69 - Giving way at a give way sign or give way line at an intersection (except a roundabout)

      If you are:

      • stopped at a Stop sign or line, or
      • facing a Give Way sign or line

      You must give way to any vehicle already in, entering or approaching an intersection, except if the vehicle is:

      • making a U-turn
      • turning left using a slip lane
      • oncoming, turning right, and is also facing a Stop or Give Way sign or line.

  • bbinc on 17/04/2024 - 16:32
    +1

    Here’s my take 2.
    OP decides not to wait. Vehicle C hightails it past truck, collides with OP.
    Police attend and charge OP with not giving way as per the sign OP was at.
    But officer, the guy behind was honking me, really, I had to go.
    Doesn’t stand the pub test, sorry, court test.

    • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 17:07

      :) I only moved when it was safe to do so. Honking in such a situation is illegal (I guess).

      "You must not use your horn or any other warning device, unless:

      you need to warn other road users about the position of your vehicle
      you need to warn others that you are approaching
      you need to warn animals to get off the road
      it’s part of an anti-theft or alcohol interlock device.
      Never use your horn to scare or intimidate other road users, particularly bicycle riders, pedestrians and horse riders."
      https://www.nsw.gov.au/driving-boating-and-transport/roads-s…

    • darshu on 17/04/2024 - 17:34

      Added the dashcam video.

      • Muzeeb on 17/04/2024 - 20:12

        A P plater in a manual Mirage. This explains everything.

  • jjjaar on 17/04/2024 - 18:16
    +1

    If you’re entering an intersection, you have to give way to anyone already in that intersection/about to approach the intersection:.

    69 - Giving way at a give way sign or give way line at an intersection (except a roundabout)

    If you are:

    • stopped at a Stop sign or line, or
    • facing a Give Way sign or line

    You must give way to any vehicle already in, entering or approaching an intersection, except if the vehicle is:

    • making a U-turn
    • turning left using a slip lane
    • oncoming, turning right, and is also facing a Stop or Give Way sign or line.

    Whether or not they’ve used the right lane and merged into the left mid-intersection wouldn’t negate you from that responsibility, and “I didn’t see them” likely wouldn’t hold up as an appeal.

    You did the right thing. We all have to share the road to keep it safe for everyone. If that means waiting 10 seconds for you to have a clear view and confirm it is safe, then you wait.

    Ignore the impatient other drivers.

  • aragornelessar on 17/04/2024 - 21:55
    +1

    I remember when doing my Hazard Perception test in NSW decades ago, you had to touch the screen to indicate when it was safe to go and when it was a possible hazard. I was advised if you never touched the screen when it was time to indicate when it was safe to turn then you would very likely not fail - ie. it wasn't a problem to be overly cautious. On the flip side when you were given the possible hazard test, you would touch the screen immediately to indicate you were getting prepared for a hazard.

    My sample size isn't large but I don't know anyone who failed by waiting too long for a 'safe' time to turn in the test. Common sense would say you wait until you're sure its safe, but common sense on the roads isn't exactly abundant.

  • iand on 18/04/2024 - 19:50
    +1

    you did nothing wrong and if the other driver confronted you then this is called road rage which is an offence and looking at you dashcam it was about 10 seconds from a car going past to you pulling out so the other guy was just an impatient wa*ker

  • Toph Beifong on 20/04/2024 - 21:31
    +1

    I see people changing lanes mid-intersection all the time, even though it is illegal to do so.
    I see people indicate but not turn. I see people turn but not indicate. You can't win. There are far too many bad drivers on the roads these days, you have done nothing wrong here.

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