Anyone installing solar battery? If so, which brand? Am thinking to get the AlphaESS battery that was on front-page few days ago. Does anyone have any feedback on this particular battery?
Anyone Installing Solar Battery?
IMBI3 on 18/05/2025 - 22:34
Comments
They've been saying that for years. Hopefully it will actually come out this year.
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/whatever-happened-to-sodiu…
they already have them. but they are just too large and heavy with less capacity making them gigantic and expensive to ship.
Elecom already released their Na+ Power bank with these large Sodium batteries inside.
https://www.theverge.com/news/631357/elecom-power-bank-batte…you can see it's the size of a 20000mAh Lithium Ion power bank, but only 9000mAh and weighs more. it's released in japan because the Sodium battery performs better at lower temperatures.
I saw in a EV/battery video, china who invested and perfected LifePO4 battery, has now invested in making Lithium Manganese Iron and Sodium Ion but make it smaller, lighter and more equal to Lithium Ion capacity. it's going to take a lot of chinese money and time.
What's your ROI on one?
I'm getting 2x 13.34 AlphaESS, the installer said they had some software issues on initial release that's been resolved now. $7500 including blackout protection and 20m run to garage on a double-storey home
System Summary
0kW solar system $16,676.00
Alpha ESS SMILE-S5 (AS4777-2 2020) (5kW) 1
Alpha ESS SMILE-BAT-13.3P (13.34kWh / 13.34kWh usable) 2
Smart Meter Installation (Alpha Consumption Monitoring)
Alpha.Cloud Monitoring App Setup & Ongoing Support
Blackout Protection
AC Coupled to existing solar system
Battery Extended Box for second Alpha 13 Module
Installation & Labour- includes all materials required to complete installation of proposed battery system
All network approvals and connections arranged by us
Warranty- 10 year Product Warranty on Alpha Hybrid Inverter 10 year Product Warranty on Alpha Battery Storage Modules 20 year Workmanship Warranty
Post install aftercare/ service calls if required, at no charge
Energy Safe Victoria Inspection & Certificate of Electrical Safety
STCs × 248 −$9,176.00
Total:
$7,500.00This seems like a very good price, can I please ask who the installer in Vic is? thanks
BrightWorks through Solarquotes
It sounds better than this deal which is only 10kWh battery. Will give BrightWorks a call
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/904348@kindra: Other than battery replacement if any issue what else benefits when using new 10kw battery over the 13.3kw?
Is this $7,500 before Solar Victoria rebates and interest-free loan?
after. You can see the STC - STCs × 248 −$9,176.00
STCs are not Solar Victoria rebates and interest-free loans, though.
@p1 ama: Yep apologies for that, there's no rebates in Victoria. I did take the interest-free loan for the full $7,500 amount
Is this some sort of weird Victorian subsides deal? Seems very cheap.
My cheapest quote was $7200 without blackout protection and external installation. Its the standard price
What is blackout protection btw? How com3 some have some dont?
@AAC: i'm confused, won't your home switch to the battery during a blackout anyway? isn't that one of its' core features of having a battery?
Are you completely of the grid now? Being no supply charge needs to be paid?
Not yet, it's difficult with an EV
Waiting on the specifics of the battery rebate to come through but I’ve got a deposit down on one of the NeoVolt 10kWh AC coupled systems.
Is this the sunboost offer.?
How much approximately?
I was quoted today for $4371.
Before the rebate, 7500 with bollards and blackout protection (limited to 2 circuits).
So maybe $3300-ish off that. About $4200.
Anyone in VIC? If so, which company did you get the quote from?
Am thinking to get the AlphaESS battery that was on front-page few days ago. Does anyone have any feedback on this particular battery?
Good value no-frills battery. If you can get extra capacity to over-provision your need given they are not as smart as other "better" batteries, then they're a good choice.
Can you elaborate on the lack of smart features for AlphaESS?
Don't do it just yet. Wait until all the excitement does down with federal rebates. It is like buying Tesla. Later people get better deals. Unless you are getting hammered by high electricity prices and use the battery in full I can't make the numbers on a spreadsheet work.
Checked 2 years ago and the warranty although they say years there is also a limit on discharge (kwh) so read the warranty terms first.
all this talking about solar batteries will be dumb when you can use your EV car battery as a home battery, it's like 5 times the size and according to some ozbers, cheaper to buy (I think they said best value is 2nd hand EV, even with aged battery still way cheaper), and can drive it.
it won't happen mate, just like using your tablet replacing laptop. EVs uses very high voltage battery (300v to 600v), home battery will eventually migrate to 48v system the way the market go. You can't just simply convert down 300v to 48v without involving expensive dc converter and losing the versatility of it.
I'm just going by discussion I read previously in forums. (buy 2nd have EV for $10k because they depreciate quickly, use as home battery)
you don't have to convince me but what you are saying didn't make much sense. isn't the outlet in your home 240V? so why does the battery need to be 48V?you say batteries will be eventually all be 48V. but doesn't converting 300V (or 600V) to 240V make much more sense? it's much more closer in voltage, rather than converting 48V to 240V?
if the battery is 48V, and you plug in a 2000W heater or something into your power outlet. wouldn't that make the amps from the battery in the hundreds of amps?? doesn't make much sense to me. just based on what I know from USB power and power banks etc you don't want high amps it causes power lost to heat.
sorry not an expert or anything but using lower voltage batteries being better than higher voltage batteries doesn't make much sense to me.
AC and DC is different so being closer is not really relevant.
48V DC is a lot safer than high voltage.
48V DC is a lot safer than high voltage.
ok makes sense I do remember hearing somewhere that high voltage DC is more dangerous than high voltage AC.
which is why we have AC in Australian houses. you will probably still die though if you stick something into a 240V AC plug.
@n3ck3ntry8bort0rgasm: DC can keep an arc going in a short circuit, which can up the risk of fire since it flows steady in one direction. AC flips back and forth 50 times a sec (in AUS), so it’s less likely to keep an arc burning, but it can still spark. We use AC in the grid because it’s cheaper, more efficient and safer to transport over long distances. Modern homes have a lot of safety gear for AC (and DC solar setups) but yeah, don’t mess with either, both can seriously hurt or kill you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zez2r1RPpWY&ab_channel=Exper…
This video demonstrates how AC can basically be switched off safely. High voltage DC, not so much, it manages to maintain the circuit even when the switch has seperated through an Arc.
Challenge with Solar and Barreries is that they are inheritly DC so need to be converted with an inverter.
You can get a 20Kw battery for less than $7.5k with 10 year warranty.. which EV with reasonable warranty remaining can you buy for that sort of a price?
you should ask the users who were recommending it if you still can (sometimes you can't reply to old commets). it wasn't just one user either but a few saying it's better value.
not sure if warranty considered or not, but buying the oldest 2nd hand EV with like 50kwh+ battery (maybe 45kwh because of cycles) for around ~$10k. I think one of them was suggesting nissan leaf, and that nothing likely to go wrong even if warranty was finished.
I also know from powerbanks/phones. the first 20% loss in capacity happens very quickly after new, and then it stays at 80% capacity for quite awhile and drops very slowly after that.
Lets say you buy a 2017 Nissan leaf.. that would be 8 years old, out of warranty and cost you about $13-14k.
Those cars had 30kw capacity.. after 8 years, expected degradation is 30-40%.. so effectively 20kw capacity left.
If someone has a need for a car, it might make sense but then in winters it may lose one of it's purposes.
To buy one purely for battery usage will be utter stupidity for various reasons.. all in my opinion
Those cars had 30kw capacity.. after 8 years, expected degradation is 30-40%.. so effectively 20kw capacity left.
do they list the remaining capacity when selling? otherwise that sucks. so if you get an EV after 8 years you can only drive half as far that's something many people aren't talking about. normal engine car will be able to drive as far as it was when new.
@n3ck3ntry8bort0rgasm: There have been some studies around it.. see this article specific to Nissan leaf
https://www.nimblefins.co.uk/study-real-life-nissan-leaf-bat…
In summary, It says on an average you will go from 12 bars to 8 bars in 6.2 Years. At 12 Bars, for a 30Kwh battery, the estimated range is 130 miles which at 8 bars drop to 86 miles.. so in 6.2 years you lose about 34% range. Now this is for old Nissan Leaf.
For new one, they have a graph which says you go from 167 miles in year 1 to 133 miles range in 5 years. That is 20% loss of range in 5 years.
@ATTS: I know the most home batteries say they lose about 20% after 8000-10000 charge cycles.. no idea about the car batteries though sorry.
@ATTS: The guy I spoke to, he said consider it 2 cycles per day.. but google says some doesnt apply to EVs.. they lose a lot more capacity
but google says some doesnt apply to EVs.. they lose a lot more capacity
depends on the battery type. I just assumed all newer EV's have LifePO4 which can get 8000+ cycles but looks like some are not. and I also assume solar home batteries are LifePO4 also.
the Nissan Leaf you described uses Lithium ion (nickel or cobalt) though. they are the same as in your phone they lose capacity much quicker than LifePO4. I read Lithium ion only lasts 1000-2000 cycles until around 75% left, and if you empty the battery regularly it can happen as soon as 500 cycles.
@n3ck3ntry8bort0rgasm: Ahh right.. googles response on Tesla now makes sense as Tesla use LiFePo4 so their batteries will last a lot longer. Same for BYD.
@n3ck3ntry8bort0rgasm: nope, phone and electronic use li-po, the Leaf use NMC which is similar to the cylindrical 18650 battery used in power tools. In terms of power and performance, li-po>nmc>LiFePO4 but duty cycle and risk of explosion go in reverse order.
@lgacb08: I saw a graph of LifePO4 and they seem quite good in performance.
the voltage written on battery (normal resting voltage) for NMC like 18650 is 3.7, for LifePO4 it's 3.6V, only 0.1V difference.
but the real difference was with the graph showing discharge. the LifePO4 basically looks like a straight line for 95% of the graph, the voltage holds much better and it basically only dips at 50% charge a tiny bit, then another straight line again. because it's just naturally like this I would think it's much less stressful for the battery.if you see a lithium ion curve, it looks like a hill it drops voltage quite fast so the voltage keeps dropping, which mean it needs more amps as it drops creating heat and you can see how it's less durable because of the lower number of cycles until big capacity drop.
the downside I heard of LifePO4 is that because it basically keeps stable voltage all the way, it's harder to check the battery %. lithium ion drops consistently down in voltage as you use it so the system can check any time like oh X.XV so 60% left.
I hear because of this, if you want accurate battery % for LifePO4, you need to do a big discharge and charge to 100% a few times per year. but if you are using the battery as a solar battery most likely this will just happen regularly.
also you mention lithium polymer (li-po) but afaik they contain cobalt and nickel as well so aren't they basically lithium ion?
@n3ck3ntry8bort0rgasm: LiFePO4 nominal voltage is 3.2v, at 3.6v it is fully charged, for other type of lithium battery it's around 4.2v when fully charge.
You got pretty good understanding of voltage characteristics of those battery types, but the reason the world move towards LiFePO4 is more because of its safer, less prone to fire and explosion, better environment footprint and cheaper to manufacture. Most other Li-ion batteries has some sort of rare mineral in its which are expensive to source/recycle and has some enviroment impact. The only major draw back to LiFePO4 is lower energy density.
All the above are lithium ion battery including LiFePO4, but LiFePO4 and to a lesser extent Lithium titan has rather different voltage range so they tend to be grouped separately. Li-po has quite similar voltage and electro-chemistry to other Li-ion battery but they are separate, and the reason for using Li-po is more due to the high power density and flexible form factor to suit small electronic device.
but google says some doesnt apply to EVs.. they lose a lot more capacity
The Nissan Leaf is one of the worst for battery life. Older models dont have active thermal management for the battery which reduces lifespan most otherbEVs donhave thermal mangement and will defrade a lot less.
I just spoke with an installed in South Australia - AlphaESS 10Kw supplied and installed for $4200 after $3.5k rebate.
However, I wasnt impressed with a few things
1. 5 Year product warranty. 10 Year performance warranty but that wouldnt matter if the product failed after 5 years.
2. I asked him if the battery could be scheduled to charge from grid during non-peak periods and he couldnt really answer.Awaiting call backs from other retailers.
Interesting that he couldn't answer point 2. Will ask this question to the company who gave me a quote tomorrow
Please let me know what you can find out.. the guy I spoke with, seemed he didnt have a lot of product knowledge. I initially asked him if the battery could be charged from Grid and he said no.. I then asked why it cant be charged from grid as it is no different to charging an EV from grid and then he changed his response to "yes it can be charged but we dont connect it to grid unless the customer asks".. and then I asked other questions which he didnt answer very well.
Was told you can set the timer to charge the battery from the grid
@IMBI3: Cool.. thanks for confirming.
I spoke to someone else today about a Neovolt battery and they have that option too.. they seem cheaper and appartenly have better after sales support.. I am leaning towards neovolt at the moment.
I have an AlphaESS 13kW, the app can be set to charge the battery from grid during off-peak hours, eg I charge at 5-6am to 25% so that the morning usage can use battery power before the sun comes up, instead of using peak power prices.
Nice.. how long have you had your system for? How is your overall experience with it? Do you mind telling what solar inverter you have and if you have enrolled your battery to any of the VPPs?
What's the go with these 5kW hybrid invertors that are bundled with the batteries? If my current system has 10kW of panels and a 10kW invertor am I going to bottle neck the system by using a 5kW hybrid in the mix. Suppose I'm a bit confused on the flow after another invertor is introduced.
In theory you could see it as a bottleneck, but in practice it's probably not anything to worry about.
With a 5kW battery inverter, you will only be able to charge / discharge the battery (regardless of the battery capacity) at 5kW.
Let's say you had a 20kWh battery with a 5kW inverter, and 10kW of solar with a 10kW inverter, it would take you 4 hours to fully charge the battery (assuming it's the middle of the day and you're generating the full 10kW). The excess unused 5kW of solar each hour would either power your house or go back to the grid.
It's likely that you have enough excess solar throughout the day to fully charge the battery (or even a larger battery) despite the battery inverter limiting the charge rate to 5kW.
Was given a quote and int included "Neovolt Three Phase Smart meter by Chint" - Does this mean I would then need to go on a TOU tariff rather than my current single use tariff?
Do you not have a smart meter already? You cant have solar without smart meter afaik.
The Neovolt smart meter is different and does not replace your current meter. It has not impact on your tarrif type.
I've had solar for 10 years and still have the original meter (electronic) that I got when I built the house. The original installer and the second installer when I added another 5kw both said that I didn't have to have a TOU meter. Has only ever been on single tariff and I prefer it that way. I'm in NSW so maybe the rules are different in other states.
I think you need to speak with an installer.. as far as I know, for battery rebate your system needs to be VPP compatible.. read the VPP capability section in the link below.. I am just not sure if that means only the battery needs to be VPP capable or your meter too
https://www.dcceew.gov.au/energy/programs/cheaper-home-batte…
For us in SA, we can have a smat meter but not necessarily need to change to a TOU tarrif.. but once we change, we cant go back.. so looks like you need some clarity
Anyone one has real world experience and review of alpha ess 13.3k BAT + built in hybrid inverter?
Also seeking reviews from people who has Alpha G3 10kW
Hi,
I have asked in multiple forums and the gist is, while it works it is good but if something goes wrong or you need support with it, then it can be pretty furstrating.
Another thing I am finding mixed information about is the product warranty. Alpha ESS lists 5 years as product warranty in all their documents while I have had two installers tell me that it is 10 years. However, Green.com.au, who are more reliable confirmed the product warranty is 5 years. The solar quotes page below proivides a good review of what to expect.
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/alpha-ess-battery-review…
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/alphaess-battery-warrant…On the other hand, while Neovolt/Voltx is relatively new, they have 10 year product and performance warranty. They used to have 5 but changed it to 10 as of Nov 2024.I have only found people who have been using Neovolt for about 18 months and they seem pretty happy. The question around Neovolt that remains is how they will treat customers if there was a need for a warranty claim. For now Neovolt appears to be cheaper but only comes in one light blue color.
I think Alpha increased the warranty from 5 years to 10 years late last year but can always confirm it with the solar company before committing
I cant find it in any of their documents relating to warranty.. even their data sheet says 5 years. Green.com.au is a large Alpha supplier and they said they manage the Alpha warranty themselves and confirmed the warranty from alpha is 5 years product and 10 years performance
@Megatron: https://www.alphaess.com/Public/Uploads/files/20241012/20241…
All installation from 01/11/2024 is 10 yrs from their pdf document
@longsighted: Thanks for sharing this. I cant find "SMILE-BAT-13.3P" in this warranty document.
I was supplied the below doco with the quote and it clearly lists the above model number of the battery.
https://www.alphaess.com/En/Skippower/downloadFile?id=112&mi…
@longsighted: Ahh yeah you are right.. but when I select "
SMILE-BAT-13.3P" at the below link, that warranty doco doesnt show up.. if I select say Smile5, then your doco shows up.. weird@longsighted: Hi mate, thank you for that link. So I had asked Green.com.au rep twice if he was wrong about the warranty and his answer was no and it truly was 5 years. I had asked him since I read on solar choice that the warranty was changed to 10 years in Nov-24.
I sent the doco you linked to Green.com.au rep and he came back saying "I have spoken with our director and can now confirm that the warranty is 10 years".. haha some of these sales people.. but thanks to you :)
It's a no brainer. I'm getting an alpha ess 26.6kw for $4 installed.
Nice price. Would you share the installer details?
Sure - I just got 3 quotes via solarquotes.com.au - Both green.com.au and Gnowee gave about the same price for the Alpha Ess.
Presume your quote was including the nsw rebates which will now end on 30 june and not stackable with federal rebate as per todays announcement.
So does that change your price?
@mr_alligator: Yes. So with the ending of the NSW rebate, it went up over $4000. Green will absorb $2000. The VPP NSW rebate has doubled to $1500, so overall the cost has gone up from about $4000 installed to $4800 assuming I join a VPP like Amber and get the $1500.
So I think an extra $800 is fair and I'll still go ahead.
@rogerwilko: Yes on the alpha ess you can choose two circuits to include on the blackout protection.
Wot, green quotes me $20k for 13kWh solar and 26kWh alpha ess battery…
What price is everyone getting for an AlphaESS 2x13.3kWh battery now? Green.com.au quoted me just under $8k. NSW.
Yeah, that's about average for them. If you want lower you can go with neovolt 30kwh package.
Ok thanks! I'm pretty new to the battery scene and really surprised that deejaygrub was getting them for half the current price. I suppose the now discontinued NSW rebate was paying more than the federal one?
Also, what's the general consensus on VPP? If I take up NSW VPP rebate, it will at least bring down the price to $6.5k.
I got from Green.com.au is $7.8k for 26.6kwh as of today. How did you end up $4?
I got 13kw solar and 26.6kw battery for $20k..
Anyone here getting or looking to get AlphaEss M5 which is their latest residential battery+inverter? I have been told that 13.3kWh is the old version which will be discontinued soon, G3 S5 is their second version which was released sometime in 2023/2024 and M5 is their latest version.
I can get G3 S5 now, but for M5 will have to wait about 6-8 weeks.
price of all battery x 2 is same, approx $7500 for 20kWh or 26kWh battery if we go with Smile 13.3kWh
Which solar company getting you 20kwh on G3-S5?
Sodium batteries are yet to hit the market at scale and will be really good for home storage.
Expect further price drops.