For someone looking to get into an EV on a budget would a low km Tesla be the better option over a new Chinese car?
Used Tesla Vs New Chinese EV
figarow on 01/07/2025 - 11:05
Last edited 01/07/2025 - 11:07
Last edited 01/07/2025 - 11:07
Poll Options
- 501New Chinese is better
- 111Used Tesla all day long
- 70ICE FTW
Comments
@BewareOfThe Dog: Well, the club gear does include an esky filled with drinks for those clubs that don't have a bar. :)
@MrHyde: 25 years ago, beer sales paid for our end of year presentation etc, back when Tooheys/VB cans were $30-35 a case, and we sold cans for $2 each.
@MrHyde: I keep a picnic rug, charging cables etc in the frunk at all times, and that leaves the entire boot, including the underfloor area, free for whatever luggage is required for a specific trip. That underfloor area is super handy.
The Tesla storage space apparently counts the space above the seats as part of size of the boot, whereas others don't. Reckon that could probably add a few hundred litres to the total.
Tesla measure their boot space differently to most manufacturers by including up to the roof rather than parcel shelf height. Here is a more practical measurement of boot spaces by how many banana boxes can fit.
Important to note the Tesla 854 measurement is up to the roof; the others are measured up to the window line.
The Y boot is big, no question - but the difference isn't as stark as the numbers suggest.
TLDR - tesla-quoted boot volume is misleading.
@andresampras: Good to know. Will have to check out the XPeng G6 and do a comparison - could be an option for my next car :)
Tesla measure their space differently, they count the space above seat back height I think. If you compare a g6 and y in person they are pretty much identical. Look at there external measurements and they are within a few millimetres of each other.
The frunk is an overpriced aftermarket piece of plastic for the g6 which is a bit of a miss.
Mr Hyde, Tesla measure their boot space differently to others. The result is their number is higher than most other SUVs of same size. Boot space can be measured from floor to bottom of window, from floor to roof. Some include the underfloor space.
The German motoring organisation ADAC does its own internal measurements of new vehicles.Tesla Model
420 floor to parcel shelf
540 floor to roofhttps://assets.adac.de/image/upload/Autodatenbank/Autotest/a…
A good practical reference is YouTuber Bjorn’s Banana box test.
In Bjorn Nyland’s banana box test note the area under the trunk floor and frunk are utilised
Model Y:
9 boxes in trunk
26 boxes with seats down
1in frunkXpeng G6:
9 boxes in trunk
27 boxes with seats down
0 in frunkTesla have sold many cars on the basis of a higher number
@Vistaman: 99% true, except you'd have to be an idiot to buy a car because you saw a number saying 854L as the boot volume instead of doing a visual check to see for yourself.
I've always said Tesla quote their number way higher (likely volume to roof filled) rather than the measurement every other manufacturer uses. No-one else does this because the 'trick' doesn't work.
The under floor storage though is massive compared to other cars and that did win me over though.
Pretty sure that is because Americans measure cargo space to the roof, whereas everywhere else only counts it to the top of the back seats.
XPeng, BYD Sealion's, Swasticar Y, all are pretty close.
If you want real storage and don't mind a fugly car with a stupid, unusable front bench seat, then EV5 is the one you want.
How's the ride comfort? is it too soft like other Chinese cars?
Seems others have noticed. I canned the BYD Otto 3 because I thought suspension was too soft at freeway speeds. In my opinion a sudden direction correction would be dangerous and could led to a death wobble based on the drive on the test track before it was introduced.
@flywire: Looking at the results of the "moose test" it seems it can handle a quick change of direction okay - definitely not an amazing result, but the low-ish centre of gravity seems to help keep it under control.
BYD Sealion 7
Why no to the model 3 vs other EV sedans?
The price is too high for no real benefit, IMO.
If you are going to pay that much for a Model 3; pay a little bit more and get a Model Y. Otherwise; for the size of a Model 3; the BYD is cheaper and better.
If you are going to pay that much for a Model 3; pay a little bit more and get a Model Y.
I respectfully disagree.
If you want a sedan, an SUV/crossover is not on the shopping list. I have zero interest in the Model Y regardless of price - it's less efficient, I dislike the higher ride position, and it's just plain uglier - even with the facelift.
The BYD Seal is a worthy competitor to the Model 3, but the base model is only a little cheaper and has worse range and features, while the models that compete more directly with the Model 3 on features and range are a similar price….or at least that was true last time I looked at a direct comparison. Knowing BYD they may well have changed both price and features since then.
@klaw81: Point taken.
The base SEAL is $47K; whereas the base RWD Model 3 is currently $55K after the $5K EOFY discount.
@MrHyde: You didn't include delivery fee, paint colors, extra software packs you need to pay with Tesla
@serpserpserp: I did say it was the base price. That $55k was drive away price for VIC shown on the Tesla website; including delivery fee. Paint colours and software packs are extra optional; so would be on top of base price.
I drive a Tesla and had high hopes for the BYD Seal to become car #2, but after test driving it I knew it wouldn't work out for me.
The frame used for the HUD casts a horrible rectangular reflection on the windscreen and it led to a really distracting driving experience, even when the HUD was turned off. Perhaps for a taller person the reflection would be less of a distraction, but they should have put more thought into designing a dashboard that suits all people.
Buy Chinese ones and please stay away from Tesla Chargers, don't want to wait 2 minutes for a spot.
Couldn't think of anything worse.
I would love a used German car if somebody else paid to maintain it. If you didn't have to pay for repairs they are great value after warranty expires.
Probably not going to be able to find a euro-repair sugar daddy though.
Probably not going to be able to find a euro-repair sugar daddy though.
Carton of piss and a box of darts and Uncle Ian will have a look at it…
You seem to try to spruik German cars whenver you can. Do you work in or own a German car dealership? Do you have investments in German car manufacturer stocks or something?
Owns a Polo with Temu GTI badges
A VAG car?! That sounds naughty.
Btw, no troll post today with your trying-saving-buck buddy!
What does this mean?
@Baysew: Nope, actually it was 'engineered with precision' that's why you understood correctly that I was asking something w/o asking!
Dudes! You cannot beat me! :)
@tenpercent: This is Trollbender's newer account.
You can't hide behind a new username, your incoherent style is too distinctive.
No doubt owns a bottom-of-the-range golf with temu amg and M badging on it, tinted tail lights and his entire personality is based on owning a "german prestige car" and trying to look down on everything else. Immature.
Syltb is a troll, don't even waste your negs. No one could possibly be that delusional about Eurotrash cars.
Looks like JV is having a real competitor this time.
The only thing worse than wasting cash on new is pouring money down the shitter on garbage second hand euro and german trash. You will come out ahead with any of the Jap or Chinese cars EV or otherwise by a wide margin.
True if your vehicle purchase is only a financial decision. If you can afford it and wish to enjoy your vehicle - German is the answer.
Then buy new, if you can't afford a new German made car you definitely can't afford a second hand one.
@gromit: Somewhat true. Cars should be purchased cash only unless through a business entity. Some slightly older German cars are more interesting than their modern versions so new isn't always better (subjective of course).
Agree for those who enjoy driving.
Get a sophisticated yet reliable Japanese car and enjoy a great investment driving a trouble free car rather than sitting on a bus or train. Avoid German crap, especially anything with a turbo engine, use the money you save on repairs as a down payment on a house.
Yes maybe a Nissan should be your new car
Best value is the chinese ev but Tesla are much nicer to drive. I recommend you test drive and see what fits best for you.
the old model Y RWD drove terribly, would not recommend. the new one's suspension has been tweaked but it'll be expensive
Test drive. And make sure to take into account the scheduling servicing cost of a chinese EV vs the expected servicing cost of a Tesla.
Used Tesla, you can pick them up for pretty decent prices.
Agreed, EVs are terrible at holding their value, so you should be able to get a used Tesla for a really good price. If not, definitely go with the new Chinese EV, they are far better value and not designed to rip you off. The insurance will also be a lot lower.
Oh yeah? Show me all these Tesla's at sub 40k pls
There are tonnes around. They also go very cheap at auction.
that's like all the 2019 model 3s. Model Y's are still holding a bit more value
If you are buying a used Tesla - make sure it is not the first run of Model Ys. The ride is harsh!!! You will feel every bump/undulation on the road.
And make sure its built in China, not US.
Pretty sure all Australian ones are out of the Chinese factory which has better qa than USA.
I think pre-2021 Australia-delivered Tesla's came from California, including the older Model S & Model X.
Test drive them all, make sure try BYD. Also look at Hyundai Ionic 5 and 6. Id avoid Tesla
My Volvo 240 is going strong. I'd recommend one but they're becoming harder to come by.
Any Chinese EV. If you want it to be "Tesla worthy" take to it with a metal rake, or paint a target on it and let nature take it's course.
MAGA
or
walk!The answer is always diesel.
Lol. Won’t go back. Been driving 2022 prado for a week now and boy, ain’t going back. 🤣🤣🤣
Feels like Jurassic driving diesel now, not to mention the infotainment 🤣🤣🤣
I have been looking at 2023 Model 3s
and then?
And then he thought he'd buy a car he could afford
and then?
Ive looked at a few too. But then they drive away with a Tesla owner in them.
Problem with buying a used Tesla, is most owners have very unrealistic expectations of their current market value. Which then limits your purchasing options to the very few realistic sellers.
Yes they all expect their 3 year old Tesla to see at a few k discount to a brand new tesla
Agree with t_c, a used Tesla is a better car but the issue is that Tesla owners think they are still worth lots of money and their prices are unrealistic. If you arent in a hurry I'd be waiting a reasonably priced Tesla to pop up on the market.
Brah you want all your vehicle data sent to the CCP? ðŸ˜
Or would you prefer sending all of it to Musky so he can sell it?
what you scared they will know how many time you visit the Chinese restaurant or massage parlour?
They'll find out your bad taste in music.
I was considering it- can get a model 3 2020 for around $30k second hand. Not bad in my opinion.
BYD dolphin 2022 is slightly higher 2nd hand than that
You can get a 2022 for under $30k. A 2020 should be closer to $25k
What's the budget?
A 2001 honda civic and 1000 eneloops .
That's a lot of FUD. Just vote ICE FTW, as that is obviously your opinion.
looking at charging large taxes for EV’s
Large? I suppose you think 50c/L fuel excise is a small portion of the cost of fuel.
Have you actually worked out how much this proposed tax might cost you? 'Large tax' is a misnomer you are using to spread misinformation.
Federal government has already reneged on fringe benefit taxes for NV leases on hybrids what’s to say they won’t for EV’s?
No they didn't. They set an end date from the start and now the end date has passed. No doubt FBT exemption will end for EVs one day, but who cares, doesn't matter for those that already have a lease.
Not going to bother correcting the rest of your "informing".
@[Deactivated]: Maybe look up the definition of renege. There was no reneging.
The FBT exemption for PHEV ran for the entire period. There was always an end date, there were no changes made. I pointed this out in my comment, but maybe you just don't understand.
Lots of misinformation points there. Wont bother to respond to them.
As far as chunese brands go, i think the market wikl settle onna few brands. Early adopters of new brands to this market may get stuck with a brand no longer supported well. BYD, MG appear relatively safe at this point. They are established.
We do not know the cost of complete battery replacement and how often this needs to occur.
Real world use points to batteries lasting over 300k km without any significant degradation, that is, less than 20%. 200000 km easily wirh under 10% degradation. The rest of the car is likely to be worn out before the batteries die. Then, youll lilely be able to purchase batteries from a wreck that have plenty of life for a lot less than a new battery. Wrecked teslas with good batteries are going for under $10k today.
Car batteries are not like in your phone. Asking what the battery replacement cost is, is the same as questioning how much a new engine and transmission would be for an ICE car - noone does it. Its a misinformation talking point.
I’m not convinced. Age of batteries vs km travelled are 2 very separate items (one is the degredation of the cells over time and the other relates to potential discharge/recharges and kms travelled)
You may not be convinced, but data is coming in showing batteries are lasting a lot longer than even manufacturers expected. Lots of kms and 10-15 years. Why else would they offer 8y warranty?Nissan built a factory to recycle batteries and they arent getting enough feed stock - even though the nissan leaf is one of the worst performers for battery life.
I’ve seen reports of Tesla battery replacements costing anywhere from $20-30K USD and more to replace (costs might have come down)
Thats about right, but prices for batteries are coming down, and more places will be able to do the work in time. Most of them are still done under warranty though. Next gen batteries are apparently 10% the cost of current stuff.
Take a phone as an example, within 3 years it’s down by up to 30% efficiency and in some cases more. Home solar batteries suffer the same levels of degredation - this is just one factor in a purchasing decision
Again, phone batteries are different. They have no active thermal management and are typically cycled a lot deeper than most EVs. Plus they are a lot smaller and subject to all manner of impacts. Data for bad degradation on home solar cpuld be skewed by lead acid systems. They probably also omit decent thermal management and are cycled heavily. They are expected to last 10-15 years.
End of the day, you do you. They dont suit everyone. Just tone down the misinformation.
please provide links to backup your claims, I need information on the levels of degradation, discharge cycles etc.
Not an opinion.How much research have you actully done? Maybe you need to actually do some research, rather than reading the first 3 google results. Ive read reports from reputable sources, but cant remember where exactly. Theyve been linked from articles by journalists who promote renewables and EVs and not murdoch media.
There is a study of something like 20,000 evs out there identiftying the longevity of ev batteries the other thing to note is that it appears, from the report, that degredation actually slows after the first few years and somewhere above 80%. Of course this does depend on charge practices somewhat.
8 years is a start.. but you didnt cover everything.
Tesla for example states:
"8 years or 160,000 km, whichever comes first, with minimum 70% retention of Battery capacity over the warranty periodTesla would not offer a warranty that solid if they expected the batteries to fail shortly thereafter. They dont want to replace batteries for free.
We do not know the cost of complete battery replacement and how often this needs to occur.
correct we don't know as despite EV's having been around for a few decades now it is still an incredibly rare thing that the vast majority of people will never need to concern themselves with as they will move on to a new car long before it dies, similarly most people move on long before their ICE engine dies.
Your entire post history is bagging out EV’s, what did they do to your fragile ego?
@ihbh: "I hope you charge them"
Via USB C?
.