Need advice on a PayPal claim

ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 09:49

Hi all,

I'm hoping i got this in the right section of the forums. So i recently purchased a copy of MS Office 2010 off ebay for $85. The item on ebay (which have been cancelled by ebay) stated that the product was genuine and that the item was in Aus, hence i proceeded to buying it.

This is where it becomes messy, a day later after i purchased and paid for the item, ebay sent me an email saying that this item was cancelled and i should put in a dispute to Paypal for my money back. So i did, Paypal requested some information from the seller, and apparently they had shipped the item (from China to me). When i received the product, I found that it looked a little off. The box was still wrapped in plastic but the colour was slightly different and the MS seal on top of the box seems to have been damaged (i actually have photos and have taken off the plastic wrapping yet). When i saw this, i escalated the dispute to say that this was not as described by the seller originally. They claimed it was a brand new genuine MS product from Aus, but it seems to me to be a dodgey item from China.

Paypal has now gotten back to me asking me to provide non-biased third party written documents as to the authenticity of the item. They want it to have a header and contact details of the person who appraised it incase they needed to be contacted. Heres the trouble i'm having, where the heck am i going to find someone who will appraise it and provide a written document regarding its authenticity. I'm thinking i should just send in the photos of the damaged MS seal with the plastic wrapping still intact because i have no idea who would possibly appraise it for me…

Any advice on this matter? Should i just write it off or is there some way i can get my money back?

Thanks in advance,

ProjectZero

General Discussion

Comments

  • airzone on 04/09/2013 - 10:20
    +7

    Microsoft have an anti-piracy hotline. I'd suggest you go to them with the details because:
    1) They will be able to validate the product's authenticity, and there's no way that Paypal can dispute their judgement.
    2) They will go after the seller themselves.

    fyi: http://www.microsoft.com/australia/piracy/

    • ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 11:36

      Thanks for the help, I'll give them a go.

  • BlazinPast on 04/09/2013 - 10:32

    Yeah, see if you can get in contact with Microsoft. Maybe you could bring it in to your local computer store and they might be nice enough to do the documentation.
    But about the purchase, did you check how many of this item were sold? Did you read the feedback regarding this particular item? This site is your best friend when purchasing off Ebay: http://www.feedbackselector.com/

    • ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 11:39

      They did sell a few, but there wasn't any feedback on the product at the time because it was recently added to ebay. Guess i should of listened to myself and waited before buying it…

  • bbqwer on 04/09/2013 - 12:18

    samething happen to me 2 years ago. I bought CD KEY Windows 7 on ebay, paid with paypal. and received the cd key the next day ( no box, no cd, Only cd key ). I was aware this might be fake or dodgy cd key ( cost me $20aud buy it now, so I give it a go ).

    4-5 days later seller was suspended, and I did received same email from ebay/paypal advice to open dispute ( but I didnt ).

    so far the cd key works, no issue at all, i can update, i can do anything. ( I also bought genuine cd key from MSY around $200 OEM ).

    If your ms office cd key is working than its good. just use it.

    • ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 14:00

      To be honest, i actually haven't tested it that far. As i saw that the MS seal seems to have been tampered with, i didn't even take it out of the plastic wrapping incase the seller said that it was my doing.

      I've give MS anti piracy hotline a go and see what they say. If they give it the green light then i might just let it go.

      Also, just a little additional info, the colour on the box that it came it looked slightly off and the writing on the back of the box seems a little blurry/ fuzzy.

      • Daabido on 04/09/2013 - 16:16

        Dollars to donuts it's dodgy. Not from Australia, seal is tampered with, colour is wrong and writing is blurry. Any half decent computer shop would be able to validate that for you, because they see so many of the real thing.

        • ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 17:02

          lol yeah, thats what i thought immediately, but i doubt any computer shop will help me without me buying the actual product from them or at least paying some kind of fee.

          I'll give MS a try first.

          The seal does seem to have been tampered with but i cant tell if it has been opened or not… i mean it seems like it has but until i undo the plastic wrapping i don't think i can be sure

      • bbqwer on 04/09/2013 - 17:00

        I suggest open the box, and punch the cd key in. this way you can find out its working or not.

        im pretty sure the ebay item number has been removed from ebay site, you cant NEG. worst case the seller got suspended.

        when it comes to paypal claim, its hard to get proof authenticity. for refund ? paypal might require buyer to send back item with proof of tracking id.

        at current situation, you are in losing position. this is what you got if buying at discounted price ( too good to be true really )

        • ozhunter on 04/09/2013 - 19:03

          when it comes to paypal claim, its hard to get proof authenticity. for refund ? paypal might require buyer to send back item with proof of tracking id.

          Yep, I think the seller knows it too. No wonder he won't offer to refund the item but just tell him to make a claim.

        • Forfiet on 04/09/2013 - 19:41
          +3

          If you can prove its counterfeit don't let paypal force you to return it!!! Tell them straight up thats its ILLEGAL to send counterfeit items through the post. Then they should refund you and no cost to you having to send it back with tracking no. If you can prove its fake and they insist you return it, tell them you will REPORT THEM to the relevant authorities. :)

          Edit: Similar case: http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/108436
          Edit 2:If Paypal goes at you to return 'counterfeit' items back report them to the Financial Ombudsman - https://www.paypal.com/au/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#…

        • ProjectZero on 04/09/2013 - 19:45

          Well… i had another thorough look at the box and have come to the conclusion that this item is definitely a counterfeit…

          I found a few typos on it…

          things like "WindOWS Vista", "WindOWS Server", "32-bitoperating system" and "graPhics"

          Now I'm just waiting for MS to reply to my email with these examples (on photo) and see what they say… once i get the email i should have enough proof that it is a counterfeit yeah?

        • Forfiet on 04/09/2013 - 19:55
          +1

          once you get a e-mail from Microsoft, plus maybe in addition take some pics of these 'typos/engrish' errors for paypals records forward this to them straight away. I made a edit to my post above when communicating with paypal which place to make a complaint if they try to make you send it back aswell. Might be easier to get your point across if you use their hot-line number as you may be able to get your points listed better.

          P.S Sorry for the muddled rant above……not really feelin well ATM :)

  • expertreader on 04/09/2013 - 20:46
    +2

    similar thing happened to me with microsoft zune mp3 player… I went on online help desk and provided them info regarding the player.. they asked me if i had serial number on the player which i didnt and they confirmed during the chat that the player was fake if it didnt have any serial number… I submitted pdf copy of the chat along with picture of the player and a signed letter stating that the item was fake and I shouldnt be asked to send the item back as doing so will make me responsible for sending counterfeit item across countries… paypal gave decision in my favour… you can probably do the same …

  • ProjectZero on 05/09/2013 - 10:31

    Thanks for the all assistance guys, i couldn't find the online help desk for the anti piracy thing but i did call up MS and they gave me the email to the Aus anti piracy department and is just waiting for the email, once i get it and sort it out with paypal, i'll post the result.

    Cheers!

  • maximum on 05/09/2013 - 11:28

    Good luck hope it works out. I learnt the hard way never acknowledge receipt of a product from eBay until you have fully checked it out. I bought a Nintendo dsi checked feedback etc (all good until after I purchased). Got email from Nintendo that the serial number was a fake but trying to get an official to verify that they had inspected would have cost me more than my loss. PayPal are great when you don't receive goods but my experience with a fake they were all talk no action.

  • Aceboy884 on 05/09/2013 - 15:27

    for verified proof

    you can just take it to a office work shop and ask the manager to state this is fake

    that's what they need, someone who sells the same product to also validate it is fake

    make sure it's written in a letter head from the retailer verifying

    You are lucky it wasn't sold to you as a cd key, otherwise paypal would not have provided cover

  • SirFlibbled on 05/09/2013 - 16:17

    Sadly you have to be really careful with some purchases on Ebay. I wont buy Hulu and Netflix codes off there for example as you just can't tell which sellers are selling codes bought with stolen CCs and which sellers are legit.

  • rambao9 on 05/09/2013 - 21:45
    +3

    Well, I bought fake sd cards off ebay that were advertised as MicroSD cards, hence the purchase and things didn't go too well for me

    I disputed them as fake, item incorrectly described and receiving incorrect quantity (bought 3 received 2) and jesus, how PayPal came down on me.

    It didnt matter anymore whether item was incorrectly described or whether or not I received the right quantity. I emailed ebay and even ebay said that they 'dealt' with the seller for selling fake items but I still must dispute through Paypal. Paypal only cared about these documentations, phoned CS, gave them a nightmare phone call of 20 minutes but nope, nothing!
    As stated by OP there was practically no way of me attaining documentation from a non-bias 3rd party that these were fake, they looked ridiculously real too.

    In the end, i had to file a dispute on FoS for them to refund me as 'a gesture of good will' rofl

    So the bottom line? NEVER EVER DISPUTE ANYTHING AS FAKE ON PAYPAL

  • rekabkram on 06/09/2013 - 04:34
    +1

    Don't forget that if you can't get help from PayPal, if you paid with a credit card then you can still go through your credit card company for a refund. PayPal hate it and may close your account thought so it is a worst case scenario and if you think it's worth the hassle of setting up a new PayPal account if they shut your account down.

    • Cheeper on 06/09/2013 - 11:02
      +1

      When you get confirmation of the item being counterfeit and if payPal still gives you the run around contact the Banking Ombudsman.

      We were caught by a scammer on ebay selling fake goods and all ebay and paypal wanted to do was to get us to send the item back to hong kong with us paying the freight.
      There was evidence that hundreds of thousands had been caught in this scam.
      Ebay and paypal were cashing in with sold fees on the fakes, they were not bothered.
      Within 2 days of the B.O. reviewing the case we had the refund in the bank.

      Ebay & paypal CAN make enquiries to confirm fake items but they DO NOTHING.
      Why?? The sale of any fake item brings them revenue so why make any extra effort at all to control such sales.

  • ProjectZero on 13/09/2013 - 14:28
    +5

    Hey guys,

    So just an update on the situation, i sent the MS confirmation of the counterfeit to ebay and i have received the reimbursement a few days later.

    Thanks for all the help guys!

    • Forfiet on 21/09/2013 - 11:27

      glad to hear it! thanks for the update!

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