Hay All,
EOFY Sale time means good time to get good deals.
Personally I don't drink coffee but my wife goes mad for it. We have one of the pod ones but she still trots to the cafe twice a day. Thinking of investing in one that takes proper beans… any coffee lovers help ?
Budget max is $1k and the only other key criteria is it can't be ugly !
Love suggestions & deals.
She drinks Large Skimmed Latte… i know after ordering it sooooo regularly
good to see that you have worked out what coffee your wife drinks.
I was working at the SCG as a bartender during the Test match. Between serving beer and wine, I was helping make espresso coffee for the guests.
Ex-PM John Howard comes up with his wife after afternoon tea to order a coffee, but his wife leaves for the bathroom. He looks a bit stunned, not knowing what coffee to get her despite them ordering coffee together the last few days in this same room. IIRC he settles for two flat whites. I serve up two coffees just as she comes back, and he hands her the flat whites and she says, "What's this?".
"It's a flat white" Howard says sheepishly.
"I haven't had milk in my coffee for years!"
"…"
Someone in the crowd shouts out, "ahhh the PM still can't remember what his wife orders after 30 years!" whilst he stands there blushing and holding two coffees, and his wife looking bemused.
love my moccamaster. best at home coffee machine and simple to use.
Although GF did flood the kitchen with coffee the first time using it….
I would advise you to spell "advice" with a "c" rather than an "s".
Great advice :)
Just remember that 'ice' is a noun, so 'advice' is also a noun. Same goes for practice/practise, licence/license etc. :)
But what's a noun?
Unless you're American in which case everything is a verb lol
The breville on sale at the moment is the go bes920 I think with the separate grinder
Read this elsewhere. Do you have one ?
yes - i'd also encourage your wife to visit her favourite cafe and enquire what blend of coffee they have and whether they sell it unground. also buy the same milk they do and have her ask their barista what dosage they typically use.
once youve got their coffee, the dosage and same milk it will be absolutely identical to her favourite cafe without the $4.50 price tag. i did exactly this and it became addictive, it's been 18 months and it really isn't that much hassle to grind, brew and clean up afterwards. to grind 19g takes ~20 seconds, level the hopper and load into machine is 10 seconds and then double shot brew ~28-30 seconds. while it's dripping you also use the dual boiler and heat/froth the milk.
in 60 seconds you have ground, brewed/dripped & frothed the milk and enjoying in a heart beat. i will say though, dont cheap out on the milk - recommend demeter unhomogenised or if you go mainstream, A2 milk etc - ive found with the heating and frothing the better milks taste much better.
if you got the bes820 unit, you'll basically empty the hopper and use a chux or similar to tidy the area and milk/purge the frothing stem - max 25 seconds. then every 100 or so coffees you slipped one of the machine cleaning tablets in, the machine is fully automated so completes the process in 3-4 minutes and that's about all the maintenance you need to worry about in the first 24 months… i've had mine 18 months and can expect to need descaling but it looks easy according to youtube.
You can't use a BES920 and clone a commercial machine's quality, even with the same beans, milk, and dosage.
With respect Dave you just can't discern the difference.
I am the last person in the world who wants to be pretentious about coffee, but there is so much more to coffee than the beans, dosage and milk. Here are some other variables that will take you a long time to master: grind (impossible to improve upon greatly with the Breville grinder), tamp pressure, water pressure and temperature, bean freshness.
mate to be fair, we're talking a bloke who doesn't drink coffee and his wife that has two coffees a day… a big assumption but hardly a connoisseur that will clearly distinguish between cafe & premium breville machine.
@aoeueoa: What? Of course you can. The BES920 will easily produce a commercial quality coffee, it just wouldn't be able to do it all day every day for years. You can adjust the temperature and pressure settings on the 920, and if you're not afraid to open it up, there's other mods you can do to get even more control.
I agree that if you wanted to be a real coffee snob, you could get a better grinder than the Breville Smart Grinder. But honestly, most people wouldn't even get close to noticing the difference.
I'm taking a guess that the Breville lineup was developed in conjunction with people in the industry who will probably forget more about coffee than you will ever know..
@ankor:
The local cafe could also make rubbish coffee ;)
I have a bes920 and smart grinder and love them. I did have to get the pump, preinfusion solenoid (??) and steam wand valve replaced under warranty just towards the end of the warranty period (2 months ago) but it was free and is running great now.
It's about 3x more effort than pod coffee, but once you're used to doing it out still only takes a few minutes and the coffee is at least 3x better. I buy my beans online from Sweet Yarra Coffee. Heaps cheaper than local cafe beans, and just as good if not better.
Break her legs so she can't get to the cafe :).
Seriously though, if you buy her a manual one it will need to be on to build pressure costing lots of power, and if she only turns it on once she wants one will she wait the 15 min to heat? Will she get sick of making them etc etc.
At work I have an elcheapo basic breville espresso maker that I bought off ebay for $25. it would be a "wait to heat", except I fill it with boiling water from the Zip instant water tap. so it's ready to go ASAP. coffee - I buy freshly ground from a Alen's espresso on George St Bris (highly recommend).
nuke the milk and then froth with espresso machines steamer.
15 mins? It takes about 30 seconds to heat up. Buy a new machine man !!!
You're obviously not married. After breaking her legs, she'll just get you to go to the cafe instead. And you'll be doing it for the rest of your life.
Lol!
I've had a few over the years, currently got a breville with the built in grinder. It's the best i've had so far
Pros :
Large drip tray i only need to empty once / twice a week
Grinds directly into the coffee thing while it holds it, you tap and walk away while it grinds into it.
Built in tamp, you dont even need to remove it, you just push the coffee thing up against it
Adjustability of the grinder, easy to get the best mix
Cons:
You always need to clean the grinds away from the edge with your finger
Uses alot of water, requires filling about once a week (for 1 person using it)
The fake metal flaked away after about 3 years, it looks corroded in the corner, its weird
Its still manual, kinda been looking into automatic ones even though the coffee would be worse
Whatever you get, also buy a coffee grinds bin. Makes it super easy to knock the grinds out of the cup without loosing it in the bin.
Thank you, mind sharing which model ? There seem to be a few with internals from Breville
I've had mine for about 3-4 years which is the old model of the Barista Express (BES870BSS.ANZ)
Great, was just looking at this one. This is a fair bit cheaper than the 920 which seems to be getting lots of love. Thanks for the info.
Both me and a friend have this exact model and we both love it.
Similarly, I purchased the older model for a family member approx 5+ years ago and its still working as good as new.
@lolitsme: The main difference between the 2 models is that 920 (no built-in grinder) comes with dual boiler so you can froth the milk while brewing your coffee. It will be useful when making several coffees for your visitors :)
870 is just fine for a family.
Maybe she likes the cafe coffee, just saying
Maybe she likes the barista?
Maybe he listens to her needs, wants and doesn't try to change her.
Maybe she just likes what he does with his steaming wand?
Maybe it's the feeling of power, to go an tell someone what to do.
Or maybe it's to get out of the house, even for just a short ( coffee ) break.
If you get her a coffee machine, she might go out and buy a pair of shoes instead.
I've gone through various machines - first of all you need to work out the degree of control she will want to have as a user. They vary from putting in some beans and pushing a button to grinding the beans correctly yourself, tamping the coffee, frothing the milk and cleaning the machine after each use. Clearly the pod coffee isn't hitting the mark, but do you think she'd want to go to the other extreme and perform each step herself? Given you say she's mad for coffee she probably would but that's going to dictate the machine you buy.
If she is willing to do some of the work herself, agree with comments above that you can't beat the Breville BES920 and the Smart Grinder Pro. I have this combination and it beats the coffee you buy in a cafe (I too used to buy it daily).
absolutely agree - thanks for sharing your views.
before going further, have you visited a nespresso boutique? If not, I'd highly recommend you goto one and try the different coffee's available.
I don't have much opinion on coffee (I'm happy to drink instant). So I can't comment on nespresso taste. They absolutely suck for the environment though.
Billions of those pods go to landfill every year and they can't be recycled easily either.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-24/former-nespresso-boss-…
nespresso does offer a recycling option for their pods. but judging from the negative votes, i'm just flogging a dead horse so it doesn't really matter. I don't own a nesspreso pod machine, it was just another option I threw in there.
I went from a breville 870XL to a prosumer profitec machine and grinder. Both can make decent coffees as long as you have the skill set, however is it more consistent with the profitec.
I'd recommend a BES920 + Smart grinder combo which you can probably get <$1000 easily. Just understand that the Breville is classified as an appliance; they are designed to break down after a few years in comparison to a prosumer machine.
Also factor in fresh beans (2 coffees using double basket a day you'll be using 1kg per month which is roughly $35 per month from Manna beans, or $35-45 from a local cafe).
"break down after a few years"? My Breville BES860XL is still going fine after 6 years and has never missed a beat. Gets used 2-3 times a day.
Go for one of the Breville Dual Boiler machines and get a grinder too. BES920.
Second hand Jura ftw. If you're in Melb there's a guy who sells/services them - 6 months warranty.
As others have said the BES920 deal is pretty good at the moment.
We got this one a couple of years back and it's been pretty good:
http://www.jetblackespresso.com.au/shop/p/lelit-pl41tem/
It's a bit smaller that the Breville in case space is an issue for you?
At the time the BES920 was about the same price, if it were at the current price then I would have bought the BES920. We use the Breville Smart grinder with Coffee Snobs sample packs (about $40 for 4 different types of beans).
FWIW I have a Breville 920 and it's awesome - before I bought it, I did a lot of research on coffeesnobs (good forums, worth taking a look)
Going to the cafe for a barista coffee is a ritual and an experience that brings you wife pleasure.
It's not just about the coffee.
You can buy her the best and most expensive machine, the best beans and the perfect technique, but you won't recreate the experience.
Then there's the male/female distinction.
Male = logical, practical, fixer
Female = feeling, emotion, experiences
Just sayin'
Thank you, covered this.
There is one cafe in our suburb, coffee is average (according to her). Next option is a 3km drive, so she's been having the average coffee. Buying a decent machine will offer better coffee & a long term cost saving !
That is your logical / male mind speaking.
Considering that the coffee is average, she is not doing it for the coffee itself.
My suggestion is not to buy a coffee machine and let her do what she loves to do.
sounds like it confirms it! I work in Melbourne's burbs and I use the work pod machine because it's consistent. The local cafes are average on a good day. She likes the experience per comment above!
Has your wife actually asked for a coffee machine, or is this your male way of fixing things?
Thanks all. Looking at a BES920 today. Any views on the "Barista Express Coffee Machine - BES870". Seems to be the next model down but has the grinder internally ?
Hi @lolitsme,
I was on the exact same page about a week ago, bought BES 920 with eBay coupon. After reading through coffee enthusiasts blogs and forums, it's better not to have the grinder internally as the high temperature from the boiler can affect the bean's freshness. I didn't have a big budget so I went with BCG820 the smart grinder pro. Sometime in the future when I have some extra money I want to try a solid grinder (may be Rancilio Rocky or Compak k3 push). According to the experienced people's opinion even with the entry level coffee machine like BES920 having a good grinder will upgrade the taste.
I just got a BES870 and it works fine. My friends have had one for 3 years and it still goes strong, although the automatic grind time has broken (not adjustable), they can still grind manually the amount they want.
I called around between Harvey Norman, Good Guys, Myer, etc and got it for $600 (3 weeks ago when it was advertised $649). You can probably get it cheaper if you worked them harder, but $600 is an ok price.
I think you may get some advantages from getting separated grinder, etc, but it performs pretty good, has some adjustments you can do to tinker with your coffee and has a pretty small footprint given the grinder is included.
Was in the same boat myself. I already have a breville smart grinder so I opted for the Sunbeam EM7100 for $620 off ebay from bid-madness with 15% off code. Sad I just missed the 920 deal, but don't want to spend more than what I am for a coffee machine. Hopefully this company is legit… paid with paypal so i'm not fussed.
Go to Coffeesnobs. com.au
Look at hardware, some excellent 2nd hand machines available and grinders.
Plenty of helpful information on website, I also buy my coffee beans from there as well, Fresh roasted and express delivery.
I picked up a Jura Impressa S9 OneTouch on Gumtree for around $400. It needed a new foaming spout and drip tray but it only ended up costing me around $600 all up. Had it a couple of years now and it hasn't missed a beat.
http://www.primecoffee.com.au/automatic-coffee-machines-smal…
Ex Barista(uni job of 4 years) here:
I have replaced my old machine with a breville infuser and my old manualy set grinder(MOD'ed sunbeam conical). I chose this machine because it met my requiremnts because i couldn't afford the dual boiler machine I really wanted(ECM single head).
The key points were:
* Semi auto function(measured shots mean you can do other things like pry the the kids apart while the machine is pulling a shot)
* not its helpfull PID but I do use and like it so I'll include this
* Its heating speed
* Steam wand design
* Price
* Most importantly propper basket design(most thermo block machine(cheaper design) have a dodgy dual basket setup.
One of the key skills a good Barista has is the ability to get the grind right not too fine that blocks the shot but fine enough that you get a deep extraction. On top of Speed, Clenliness, and MAD coffee skillz.
breville infuser espresso machine bes840 sell for around $300
and a good grinder should cost minimum $150
the key is good grind and good beans.. Find a local roaster and buy by the kilo. I have a great source about 20 mins away that does 1kg of the best coffee for $29.
your local grinder is pretty average IMO
but then again people do say i am a bit of a coffee snob
Thanks for this, great info to consider.
BES920 + smart grinder is the best bang for buck setup at <$1K in the sales.
Or you can buy my old EM7000 for a few hundred bucks? :)
Have a rancilio Silvia with sunbeam grinder. Fully manual setup is what I like. I can see Silvia going strong for many more years, but can't recommend the grinder. It's all plastic inside and doesn't hold the setting.
I own the Rancilio Miss Silva. I did a lot of research on different options and this seemed to be the best. Managed to pick up a second hand one from gumtree for about $500. Still works great. Its extremely loud and quite slow but the quality is good.
What you need to realise when making your own espresso coffee is that the coffee machine is only the third most important part. Far more important is the grinder and the freshness and quality of the beans. You should be looking to spend at least as much as the coffee machine on the grinder. A $100 grinder with a $5,000 coffee machine will make worse coffee than a $500 grinder with a $500 machine.
You also need to be obsessed with the freshness of the beans which will mean regular trips to somewhere like a local café to buy the beans (depending on how much coffee you drink, every 1-2 weeks). Everytime I see a café pull out a giant bag of beans from an old box under the counter that were probably roasted 3 months ago I shudder.
Ask your local café where they get their beans from and when they were roasted. If your wife is a good customer they may sell her a bag of their beans every week or two. It should have the date they were roasted – if it is more than a week ago do not buy it. You can order freshly roasted online and have them shipped to you every week (and they guarantee you will receive them less than a week after they were roasted) but I think this is pretty expensive.
Good luck – its actually quite an art-form to make a good espresso coffee. Even if you’ve watched a barista do it 1000 times its harder than it looks. You may wish to do a coffee making course before buying the machine – if you drink coffee it would be a fun activity to do together.
I buy my coffee online from coffeesnobs. They roast Wednesday and Sunday. Works out a lot cheaper than buying from a cafe, I buy a roast which is $77 for 2 kg (you can buy more or less) and delivery is $11, if you live in Melbourne you can pick up.
I own the Rancilio Miss Silva.
Those look amazing.
İnternational roast best coffee
Dad always told me this was the worst coffee. I never believed that a coffee would could be so bad. I finally bought one, and OMG, it was AWFUL. It truly was the worst coffee I've ever had!
brought a DeLonghi Silver Compact ECAM 23.460.S for my workplace. Quite happy with it. This is automated so it's good for every instead of the real barista.
I have a BES920 and smart grinder. I have used a BES820 in the past.
The upside of the 920 is the dual boiler and pump. Also larger pumps. I can pull a shot and froth at the same time. Frothing is also faster than the 820.
The 820 has a much smaller foot print and much more suitable for a single user.
If it's purely for the wife, I'd be getting a 820 and a decent grinder. The smart grinder is average but a meaningful upgrade to a non conical bur type grinder can be >$700.
We have a Rancilio Silvia ($400 second hand), Breville Smart Grinder ($200) and a Breville knock box.
Another vote for BES920 + Smart Grinder. Good balance of not having to muck around too much, and able to pull decent shots while frothing the milk.
Also recommend going on a 1/2 day Barista course to get the background on beans, how they age, grinding, pulling shots and properly frothing milk
Definitely recommend doing a half day course, will pay off very quickly, especially when you are making coffees for friends!
if you are after a fully automatic machine, i recommend using European amazon sites. I got a philips machine for about $450 aud (Amazon France), while in Aus the cheapest fully automatic would be approx $700. There are also heaps of reviews on those sites.
Eg something like this would be good if you want easy coffees with milk
https://www.amazon.fr/Melitta-Machine-Automatique-Cappuccina…
https://www.amazon.fr/Saeco-01-Machine-expresso-automatique-…
We bought this sunbeam machine: https://m.myer.com.au/shop/mobile/mystore/123182?gclid=Cj0KE…
You can usually find it for about 700. It makes a good coffee and the pressure gauge makes it easy to make a consistantly good coffee. The built in temp gauge will be useful. I have my coffee like your partner and I would recommend this machine. But - it did break in the first year (by 3 days). Myer gave us a brand new one with a new receipt so that's fine, but you might consider getting the extended warranty. You can spend the money left over on a good grinder.
I bought the delonghi icona the other day from costco. I only make coffee two or three times a week, it takes ground coffee. I buy Victoria cafe style from coles. It makes good enough cappuccinos but this coming from someone who can drink 7/11 coffee. Also not the most reliable from reviews but looks nice & comes with two year warranty
It's a bit hard to give you personal advice, especially since you're not that big on coffee yourself.
But from my own experience I started off with a Breville Fresca machine (BES860) (now discontinued and superseded by the Breville Barista Express BES870 but essentially the same). This model was a good introduction to coffee making as you can buy freshly roasted beans and grind them yourself for a nice and fresh brew.
I now have the BES920 with a Breville smart grinder and it is very good, a decent step above the Fresca and I assume the BES870. It meets my needs and makes a great coffee, in my mind equivalent to a good barista made coffee. I don't know how keen you or your wife are on attempting this machine but it's not too hard to use if you're willing to tailor the settings to your taste?
don't bother mate, sounds unlikely she'll use it! She just likes the cafe!
Agreed.
I think you need to get more info first. What's wrong with the pod machine? (there are plenty reasons, but what are hers? Is it even related to the coffee/taste?)
You could be in for an expensive waste especially if you don't use it!
How we make lovely coffee: Stovetop espresso maker (e.g. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001BKL8C2 ~$100), milk frother (e.g. https://www.breville.com.au/the-milk-cafetm.html ~$120 with extra couple of years warranty), grinder (https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/215068 ~$160). Finally, find a local roasting place - we like Toby's estate for the decaf. It might seem desirable to have more mechanical wizardry, but this approach can save a lot in maintenance hassle & cost.
http://www.harveynorman.com.au/breville-dynamic-duo-coffee-m…
or
https://m.myer.com.au/shop/mobile/mystore/123182?gclid=Cj0KE…
Are the usual go to recommendations for home coffee brewing.
I have the older model of the sunbeam.
Agreed with the recommendation above about buying her favourite beans. That breville combo sounds perfect though.
bes920 plus the smart grinder. Love it.
yep, i love my dual boiler and smart grinder too.
i dont use the dual boiling very much though, could probably do with a single boiler unless you entertain.
the breville barista express is a good unit. 2 birds with 1 stone
I think alot depends on the there, it makes the coffee, the beans arnt an issues, just as long as they arnt too scorched and bitter tasting.
in any event, any home machine is only acceptable for a stop gap before you get to town and have your proper coffee and dont need to clean up after wards. thats what you pay the extra $2 for ;-)
I got this : https://www.appliancesonline.com.au/breville-bes810bss-duo-t…
Not disappointed - takes better than a lot I get at the cafes. Nice box and accessories, even comes with water filter.
Is it worth spending a thousand ? You've got to be a trianed barista to get everything right. But this hits the bang for buck mark for me, nice steamed milk and not scorched/burnt coffee thanks to the temperature control. Water filter, and magnetic tamper.
I've been using Sunbeam PU5900 (EM5900 Machine + EM0450 Coffee Grinder) for about two years now. Great machine for a sub $1k.
I also recommend giving your wife a barista lesson voucher for her birthday, it'll give her the skills to get the most out of the machine and will get her interested in using it rather than sneaking off to the cafe. ;)
Bes 870 if you have limited bench space and want to spend around $700
The rancilio silvia and grinder is much better than the bes 920 as its a proven italian machine with mechanical switches not poor quality chinese circuitboards and will last 10 years + with minimal maintenence.
https://www.newcoffeeitalia.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=ranci…
Cheers
I've got the DELONGHI Primadonna S; which appears to be on sale at Myer at the moment for $1179 (Using CCSELL20 code at checkout).
https://m.myer.com.au/shop/mobile/mystore/ecam28465m-primado…
Makes both espresso and milk coffee, fully automated. I only use it for espresso; but I make flat whites for guests and they seem to love it.
It's a tick over your budget ceiling; but it looks great and requires no effort to make a coffee.
Black coffee or milky coffee?
Go mochamaster, never go back. Only makes black coffee though.