Want to learn manual and want to get a manual car in the near future.
What is the cheapest way to learn it? No one from friends and family drives or knows how to drive manual… I have full licence.
Would it be better to pay for lessons? Wait until I get my own manual and learn on it (means I can't test drive and may cause damage)? Rent a manual from some where?
Thanks
It was really cheap - about $35-40/day. I passed my test years before that and had an automatic licence but it became unrestricted after. I was pretty confident in my own ability to not crash so didn't take out the excess reduction, etc. options that would've just added more to the cost.
My mate was free.
Is your mate still free for OP? He might want him to watch him handle knobs.
I find it a struggle to even find manuals to hire. (Europe is OK but here and the US they are like hen's teeth.) Which is a real pity when hiring a small car - the type that benefits most from a manual transmission.
I think they're only available in the suburban areas. They're the cheapest of the cheap cars to hire. I got it from Budget, but that was about 10 years ago. You could perhaps try one on them rent-a-bomb places. haha
You were me a year ago. I went for a few lessons and bought a car.
Youtube is very handy. I watch a channel called world driving or something along those lines which was very helpful. They have cameras on the pedals and gear stick. It is a british channel rather than american so they do more than go in a straight line on level ground.
Pfffft… I drive trucks and some of those have 18 gears and no synchros. It's like driving a manual, but on hard mode… :D
If you have been driving for a while now, just get a driving instructor. just tell them you want to learn manual and it wont take you long to get it done. They dont have to teach you everything else, just how to change gears. It should only take a few lessons and that wont be too hard. Once you have that learning done, THEN go out and hire/rent/buy/beg/steal a manual car to continue practice.
cheapest way - visualisation.
close your eyes and imagine you are driving around the streets in a manual car using the clutch, brake & accelerator.
Aaahh, yes. The goodies method, don't know why down voted.
Get yourself a dinner plate, a spoon and a chair. then have a mate lie on the floor and raise his feet for the pedals. (Check The Goodies episode The Race)
Did you pass your driver's test in Australia?
I doubt you have an "unrestricted" licence if you didn't take the test in a manual car.
Are you sure you don't just have an open licence but with a condition (auto only). **
Either way, if you don't have family or friends to guide you, best to employ a driving instructor.
That way you can destroy their transmission and clutch while learning.
** nevermind…. just read VicRoads website. Licence goes unrestricted after probationary period.
nsw too, after Ps
** nevermind…. just read VicRoads website. Licence goes unrestricted after probationary period.
Exactly. I'm wondering, what happens if you get an auto-only licence in WA, then move to VIC and get an unrestricted licence and then move back to WA…? They'd probably give you an unrestricted WA licence.
I reckon if you grab this for a few days, you should be OK.
$20 for a manual a day(+kms). If you rent it for a few days and get some solid hours down you should be good to go.
https://www.carnextdoor.com.au/reservations/new?end_time_iso…
Car Next Door is pretty good. You don't even need to meet anyone to get the rental, its all electronic.
Also good because they don't have to see you struggling to get the car and take it somewhere safe lol.
Luckily I had a colleague teach me manual a month before I bought my new 86 :). Didn't do too many hours.
EDIT: 86 is also a pretty easy manual car to drive. Good luck finding a decent secondhand though.
Thanks for the link, I've never heard of this website before until this post. But can you elaborate on the 2nd hand 86 thing?
Plenty of information RE: it online.
etc.
http://www.drive.com.au/new-car-reviews/20122016-toyota-86-u…
my mate hired a porsche boxter through car next door for like $70 a day. for all cars there is also a small booking and insurance excess reduction fee. i think he paid $18 a month membership to avoid extra fees for each time he hired it.
I considered using them for a $30 a day car for a few days but ended up just using rent-a-bomb because they were located close to where I wanted to pick up. many small rental cars are manual because of the tiny engines. picking up a car next door without someone seeing you drive off might be a better option for you than rent-a-bomb though :)
as for driving a manual. when my brother (a police officer) taught me to drive we did an exercise to learn the clutch. start from stop and never use the accelerator. but slowly gain speed using the idling engine and shift up through the gears making sure you dont stall. you should be able to get into 4th and still be travelling quite slowly.
I did the most un-Ozbargain way possible.
I bought a new manual car, then started learning late at night when the roads were empty.
Best way would be through a driving instructor - they'll teach you the basics so you'll be able to develop a strong foundation
That's what I did, bought a manual and sit with my friend once or twice. Drive myself when no traffic. But boy the first day driving to work during peak was nerve breaking.
I’d get a couple of lessons, then when more confident hire an old Ute from a small hire firm
Then go to an industrial area on the weekend when it’s quiet and drive around and practice.
i learned when an old job would send me on deliveries across the city in their company car- the owners daughters old stationwagon. before that all i had done was a few minutes in a rental in the deserted roads of alice springs, where i wasnt sure how to brake.
lugging that wagon around sydney was terrifying the first few times. my heart rate would increase every time i hit a red light and had to go through it all over again. after a while it got better, and then i had some car trouble and borrowed the owners spare old car for a couple months. manual again, became my daily drive and was good practise. helped that it was a small car
a year later i bought a manual toyota echo. cheap, ran well, fun to drive and great to chuck about and learn in. couple years later changed it to an mx5
Same way I did, Daytona USA - Advanced
Drive it like a rental…top spees to secind gear in 1/2 a second.
shift from gear 4 to 2 during heavy turnings? lol
Don't do it to a real manual car ….might kill the gear box.
1 to start the power slide, then 2, 3 and finally 4 when you wanna straighten out.
I only ever used 2nd gear if I was stopped and needed to get up top speed. In the turns id go 1,3,4 completely skipping 2nd. By skipping 2nd you spend less time decelerating and more time getting back up to speed. I'm 100% sure that this method would work in all manual cars and recommend everyone use it.
@cypher67:
its normally 1 3 4 but theres one super tight turn that you need all of them. Forgot which one its been years since ive played.
Expert backwards or go home.
very nice, clutch is overrated anyway
Make sure you get to the time extension! Don't go into the stop pit.
I learned through a combination of bikes and driving a ute on farms with zero risk. If you're not confident doing it in a city, I'd pay for lessons. You can't immediately transfer skills through watching YouTube videos or games, you need to feel it.
I would just bite the bullet and buy a manual car. I learned on an auto and wanted a manual. Once I was fully licenced I got a Subaru (Dont get a Subaru if you wanna learn manual… their clutch pedals are super heavy) and taught myself. You will make some mistakes, grind some gears, and make the odd burning smell… but you wont destroy your car. You will eventually get the hang of it and you'll be satisfied that you did.
86/BRZ (which is what the OP wants) does not have a heavy clutch though.
i only have an auto car at home, did a few hours with an instructor in a manual, passed first time.
If you can't drive a manual, you can't really drive!
If your gearbox has less than 9 gears, you can’t really drive…
Why do you want to learn manual?
Just watched initial D? :)
Paddles should be restricted to the bedroom and not your car.
Cheaper new cars, more/cheaper options for car hire. The satisfaction of knowing you are actually a proper driver.
Superiority complex much? Proper driver? Get outta here.
Absolutely. Hill starts, clutch control. Far more skill needed.
I love car drivers saying that “if you can’t drive a manual” rubbish and watch them try and get my truck from 2nd into 3rd gear, let alone into 13th.
Pull your head in. There isn’t a gaping chasm between manual and auto trans in cars. It’s a skill I have taught people in about an hour.
Far more skill… sheesh.
@pegaxs: An hour? How many clutches did they burn out after that? And to be fair most people don't need to drive trucks so that's not particularly relevant. Truck driving is a skill in itself.
I do now drive an auto, mainly because my wife doesn't like manuals. In my view manuals are far more fun to drive and of course cheaper to buy.
How many clutches? None. How many gearboxes? None.
Someone with previous driving experience such as OP can generally learn how to drive a manual transmission in “about” an hour. Some learn quicker, some longer. But generally, it’s about 1 hour.
I think you are confusing “learning” with “proficiency”.
More fun to drive? That old rhetoric. Until you have to drive in bumper to bumper grid locked traffic in peak hour. On Saturday morning country road blasts, sure. In the city? No thanks.
Cheaper to buy, new cars, yes, used, not so much. Meh, depends on what you value and how good you are at haggling I guess.
"cheaper to buy"
man i wish. my first car was an LH Torana with 3 on the tree. Then a 5 speed manual VH Commodore. But my last two cars are Autos because in my price range manuals dont exist.
I started with a manual back in my home country because that's the only way to get a license.
But now I couldn't be bothered with a stickshifter because it increases my blood pressure
well unless its something really special i wouldnt mind driving it on the weekends maybe
Mon-fri peak hour traffic no way
realistically, two options:
OR
i would go for option 1 — it would probably be cheaper and faster. you could probably buy a shitb0x of an automobile for the same cost as the lessons you might otherwise get.
Unless you are severely uncoordinated you are unlikely to 'destroy the gearbox'. Sure, it'll get a bit of extra wear, but if you can work out how to drive in a few drives it'll all be fine. I'd be very surprised if there is a manual car out there that hasn't had a couple of hundred dud gear changes and isn't still running fine. Even experienced drivers muck it up from time to time and a gearbox/clutch is designed to cope with it.
I learned to drive a manual car in my parent's (20M) driveway (and my parent's car). 1st to 4th gear in 10M, 4th to first and stop in 2nd half (this WAS in 1966 when autos were much too expensive for most people and, in many cases, only had two forward gears (expensive to run) max speed about 15 miles/hour (yes miles in 1966). Mind you I'm not sure how good the car was afterwards lol).
It's really only first gear that matters as far as the catch-point is concerned, the other gears are just clutch-in, clutch-out accelerate/brake and make sure you have the clutch in/neutral when you stop.
Having taught both my kids to drive in a manual, it probably took them an hour to get it pretty well and then the occasional stall/bunny-hop in the next few hours. Empty car park or similar with hand-brake starts as a part of the practice.
Get a few lessons in manual from pro car teacher (and their car) and you should be good to go. Make your own mind up as to when you feel confident, the pro will probably milk you for what they can. Make sure you upgrade your license if it is restricted, it might save you from many tears if you have an accident and you either get fined or the insurance won't pay up.
Don't sweat it. Millions of people drive manual cars.
It's harder to learn man after learning to stab then steer.
Be it muscle memory, age, bad habit- I dunno.
The best (but not the fastest) way to learn to drive a manual is probably to pick the most cumbersome vehicle you can, one with a difficult shift, cranky clutch, under-powered engine, full of faults, faulty park brake, poor road surface, etc.
Nothing like a baptism of fire for the feet!
The best drivers I know started out with the worst cars. Same goes for jockeys perhaps.
I learnt to drive on a 1947 Major Petro Kero Tractor. (I was 11) I ended up with calf muscles like a centreback………
In South Australia you cannot get a car licence only for automatic. you must take your test in a manual vehicle………
As for automatics. My fathers 1955 Studibaker was a three speed automatic and I can tell you it went a lot faster than 15 miles an hour!!!!
As for manual cars, I currently drive a 2016 Mazda re 6 speed manual…….
When I was learning to drive last year, I took manual lessons from an instructor as no one in my family had a manual car. Took me about 2 months of weekly lessons to get the hang of it, as I had already learned the basic driving skills in an auto, as you have.
This would be about right, unlike the person above that reckons he's taught people to do it in an hour! Would be longer if you had never driven before obviously.
When I say get the hang of it, I actually mean drive well enough to pass the test. I never drove manual after that for 8 months, and it took me another two months just recently to master it again after buying my first car.
have you got a license already and know how to drive an auto?
If you live in Melbourne, I'll teach you.
Im sure one of your friends will know how to driva a manual
Gearbox swap your car :)
Good luck with it all. It was so so painful. I thought it would be a good idea to learn manual in a rental so rented one in Mauritius. Had two 20 min sessions (my partner can drive a manual, I can drive auto no problems) and it was fine. Then he injured himself and I had to do ALL the driving around, learning how to drive as the same time as touring a 2nd world country with crazy roads, crazy drivers, crazy bikes… Drove all around Mauritius in over a week. Considering the circumstances I did alright (couple of stalls, bunny hops, hills and stopping at lights or roundabouts was a bit frightening) but I wouldn't call it fun and I definitely would not bother driving a manual again.
but you do know how to do it now, and if required you will be able to (even if you don't like it)
That's the thing. The basics are fairly easy, but to master it takes much longer. When you are stuck on a hill with another car right behind you and need to get the clutch bite just right, that's when the real skill comes in. And every car has a slightly different clutch bite point.
Auto far, far easier to drive but being able to drive manual can be a very useful skill. For example when I hired cars in the uk last year autos were around twice the price of manuals. Saved a lot because I can drive a manual although it did mean I had to do all the driving because my wife doesn't like them!
Hand brake start. Easy
I have a manual currently, next car will be auto most probably, thanks Sydney traffic.
Go to a car dealer and test drive their manual cars, maybe the sales person can give you some tips.
You could try Air Tasker. Someone in your area with a manual car might be willing to teach you for a reasonable amount. Best of luck!
Airtasker is a pay for service site. The OP asking cheapest.
And your point is?
A driving instructor may be $100 for a lesson, Airtasker user may do it for $50, hence “cheaper”.
my point is below
TL;DR???
OP asked for cheap options and I think that Airtasker would be an ideal place to look…
To your comments below as they relate to Airtasker…
1: Buy the car? To learn in? Seems an expensive way to do it.
2: or, you know… post an ad on “Airtasker”
3: great advice.
4: strange advice, turning AND changing gear?? Is that what you’re suggesting?
5: At no time? What if the vehicle is stopped?
6: Eyes on the road, cover your “brakes”. Solid advice.
7: make sure you have enough road and appropriate speed limits for 4th gear.
8: good advice. Get out on the highway and get it into top cog.
9: Excellent advice!
10: Learn hill starts, both styles. highly recommended.
11: practice that reverse parking. Harder than it sounds in a manual
From my own experience learning when was a teen and teaching my friends and partners and the past. 1st Do not rent a car. It is more costlier than get an instructor . and in case of an accident the insurance excess is enormous. 2nd If a professional instructor with a car that is for teaching (pedals on the passenger side as well) is too expensive or not affordable for some reason, , I agree with above (user: chumlee): You have to buy the gear to learn the driving skills. That's the hardest part. Because you need someone skilled to buy the car. Then comes the easiest part. You will find so many friends/ guys / neighbors around your area to teach you. It's fun. If you in eastern suburbs of Sydney I could.
1. By the car
2. post an ad here, gumtree, or any other social media site that you got a car and want to to learn manual driving skills. You'll be surprised.
3 start slow. Better on abandoned parking areas, where'is no pedestrians, parked cars, traffic and most important kids.
4. After you have handled and learned move from the 1st and then 1-2 switch gears, chose empty streets to try with turns and changing the gears.
5. AT NO TIME LOOK DOWN TO SEE WHAT"S THE GEAR TO SWITCH TO OR CHANGE TO OR WHAT IS DOWN THERE!
6. Keep yr eyes on the road at all time ! Keep the right foot hovering over the break paddle if you don't press gas pedal.
7. Enjoy and relax when you comfortable to take it up to 4th gear .
8. Test a Highway. Which is easier than city driving because you have the licence already.
9. Watch the road and eyes on the road at all time :)
Also learn the up hill start driving with a parking break and without. Rear parking skills
I was on my green P plates and had only ever driven my parents automatic cars, but was very keen to learn manual. I had watched YouTube videos and played video games with manual cars. I went with my dad to look at a $1200 manual corolla about 300kms from home.
My dad test drove it and I paid for it. Dad decided that he was not keen to drive 300kms back home with no air conditioning and told me to drive it home myself.
I learned very quickly! This included just revving up the engine to 4000rpm and slowly letting the clutch out at the lights for fear of stalling! And a nervous merge onto the Hume highway.
If you already know the basics, it will only take a few hours just to get the hang of finding the friction point. I also just avoided hills for the whole time I had the car because the handbrake never worked.
Daytona USA, everyone first manual practice. Can find at any game arcade!
About to write this. Got in my first manual and it was no problem at all.
Problem is it's right hand shift. Think it's a lot more intuitive for right handed drivers.
Rental car if you already have a full licence.
bought a $400 manual ford festiva with 1 month rego left. learnt in 1 month. trashed it. then sold it for scraps for $150 to metal collectors.
who provided RWC? how much was that
If u buy it with registered still. It's alrdy got RWC
in Vic we dont need to get RWC tested yearly. so we generally need a new RWC to complete a sale. for example my old car went to a wrecker because I had been driving it in a condition it wouldn't have passed RWC for several years before I finally got rid of it.
^^^This!
Best way is to buy a cheap car and learn yourself on quiet streets. Cheaper than lessons, and rentals.
Its easy as, you could probably become pretty good within a week of driving.
very hard to find drivable cars that cheap with rego and rwc
Learnt on manual 11 years ago and since then been driving manual. In fact I struggle with auto cars because I'm used to engine braking so it's very awkward for me to drive an auto.
I drive a manual 1995 beaten up Toyota Celica with almost 300,000 klms on it and while the engine is still going strong, the body is just terrible so I'll most probably part it out and sell for scrap metal sometime next year. Located in Western Sydney and happy to give you a lesson.
Is that the one with the 7AFE?? They're bulletproof engines!!
I believe the 7A-FE is the 1.8L engine which wasn't available in AUS or was used in Corollas. Mine is 5S-FE 2.2L 4cyl (also used in 1996 Toyota Camry) which has a little more torque since bigger displacement in each cylinder. Because it's got more torque, it has more low end power which means I don't need to rev the engine. By not revving the engine, it will therefore last longer. I have no doubt the mechanics of the car can reach 400,000 klm but the body is just really bad. Not washed in over 2 years, bashed, scratched and bruised literally every panel (all from other people). Steering wheel, gear knob, interior are all very well designed and positioned.
I would suggest start by doing one driving lesson. For anyone with a basic idea manual transmission concepts this will get you a basic proficiency in going and stopping. You'll feel a huge boost in confidence just getting into a manual car and being guided correctly. This will also let you feel if a manual car is right for you. You will know after a 1 hour lesson. After this you can just go and buy your manual car, do a couple of car park practice sessions and you should be good to go.
It's not really about "changing gears." The most difficult part to learn is low speed manouvering such as starting, hill starting, reversing, parking situations, stop and start traffic. People who say it took them 'months' to master don't realise that 99% of driving time is either cruising along in high gear or changing gears at speed (which is easy). You can compress these 'months' into a couple of hours just by practising those low speed manouvers in an empty car park over and over.
Don't make the mistake of trying to learn the whole co-ordination all in one go. Do you learn a new swimming stroke by doing it all at once? No - first you start with kicking. Start in a car park by making the car move (at walking pace) from stop on a flat surface by only slowly but fully releasing the clutch into first gear without touching any other pedal. Repeat this drill a number of times. Then start trying to speed up the process by adding in a bit of accelerator to maintain revs. Repeat. Once you've got this try it a few more times but follow through with accelerating slowly to maybe 20km/hr. Once you have all this down then try again but shift to 2nd gear at a low speed. Now keep doing this and add in practice slowing and stopping from 2nd gear by letting the car coast/slow in gear until the engine is nearly at idle speed before clutch-in then completely stopping. Once you are confident with all that you can go practice these starting/stopping techniques on an empty side street pulling away from the kerb (doing the correct indication/check), then pulling back in to the kerb and stopping. After a few goes of that you can go looking around quiet side streets for some T-intersections and roundabouts. Come to a stop at them pretending that you are giving way to a car then pull away.
I paid about $100 (all up) for 2x 1 hour private lessons with a local instructor, I learnt everything I needed to drive a manual out of the dealership, then I continued learning by driving. (I was already capable of driving an auto.)
It's worth noting that dealerships will let you test drive cards and will generally tolerate your inexperienced driving as long as you seem like you're genuinely going to buy a car. (It might be a good idea to tell them before asking for a test drive though, and don't make it your first experience in a manual.)
manual car + stopping on a slope = nightmare for a beginner
So many bunouts and bunnyhops done in the first 2-3 weeks first driving manual while in peak hour traffic stopping on hills.
Newer manual cars hold the brake for you on slopes, but you lose a bit of control as a result.
I’m curious. My wife’s car has auto hill start hold on it and I think it’s the best invention added to cars in, well, forever. Didn’t have to teach my wife about using handbrake method. I have been driving for 30 years and done many a hill start and can not think of any loss of control and if anything, I feel it gives increased control over the car.
So, pray tell, what control am I losing as a result of having a hill start assist system…
I found that the hill start assist doesn't release the brake slowly like a handbrake hill start. You can release the handbrake slowly so that the clutch takes it up the load properly and you don't roll back.
I had a forester with this feature and on steep hill would still use the handbrake technique. While your foot was on the clutch the car would hold, when the clutch got to the release point the car sometimes rolled back if you didn't have enough revs to drive forward. In another car (can't remember which model), the hill hold feature would only hold for a few seconds which took some getting used to after a couple of roll backs.
All well and good, but what control am I “losing” by having hill start assist on the vehicle?
Of all the vehicles I have driven with it, it is seamless and the learning curve to use it took 2 goes, maybe 3.
That's disappointing to here; I remember being so pleased with myself after mastering hill starts; reverse hill starts/etc.
@pegaxs: The brake holds until the car moves forward (or for a few seconds), which is basically what you want 99% of the time, but if you're trying to accelerate (high RPM start) rapidly up a hill it's going to hold you back and spin out your tires forcing you to slide back and possibly stall.
Basically it's a ghost holding the footbrake for you, the loss of control is inherent in the assist.
It also just feels weird how it hugs onto hills with a slight gradient.
Occasionally I'll let my foot off the brake, misjudging the terrain as flat because of the lack of movement, then the car will begin moving after the delay, which can be unsafe. (I'm pretty conscious of this after the first time I did it.)
Basically I'd prefer a physical button that engaged the feature than a setting deep within the ui.
So, I am losing control 1% of the time and it’s “basically what I want 99% of the time.” Seems like an acceptable margin for error…
And your description of how it works and possibly causes issues doesn’t seem to reflect my experience with it in various vehicles. How could it possible cause your tyres to spin? If you want to accelerate up a hill from a standing start that hard, it isn’t the hill hold assist spinning your tyres, it’s the lead in your right foot. And hill hold assist is there to minimise the “slide back”. Kinda how it got it’s name…
I would say it feels more like a ghost holding the hand brake rather than the foot brake. It really feels little in difference than doing hill start without the park brake. That really fast, “get off the brake and get on the gas as you let out the clutch” method. Only you don’t have to be as fast off the brake now.
While I can see the ability to choose when to enable it, maybe car makers thought, well, it’s going to be on 99% of the time, so let’s just bury it deep down in the “UI”
@pegaxs: If you don't need to do it, you are effectively passing your control on to a computer and some sensors. You lose that control. Humans are far more adaptable than mainstream computers in managing complex tasks like driving.
Sure, an automatic system works most of the time, but when it doesn't it is handy to have skills that will overcome the problem.
You obviously lose control to roll back when starting uphill. I wonder why anyone would want to do that, but you still lose the control.
Do you recall how much you spent on the rental?