Car & Bicycle Accident. Who Is at Fault?

• 

  rover on 25/01/2019 - 13:20

  +13

  "There is also a law that cyclists overtaking on the left must give way to all turning cars" that does not mean a car can recklessly swerve in front of you.

  • 

    sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 13:26

    +2

    Here is a link to the law.

    https://www.qld.gov.au/transport/safety/rules/wheeled-device…

    So no, legally they couldn't recklessly swerve in front of you, but if they were indicating that they were going to turn, and a cyclist tried to pass them on the left, the car would not be at fault. Like I said, not sure if this also applies to a bike lane, since it is classed as a Special Lane and is the equivalent to say, a bus lane. If you passed a bus on the right and swung in front of it through a bus lane, I think most people would agree the car was at fault

• 

  thatonethere on 25/01/2019 - 13:22

  +1

  https://www.qld.gov.au/transport/safety/rules/road/give-way

  Pretty clear

• 

  jsb on 25/01/2019 - 13:24

  +2

  She is at fault. She didn't check her blind spot before turning. She has to give you way as you were in your lane and she is the one turning into your lane.

  • [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 15:47 Comment score below threshold.
    • 

      [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 15:52

      +5

      your post doesn't appear to take into account the speed at which a cyclist might be riding at. eg. 5 seconds at 40-50km/h is NOT enough 'time' even with well tuned rim brakes or disc brakes.

      stopping a bicycle at speed is like a train stopping, or b-double with full load. takes far longer than you think.

      your other comments about the car not magically being able to move is ridiculous. it is an offence to cause an obstruction to another vehicle eg. by stopping in their lane.

      this driver clearly didn't give a toss and i've been in a similar situation. got the usual excuses (SMIDSY despite hi-viz, misjudged your speed etc.)

      • 

        [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 15:58

        -8

        your post doesn't appear to take into account the speed at which a cyclist might be riding

        Fair point, I obviously do not ride push bikes, so let's double those times. Again, it is just a sliding scale used to make an example.

        your other comments about the car not magically being able to move is ridiculous. it is an offence to cause an obstruction to another vehicle eg. by stopping in their lane.

        So if a car takes a few seconds to climb over a gutter and into a driveway that's near a corner, the car can never safely get into the driveway because a cyclist has absolute right of way? Surely not.

        this driver clearly didn't give a toss

        Come on, that is surely speculation.

        • 

          [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 16:02

          +1

          @[Deactivated]:

          Come on, that is surely speculation.

          read below for a description of things said. in my experience the ones that cut you off/turn in front of you absolutely despise you just because you're on a bicycle. there are serious issues with mentally ill people and entitlement in australia in cars vs bikes. probably something you can only understand once you're a victim of it and the abuse that it entails.

          So if a car takes a few seconds to climb over a gutter and into a driveway that's near a corner, the car can never safely get into the driveway because a cyclist has absolute right of way? Surely not.

          if it takes a few seconds to climb over a gutter then it's not a safe time to be climbing over that gutter. it literally takes a few seconds to slow down and let the rider pass before turning.

          a few seconds of your life to avoid a collision and both parties to be on their way without ever having to cross paths with each other.

          • 

            [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 16:20

            @[Deactivated]:

            in my experience the ones that cut you off/turn in front of you absolutely despise you just because you're on a bicycle. there are serious issues with mentally ill people and entitlement in australia in cars vs bikes. probably something you can only understand once you're a victim of it and the abuse that it entails.

            The "you'll never understand" arguments aside, if and when drivers behave that way, it is terrible. That is malicious and it is the same as any malicious crime - no one is in support of this but some people will be assholes.

            if it takes a few seconds to climb over a gutter then it's not a safe time to be climbing over that gutter. it literally takes a few seconds to slow down and let the rider pass before turning.

            See the part where I say that the lane is close a corner. The cyclist may not be in line of sight as the cyclist has to turn a corner to see the car and vice versa.

            You've taken the complete opposite stance to the malicious driver, you're being a malicious cyclist and attempting to make the driver wrong in every instance.

            • 

              [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 16:28

              +2

              @[Deactivated]: it's not even malicious or the same as any malicious 'crime'. honestly you're clutching at straws to dramatise your comments that clearly try to put the blame on the cyclist where there shouldn't be any. it's clear from your initial post.

              it's always apparent in online discussions when and where people refuse to be impartial.

              the turning a corner argument you have is also BS. you are just trying to put the minor inconveniences of a driver, in a metal cage that is capable of murder over a vulnerable road user that has done nothing wrong and can really do no wrong in that situation except come to a complete stop (if they can - in this case they couldn't) to allow the 'rego paying' road user right of way (despite laws against it).

              probably best if you take your arguments back to the dashcam facebook groups that constantly complain about cyclists as if they murdered and raped a child just by existing on the road.

              • 

                [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 17:15

                @[Deactivated]:

                it's not even malicious

                You don't even know the entire scenario and you've labelled the driver as someone who "couldn't give a toss" and…

                in my experience the ones that cut you off/turn in front of you absolutely despise you just because you're on a bicycle. there are serious issues with mentally ill people and entitlement in australia in cars vs bikes. probably something you can only understand once you're a victim of it and the abuse that it entails.

                …that drivers that cut you off, regardless of their intent, despises you.

                A driver doesn't have a chance with you regardless of the circumstance.

                • 

                  [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 17:16

                  +1

                  @[Deactivated]: it's called experience. get some.

    • 

      sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 17:05

      +1

      Your points are valid. As I state in my OP, she didn't merge into the bike lane, she just did a 90-degree turn across it.

      I would also argue that if you are traveling slower than the vehicle in the lane that you are moving into then that would significantly reduce the time they have to stop. I was traveling 30km/h and they entered my lane at 10km/h and continuing to slow down to almost zero, then that is significantly different than if they moved in front of me doing the same speed and gradually slowed down.

      • 

        [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 17:08

        -4

        Thanks for being pliable to my points.

        I do not know the exact circumstances of the collision, I was simply trying to edify those willing to see a different perspective that the driver isn't automatically at fault.

        Many cyclist are part of a very toxic culture where they view drivers as the enemy and equate carelessness to intent to kill, and where cyclist can do no wrong.

        I'm glad you're not one of those.

        • 

          [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 17:19

          +2

          @[Deactivated]:

          Many cyclist are part of a very toxic culture where they view drivers as the enemy and equate carelessness to intent to kill, and where cyclist can do no wrong.

          ahahahhaha. and motorists aren't part of a toxic culture?

          you're showing your true colours here.

          how many people do motorists kill and seriously injure each and every year, including themselves?

          how many people do cyclists kill and seriously injure each and every year where they are at fault? NONE

        • 

          sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 18:01

          +2

          @[Deactivated]: I mean, it's not "bikes" or "cars" that are the problem, it's the people in control of them. If you think that cyclists are the sole problem then I'm not sure I can agree. I ride purely for commuting purposes, I am not a avid cyclist who goes out in group rides or anything. Just a guy who jumps on the bike to get to work.

          I can tell you that drivers can be completely reckless around me, overtaking in dangerous situations just to save 5-10 seconds. I don't ride anywhere that does not have plenty of room for both a bike and a car, but a number of drivers are terrible at judging the size of the car and end up getting way too close to me when trying to pass. I am fully aware how bad cyclists can be as well, I have morons who go flying around blind corners on bike paths and end up almost wiping out trying to avoid me because they went way onto the wrong side of the path.

          There is a toxic culture in both car circles and cycling circles. Grouping everyone by their mode of transport is stupid.

          • 

            [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 18:07

            @sheamas88: I am not anti-cyclist and have never insinuated cyclists are the problem. I simply stated cyclists tend to band together as it is a hobby to many cyclist, whereas drivers are just there for the convenience. No culture involved so no group to argue either way.

            Not all cyclists are bad nor part of the toxic culture. Not all drivers are bad nor are all bad drivers malicious.

            • 

              [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 20:10

              +1

              @[Deactivated]:

              I simply stated cyclists tend to band together as it is a hobby to many cyclist, whereas drivers are just there for the convenience. No culture involved so no group to argue either way.

              and i suppose that's why there are countless facebook groups and comments on youtube videos etc. of people 'banding together' against all forms of cycling with such vitriol that encourages deliberate careless manoeuvres and dangerous driving such as what the op encountered, not to mention widespread encouragement for physical violence (and many actual incidents of such violence that regularly pops up in the news)

              but of course when it's a group that you don't like, the arguments are reversed despite no evidence to show otherwise.

              it's called narcissistic projection and i think it's what you are displaying in your comments.

              No culture involved so no group to argue either way

              no culture… ever heard of car clubs? 4wd clubs? motorcycle meets? group rides?

              are you delusional or something?

              • 

                [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 21:07

                @[Deactivated]:

                and i suppose that's why there are countless facebook groups and comments on youtube videos etc. of people 'banding together' against all forms of cycling with such vitriol that encourages deliberate careless manoeuvres and dangerous driving such as what the op encountered

                And there are terrorist encouraging violence, what's your point?

                but of course when it's a group that you don't like, the arguments are reversed despite no evidence to show otherwise.

                I did show evidence above to everything I claimed, ie you being malicious. You're bent on calling out drivers, and you've made it very clear.

                no culture… ever heard of car clubs? 4wd clubs? motorcycle meets? group rides?

                And how many of these have regular postings about drivers vs cyclists? To say cycling forums have the proportionate amount is to be disingenuous.

                I'm just going to ignore you because you've demonstrated you're interested in being a victim and no one else can understand. You've created an exclusive club of people who can win in your book.

                it's called experience. get some.

                Good luck.

                • 

                  [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 21:51

                  +2

                  @[Deactivated]:

                  And there are terrorist encouraging violence, what's your point?

                  think the world likes terrorists?

                  I did show evidence above to everything I claimed

                  evidence? what evidence? just accusations and blatant inflammation.

                  You're bent on calling out drivers, and you've made it very clear.

                  so have the 82 other people that voted with me

                  And how many of these have regular postings about drivers vs cyclists?

                  i can't monitor all the conversations at once at coffee stops but i can attest to the constant aggressive attitudes and verbal abuse shown by motorcyclists and drivers even when doing absolutely nothing wrong or when for some reason my presence on the road gets in the way of their 'joy ride'.

                  I'm just going to ignore you because you've demonstrated you're interested in being a victim and no one else can understand. You've created an exclusive club of people who can win in your book.

                  that's right, take your toys and go home. you've literally argued with weak points and now accuse me of playing the victim (more narcissistic projection here).

                  there's no club moron, just people that want to get from A to B safely home to their families until some f*khead decides they're not going to let that happen because it inconveniences them by mere seconds.

    • 

      jsb on 25/01/2019 - 19:12

      +1

      "When drivers changing lane are involved in a collision, it would it depend on timing. If the car has completed a lane change demonstrable by damage directly from rear, the car behind is at fault but if the lane change is incomplete and consistent with damage off centre and biased to a corner, the merging car is at fault.

      Similarly, this applies to a cyclist crashing into a turning car. If the car is already occupying the cyclist's lane, the car cannot magically move. The reason for the car being stopped across the cyclist lane is irrelevant. The car was on the lane first."

      Prob. you did not read the description. The driver here did not change the lane, but crossed bike lane to enter driveway prob. reducing the speed while doing so.
      Assuming OP did not speed up at that time (He infact applied breaks) and still hit the car, means it was unsafe turn by the driver.

      • 

        [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 19:22

        See Rover's source checked comment.

        There is also a law that cyclists overtaking on the left must give way to all turning cars"

        The car isn't automatically at fault because it is hit by the bike. Hitting the brakes or speeding up is irrelevant.

        • 

          jsb on 25/01/2019 - 23:58

          +1

          @[Deactivated]: Hitting the breaks or speeding up is irrelevant? Are you high?
          So you mean to say, you can simply cross the bike lane without giving any safe distance to oncoming bikes in the bike lane with utter disregard to their safety.

          Please check
          https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/safety-and-road-rules/road-r…

          Text from above link: You must give way to cyclists already in the bicycle lane.

          • 

            [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 07:48

            @jsb:

            So you mean to say, you can simply cross the bike lane without giving any safe distance to oncoming bikes in the bike lane with utter disregard to their safety.

            At no point did I say that. Please reference a single comment I made that says that.

            I am saying that if a car is already in a situation where a bike hits the side of a car, whether you claim you accelerated into the car or brake approaching the car, objectively, you're hitting the car because it is side on damage. Because a car is hit by a cyclist, it is not automatically the driver's fault. (Conversely, it doesn't make the automatically the cyclist's fault but majority of the comments are making post hoc ergo propter hoc arguments).

            I have no idea how you extrapolated "disregard for safety".

    • 

      terrys on 26/01/2019 - 11:34

      As it says in the link thatonethere gave:

      "Giving way when entering or leaving a road

      When you are entering or leaving a road from private property or a driveway, you must give way to pedestrians or bicycle riders on the footpath or road."

      No ambiguity whatsoever.

    • 

      snook on 26/01/2019 - 15:25

      +1

      I feel like you're on drugs.

      The law says that you have to give way to the cyclist already in the lane. She didn't.

      An online study found that most people need 1.5 to 3 seconds to react and not all are the same. And that's 'react', that's NOT ability to stop.

      I have recently been involved in a similar situation in NSW where I hit the back end of a car that turned in front of me. He didn't give way. I had less than a second to react. The driver is charged with Neg driving causing GBH. Will lose licence for 12 months and get at least a $3000 fine. This is how the law works.

      • 

        [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 15:33

        The car didn't merge into the lane, it overtook the bike and made a turn up ahead. Potentially, the car didn't allow enough time for the bike to brake which resulted in a collision where the bike "T-boned" the tail end of the car.

        Either way, I'm not saying the cyclist is automatically and fault, nor the car. The discussion is very one sided for the cyclist, I was merely suggesting it is not automatically the cars fault based in the picture. In fact, I may even think the driver is at fault but what I think regarding this case is irrelevant.

        An online study found that most people need 1.5 to 3 seconds to react

        If someone takes 3 seconds to react, they shouldn't be on the road, bike or car.

        I feel like you're on drugs.

        I wish. Btw, there's no need to disparage someone before making your points.

        • 

          snook on 26/01/2019 - 15:50

          +2

          @[Deactivated]: there's disparaging and then there's plain crazy. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt.

          No where did i say anything about merge. The driver crossed the path of a cyclist, which the driver, by written, legislated law, had to give way to. The driver is 100% at fault.

          • 

            [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 19:57

            @snook:

            The driver crossed the path of a cyclist, which the driver, by written, legislated law, had to give way to. The driver is 100% at fault.

            I agree to all that and since I have decided to retire from being devil's advocate, I do think the driver is at fault. If you read all my comments in this post, I never once mentioned the cyclist is at fault but only ever did say the cyclist hit the driver. The driver being involved doesn't mean they're instantly to blame. The cyclist hitting the car doesn't mean the cyclist is instantly to blame.

            I did see a version of this where I believe the driver is not at fault. Ie. Cyclist is far away enough and obstructed line of sight (branches and bends) and hits car where the driver couldn't have known where the cyclist was - not applicable in this case since the driver overtook and I'm speculating seriously misjudged the cyclist's speed. Just one example that comes to mind.

      • 

        whooah1979 on 26/01/2019 - 18:19

        +1

        The driver is charged with Neg driving causing GBH. Will lose licence for 12 months and get at least a $3000 fine. This is how the law works.

        Well done.

    • 

      ankor on 27/01/2019 - 10:50

      Good luck trying to prove every one of those assumptions at court. You'd get wrecked.

• 

  HighAndDry on 25/01/2019 - 13:26

  +2

  Yeah pretty clear she turned across your lane while you were going straight.

• 

  bargainhunter87 on 25/01/2019 - 13:28

  Driver at fault.

• 

  blitz on 25/01/2019 - 13:33

  The driver is at fault. They cut into your lane, when they should have given way to you.

• 

  elgrande on 25/01/2019 - 13:34

  +16

  Thanks for the ms paint.

  • 

    sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 14:53

    +21

    Had to go out of my way for you guys, since I don't even own a copy of Windows

• 

  trustnoone on 25/01/2019 - 13:34

  +2

  Shes at fault pretty sure, I know a friend who did a similar thing during a driving test (no crash though) instead of waiting, they turned left as they saw the bike slowing down. But pretty sure driver is supposed to let you past first. Anyways my friend failed for not giving way to the bike rider (SA).

• 

  tsunamisurfer on 25/01/2019 - 13:34

  +4

  Hopefully your bike is not a Masertti and her car a uninsured Carolla.

• 

  wannagrababargain on 25/01/2019 - 13:43

  +10

  What the driver did was dangerous and stupid. If you are approaching a cyclist and you need to turn imminently just turn in left behind the cyclist, no point in speeding up just to overtake then cut off a cyclist for 2 seconds advantage.

  Glad you are ok but ride more defensively man. Forget the helmet cam and open your own eyes to the behaviour of the cars around you. As a cyclist myself if a car was indicating next to me I would already be on the brakes. I have accumulated so many near misses that it's scary how normal this type of thing has become for me.

  • 

    ShannonN on 25/01/2019 - 13:46

    -1

    This

  • 

    sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 13:53

    +7

    Well in this situation it didn't even save them any time, because we both arrived at the drive-way at the same time.

    Normally I am ready for cars to be turning in front of me, but 99% of the time that would be at an intersection, not a drive-way. The road I was on literally has no left-hand turns for intersections and has only houses along it, so I am not expecting a car to turn left along that stretch. If this happened at an intersection then I would 100% agree I could have been more careful. If I have to slow down for every driveway I pass, then I may as well walk to work, rather than ride.

    If I weren't riding defensively then I would have hit the car much harder, in fact, I didn't even come off my bike, the scratch is from by arm getting between the handlebar and the car. Defensive riding can only get you so far, especially when the vehicle comes from behind. But you are right, in the end the cyclist needs to take their safety into their own hands

• 

  CMH on 25/01/2019 - 13:59

  +2

  Just wait for her insurance to contact you, and send them your helmet cam footage.

  They should leave you alone after that.

• 

  Caped Baldy on 25/01/2019 - 14:19

  +2

  As just about everyone else has said the driver is at fault. Did you by chance get her on camera saying she had no license on her? Fairly sure it's illegal in all states.

  • 

    sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 14:38

    +9

    Yes the whole conversation was with her would have been rather amusing if she hadn't just hit me with her car. Wish I could show the video but will probably refrain until any insurance matters are resolved.

    During the conversation she:
    - Blamed the pedestrian that was walking on the footpath. That was why she had to brake hard to make the turn, because there was a pedestrian walking across the driveway
    - Admitted to driving without her license.
    - Accused me of only having a helmet camera to "get people"
    - Bringing up her past altercations with other cyclists as a reason she drives so carefully around them :\
    - Brought up how she was "almost killed" because of a cyclist in the past

    To be fair she did seem rather concerned if was OK. Just wish she was more concerned before she hit me

    • 

      Caped Baldy on 25/01/2019 - 15:16

      +1

      Ahhh, I'm glad you're okay too OP. She seems like the type where everything that goes wrong is someone else's fault and never her own.

    • 

      [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 15:58

      +4

      you've had a run in with a rotten sort of human being. i've had similar (including deliberate dooring attempts, and a same situation as what you describe)

      seriously upload the footage so the world can see it.

      i'll pm you a cycling forum where to post it where you will get more support and zero cyclist haters that pop out of the woodwork every now and then here.

      i would seriously get your bike checked before resolving the situation with her/her insurance. checked the frame/fork for cracks? sometimes they don't manifest until later. ultrasound frame inspection from a bike shop is necessary and costly (to her).

      same with wheel truing and examination (spokes, nipples, rim cracks etc.)

      do all of the above once you have a ruling of some sort and claim it from her. especially with your video etc.

      make her pay.

      honestly i'm surprised she didn't mention that this is somehow your fault because you don't pay rego.

      oh and report her to the police for driving without a licence. i wouldn't even think twice about this.

      • 

        sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 16:50

        Good points about the damage, I'll be sure to get it checked

        • 

          [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 17:04

          @sheamas88: i'd look into discussing it with her insurance first otherwise you might end up chasing it in small claims court where she'll never pay.

          probably wouldn't bother unless you're guaranteed to get that money back for the analysis.

          head over to a cycling forum to ask about this kind of thing. a popular one is BNA www.bicycles.net.au

          • 

            sheamas88 on 25/01/2019 - 17:08

            @[Deactivated]: Thanks, yes I definitely won't be spending money out of my own pocket, I would get the money from them first in that scenario

      • 

        txb on 26/01/2019 - 16:37

        +1

        You can drive without your licence.

        https://www.qld.gov.au/transport/licensing/driver-licensing/…

        "if you hold an open licence and are driving a car or riding a motorcycle, you may be given 48 hours to present your licence at a police station."

        unless she dosent have a licence AT all? then yeah , agree

    • 

      ankor on 27/01/2019 - 10:52

      A crazy driver.. get a police report done up and see if they want to file charges.

• 

  87percent on 25/01/2019 - 14:50

  what's the bet she either doesn't have insurance OR doesn't have a valid license?

• 

  mbck on 25/01/2019 - 14:54

  and she has no valid licence…lol

• 

  Levathian on 25/01/2019 - 15:24

  -1

  Yup 100% drivers fault surprisingly

• 

  trilby on 25/01/2019 - 15:38

  +1

  Can't see how this is different from a car turning from and outside lane into a driveway and swiping a car on the inside lane or knocking over a pedestrian on the footpath when turning into your driveway.

• 

  inasero on 25/01/2019 - 15:55

  -1

  the driver is at fault
  are you sure your bike has no damage? you know alot of bikes can have damage which isn't visible to the naked eye (particularly carbon fibre), and you could easily make a claim in this case

• 

  Seraphin7 on 25/01/2019 - 15:55

  +3

  she didn't have her license on her

  Dead giveaway that this will turn into the proverbial sh*tfight and an indication that you should have called the police immediately.

• 

  picklewizard on 25/01/2019 - 16:15

  she didn't have her license on her, I only got her name and phone number

  Yes she did.

• 

  whooah1979 on 25/01/2019 - 16:48

  +1

  no-one is seriously hurt

  It sounds like you were injured. The right thing to do was to call the local LAC and report the event.

  • 

    RockyRaccoon on 25/01/2019 - 17:05

    Ring them now and report the incident. She could do the same and then it wouldnt look good for you (within 24hrs of accident is ok)

    • 

      whooah1979 on 25/01/2019 - 17:19

      Make a copy of the recording. Go the LAC where this happened and file an incident report. Give the officer the original recording as evidence.

• 

  whooah1979 on 25/01/2019 - 17:12

  +1

  Basic road rules for entering adjacent land.

  http://www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/qld/cons…
  TRANSPORT OPERATIONS (ROAD USE MANAGEMENT—ROAD RULES) REGULATION 2009 - REG 75
  Giving way when entering a road-related area or adjacent land from a road
  75 Giving way when entering a road-related area or adjacent land from a road

  (1) A driver entering a road-related area or adjacent land from a place on a road without traffic lights or a stop sign, stop line, give way sign or give way line must give way to—

  (a) any pedestrian on the road; and

  (b) any vehicle or pedestrian on any road-related area that the driver crosses or enters; and

  (c) if the driver is turning right from the road—any oncoming vehicle on the road that is going straight ahead or turning left; and

  (d) if the road the driver is leaving ends at a T-intersection opposite the road-related area or adjacent land and the driver is crossing the continuing road—any vehicle on the continuing road.

  Penalty: Maximum penalty—20 penalty units.

• 

  WreckTangle on 25/01/2019 - 17:28

  +8

  Upload the video!

• 

  askme69 on 25/01/2019 - 19:18

  +1

  Did you get the rego? If not message and get it, also get her licence number.

  Go to the Police and show the footage and get the officer's opinion. Get them to put it in writing.

  Then call the driver and say the Police have viewed the footage and she was at fault. Send her an invoice/claim for a new bike or repairs.

  Otherwise it's a he said/she said and her insurance will chase you.

  • 

    [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 20:14

    +1

    yes this is important

    YOU NEED A POLICE REPORT

    i made this mistake once but fortunately didn't have any damage because it was really really low speed when i fell as i managed to brake to a virtual standstill when the car blatantly failed to give way (i had video as well, would make for great viewing but altogether pointless)

    but i'm sure "tshow" would somehow find me at fault for that too

  • 

    [Deactivated] on 25/01/2019 - 22:20

    There is no damage to my bike…

• 

  backpaqer on 26/01/2019 - 08:03

  Edit: duplicated post

• 

  backpaqer on 26/01/2019 - 08:07

  -2

  The cyclists overtaking on left law only applies where there isn't a bike lane. Where there is a bike lane, lane changing laws apply (need to do so safely and where it allows other road users the chance to react. Bicycle brakes are not usually great at pulling up fast and also can lead to instability and crashes - and in Victoria you can claim tac cover even if you didn't impact with a car but one caused you to fall off your bicycle.

  … But if you saw the indicator and had time to stop and thought she'd wait for you… Although she's still at fault, you need to improve your road skills. (I'm a cyclist that commutes 20km each way to work each day… Car drivers are out to get you)

• 

  kickling on 26/01/2019 - 09:00

  +2

  This also happened to me. I sustained injuries too.

  Driver is at fault.

  A bike lane is still a laneway. The driver did not give way to traffic when changing or crossing.

• 

  [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 10:20

  As a result of the accident her car was damaged. Depending on the State you need to report this ASAP and within 24 hrs.

• 

  dddddog on 26/01/2019 - 11:41

  +3

  This EXACT thing happened to me on Chapel St in Melbourne.

  It was a wet day, I was riding cautiously up Chapel St. A Mercedes suddenly swerved into the cycle lane because someone was turning right. I braked as soon as I could but ended up going into the back of the Mercedes.

  My hand brake punctured her plastic back bumper.

  I believed I was totally innocent and handed over the driver my details, thinking I would never hear anything of it again.. A month later I got a bill from an insurance company for $7,675!

  So, after 6 months of letters, photographs and personal statements, the insurance company was decided the driver was at fault. Caused a lot of stress and anxiety to me. I hope she'd fronted that 7k bill by herself and drives more responsibly.

  • 

    ankor on 27/01/2019 - 10:55

    The excess on her car accident should also cover whatever property damage you've suffered from the accident. E.g. your own bike repairs, as well as investigations such as ultrasounds and whatnot to see if your bicycle is munted.

    But you need to contact that insurer and say you want to make that claim for damages against their insurance.

• 

  minklet on 26/01/2019 - 12:33

  Can I just say that I'm pleasantly surprised that logic prevailed in this thread. Seen so many occasions where ozbargain will immediately side against the cyclist and this makes me feel less jaded.

  OP file a police report first, now.

• 

  DarkOz on 26/01/2019 - 12:44

  +2

  Driver is definitely at fault. That's dangerous/reckless driving and the driver should be charged accordingly.

  Imagine if you are jogging on the foot path and the car overtakes you and left-hooks into the driveway. There is every chance that the car could run you over.

• 

  Cletus vandamme on 26/01/2019 - 13:42

  +2

  Definately driver. The amount of people that dont pay attention on the roads amazes me.

• 

  Meowcat on 26/01/2019 - 14:40

  -1

  Contact bicycle qld

• 

  hasher22 on 26/01/2019 - 15:25

  Its obviously the cars fault.

  Also, when she was driving, and she needed to turn left, didn't she even see you infront of her?

  Stupid driver

• 

  Levathian on 26/01/2019 - 15:34

  OP have you made a police report yet?

• 

  highdealer on 26/01/2019 - 15:56

  +1

  Dash Cam Owner Australia

  Please, pretty please submit your video to them. I know your video isn't from a dash cam but helmet cam is close enough.

  Also, next time if you are ever involved in an accident with someone and they said they don't have their driver license with them, just call the police.

  • 

    [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 17:30

    +3

    i wouldn't submit any cycling footage to those youtube channels and facebook channels typically encourage a barrage of hatred towards cyclists even when the rider has done no wrong.

    they are also profiteering off commissions from affiliate links which they don't disclose and adsense revenue.

    you're effectively giving money to a bunch of tools.

• 

  bobs burgers on 26/01/2019 - 16:40

  +1

  The cyclist is at fault here clearly.
  Mentioned does not even have Windows then claims drawing is mspaint.

  I suspect OP used gimp and claimed the drawing was mspaint.
  OP is not trustworthy after declaring falsely using mspsint while despises Windows.

  You never know who you can trust these days on the internet.

  :p

  • 

    Bargain80 on 01/02/2019 - 15:46

    not to mention that the cyclist was his/her friend.

• 

  [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 17:00

  We need new licensing system with comprehensive tests and education. Both for new drivers and riders who ride on shared roads.

  Easy :)

• 

  Chris Topher on 26/01/2019 - 17:21

  No mention of direction indicators used by the car driver… how far in front of you did it brake and start to turn?

  Is it a typical impatient driver maneuver, who couldn't slow behind until you passed where she wanted to turn? I couldn't even guess at how many times that a car that I've been overtaken by and then immediately turned left causing me to brake heavily to avoid hitting them.

  Straight out impatient and dangerous driving.

• 

  andyhui01 on 26/01/2019 - 17:52

  +2

  Driver at fault.

  But you did say that the indicator was on for 4 seconds before she turned. Cyclist and Motorcylisf need to understand this though, it doesn’t matter who is at fault when you have a sheet over you or in the ER.

  Next time just get on the brake, let them do whatever illegal stupid move they need to do and move on with life.

  Be selfish on the road, these drivers will eventually hit and seriously injure/kill someone on a bike, there isn’t much you can do about it except to make sure it isn’t you.

• 

  Conka on 26/01/2019 - 20:16

  Post the video! And let the court (ie ozb) decide!

  • 

    [Deactivated] on 26/01/2019 - 22:44

    great idea for a new username - judgedredd

    judge jury and executioner all in one!

• 

  ledifni on 26/01/2019 - 23:26

  +1

  Please try to share the video to insurance guys and police officers, then ask them the same question.

• 

  kaleidoscope on 27/01/2019 - 08:12

  from what you described she’s at fault. Before merging motorists must give way to cyclists.

• 

  SpotTheOzzie on 27/01/2019 - 08:44

  Upload the footage…

• 

  chinawa111 on 27/01/2019 - 11:35

  Check mirror before turning… Ut cutting someones lane.

• 

  [Deactivated] on 27/01/2019 - 13:57

  +1

  The people are dumb
  The cases are dumb
  Welcome to ozbargain

  • 

    solidussnake on 27/01/2019 - 14:55

    😂🤣

• 

  [Deactivated] on 27/01/2019 - 22:06

  Kind of similar event happened last night. No Collison, but kind of close.
  Rider was riding in dark clothing, dark coloured bike, no lights on at all so he essentially came out of nowhere at me because it was so dark, I was turning into my driveway on opposite side of road, cyclist coming from opposite direction, riding in dark in middle of the road (but on correct side for his direction travelling, on the left) .
  When he popped up out of the dark out of nowhere, I braked immediately, then he kind of zig zagged a bit then went around me.
  I was particularly annoyed because he had a childseat and small child in back of his bike, riding on pitch black road, without any sort of light, and there was a sealed footpath there he could have been riding on.

  Do bicycle riders have to have lights on when riding in middle of road in darkness?? Seems dangerous not to have some kind of light on, especially with small child on bike. I'm thinking he was probably drunk or on drugs, such a stupid thing to do with child on bike, especially when there was footpath there he could be riding on instead.

  • 

    kickling on 28/01/2019 - 08:28

    +1

    Yes. It is illegal to ride during certain times of the day (according to light conditions) without having at least a rear light (must be red and bright enough) and depending on which State you're in, you may also need a front light.

    NSW says :

    259 Riding at night

    The rider of a bicycle must not ride at night, or in hazardous weather conditions causing reduced visibility, unless the bicycle, or the rider, displays:

    (a) a flashing or steady white light that is clearly visible for at least 200 metres from the front of the bicycle, and

    (b) a flashing or steady red light that is clearly visible for at least 200 metres from the rear of the bicycle, and

    (c) a red reflector that is clearly visible for at least 50 metres from the rear of the bicycle when light is projected onto it by a vehicle’s headlight on low-beam.

    Maximum penalty: 20 penalty units

    • 

      [Deactivated] on 28/01/2019 - 13:06

      Thanks for the info.
      It was NSW. So should have had front and rear light.
      Wouldn't have bothered me, so much, if was just the druggie/drunk riding round by himself like that and risking his own safety. Was the fact that he was putting the innocent small child at risk that bothered me much more so.

  • 

    [Deactivated] on 28/01/2019 - 09:57

    how dark was it really though? no street lights? no ambient lighting from your headlights? sounds like another whinge.

    i remember cycling in asia, the kids have ZERO lights and ZERO reflectors and in complete pitch black darkness and cars never had a problem seeing them

    it is definitely an 'offence' to not have appropriate lights, but sometimes batteries go dead mid ride etc. i've been caught out sometimes like that so i just head for back streets and ride slower/more carefully.

    oh and yesterday i had a driver come up from behind and turn in front of me (i was riding on a prescribed bikeway and had green). i had to brake to avoid collision just like the thread describes.

    the main problem isn't riders without lights or helmets.

    • 

      [Deactivated] on 28/01/2019 - 13:02

      the main problem isn't riders without lights or helmets.

      So you think riding without helmet is fine too..

      how dark was it really though? no street lights?

      Pitch black, no street lighting at my house. He may have come round corner, I'm not sure, as he appeared out of nowhere, ie I had no way of seeing him, until when I turned towards my driveway and headlights were on him then, then I could have sped up to get out of his way faster, but this was not an option because I always stop just before ny driveway, due to the footpath being there, so I need to stop in case of pedestrians or bike riders using the path, I stop and give way, then proceed carefully (my van parked out front obstructs view of footpath traffic somewhat)

      • 

        [Deactivated] on 28/01/2019 - 13:25

        So you think riding without helmet is fine too..

        i (and many others) don't agree with mandatory helmet laws. it's a major barrier to casual slow speed commuting cycling and the countries (most of them) that don't have such laws but proper segregated cycling infrastructure (and respect to share the road where such infrastructure doesn't exist) have a much higher proportion of the population cycling for short distance travel. the health benefits, improvement on traffic congestion and billions saved are evidence enough.

        i don't necessarily dispute your version of events, but as i said, unless you've got issues with your eyes even wannabe ninja riders dressed in black are still somewhat visible in most cases.

        if you live on/near a corner, it's possible a rider in hi-viz road cyclist coming around that corner at 30km/h (like many cars do) would still have caused you to brake suddenly.

        that said, i've been in countless situations where despite proper lighting i've still been cut off/failed to give way in the same kind of situation you describe.

        never seems to generate as much interest though. i wonder why.

  • 

    alee112 on 04/02/2019 - 13:05

    +1

    Guy should've had lights. Even if you had hit him, I would presume that he would be at fault, or at least partially to blame.
    The footpath issue is irrelevant. Most cyclists I know (including myself) would never ride on the footpath unless we absolutely need to, mainly due to the fact that a car could pull out of the driveway suddenly or a person would walk out suddenly. Also, footpaths tend to have a lot of bumps and cracks, which are not good if youre travelling at 30kph