Private Car Sale - Bank Transfer - What Can Go Wrong?

bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 16:08
Last edited 14/06/2020 - 14:22

Dear Ozbargain

Selling my car over the weekend. Priced at (13k). The buyer has mentioned he has no access to cash as the banks are closed (Sat pm). Pick up is on Sunday. He has said he will do a bank transfer in front of me at the time of pick up. I have asked for cash still.

What can go wrong here?
Is it worth seeing the car drive off and the cash is in transit?

Any other work around? New tech for transfer this amount (pay ID)?
Can the banks up the limit temporarily to access that much cash from atm ?

Any words of wisdom/advice?

Thanks in advance.

EDIT:
Thanks to everyone for sharing their ideas and thoughts and setting my mind straight. Appreciate it. Hopefully it will be straightforward from here.

Points taken from the helpers below;
- Cash transaction (King of all other options).
- No bank transfer especially during a non-business day as the transaction can be cancelled. It can also be faked to a certain extent.
- Bank transfer if the buyer is genuine and the funds have cleared to seller account before picking up car. Move the funds to a different account just for a peace of mind (I guess).
- Do the transaction on a business day if there is no access to banks (cash/cheque). Bank cheques can also be cancelled so be wary of this and make sure the funds clear.
- Go to bank for transfer of funds if necessary and have witnesses.
- A bill of sale signed and witnessed is legally enforceable. So get something in writing and also get it witnessed an example:
https://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/-/media/files/formsandpublic…

For interest:
Buyer arrived with cash on Sunday. Few good things learnt. Thanks y'all.

Automotive

Comments

    • dcep on 13/06/2020 - 19:09

      10k cash limit is business transaction

      • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 21:06

        You mean via online means? As in, its not possible to transfer anything over 10k via a transaction?

        • dcep on 13/06/2020 - 22:16

          10k limit is on physical cash money for business transaction, excluding private sales

          fyi, i was replying to the post above regarding 10k legality

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 20:29

      OH right I see. This guy seems very legit and yea sometimes its easy to trust, but I wanted some opinion. On the day at the time I might actually end up doing this. But these comments from the community has helped me straight up my thinking.

      I will take that cash and buy my next car, so its all good I guess. I think I can fend off the mugging to a certain extent but seeing my car driving off and then never seeing the $13k would be pretty helpless.

    • pizzaking on 17/06/2020 - 12:36

      If someone scams you and sends money from an account they don't own you can lose all the money, the car and access to your own account. Many banks allow you to change the name of the sender so not sure how you could tell. Mainly an issue for online transactions I guess.

      • inherentchoice on 17/06/2020 - 17:57

        As long as you have the name and address, you still have legal recourse.

  • Ocker on 13/06/2020 - 19:04
    +1

    Save yourself all of the anxiety and simply tell the buyer you want cash on Monday. If the buyer is genuine then it will be done, if the buyer baulks then run away from the deal.

    • holdenmg on 13/06/2020 - 19:05
      +1

      Or drive away, whichever.

  • iforgotmysocks on 13/06/2020 - 20:03
    +1

    Note PayID might be held for 24 hours given the size of the transaction.

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 20:31

      I've got set up PayID on my ANZ account but havent used it before and so yea I am not sure how it will go at the time. And also given the size of the transaction.

  • abear on 13/06/2020 - 20:39
    +3

    Just bought a car last weekend.Paid with Osko, the transfer was instant and I hopped in and drove away.Easy, instant and everyone was happy.No need to wait for cash or bank cheques.

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 20:42

      That's nice to hear. Just looked up and it links to PayID. Was there any limits?
      How did you pay the seller. Did you send from you bank account details? Were you next to him?
      Anymore details pls?

      • R-Man on 14/06/2020 - 17:16
        +1

        PayID won't work for $13k, think the limit is $2000?

        Also I dunno about instant, I sold a phone and the $800 osko payment was held for exactly 24 hours. I think it's due to transfer to a new person from the buyer, but don't understand why @abear didn't have this problem.

    • Toph Beifong on 14/06/2020 - 18:28

      For many banks the Osko Payment limit is 1k except for NAB which is $20k.

  • abear on 13/06/2020 - 20:48
    +1

    You would have to check your bank for limits. My sale was 9500 which went straight through.The seller was beside me,confirmed his bank details.It went straight from my bank account to his.He confirmed the deposit ,said thanks and I drove away.

  • coolc on 13/06/2020 - 20:58
    +2

    cash cash cash mate.
    Gobto bank with him and get cash then keys :)

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 21:01

      Ok mate. Cash !!! I will drill this into my head and be ready. 👍🏼

  • Banana313 on 13/06/2020 - 21:08
    -3

    I would suggest you wait cash.

    Any PayID transcations will not be instant, it'll be held for 24 hours to which the seller has the freedom of cancelling and returning the money into their bank account. Same goes with BSB and account number, they have the option to cancel anytime until the nexst business day starts (Monday). The funds will certainly not hit your account same day regardless of banking institution.

    Source: Big 4 bank employee.

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 21:09

      Woa this is a good one and I like the source. Thanks. If you don't mind might even say one of my mate from the big 4 has said so… :)

      • Banana313 on 13/06/2020 - 21:12

        I've encountered far too many people in anxious fits after they've handed the keys over and wondered if the money is going to arrive. Give yourself piece of mind and take cash or bank cheque

    • Amaris on 13/06/2020 - 21:27
      +3

      Don’t think the bit about 24hr cancellation is true.

    • aussie bargain on 14/06/2020 - 00:30

      Technically not correct. PayId is instant, but both sending and receiving banks may put in some brakes for fraud check purposes. 24 hours seem long, but that's not suprising and really bank dependent.

      As for cancellations, ANY credit hitting your account cannot be simply reversed without authorisation and a genuine reason.

      In majority of cases, your bank need to contact you, explain what happened and then ask your permission. The minority of the case is for genuine system errors (some of which the bank is still obligated to call you). Basically, the system works by putting the onus on the sender to prove that the payment is sent in error and then asking the receiving bank nicely to retrieve the money. The receiving bank then needs to contact their customer to explain the situation.

      Imagine you running a business receiving money through bank transfers and people can simply call their bank to "cancel" payments AFTER the fund is credited to your account. Doesn't make much sense, does it?

      You can read EFT code for the legal explanation on this.

      • Banana313 on 14/06/2020 - 00:45
        +1

        To clarfiy, the 24 hour is for first time transfers $500> and the funds are held in the senders account as pending before they're released. The bank has the ability to release the funds prematurely, but rarely due to liability.

        You are correct, once funds have creditted the receiving account it can't be retrieved without permission from both parties and institutions.

        • aussie bargain on 14/06/2020 - 11:37
          +1

          I think you have just reaffirmed my point where the sending bank puts a "brake" on the payment. Different banks put different types of brakes depending on their risk profile, so what u stated is true for one bank, but not for others.

          The best thing to do is to ring their call centre (sender and receiver banks) to clarify these rules.

          But to answer OP's original question, bank cheque or cash are always better as unfortunately there are far too many fraudsters out there.

          Cash is slightly ahead as it is generally harder to counterfeit cash than cheques.

        • Amaris on 14/06/2020 - 13:15

          senders account as pending

          If this is the case, then the receiver would see 'pending' or similar appear on his internet banking transactions, wouldn't he?

          • aussie bargain on 14/06/2020 - 15:54

            @Amaris: Nope.
            That is not how the banking payment system works.

            The person waiting for the credit has their own relationship with their bank (similar to the person with the debit and their own bank). So in the example presented, the "pending" transaction is only on the debit side while the credit side never sees anything until it is "cleared" and sent across. These two relationships are independent relationships.

            What most people see as "pending" debits and credits on their account are combinations of different things. The most common pending credit item is uncleared cheque, while the most common pending debit item is visa/mastercard hold when you are doing a visa debit/mastercard transaction.

            If you are interested in these, go to woolies (not coles or bunnings) and pay for your transaction using the same card, but select savings on one transaction and credit on the other transaction. You will see the difference in the two (albeit not very much).

  • No ONE on 13/06/2020 - 21:31
    +1

    Or ask to do the transfer and take the car once money is cleared.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 11:05

      Yes, if he wants me to trust him, it could work the other way too. Good one.

  • NotaSpender on 13/06/2020 - 21:32
    +2

    Cash only for any private sale, I wouldn't take a 13k risk and good luck with the sale OP :)

    • bizarredeal on 13/06/2020 - 21:47
      +1

      Thanks, appreciate it.

      • deepblonde on 14/06/2020 - 08:09

        I sold a car and buyer paid via Osko .
        Two days before, buyer transferred one dollar into my account and it appeared instantly- we thought great- but then when they transferred the full amount it didn’t appear in my account until 26 hours later…

  • aussie bargain on 13/06/2020 - 22:43
    +1

    Cash or bank cheque only.
    If the buyer really wants the car and legit. Waiting another day for a bank cheque should be okay.

    If he really wants it, technically Osko and PayID is realtime (bank dependent) and will reach your account immediately. However, due to the amount and the fact that you are probably not in his saved payee list, then it may take a while.

    I work in payments for the bank, so I have seen way too many scams and fraud. NEVER NEVER trust their screenshot or anything they show you. If you decide to take bank transfer, the money is only good when you see the credit in your account through the app/internet banking or whatever you normally use. Even then, alsp make sure that you sign a receipt signed by both parties indocating that you have both agreed to the sale.

    Good luck.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 00:08

      Great thanks for the share.

  • ToTheMoon on 13/06/2020 - 23:45
    +1

    I sold my car recently. I firstly accepted a $1000 deposit from the buyer on the day she confirmed the purchase via pay ID transfer.
    3 days after, I lifted her to Vicroad using another car and completed the title transfer, then lifted her to her bank. The bank clerk withdrew the balance from her account and deposited it into my account (we both bank with Commbank). In last step, she got the key.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 00:03

      Thanks for the share.

      • ToTheMoon on 14/06/2020 - 00:12

        no worries. I would highly recommend completing the transfer at a bank because 1) no one needs to count/check the banknotes, and 2) no risk of robbery, and 3)it equals the buyer withdraw cash + cash deposit straightly to your account, so the buyer will never get a chance to chargeback. You will see the money on your account statement in no time

        • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 00:15

          Very good points.

        • kiitos on 14/06/2020 - 23:17

          it equals the buyer withdraw cash + cash deposit straightly to your account, so the buyer will never get a chance to chargeback.

          Why is that? Why isn't it considered a single transaction from one account to another? Do you have to ask for it to be 2 transactions?

          • ToTheMoon on 15/06/2020 - 09:34

            @kiitos: that's a good question for me. The buyer didn't speak English well so I was the one who told the bank clerk the purpose of this transaction is to buy a used car. The buyer entered the password and signed a receipt (I remember it was cash withdraw or something like that). From my bank statement, the transaction is a cash deposit. That's why I say so.

  • TheBird on 14/06/2020 - 01:35

    I can't find an appropriate link as an example, but be very careful with bank transfers.

    A scam that was going around a couple of years ago involved money being deposited into an account purchase an asset. The risk is if it's a fraudulent or hacked account, the transaction can be reversed and you've lost your asset (car). It's typically a little more involved than a simple transaction, as they often want a friend/relative to pick up the asset. Victims often feel confident the transaction is legitimate after the money becomes available in your bank account.

    It doesn't mean you're getting fooled or cheated. You just need to be aware, there are risks. Knowing what the risks are can help you make a decision to help mitigate those risks.

  • Muzeeb on 14/06/2020 - 02:16
    +8

    I would like to compliment the op.

    They asked a great question and followed up every response in a timely and respectful manner.

    This is how forum questions should work. Cheers bizarredeal and good luck with the car sale.

    • Ozpit on 14/06/2020 - 10:00
      +1

      This^. This^. This^.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 10:12
      +3

      Thanks MS Paint. Just a regular guy respecting everyone's input for a genuine query.
      I don't want to be the guy who posts when the car has been driven off already and the payment is wired and in anxiety. These replies has defn has set me straight.

  • ozbargainerlife1 on 14/06/2020 - 02:22
    +2

    I bought a car for $21k and the seller wanted cash. We went to the bank, told them we are wanting to do a transaction where funds become available straight away and then keys to be handed over.

    The teller did a paperless transaction, no physical cash was withdrawn. money went out from my account to his account straighaway and then I got the keys.

    We had a witness as well in this transaction :)

    Hope that helps. I stil did a bill of sale etc.

  • TheBilly on 14/06/2020 - 06:37
    +2

    Just tell him he can transfer then pickup when it clears. He knows where you live.

  • Nutrino on 14/06/2020 - 09:38
    +7

    Ive just deposited 13k into your bank account, ill sent you the screenshot of the the transfer on my phone, ill pick up the car in 15min, if you dont mine, can you have the car ready warned up and key in the ignition as im in a hurry as my mum is having surgery and need to get the hospital asap. Ta.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 10:10

      Haha thanks for the giggles…

  • Strikes on 14/06/2020 - 10:05

    I think receiving money through cheque format is one of a good offline payment methods.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 10:11

      Great thanks.

    • pegaxs on 14/06/2020 - 14:18

      receiving money through bank cheque format

      FTFY

      Make sure it's a bank cheque and not a personal cheque.

  • peterw1 on 14/06/2020 - 10:47
    +2

    would you consider opening a bank account in the same bank as the purchaser(transaction 1). Once opened, purchaser can ask bank teller to do a direct transfer into your account (transaction 2). you can then immediately check your balance. (transaction 3). Then ask teller to transfer money into your home account (transaction 4). Then goto DoT and transfer reg so you don't cop any speeding fines etc. Finally close your new account(transaction 5). Bit of a hassle but very safe. Cost for process: priceless and ability to sleep at night. No need to worry about holding cash.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 10:55

      Great idea to be honest. So it is possible on Monday and if he has issues with access to cash I could go with him to a commonwealth bank and open an account. Wonder though if I can open one instantly? and whether or not there are account fees etc. Sometimes they need proof to open and might take sometime perhaps? nonetheless, a good idea to have multiple accounts if there is no cost to have one for such instances.

    • SummerZero on 15/06/2020 - 17:39

      I like this method

  • missychat on 14/06/2020 - 10:50

    The fact that you asked the forum shows you have some common sense. None if you sign over rego and hand over the car before you have cash in hand or a bank transfer clears in your account.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 10:54

      Thanks. Sometimes in the spur of the moment you can be tricked, luckily I was not in enforceable situation.
      The guy seems genuine and I already said yes for bank transfer over the phone. After which I posted this here and got some opinions.
      But went back to him and told him lets do cash. Let's see what happens today. I am ok to wait till Monday.

  • tikei on 14/06/2020 - 11:30
    +2

    When I bought my car I offered to pay $4k cash. Seller said she wasn't comfortable carrying around that much cash so I bank transferred on the day (both use the same bank).

    I wouldn't be comfortable carrying beyond $6k cash to be honest. Even if I was a seller I would prefer bank deposit that has been cleared. Asking someone to pay $10k+ in notes would give me more anxiety. There's risks to everything. The notes could be counterfeit, who knows. I'd rather see a cleared bank transaction.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 11:48

      Ah fair enough… counterfeit hmm didn't think that far. I will use the cash for the next purchase. But I guess I haven't thought of your side. I will be vigilant and be careful.

  • herecomestheoost on 14/06/2020 - 11:30
    +2

    It's already been said enough.. But personally I'd be asking for the cash in hand.. I once sold a vehicle for a lot less and was given a bank cheque, I didn't rest much until it actually cleared.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 11:49
      +2

      Oh really. Cheques also takes it time to clear. I guess if you have seen the money clear then hand over the car would have been a lot better. Thanks.

  • Pantagonist on 14/06/2020 - 12:52
    +1

    Has the prospective buyer actually inspected / test driven the car?

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 13:01

      Yes. Yesterday (sat 13th June)

  • Herbse on 14/06/2020 - 12:57
    +1

    I'd only allow a bank transfer if the money is cleared during the week, you call the bank to confirm its a completed deposit and can't be reversed, and then transfer the money out and into another bank account. Only then let them have the car.
    Plus get his driver's licence info.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 13:01

      👍🏼will Do.

  • DreadPirateRoberts on 14/06/2020 - 13:39
    +2

    My girlfriend sold her car for $25k and the buyer did a bank transfer. We were all together, they transferred the money in front of us, and it was instantly in her account (same banks). They also seemed like trustworthy people and if they weren't, we had photos of their licenses.

    I would think carrying around $13k in cash is far riskier

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 13:47

      Yea the bank idea did come up on this by others, but unfortunately I don't have the same bank as the buyer (commbank).
      It is something for future though. And I think they have to advise the bank of this large transaction prior so that they will up the limit. Because 25k to another person if prbably not straight forward.
      But good idea nontheless, since it is instant and the same bank its less hassle transaction.
      My buyer is also seems very genine, but who knows once they drive off their mindset may change.
      Yea understand carrying 13k is dangerous, its far dangerous in other countries, in Australia for a short time (until the next purchase) I hope I can manage. Will be careful.
      Will consider your idea for the future.

      • DreadPirateRoberts on 14/06/2020 - 17:37
        +1

        Cash is probably best in your scenario with the different banks. I had someone PayID me for a car (lol…) and that got blocked by the banks because it was a big transaction for PayID. I knew the guy so wasn't stressed.

        I double-checked with her and it was actually just under $20k. Didn't let the bank know or anything (not sure if the buyers did something on their end) - just straight transfer from the app and it arrived instantly in her account. Good luck!

  • crazyboy on 14/06/2020 - 14:10

    Most scammers use this trick. I want to purchase on weekend, banks are closed, cash not accessible. They may do a fake bank transfer and you lose money and car. Why not wait till Monday?

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 14:21
      +1

      Thanks. Buyer was all good.

  • Orico on 14/06/2020 - 15:00
    +1

    As the asians say, CASH CASH CASH!

    I ask them to bring the cash to my bank and then I deposit it.

  • thatonethere on 14/06/2020 - 15:27

    Hilarious they had $13k lying around…

    I guess they owned a shop or something.

  • CharcoalChicken on 14/06/2020 - 18:06
    +1

    I always payID between my two banks. The limit is max at $20k (without calling the bank, CBA). Instant transfer. Easy.

  • HASS on 14/06/2020 - 19:08
    -2

    Most likely ita scam, either wait for Monday or go to ATM get the cash and sign papers. He may apply for refunding on Monday and you will not have a place to go. Be careful.

  • Eeples on 14/06/2020 - 19:20
    +2

    OP your EDIT "Bank cheques can also be cancelled so be wary of this and make sure the funds clear."

    ….is ill-founded and the the last part does not make sense.

    Glad, it all worked out for you.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 22:21

      Thanks, think I read in one of the comments about how a bank cheque can also not go through…

  • melbourne guy on 14/06/2020 - 20:16

    From my experience, I recently sold a car with payment made via bank transfer.
    I offered the seller the option as long as they were either with the same bank as me or had PayID set up.

    I demanded a deposit first up before the remainder of the payment later, so that’s a good way to see how long the payment takes to transfer without having the seller drive off before getting your money. In my experience it ended up being a CBA to CBA transfer so it was instant.

  • DiscoJango on 14/06/2020 - 21:23
    +3

    Sold a previous car to an interstate buyer who picked it up on a saturday arvo. By then the banks were closed and i was paranoid of having that much cash on hand + the buyer knowing my address, so i went and stashed it at my parents, just in case lol

    • superuser on 14/06/2020 - 22:01

      Good point, they might have a team and set up a robbery.

    • bizarredeal on 14/06/2020 - 22:21

      Good vigilance.

    • Richardc on 15/06/2020 - 20:36

      Deposit via ATM.

  • Black Brown Blue on 14/06/2020 - 23:30
    +1

    Cash only

  • [Deactivated] on 14/06/2020 - 23:54
    +1

    I paid for my car that way, transferred the money via commbank then he signed the paper work and I drove off.

  • FloatingPoint on 15/06/2020 - 12:16
    +1

    Nothing is really perfectly safe. Counterfeit cash can be mixed along with the real ones. Are you going to check every single note on the day? There will be 260 x $50 notes. Some fake ones are quite hard to tell as well.
    Whatever you use (Bank cheque / Cash / Bank Transfer / Bitcoins / Eneloops) you should go along with a signed contact + copy of license + address

    • bizarredeal on 15/06/2020 - 17:32

      Damn this is deep and something to think about.

  • cashless on 15/06/2020 - 12:38
    +1

    What can go wrong here?

    Just about every nightmare you can imagine

    • bizarredeal on 15/06/2020 - 17:31

      You are right and glad ozb got our backs…

  • kolorijo on 15/06/2020 - 14:11
    +1

    I took a day off work when I bought my car. Went to my bank with the seller, asked the CS officer to increase my transfer limit, did a transfer, the money popped up instantly in the seller account (NAB to ING if anyone interested), got the CS officer to restore my transfer limit.

    Did the transfer of registration online. Took a picture of his licence (he took mine).

    He then gave me they key and we went our own way.

    • bizarredeal on 15/06/2020 - 17:30

      Day off fro work for a transaction like this is worth every second.

  • kaleidoscope on 15/06/2020 - 15:12
    +1

    Hopefully by now you’d made the right decision. For future events, where there is risk involved, take your time and don’t be pressured for making the decision. Legit buyers will always return and scammers won’t.

    • bizarredeal on 15/06/2020 - 17:30

      Thanks. Great advise. I took my time and asked the question on this great forum, and I ended up getting an overwhelming response. The buyer was in fact straight forward. Buyer after visiting sat PM he offered over the phone shortly afterwards and suggested the bank transfer. To this I accepted after which I thought about asking here to verify. Later got back to him about doing it in cash. In the end all was well. And spot on about being not pressured and taking the time to evaluate.

  • BartholemewH on 15/06/2020 - 18:54

    With today being Monday, and the exchange being on Sunday, I'm pretty sure the buyer could make it into a branch between now and then. If his house burns down between now and then, well I guess he'll have more to worry about anyway.

  • neilpatrickharris on 15/06/2020 - 19:22

    When I sold my car (30k) I insisted on a bank cheque. We both went into the CBA branch and cashed it as it's recorded on camera. That way, if it was cancelled for whatever reason, I'd have proof that we agreed on it. Also had a signed document and took photos of each others licence for peace of mind.

    • bizarredeal on 15/06/2020 - 19:23

      Fair enough.. bigger the amount.. bigger the headache. Good points.

  • OldBugger on 15/06/2020 - 20:03

    You hear this type of question often. I'm surprised there is still no better way to do things than having the seller and buyer walk into a bank together.

Login or Join to leave a comment
Login Join