Considering that the forum consensus now is $100k is not considered rich, what jobs pay more than $200k a year?
Interested to hear from people who earn this and how they got there.
What Jobs Pay $200k a Year?
pollambo on 06/02/2021 - 15:01
Last edited 06/02/2021 - 15:08 by 1 other user
Last edited 06/02/2021 - 15:08 by 1 other user
Comments
Yep, definitely some mining jobs.
But just pointing out for anyone reading and thinking they can just walk into one of these jobs, most mining jobs within Australia don't pay anywhere near that, even for experienced and qualified workers willing to live in remote places or do FIFO.
Correct, I went there just after the boom in Perth, went to see about cleaners earning 100k etc.
The guy said what salary do you want? - I said, $100k, he laughed and said oh no, those times are over, now there is too many people looking for mining jobs.In reality if you are "lucky" enough to get one, your per hour wage is $~20 bucks, but you work 10 hour days to make up for it.
Most labour hire roles (including site admins) pay $45-$55 per hour excluding super which should translate to ~$125k before tax
You guys get paid a lot of money for digging rocks out of the ground
It's high risk work, my sister worked driving the larger trucks. little rain carrying so much weight is deadly.
If you're an engineer or senior geologist then sure. Truck drivers won't get anywhere near that without lots of experience or overtime.
Truck drivers, by and large, no longer exist on the major mine sites as most trucks are now automated.
Not quite, only a couple have automated the truck process.
But still, the days of mining truck drivers, let alone all truck drivers are numbered.
Maybe if you're doing 2/1 or longer roster and still on legacy rates. Boom time rates are over these days. Don't expect to get in to mining and make 200k.
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Mining eng here. You don't see many 200k+ jobs thrown around easily. IMO the quickest way to that kind of cash is being an electrician underground. I've seen jobs for 250k and 2-3 years underground exp for them.
As an operator, you won't see that cash until you either a. become a dragline operator (takes a lot of effort to reach), or b. become a supervisor and take it overseas. If you stay in aus there are some OCE roles that might get you into the 200k range but more than likely it won't happen till you're a manager, and imo again, it's not really worth it for the stress/hours those guys have.
Finally, if you go the engineering route like me, you will likely be in the mid 100s for at least 3-5 years. I've been in for 3 years and was offered a role that was about 225k if you include benefits (165k base) but it was in a super depressing location and mon-fri roster so you'd end up killing yourself. I've recently taken a job that pays ~145k (plus 20k bonus if things go well) with all expenses covered while living in camp during the week and it's close to the coast. Again imo, once you hit the mid 100s it's diminishing returns after that, the aim should be to stay at that level and increase work life balance.
One final thing too consider is the hours. While we don't do doctor hours, it's still and certain 10hrs per day plus loads of unpaid over time. Locations also make families and even social life a struggle to the wrong types of people. The only place I've seen a more depressing divorce rate was the Army.
While all this does drop the hourly rate a lot it's still a great industry if you're looking to save a quick buck and have the fortitude to not become reliant on high income.Hope this helps, one thing I hate is the gatekeeping in the industry (and pretty much every other professional one) about knowing salaries. People would make much better decisions if they knew the reality of the working world.
Think you're right there. I find that as I grow older, the work life balance counts for more than the money. But that's just opinion.
Thanks for being so open, totally agree about being transparent regarding salaries.
For contrast, I know experienced Project Engineers and Senior Project Engineers can earn similar money working in civil infrastructure in Sydney ($140-$170 + car + super). That's in a Tier 1 or higher end Tier 2 contractor. Similar to what you said, you'd be working 11 hours a day minimum, most days working closer to 12 or more.
From there the salary goes up but so do the hours and stress.
I totally agree with your point about diminishing returns over ~$150k.
I've come to realise that you're never going to get rich by working for someone else anyway, unless you're the 0.1% that makes it to General Manager etc and you end up on $500k.I think a high salary is great to get you on your feet, but from there once you're setup with a home and the essentials, you need to focus on work/life balance and invest as much as you can to really get ahead.
Diminishing returns due to the ridiculous tax rate, almost half your pay going to the government… incentivises you not to work.
Agreed. I'm approaching a decade in mining as a professional between the big 2 companies. Mid-100's in the city or high-100's FIF0 8/6 is the dream for an experienced professional that doesn't have to manage anyone or come up with miracles to justify their big pay cheque's. At that level there is good work-life balance and your job is relatively safe during down-turns/cuts. As you say, any higher and the hours and stress go up, and then the tax man takes half of the extra amount anyway. Not worth it IMO. Time is the most precious commodity of all, don't waste it.
Sounds like you've got a lot more industry wisdom than me. Any hot tips for young players?
@900dollaridoos: Don't be afraid to change employers in order to gain new experiences, build your network, increase your salary and improve your working conditions (work-life balance opportunities).
Same goes for internal opportunities: actively seek out and pursue secondments in other teams.
If you haven't already, make an ambitious but achievable development plan and actively work towards making it a reality (hopefully your employer empowers you to do this).
It does require you taking on some degree of risk, you may need to work a little harder and you're also putting the spotlight on yourself, but it does come with its rewards overt time (ie promotions, new challenges). In saying that, I used to want to make Super or Manager when I first started out, but after working in multiple teams now I pitty them, and don't want that burden on myself for the foreseeable future. I found myself a mid-level Specialist role that pays the same as a Senior role by changing employers, and am quite content where I am.@Viper8: Nice one, thanks for that. I'm glad to hear you echo my own thoughts for much of it, especially the promotional stuff. I've always said I'd rather be a shit-hot engineer down the track than promoted up the chain to management. I place a lot of value on feeling competent in my role too, not a luxury I have at this stage lol
In the Pilbara, it's diesel mechs/techs that make the big candy. Some of those guys make serious money.
how much out of interest? I'm in the bowen basin so it might be a bit different. Don't get me wrong, they are still on good coin here, leccy's just win.
@900dollaridoos: I saw an ad recently for $160k base for a diesel tech, but in reality it's plus, plus plus - overtime, super, allowances etc. I've heard of guys on $250k+
The thing is with some of these guys (maybe not the $250k ones) is that they essentially only work half a year.
@900dollaridoos: Out at the mines near Mudgee the diesel mechanics make between $150-200K depending on the hours and allowances etc. Makes it hard for the mechanics in town, you can't keep staff, they generally prefer to go to the mine to earn 3x the money.
I work in mining and earn around about the above number. I don't do FIFO (apart from frequent 1-3 day site visits) but rather Perth-based in the head office of one of the mining majors (actually full-time from home now). I do a 45hr week as standard and any overtime is paid on top of that (no unpaid OT) and work 45 weeks a year. I do electrical, instrumentation and control design, 3D modelling and project engineering with zero management responsibility. It's a skilled job and I have a lot of experience. I'm fairly happy with my current situation. Our heyday was up until 2013, when I was earning substantially more but it declined rapidly and in 2016, I was earning 40% of what I was earning in 2013. 2013-2016 were dire years for my skill set. Things have recovered somewhat since then and we are expecting a solid 2-4 years of good work. Mining is a cyclical industry and Dutch disease is inevitable and unavoidable unfortunately - and in this town, in my gig, it's mining (or LNG) or nothing. I qualified as an electrician but didn't really enjoy the job, so I got involved in electrical design and carried on studying at tech and eventually went to uni (but did not study engineering). All these years later, I'm in a comfortable spot but I've had to work hard to get here. Life's good. My experience is that if you want to earn good money (outside of bullshit selling jobs), you need to get skilled - in hard skills and get some experience. After some of that and a bit of common sense and luck, you can be set.
Ha, i looked up Dutch disease , only cos I'm half Dutch. Luckily I don't have it.. lol
High end escort, stripper, doctor/surgeon, Lawyer, Tradie, lotto winner, politician.
What kind of tradie makes 200k a year?
Good ones :)
And dodgy ones who rip-off the elderly.
@Scrooge McDuck: Not necessarily elderly - anyone they think they can..
Case in point - Instant hot water system finally gave up the ghost last year @ home so called J**s plumbing — was told it would be $120 call out - I said okay.
They called in a subcontractor who turned up in a very nice new european made van within 2 hrs.
He took one look at the system and said its too old, you can't repair only replace. Asked him how much, was quoted a tad over $4000. Thanked him for his time and asked for quote to be emailed. Quote was never emailed.. Called another contractor ended up paying a bit over $1000 for new unit + installation…
@digitalaxon: Yep, always get 2-3 quotes. ALWAYS. Amount of times I have seen $3,000 differences for the same job is astounding. Absolute crooks some tradies are. Scum!
Outback locations can boost hourly rates.
One local sparky aims to get $70 / hr
A plumbing co. quotes $160 / hr to fix leaky faucets, perhaps to encourage owners, who can, to attempt a DIY fix.
Licensed Air-Con installers (= refrig'n tech's) quote fr $550 to $850 / job. w/ an option to add $$, if they hit unexpected issues.
Some bring in a sparky; Actual job cost example: sparky, who does "90% of job" takes $550; refrig'n tech quotes $250, to bring job cost up to $800 (for a low-end split-system air-con).
All include local transport.
For businesses, only some tradies incl GST; others may not be reg'd for GST. Receipts are marked accordingly.
So… one in a million
One of my mates does aircon installs. He makes close to 200K per annum, but works crazy hours for it
Plumbers who work 6 days
Are you asking income or taxable income?
Gross or Net doesn't really matter, show me the 200 grand trades job. I work for a major telco and don't know a single tradesman who pulls that amount of dollarydoos. Share your secret and hot diggity I'm in.
@elgrande: Just because Australians pay exorbitant amount of money for the services of plumbers does not mean they pull in $200 grand a year. Unless they run their own plumbing business, I fail to see how they'll be earning that amount even in Gross pay.
@Caped Baldy: Job keeper was the biggest scam going around.
Most businesses outside of hospitality had their busiest year yet because of all the cash getting splashed by the government.
All they had to do to qualify was have one FORTNIGHT that was 30% lower than last year, which a lot did have in the month leading up to the government announcing jobkeeper, they then qualify for potentially hundreds of thousands of $$$ worth of wage subsidy, basically the tax payer paid for their staff's wages while they raked it in.
@kiwimex: Still doesn't justify $500 to change a washer. If their overheads demand that, then no one should be a plumber.
I work for a major telco
Well I can guarantee your upper management make 200k an they might not even be as high up as you think.
A fully booked plumber for a year can easily make 200k as a one man band. but if he decides to hire an admin person, apprentice, accountant etc. than yeah, his profit after expenses might be much lower.
@serpserpserp: Management are not classified as tradies. Sure some project managers will occasionally come down and provide some form of labour but their job is primarily to supervise and organize projects.
Management are not classified as tradies
Did I say that? Did you even read the second line of my post?
@serpserpserp: Worked for Telstra HQ in Melbourne, my boss was on $200k and so were the 200 above him
@Phlume: working for a telco you wouldnt earn 200k. They pay shit, but you dont have to work extremely hard
Workin for themselves is a different kettle.
@pharkurnell: Incorrect, I worked in Telco for 6x years and saw sales people earn up to $700k a year, average enterprise with comms was ~$200k
@Phlume: My mate charges $120 an hour as a tiler, he's booked 6 months in advance.
You work out the math!! He only works half days too, and half the times he's like made 5k this week CASH!
Most trades I know out earn any Lawyer I've ever met!
You work out the math!!
Well your math doesn't add up. If he makes $5000 in one week at $120/h then that's over 40 hours worked, not the part-time you claimed…
Sounds like he's found a niche market for his work, which is the trick to getting paid well in any industry. Most of my family are tradesmen but most don't get $100k let alone $200k for a 38 hour week. Most of them actually make over $100k in the end but it's working extra hours and weekends to do so.
@sheamas88: Yeah, from tradie friends I know, they range from $80K to $120K. Other friends get more coding.
@[Deactivated]: So.. let's break this down.
$120 an hour * 164.67 for a full time gig
$19,760.4*12 let's assume he takes no holidays, and doesn't get sick.
=$237,124.8
/ 2 as he only works half days
$118,562.
Still not too bad for half a day's work.@dasher86: You need to subtract any cost of doing business from that figure. Vehicle, Consumables etc etc
@dirtybigbjelke: Yep, just pure income I calculated.
So you're correct that after running costs it may not seem too good Afterall.
@dasher86: I wrote what he charges an hour, then what he earns some weeks for CASH JOBS.
Different pathways to earning an income.
@[Deactivated]: Also need to factor in expected working time frame
Not sure many tradies want to be to doing hard manual labour in their 50s or 60s, while 'desk' work of a lawyer that likely wouldn't be an issue.
But I'm sure if he's making that kind of money he's investing for his future, and not dropping it on things like a new ranger with a jetski behind it :)
@[Deactivated]: Don 't know any tilers that charges per hour.
It's usually per m2. Rate would be based on type of tile, size of tile, and then add ons for glue, grout, tile angles and bedding of needed.
His per hour rate may work out to be $120, but he wouldn't be quoting that rate on a job. Can't see too many people just give a blank cheque like that unless it's a simple lump sum contract where the total cost is fixed.
The ones who do cash jobs.
= tradies ;)
¿Qué?
Did your parents work at a nuclear plant?
There are nuclear plants in Australia, just very small ones, I believe a Sydney Hospital is on top of one.
@Headless: That is the one and only one, the OPAL research reactor at Lucus Heights.
Only used to create medical isotopes, no power generation what so ever.
The ones that own their own trade business, which literally anyone can do. ie a Businessman/tradie, emphasis on the businessman.
Exactly.
People who compare a self employed tradie to a full time wage are absolutely clueless.
Look at the full time average wage for say, a domestic or commercial plumber and that will give you a real indication of what these professions are worth.
The tradie making exorbitant amounts of money spent years building up a client base so he can take all the profit from each job. They also won't be getting sick / holiday pay.
All of them that I’ve met. They literally won’t roll out of bed for less than a grand in the hand
Nor should they when you consider operating expenses, insurance, liability etc. That's the luxury of running your own business, naming your price.
They didn't just wake up one day and have a client base.
Electrician, plumbers, waterproofers, do I need to keep going?
Industrial electricians
The kind of tradie that is smart and starts their own business and then has half a dozen tradies working for them.
I don’t know a single tradie making less than 200k. Most I do know work 3 days and bring in circa 300. After overheads and tax, usually at least 200.
I know many doctors that make less. It’s a disgrace.
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Some lawyers, most make nowhere near that.
I would say more than just some. Senior level Senior Associates and above in large firms would be making 200k+.
Sure, probably 4+ year senior associates are making >$200k in large firms. So if one was changing into the legal career, you'd need to do a 3 year JD, a PLT course for a year (part time with work), another 4 years to get to senior associate (or thereabouts), and then another 4 years before you hit $200k.
If you don't love law, I wouldn't recommend making the switch just for the money / chance to get to $200k/yr, if it takes 12 years or so from the moment you make the decision to change to get to that level - not to mention the very intense working hours you will have to work to make it there.
@hybridex: I'm interested on the progression of lawyers. Is the 3 years JD on top of the 3 year Bachelor of Laws degrees?
If it takes that long to reach senior associate status, why do I see Lawyers with Senior Associate titles on linkedin that look like they're in their mid 20s?
@Homr: One of the problems with these sorts of titles (Associate, Senior Associate, Special Counsel, Partner) is that there are no standards for attaining them. When the firm you are at says that you are one, you are.
I've noticed a trend over the past 10 years or so for younger and younger people to be given more senior titles, and it primarily relates to (you guessed it) money. Most firms have fixed rates that they can charge for the work of a particular level of staff (say $300 / hour for a Graduate, $375 / hour for an Associate etc) so if you can bump someone up to the next level early (and the clients don't object) then you can make more money.
This has been particularly exacerbated because the legal services industry as a whole has become super competitive and clients have been able to put heavy pressure on firms to maintain charge rates over extended periods of time.
@Homr: Dunno about law companies, but in some US companies I've seen, the lowest level employee is associate - so senior associate could just be they aren't so fresh anymore?
@Homr: 12 years from when you start training - in most firms to be promoted to SA you would need at least 4 years of whats called Post Qualification Experience (PQE) that is, after you've been recognised by the court as a proper lawyer (the requirements for this vary considerably depending on where you are).
The general levels of lawyer (at least here in NSW) are:
Graduate - 0 years PQE
Associate - 2 years PQE
Senior Associate - 4 years PQEAfter that you usually go one of three ways:
- Partner: This is usually split into two segments - salaried partners and equity partners.
Salaried partners are essentially just employees like everyone else, but are usually responsible for a team of lawyers and have to generate their own business. But like everyone else, there is a significant delta between what you earn for the firm and what they pay you.
Equity partners are "shareholders" of the business, and get a cut of the profits made by the firm.
Special Counsel: this is a level for senior lawyers (10 years PQE at least) who for whatever reason either can't or don't want to become a partner. Many firms use this as another rung on the ladder between between SA and Partner, whilst others use it to retain good lawyers who they want to keep in the firm but want them focused on service delivery (ie billable hours) rather than managing a team.
Consultant: this is a reasonably new development, where senior lawyers (10+ PQE) work more a project basis or on a limited number of days (many equity partners who have sold out their share of the business to retire will stay on as consultants for their client management and networking skills).
Obviously the other option is to go and start your own firm and then you can call yourself whatever you damn well like :) Most jurisdictions require you to have done at least 2 years inside someone else's firm before you can start your own firm.
@Homr: Honestly I think there would be very few SA's pulling in $200K. Maybe in the top tier firms (Allens, Mallesons, Clayton Utz, Herbert Smith, Ashurst) but you'd need to be doing some serious billing to justify that.
Think about it this way - most law firms work on a 3x multiplier. That is, you need to be billing 3 times your salary each year in fees. So let's say you're being paid $200K. That means you need to bill $600K per year to justify your salary.
Let's assume your charge rate as an SA is $450 / hour. That means you've got to bill 1333 hours per year. Let's assume you work 48 weeks in the year, and 5 days per week (unlikely as an SA, but let's assume that). That's 240 working days per year.
So you only need to be billing 5.5 hours per day to justify that salary, which seems like a pretty cushy ride right? Except there are a couple of things we've assumed above that don't work in the real world.
Firstly, you (and the firm) have got to have the pipeline of work to be able to bill clients. For many firms, this is a real problem right now.
Secondly, even if you have the work to do, there is a significant gap between the amount of time you actually work, and what you can actually charge for. So for every hour you work, you might actually only be able to bill 24 or 30 minutes of it.
Thirdly, even after you've eaten a lot of time at stage 2, once the invoice for the client is totaled up, it will be a very large number and in the interests of not killing you clients of a heart attack and/or losing them, the firm will write off even more time to make the bill more palatable. A line something like "10 hours @ $450 / hour - say $3,500" is very common.
Lastly, and this is the big one - there are so many lawyers being pumped out by universities these days that the industry is massively oversupplied and as such, competition for jobs means salaries can be kept lower.
This is the latest numbers I can find (from 2018) but honestly, I would be surprised if they were significantly different. I've got a lot of friends in the industry and most have been moaning about stagnating pay levels. https://www.legalpeople.com.au/news/salary-trends-in-the-leg…
So it's definitely possible, but as the same in any industry, they are the exception rather than the rule.
Mining