[NSW] Am I Allowed to Buy Something Essential from a Facebook Marketplace Seller?

Ok, so I found on FB someone selling some kid DVDs and cars. My kids need cars and DVD to remain entertained. I could buy from a shop with click and collect for 10x the price. Or from this person

I am not in a hotspot LGA.

This Facebook seller lives in my same LGA and less than 5km away. I can pay them with PayID prior to attending. They can leave the parcel in their driveway and I can pick it up contactless.

I am fully vaxed for COVID. Both doses.

In my mind, this is safer than click and collect anyway and it is something that I need for my children.

Thoughts?

Poll Options

  • 138
    I am fine
  • 407
    I could be fined
  • 21
    I should find the items in a shop, click and collect and pay 10x more

Comments

    • +1

      Oh my kids know the difference between a blank screen, postman Pat and rally car racing clips and ten little busses from LBB. They most certainly do.

      It's the only way to change nappies without shit going everywhere

  • +1

    You know you could just go on YouTube and find many cartoons and tv shows for your kids, or spend a little money and buy a Netflix or Disney Plus subscription which can be used by both the kids and yourself.

    • +1

      I know. We have Netflix an Amazon prime.. sadly. cars is not available in either without further expense. This person was selling many DVDs for the same price as one online purchase and also matchbox cars for the kids to play with. So it was a great saving vs buying new.

      • +2

        Truthful/honest offer, I’d be happy to post your kids a 5 pack matchbox car from Amazon. I have prime delivery so they could have it delivered before Friday.

  • Is your internet not working? There's whole episodes of kids shows on youtube and they'd never need to watch the same thing twice.

    • But kids like to watch the same thing over and over and over again

      • +1

        This.
        The kids watch the same Cocomelon tunes over and over and over and over and over.

        They also get great joy from putting DVDs into the dvd player. Try teaching toddlers to turn on the YouTube app, search for things, skips ads, etc.

        Right now theyre practicing with audio CDs on a CD player because they have no dvds

        • +1

          You've got them trained well! My 2yo likes to put coins into the disc drive of my Xbox.. last time I managed to extract a little over $3 from it.

          Also have they discovered blippi yet? That guy's a menace and teaches them bad things like throwing stuff into water to see if it'll float, or spray painting a car, or hitting things with hammers.. block him if it isn't too late haha

          • +3

            @marc kay: Ive blocked blippi from youtube kids already.
            we dont have coins at home thankfully.

            My condolences on your xbox coin box.

          • +1

            @marc kay: Hated blippi with a passion. So happy when my son outgrew it. He’s now in Mario stage and everything is Mario this and Mario that, but I’m an 80s baby so I find it adorable.

  • Stay home. Shut up. Back in your box. Don't speak to humans. Get vaccinated. We'll let you out to pee once in awhile.

  • +2

    Sure it's not essential and sounds stupid that you even think it may be essential BUT it's lower risk than almost all essential activities that are allowed. So yeah, people might get all self righteous here but if we're all being pragmatic it should be fine. Which means you'll probably be fined if you get caught lol (That's how the legal system 'works')

    • -1

      Sorry I beg to differ.
      Its not up to you to determine what is essential for OP
      Nor can the police determine that
      It is for Op to determine what is an essential purchase and nobody else.

      LEGAL ADVICE:its best not to disclose what you are out to buy.
      But if you must just say "essential items" or out for exercise or out to grab some food.

      • +1

        Lol by your logic everything can be essential. Here's why your logic is flawed. Hairdressers are not deemed essential so they're not allowed to open. What if someone is offering a haircut on markeplace and OP decides they can get one because it's essential for them?

        PS: you're suggesting lying to the cops to get away with it. That may work but it's a different argument to what's essential and what's not

  • -2

    If you are within your LGA you are fine…100%
    All the police can do is check your license and then let you go
    .
    There is no definition of "essential" items so its up to the individual to determine what is essential.
    …….Not the police.

    You don't have to disclose to the police exactly what you are out to buy.
    Just say out to buy some essential items

    You can always just say.."Food"

    Remember you are allowed to go somewhere to exercise as well so that too is a valid reason to be out.
    In the less restricted suburbs recreation is also allowable so even going out for a coffee is acceptable

    Just remember to carry a mask and wear it if police approach you

    • +4

      God I hope you get fined $5000

      • -2

        I hope YOU get fined.
        Unlike OP Im sure you arent complying 100% with the COVID19 rules

        • +5

          Yes I am because I understand that looking for excuses is what put us in this mess. You and OP are the problem.

        • You are telling others to break rules, and then you claim others are not following COVID-19 rules. That's gold.

  • +6

    Sounds low risk. The virus is airborne, that is how almost all transmission occurs. As you say, use PayID, contactless collect. Just to be certain wipe the items, if you want to be extra sure leave them for a couple of days before using as well.

    It's better than doing click and collect from a store as most of them suck at contactless. Need is a bit of a stretch, but I'm sure it is tough being locked down with children, so if you feel this will have a big positive effect in your household then do it.

    Also try to combine it with another trip you need to do anyway, like getting groceries. The other small risk is say getting into an accident, or car breaking down or something and then having to be in contact with people.

    Anything that requires being in the same air space as other humans is risky, so avoid that sort of activity as much as possible, if you needed to do this to get the items I would say don't do it.

    Edit: This is not a comment on whether or not you will be fined.

    • +2

      Sensible reply and only one of a couple

  • +2

    Clearly, DVDs are not essential. There are too many alternatives (Youtube, Netflix, Disney+)
    Don't be selfish. Reduce outdoor movement as much as possible.

    • +1

      And what makes you a judge of what is essential to OP?

      Its you that's selfish by ignoring and downplaying OPs essential needs as a parent of young kids

      And how dare you suggest that OP should spend extra money on subscription services just to appease you.
      And I suppose you get all your requirements home delivered, do exercise at home or in the garage and don't go out and talk to the neighbours or go out to buy that non-essential coffee…right?

      • +2

        Oh geeze. Coffee. The local coffee shops is as busy as every with queues of people on Saturday morning. I used to go there with the kids on their ride on to buy Saturday snack but now I just go past on the other side of the road while thinking …. Coffee… Sigh.

        Nb I go out to with the kids on their little ride ons around the block or to the local park which is very very near home. A 1km round trip.

  • +4

    Everyone in this thread seems to be assuming that the legal test is whether the goods are "essential", which is not how the rules are actually drafted.

    The content of the rule is set out in Schedule 1 of the Public Health (COVID-19 Additional Restrictions for Delta Outbreak) Order 2021, which lists "reasonable excuses" for leaving home. You can find it on page 30 of this document. The relevant rule is the first one. You can leave home if you are "obtaining food or other goods or services if the food, goods or services are for the personal needs of the person's household or for other household purposes, including for vulnerable persons or pets". It has to be done locally, and only one person per household may leave per day.

    The word "essential" does not appear anywhere within that rule. The test is whether the goods are "for the personal needs of the person's household or for other household purposes".

    • Thank you, Thank you, Thank you
      Someone with some intelligence at last

      regardless "essential" is not defined anywhere either but rather implied by the words you have quoted

      The FAKE NEWS and possibly some speakers such as Gladys may have used the word "essential" to stress the importance of restricted movement. But as you said its not written into the law

    • Thank you for this - I have to visit a locked down LGA about 40 Km away to get medication only dispensed by a major hospital pharmacy this week and was worried if i got pulled up by the police for leaving the 5 km radius but the document states:

      Obtaining medical care or supplies or health supplies or fulfilling carer’s responsibilities, including obtaining a COVID-19 vaccination

      The information publicly announced has not been very clear

      • What is meant by LGA/?

        • +1

          Boundies of which suburbs are in a particular LGA - Local Government Area
          https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/rules/affected-area

        • Another reason why covid is spreading in NSW like wild fire…

          People in government writing all these rules thinking everyone understands all the acronyms…

  • Is it worth the fine?? I'd say No

    Best place to meet up? I'd say you can meetup at supermarket aka say you were both shopping around if you are closely being monitored by COVID-PATROL

    Is it really needed? You'd be better judge of that

    • It's ok. Instead of paying $15 for 15 matchbox cars I paid $32 for 4 matchbox cars from Kmart. Which the kids absolutely love and adore. For a week I'm guessing. It took a visit to the second nearest Kmart (still within 5km) at a shopping centre which was thankfully pretty depressingly empty. And I also stopped by a pharmacy to buy some eye drops.

      Not really a bargain but it'll keep all those hardcore stay at home-ers which are so eagerly flaming me happy.

      • $32 you could have bought many books for coloring and puzzles and Textas to draw and be creative for months not days

        • We have textas. We have crayons.
          I print out things to colour-in from Crayola's website.

          They're over colouring in for now.

      • Amazon had a box of 9 for $20 with prime delivery. Doesn’t help you now but definitely consider looking at Amazon first in the future!

        • Yeah we bought previous cheapie eBay cars. Kids stomp or crash then the wheels fall of. Are all hotwheel cars full metal and rugged? Or do they have a shit variety and a quality variant?

          • @FoxJump: I’ve always wanted to know this to be honest. I remember the hot wheels ones we had as kids being a lot more durable than the ones nowadays but they were also more expensive.

            I’ve been staying clear of eBay purchases for a while due to how bad quality toys have been, so I go for ones with really good reviews on Amazon.

  • +2

    Within 5km? Easy. Go for a walk for exercise and pick them up on the way.

  • -1

    See my post.
    FoxJump You are operating 100% within the law
    Ignore all these fools who dont know where to find or read the actual law
    They are quoting garbage being peddled by the FAKE NEWS media
    Nothing in the written law (nsw.gov.au) says goods or service must be "essential"
    Just goes to show you

    • Actually quoting Gladys. It may not be the law, but it's what she keeps saying.

    • +1

      Nothing in the written law (nsw.gov.au) says goods or service must be "essential"

      The word 'essential' is not used however the reasonable excuse is the definition of essential

      A reasonable excuse is if you need to obtain food or other goods and services for the personal needs of the household or for other household purposes (including pets)
      https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/rules/greater-sydney#other-r...

      (Even though you have linked to that page and called it "the law", that page is not the law. It is only an overview of rules and restrictions)

      Now look at the definition of essential

      2a: of the utmost importance : BASIC, INDISPENSABLE, NECESSARY
      2: : something necessary, indispensable, or unavoidable
      https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/essential

      So "if you need to obtain food or other goods and services for the personal needs of the household" they are essential goods because they are "something necessary, indispensable, or unavoidable"

      Or you can look at what businesses are defined as essential because if you are buying something from a business that is providing an essential product then you are buying an essential good.

      Businesses providing essential products and services that can be open include
      supermarkets
      grocery stores including
      butchers, bakeries, fruit and vegetable, seafood
      other food or drink retailers that predominantly sell or display food or drinks
      kiosks and other small food and drink premises
      petrol stations
      banks and financial institutions
      hardware, building supplies
      landscaping material supplies
      agricultural and rural supplies
      shops that, in the normal course of business, operate as or sell and display
      pet supplies
      newsagents
      office supplies
      chemists providing health, medical, maternity and baby supplies or
      liquor stores
      post offices
      garden centres and plant nurseries
      vehicle hire premises, not including the premises at which vehicles are sold;
      shops that predominantly carry out repairs of mobile phones
      laundromats and drycleaners.

      So if you are leaving you house for food or other goods and services for the personal needs of the household, those things are essential.

    • Glady and her mates have been using different language and blaming people for not following the rules that do not exist.

      Who would have thought this all started from a Uber/taxi driver who was an epidemiology and knew this virus was airborne and deliberately not wear the appropriate PPE to prevent transmission…

      O wait… The driver was not an epidemiologist, but he sure is an easy scapegoat.

      • yes Gladys typically says:
        "We only want people leaving home if its absolutely necessary….
        Pls only leave home to buy essential items"

        The media then pick this up as the new rule and publish it but its not.
        Its just a request from Gladys to emphasise the importance of the stay at home order

        As many have pointed out including myself the word "essential" does not appear in the law

        The bottom line is
        a) any reasonable excuse
        b) anywhere within your LGA….. OR if you must travel outside your LGA then no more than 5km from your home

    • +3

      Ha! More like needing a break so we can actually cook stuff to eat while the other does chores at home.

      We have zero family help and we have twins.

      I hope when you have kids you get triplets.

      • +1

        Wishing you all the best, OP. 2 year old twins with no family help sounds very tough. We kept sending my sister (2 kids under 3 on a tiny place) small Kmart packages during the Victorian lockdown because just the excitement of opening a package and having a small toy (even just bubbles) would give her a bit of much needed sanity for a couple of hours.

        Definitely look after yourselves. I have PMs open if there’s ever anything I can do to help.

        • Oooh bubbles. I had forgotten about my stash of bubbles wands. Thanks.

      • Many immature posters have no idea FoxJump

        What's worse they all think they are Self-proclaimed (Cowboy) lawyers yet few ever check the wording of the law.
        Those very few that go that extra step quote the law here

  • -1

    This post sums up why nsw is in the mess that it is in.

    • +6

      No. the mess is because
      a) they downvoted the AZ vaccine which in reality is good, better than Sinovac/pharm ones.
      b) They didnt prioritise the most mobile of the population which would eventually be all the carriers. Ie: like they say, the young people which do a lot of the /essential work/ around town.
      c) It used to be okay for someone who picks up people from the airport to not be vaccinated.

      That's why we're in this mess.

      • Glady told people not to cancel their appoints when there were 20 cases then 4-5 days later reported there was a party and that increased the cases etc.

        She screwed up, because of gold standards in contract tracing and ScoMo praising her for not locking down.

        If she did a hard and fast lockdown, NSW would have been out 4 weeks ago.

        Just watch what New Zealand is doing now, I'm pretty sure they'll be out in under 4 weeks with 0 cases.

        Looks at SA and NT.

        VIC screwed up by coming out too early before they were on top of ever case and they are paying for it again now.

      • Also I don't think it's fair to assume an Uber driver is a trained epidemiologist who specialises in airborne viruses and disease control.

        This is the expectations of government, ie to put controls in place.

        It's not like we just found out about the virus… It's been around for 18 months. Our government fell asleep behind the wheel and is using Uber drivers/removalist as scape goats.

      • The Astra Zeneca vaccine was the perfect choice for Australia when it was decided:

        Highly effective
        Was being used widely around Europe and the UK
        Proven to work
        Australia could secure supply by manufacturing it locally
        Inexpensive to make/buy
        not an experimental mRNA vaccine
        Standard storage requirements makes it easy to store and distribute anywhere in Australia

        The government had ordered some Pfizer as a backup.

        So the government had received all the correct advice and taken the appropriate action

        But then came……
        1. the blood clotting scare in Europe and the temporary hold on administering the AZ vaccine
        I suspect this was a marketing ploy by Pfizer to damage the highly successful AZ brand but who forgot to mention the same problem occurs with their vaccine
        The incidence is 5ppm for AZ and 4ppm for Pfizer so statistically minimal difference
        2. The initial Pfizer orders we placed where redirected (stolen) to the US.

        But we had COVID-19 well under control there there was no rush
        Australia was the world model

        …….Until the uncontrollable delta strain arrived
        The consequences were unpredictable

        So dont listen to the critics - especially Labor who are trying to make political mileage out of this
        The government acted on the advice it was given by ATAGI and continues to do so

  • I think these are "desires" and not "needs". Desires are unfortunately endless so you / they will get bored with these in couple of days/ weeks too. Kids don't need toys, they can literally play with anything. They can get far more creative than we think. But yes if you keep buying new stuff before they are bored, you will keep them engaged with new things and may suppress their creative side. I'm not denying that keeping kids entertained during lockdown is a challenge but there are plenty of resources online on how to keep kids engaged with variety of ideas. If you can share how old are your kids, perhaps others can throw some ideas on things you can try. Good luck on keeping them engaged and stay safe.

    • -1

      Yep they will become entitled and spoilt, I remember as kids we played with ants or climbed trees or built sand castles or did drawings but now kids need to be entertained even more with all these gadgets, I just hope these twins grow to appreciate every little thing in life and not being too entitled.

      • +3

        Cool. I dont live near the beach. Where do i go build sandcastles?
        It's winter, there's few ants.
        Climbed trees. Too young for that they are.

        We go to the local playground every weekend day. And we scoot around the block. I keep them active as much as i can. But sometimes, they too just want to chill for a few minutes rather than running around 24/7 or playing with their train tracks or cars or colouring in pages or walls.

        • Are playgrounds still okay? I know all my local playgrounds were closed last year but I haven’t checked this time around.

          • @Laurana: I don't recall seeing them being closed and I watch the G & K show every morning

            • @FoxJump: Thanks for responding. I’ll keeping trying to not visit them but really handy to know that there’s a possibility that they’re open. Kids have been fine so far but lockdown fatigue it’s very real.

              • +2

                @Laurana: Yeah if they close the playground im gonna struggle through weekends and whenever they have a sniffle from childcare which is … Ridiculous often. Ive lost count of how many covid tests we've had as a household

  • +3

    This entire thread explains why NSW will never control their outbreak and how Vic did control theirs.

    Wowee NSW are in trouble. Can we build a wall?

    • +1

      How Victoria “controlled” theirs? You are kidding right ? We are the most extremely locked down and longest lock down in the world. I would hardly use this example as a success story.
      People are suffering from a range of health issues, both mentally and otherwise from this prolonged situation. In the real world leaving the home means there are risks … getting hit by a car, getting robbed, workplace accidents, being hit by lightning… The “safest” solution to these problems is to stay at home, however that is no way to live a life. We may as well be in prison.

  • Besides it being legal or not…

    If you have to ask its probably not essential. The sooner people stop looking for loop holes and do the right thing, the sooner it gets under control.

    • +4

      I know i'm going to get downvoted heavily for this comment but : The longer we're in a lockdown the longer more people will look for loop holes. Fatigue sets in. Gladys should have locked down hard and early and we would have had a shorter lockdown.

      At this stage, no matter what happens, no matter how much we all stay at home, we're all at home until November.

  • Yep typical NSW the only state with 100s of infected

  • Take the necessary precautions and do what you gotta do 🙄. i’ve been to the shopping center for groceries (vic) and amid lockdowns was shocked to see people’s ignorant behaviour.

  • They are within your 5km limit, what’s the problem?

    End of discussion?

  • +3

    If alcohol stores are considered an essential store, then I have no problem with this.

    • +1

      haha. Good point. Everyone must be cooking with wine

      • Just makes no sense though. If COVID is more lethal to the unhealthy population, why have bottle shops opened when it's evident there's been an increase in alcohol intake during the pandemic? I can't believe a bottle shop can be considered essential, but a place like Officeworks is not. Many times I've had to delay work activities because the supplies I need are delayed for click&collect pickup, but no worries I can walk into Liquorland and pick up a bottle of bourbon. So yeh, just go pick it up. Everyone is doing it, marketplace is full of ads and people drive all over town to collect things.

        • +1

          The juicy taxes govt collects from bottlo's is possibly one reason.

          • @FoxJump: I suspect that is a major reason, and also because it's such a coping mechanism for many during this difficult time that they allow it to stay open. I know many people are relying on alcohol and drugs to help them through this lockdown.

            • @Mysterious: I rely on taking my kids to the playground. And on just being so tired being a parent. YAAAAAAAAAWNNNNNNNN

        • Because hospitals don’t need mass cases of alcohol withdrawal syndrome or people in acute mental health crisis who had been previously self medicating with alcohol to add to their workload. Even for less heavy drinkers access to alcohol keeps the dependent subdued. They’ll be very unlikely to close bottle shops even if lockdowns were stricter - it would be it’s own public health crisis.

  • +3

    OP, I can understand your need of the DVD and cars. However, assuming that your question isn't just hypothetical or for trolling, why would you even think about asking it here?
    Just go exercise or by take away food and pick up your parcel on the way..

    • +4

      By asking, someone suggested to ask the police, which was helpful. So, this thread, despite all the hate i'm getting, has been useful

      • Sure, if that is a good result for you :)

      • +3

        LOL you got crucified for asking a question.
        I guess a lot of people are frustrated being locked in and at the escalating situation in NSW that they lash out at anyone not sticking to the strictest interpretation of the rules.
        I don't think it was unreasonable to ask and it's good you got the proper response from an actual authority. I hope other people not sure find your question and the answer.

        • +3

          And anyone else asking a question should also carry a bucket of burn cream and aloe vera.

  • +3

    If grog stores and hardware store are open why not this.

    I did a C&C at Rebel to get a ball for the kids, in my mind its essential.

    Obviously a lot of people hear don't have kids, especially young children.

    You determine what's essential, as long as you are not taking the piss and follow the guidelines. I.e. only one in the car, go directly to the shop, get your item and go back home, no browsing or walking around.

    • Yeah we gotta buy a small soccer ball and goal set soon. But currently they cant even kick their ball-pit balls so we got time.

  • +2

    If people continually look for loop holes in the system rather than ya know doing the right thing, then good luck ever getting out of lockdown.

    I have 2 kids under 5 as well and 100% agree that dvds and toy cars are not essential. Even if they were under whatever loop hole you convince yourself if justified, there are safer and more legal ways to obtain it other than Facebook marketplace.

    I’m glad you did the right thing in the end and while it probably cost you more, you put yourself at lower risk both in spreading the infection and getting a fine for it

    • Just a question u assume they have this cold ???
      And another thing if someone wants to stand up for his freedom and go out within the 5k it’s breaking no law as gladdy says every day it’s only health advice

    • Define "right thing" when you have a totalitarian government. Damn, no critical and independent thinking going on round here…!

      • Nope, certainly not from you anyway

  • Maybe take this opportunity to teach your kids about patience and waiting can lead to greater rewards.

    • I can't even get my 2yo to change his nappy when I pause the TV in front of him so he doesn't miss anything lol. Patience and the concept of time are foreign to a toddler.

  • The fined someone for leaving home to feed and care for a horse.
    Horse vs DVDs?

    • Where was this? Animals shouldn't have to suffer because of lockdown

    • +1

      https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/twist-after-...

      Turns out they didnt quite fine her, although they said they would, and after coming to the media they said they wont.

      • +1

        That was from July 2020, when VicPol were a bit, how should I say… overzealous in their dealings with the public. Plus the horse owner never got a fine, only a warning really

        • +1

          "You may receive a fine in the mail." They always say that. They refuse to just tell you. Spoiler alert, you mostly get one. In this case their boss probably told them no.

  • -1

    Since it's in your LGA, can you be doing exercise and happen to run/ride past their place and happen to pick the items up?

  • +3

    My recommendation is to use your common sense.

    You mentioned same LGA, within 5kms, not hotspot LGA, vax'd, contactless pickup - all contributing to very low risk situation.

    Make sure you bring some shopping bags in the car and know where there's a supermarket beyond the pickup place and what you're planning to buy. ;)

    The alternative is you have to buy something anyway, but it's less sustainable and you and the seller will be worse off.

    E.g. Someone a couple of hundred meters away from my home gave me some gardening equipment earlier in the year (wasn't in lockdown) which we picked up. Last night he offered us some more very useful times and dropped it off this morning contactless. He's sold his place and will move shortly but wants to be as sustainable as possible and in the process we've been too - I could easily afford everything, but have gotten hundreds of dollars worth of equipment free, and we'll have saved a fair bit of equipment from going into landfill.

  • You're fine mate. Scomo said it's essential to buy jigsaw puzzles for your kids.
    And it's obviously essential for your seller to earn income by selling those things.
    Legit I think you're good, just mask the (profanity) up and do payID if you can.