• expired

$0 Brokage Fees on ASX Trades (HIN) until 1 Jan 2022, Then $3 Per Trade Afterwards @ Stake

2000

Credit to 1337 for pointing out Self Wealth seem to be matching stakes $0 trade until 04-01-2022, Credit to Raif pointing out ETFs only

Seems Stake has decided to give the $0 per trade to all users until 01 Jan 2022 ($3 per trade afterwards) on the ASX (Still $0 for US trades). This finally represents some decent competition for those in the ASX game (compared to CommBank etc). Use the referral links below to gain yourself a free US share (likely Gopro, but you might get lucky and get Nike).

Minimal starting stake is A$500 (as the stake is Chess-Sponsored / HIN)

Link/Information on (expanded from thread):
Pricing
Deposits
Stake Wallet for ASX
Transfers to stake
Share Certificate
CHESS-sponsored investing & HIN - Stake
CHESS Information - ASX
Salan Private Wealth Australian Division aka stake's owners
Canstar explaining the initial $500 ASX requirement for HIN
2.4/5.0 Stake on Product Review, lol

Nice comparison of different brokers such as: SelfWealth, Pearler, Superhero, Think, Open. Stake is not mentioned as it's only been a product on the ASX for all for a day

Referral Links

Referral: random (1528)

Referrer gets $1 off brokerage for 12 months for each referral. Referees gets $10 bonus (funding account within 24 hours of sign-up required).

Related Stores

Stake
Stake

closed Comments

  • +2

    I have been on the ASX Beta waitlist for ages and still no invite. How come they are allowing new sign-ups without clearing their waitlist first?

    • Because you'll be a customer already, this way they can attract new customers.
      Not saying I agree but that's the strat I see tonnes of businesses use.

      • +1

        Might be what they're thinking but I was on the waitlist and am not an existing stake customer.

      • +1

        All customers should of came across today as beta is done. I cannot find anyone in any of my facebook groups that didn't automatically get access

    • It should have switched across today. Maybe try to clear your cache or update the app (I'm sure someone here can give better advice). I was part of Beta group and today the "Beta" wording has dropped and it's the same layout type as wall street. Also (Just in case it may have been overlooked), make sure you change "wall street" (aka American flag), to ASX. They seem to be running this as two completely separate items, in both the app and on the web

    • +1

      I would suggest inviting one of your alt email accounts, it bumps you up the waitlist by heaps.

  • $3 flat regardless of size?
    are the shares owned by a custodian?

    • +12

      No, not custodian. CHESS sponsored with your own HIN.

    • $500 min per trade, as it goes in your name and not under "Sanlam Private Wealth Pty blah blah". After 01-01-2022 $3 is the flat rate on trades of $500+ (ASX min for this process, according to stake Beta).

      More on CHESS-sponsored investing / HIN

      • +11

        The $500 minimum thing is an ASX limit of course ("minimum marketable parcel"). Once you have at least $500 worth of a particular stock you can buy smaller amounts. As it happens I bought 1 share of an ETF this morning for example (where I already hold over $500 through that HIN). Would never have done that if there was brokerage to pay but given that it's currently free…

        • +5

          I stand corrected. Thanks for the information, I misunderstood the $500 min rule. It makes alot more sense now.

  • +3

    Can someone tell me how they make money, I ain’t letting them be my broker unless I know how they make money and not going to go flop when they run out of money to chase market share. At $3 per trade they are not covering their costs to ASX from memory

    • +4

      They are Sanlam Private Wealth Pty and they are a major player. $0 is limited until 01.01.2022, then you'll pay the $3. As a whole the company makes a massive number of trades (under many company names for many markets), hence can afford the freebie. It's also CHESS sponsored, so if they went flop, it makes no difference as the ASX shares are under your name and not theirs. "At $3 per trade they are not covering their costs to ASX from memory" I'm keen to see the actual cost as time goes on. I don't trust figures quoted by other brokers. They have held the market to themselves, up till recently

        • +12

          what’s the risk? its chess sponsored, if they go bust shares are still in your own name available for you to move across to different broker as you wish

          • -6

            @ujwols: Where did I say risk? I did not say there is risk, I said headache.

            Please share your experience of you HIN broker going under and shifting your portfolio to another, if it’s as easy as porting a mobile you’ve sold me.

          • -1

            @ujwols: It isn't as easy as you think. I was a client of the stockbroker BBY a few years ago and they went broke. My shares were CHESS-sponsored in my name on the HIN but after they went broke I couldn't move them to another broker for at least 3 weeks and they wouldn't let me move the shares to issuer-sponsored for at least 3 weeks, because an administrator took over and they did not honour any requests to move shares out for over 3 weeks, so I lost $40k while I was holding these shares with the broker that I couldn't sell for over 3 weeks.

            So you are living in a fantasy if you think you will be able to move your shares to another broker quickly when your old broker goes broke.

            • @bargainhunter17: You lying? BBY were doing their own custodian shenanigans:

              https://home.kpmg/au/en/home/services/advisory/deal-advisory...

              BBY Nominees apparently acted as a trustee and nominated custodian for clients of the BBY business in respect of domestic and international accounts as well as holding ‘house accounts’. At the time of administration, the records available to the Administrators were inadequate to determine the identity of BBY Nominees clients and creditors, the extent of assets the Company held and whether assets were owned by the Company or held on trust for others.

        • +7

          I encourage you to do your own research as we are taking $$$. I can only speak from my experience, friends and family and feedback in the community. I am unclear why there would be a "headache of recovering my shares", as they are CHESS sponsored.

          Other brokers I have researched in regard to the ASX, are major banks (commsec for example), Seflwealth, Morgans and Interactive. I'm not suggesting it's a duopoly, but brokers have sat nicely on fees for a long time. Much like the current health insurance scheme in this country. This is just the equivalent of the US market opening with the likes of Robinhood.

          If your gut tells you to walk away, then walk away. I'm sure down the tract they will become a bigger player on our market.

          • -1

            @Pharmacy: Self wealth annual report 2020, they earn 5m in trading fees and have COGS of 5m. That doesn’t strike me as very profitable at $9.50 per trade. All their profit is from earning interest from the money clients have in the bank under their accounts.

            So tell me, since you claim there they sit nicely on fees, how is it self wealth can’t make money on 9.50 and stake can on 3 bucks.

            • @cloudy: Selfwealth's cost of trades is actually slightly less than $5 wholesale from Openmarkets. Reason for your COGS stat is more likely that their cost associated with referrals of 5 free trades each way is being put under COGS.

              No idea about Stake, but worth noting they use a different upstream provider in Finclear vs Openmarkets. One potential model is loss leader for their US business. Or loss leader for a more premium data offering "Stake Black". It's a fairly regulated industry so I would be confident that there isn't anything too shady.

              • +1

                @blighst: I understand COGS won’t tell a full story as there are other expensives that fall under cogs but it’s a fairly good proxy which is why I brought it up, especially in a debate where no one else is interested in doing any quantitative research and only relying on the fact having a HIN is all they care about.

                SWF also runs promos as you mention, such as free trades which hit the COGS line with no revenue as well , but the point is you surely can’t be making money offering $3 trades. So how are they? Loss leader strategies exist, to lure clients in like in supermarkets knowing they will be cross sold, I doubt that can be the strategy here.

                As for this industry having nothing shady, we’ll, as an investor I’m eternally optimistic and forever cautious. It serves me well in markets and seeing the comments is a warning flag in general about markets.

      • The ASX charges a fee per trade, they are literally losing money on every trade. The more trades that occur the bigger the loss.
        No to mention the copious amount of other fees that the ASX charges participants. Google ASX fee schedule for some insights.

      • Where’s the evidence of the “massive number of trades”?

        Stake are newer than SelfWealth who charge $9.50 per trade and I’m not sure if Stake’s membership numbers are at the same level as SelfWealth’s (who have 100k customers I think). If I had to guess I’d say Stake isn’t at that stage.

        Stake may have more day trading activity but not sure. It’s obvious they’ll need to rely on huge volume at such a cheap brokerage fee, only time will tell how sustainable that will be. I’d say they also need to acquire a lot more customers as they’ve only offered US shares up till now.

  • +3

    I've primarily been using SelfWealth, would the main benefit of Stake be the $3 fees over $9.50 of SW?

    Thinking of maybe shifting my portfolio over to Stake if its similar to SW with $3 fees per trade only…

    • I cannot find the companies name, but one company was cheaper than stake per trade but also charged a % fee. Stake will charge the $3 flat rate, no matter the amount (like their wall street portal, but they will charge a fee for ASX). Transferring in and out seems straight forward, but I suggest reading the T&C's.

      The pricing link also may help you

    • +5
      • Thanks. I will add that in the description

        • +3

          Important to note that it is for ETFs only.

        • Thanks for adding in description!

          • +1

            @1337: thanks all. I was planning on divesting all my Self Wealth ETFs anyhow. now I just need to research what happens to remaining share reinvestment plan currency for VDHG and VGS

            edit: withdrawing from the reinvestment plan can either be done manually (through computershare) or happens automatically when you sell. any residual balance will be deposited into your account at a time of Vanguard's choosing.

    • F

  • This is a scummy company. A lot of people are giving them a pass because they think they are safe and banking on untested 'facts'.

    Great you have CHESS sponsor, great that you can transfer to another broker but what good will any of that be if they simply put the app on permanent 'maintenance' mode and you can't even put in requests? What good is it when market/limit orders either don't go through or take over 30minutes to execute?

    When it comes time you will know….

    $10/$20 is nothing on tried and true platforms if you intend on holding long term. If you are short term/paper hands then yeah give this casino a go.

    • +7

      Can you share more insight as to why Stake is scummy? I currently have a considerable amount of US shares so now I'm concerned…

      • +3

        Stake failed miserably during the GameStop saga (still going btw)

      • Whoever is managing the software development is really shit and has no idea what they're doing. During gme, they rolled multiple patches over an entire week, using their customers to trial and error until the hype went away. They didn't appear to fix the problem, and waited until the traffic died down and the issues self corrected

        You weren't able to make trades in a timely fashion, some trades were cancelled, some didn't even go through. The app didn't update your portfolio immediately, it did not update the prices (it would simply say check back later). You couldn't even login via app or website. Couldn't even reset password.

        Robinhood, Webull etc. did not suffer from these issues. The Stake technical team don't know what they're doing.

        • You think this wasn't on purpose?

    • +4

      Not really untested facts. The CHESS system is regulated by the ASX and your shares are protected. Have a read: https://www.asx.com.au/documents/research/chess_brochure.pdf

      Nothing that Stake can do will change that. If they went bust your shares might be tied up in red tape for a bit but you’ll get them back eventually. Which would only be an issue if you needed to sell in a hurry.

      For me I absolutely agree on long term holding being the way to go and have no intention of selling for many years. I have no control over returns, but I can control fees. Paying higher brokerage means you have to buy in larger chunks to offset that cost. With lower brokerage I can add to my holding more frequently.

      • -3

        I have no control over returns, but I can control fees. Paying higher brokerage means you have to buy in larger chunks to offset that cost. With lower brokerage I can add to my holding more frequently.

        You got this slightly wrong.

        Usually the fees talked about are like 1% vs 0.2% in ETF. Say for example. You invest monthly. The difference between $10 a trade ($120pa) and $3 a trade ($36 pa) is $84 over 10 years it is $840. But if you have a significant amount ie. $250k (because you salary sacrificed $25k pa into your super) 1% fee is $2500 pa vs $500 pa at 0.2%.

        Unless you get really stupid with brokerage it isn't that fee that kills you because you $10 brokerage this month is once off over 30 years. Where as % asset management fee is year in and year out.

    • Agree, if you think paying $19.95 is too much then you're in the wrong game. Quality ain't cheap and cheap ain't quality.

      Funny how Aussies love property where the agent charges 2-4% when you sell, and the Gov't charges 3.5% stamp duty when you buy. Not to mention the dollars involved.
      Yet when it comes to share trading people take issue with paying 0.11%. That's $110 on a $100,000 trade! it's peanuts.

    • +1

      To be fair it was Stake’s clearing house that was blocking the trades IIRC.

      I was using them at the time too but for full transparency that’s what occurred. No issues were happening on SelfWealth for GME.

  • If like to know what exchange rates are used when buying USA stock???
    Is that the catch?
    Just asking.

    • +2

      70BPS ON DEPOSIT AND WITHDRAWAL ONLY
      Add 0.5% for express deposit.
      see https://hellostake.com/au/pricing

      • -4

        Stake charge you money to deposit? and withdraw money?…..pass

        • +1

          Only for USD.. it's still a lot cheaper than any other platform

          • @lookingforTV: Yeah, I looked into it and decided to stick with ASX. Having to recover FX costs before making any profits, then currency changes screwing with your results, I decided to give it a miss.

    • +1

      In my opinion, it's shit. Use something like Revolut for larger amounts (change AUD —> USD) and then deposit into stake (there is a small fee, I think $5 or $10), and a delay, but you'll get a much better rate. Hopefully someone else can suggest another solution, as this is the best I could come up with

      • any hints for large amounts the other direction? USD -> AUD?

        • Revolut lol. I haven't really screwed with other apps as revolut seemed to be highly rated when I was looking for a year ago. Oh, they also have a "fair usage policy" and have subscriptions to get around this. I just know I was getting around 2-4% extra cash, over what stake was giving at the time

      • +2

        then deposit into stake (there is a small fee, I think $5 or $10)

        I might be wrong, but they have removed this feature. Now I can only transfer via PoLi or Bank transfer, with their FX rate.

        Personally, that's why I don't trust them.

        I always believe, if you don't pay for a product, you are the product.

        For day trader, sure, stake gives better rate. But since I hold for long term, the last thing I want, is few months/years down the road, Stake starts changing their pricing policy, and I have to go through the headache to move my shares.

        Moreover, if $3 becomes the norm, I believe big 4 banks share trading account would change their charges accordingly to stay competitive. Just look at what Robinhood has done to eTrade.

        • Thanks. This feature was removed. I was aware this has happened.
          "I always believe, if you don't pay for a product, you are the product." I also believe in this statement. I pay $90USD a year for stake black and then also pay a fraction on trades (Long time argued with Wall Street, but I accept this).
          I have also posted this entire thread as there is an importance here (Not just $0, but for people to question fees) and that's the big 4 need to start to explain their much higher fees. I have done very well with stake and am proud that it has come to the point where Salan Private Wealth has become a headache for Robinhood.
          I tell people, go with your research/gut and this is no difference. Long-term, I believe stake / other may do what Hyundai did with the excel for warranties (aka 3-year unlimited km's, compared to 12-month 20,000km). I trust stake (and the coverage the US government provides for me trading in the states) and I even those that don't use the platform, reap the reward from competition.

          • @Pharmacy: My only concern is the IRS and dealing with their crap, investing in US stocks.

        • +1

          I hope everyone else sign up to it to push commsec prices down

  • -1

    Does it have any kind of instant fund deposit mechanism? It's the only downside with selfwealth really.

    • You get an account with a BSB and account number so you just transfer to that via your internet banking. It’s not quite instant. Usually takes about 5-10 mins for the funds to arrive.

    • +4

      For Australian shares:
      It will take approximately 5-15 minutes for your funds to land in your Stake AUS wallet if your bank is with the New Payments Platform (NPP), if your bank is not on NPP then your deposit will take 1-2 business days to land in your AUD Wallet.
      https://hellostake.com/au/support/asx/articles/35000187061

      USA funding is different and slower.

      • Thanks. That kind of make sense. NPP generally has a very low daily transfer limit though, so I suppose anything over a few thousand would take 1-2 days.

    • +1

      SelfWealth supports osko instant in transfers - I have used it a number of times. What downside are you talking about?

      • When did they start supporting osko? I did a mid size transfer in September and they definitely didn't support it back then.

        • +3

          September.

          https://www.selfwealth.com.au/blog/selfwealth-launch-instant...

          Been working for me every time I've done a Osko transfer (through NAB app).

          • @Seisei: Selfwealth is very hit and miss, they promise a feature and never deliver, like live pricing.

            • @SpaceJudge: They promised to introduce US trading which they did but they were way behind schedule. I think like 6-12 months behind?

              Even though SelfWealth are technically a startup they move at a dinosaur’s pace.

      • +2

        I don't think instant transfer working anymore, Have you transferred recently, it deposited next day. It worked for few days but not anymore.

        • Yeah I signed up for Selfwealth this month and the two times I've transferred from CBA have been next day.

        • +2

          Tried it this morning, still works. Remember that Osko transfers are subject to limits. For example my bank account can only send max 5000 a day and 1000 per transaction over Osko. So I end up sending 5 transfers of 1000 and schedule the rest for following days. Not ideal but not a deal breaker for me at least.

          • @hashtagbargain: I think that could be the case, large money transfer going next day, smaller amounts may be same day

          • @hashtagbargain: This is exactly the case. At first I thought it was SelfWealth screwing me over with osko not being instant but then I checked with my bank (bankwest) and they also have a $1000 per transaction, $5000 per day osko fast payment limit. If I transfer $1000 it is instant, if I transfer $1001 it takes 1+ days. It’s annoying as my trades are always over $5k.

  • +3

    Fyi if you sign using their promo code, get $150 worth of stock, they will give you a few cents worth or at max $1 with of stock.
    Back when I used it they had dodgy withdrawal fees and even account cash funding fees. If you want to deposit the money same day they charge you an extra 8 dollars for speedy fee. The interface looks like a website designed by a 10yo. In short Dodgy platform with hidden fees. Avoid.

    • +2

      what platform do you suggest instead?

      • -1

        Selfwealth

    • what platform would you recommend?

  • +1

    seems the same company designed Robinhood app in USA.

    if you don't know what had Robinhood done in the past 12 months then you probably should google it.

    • -2

      Same concept, different company: Sanlam Private Wealth Pty Ltd (stake) vs Robinhood LLC. Sanlam group is becoming one of Robin hood's biggest headaches. The most I saw during the meme stocks, was a warning stating this stock maybe inflated (and a bunch of links to GME Etc), but was never prevented from buying (except during SEC freeze)

      • +2

        Sanlam have nothing to do with Robinhood or Stake (beyond supplying Stake's AFSL).

        US market access is given to stake by Drivewealth, and AU market access is given by FinClear

        • https://hellostake.com/au/legal/financial-services-guide

          Stakeshop Pty Ltd (Stake, us, our) is an Authorised Representative (Authorised Representative No. 1241398) of Sanlam Private Wealth Pty Ltd (Sanlam) which holds Australian Financial Services Licence number 337927.

          Free financial advice can be worth less than it costs to recieve. Financial products aren't toys. But neither are poker machines or sports betting apps.

          $3 Brokerage is incredible. Hopefully it effects how the big players operate. A proven track record of service and reliability is important considering the nature of the product.

  • Has anyones deposit gone through yet? Mine hasn't after 24 hours.

    • It should be fairly quick for ASX (mentioned above). All my deposits were via their American portal and I found the deposit would sometimes go through shortly after the market opened.

      • Could it be that I only deposited $5? I'm waiting for Spaceship to withdraw my funds (ETA Friday), so figured I'd make a tiny deposit so it could active NPP, so when I do get my funds from Spaceship they'll arrive in Stake in 5-15 minutes.

  • Genuine question, perhaps out of ignorance. I invest small amounts (less than $500) using Sharesies. They charge 0.5% if investing under $3,000 or 0.1% above that. So basically $2.50 per $500 (or in my case, much less as I don't invest that much).
    Why would I pay $3 per trade with somewhere like this?

    • +1

      Because they don't charge % invest fee. There is one broker that has a cheaper fee (I will remember their name), but also charges a %. It worked out that anything over a few hundred then carried a high fee than the $3 flat fee from stake

    • how was experience with them?

      • I've found it reasonably seamless, no real delay in deposit/withdraw/buy/sell.

    • +1

      You own these shares (CHESS). So minimum hold of $500 and brokerage is required.

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