Neighbour Has Extremely Large Weekly Gatherings (200+ people) VIC

mfazackerley on 29/07/2023 - 20:03

Just after some advice about if this is legal. I cant imagine it is.

My neighbour has some form of religious gathering every week which can often attract more than 200 people.

I'm sure that gatherings that are this large and this regular surely would need at least a permit (which they wouldn't have) but I've tried searching to find an actual law or regulation about it and cant for the life of me. The house they attend is a small 3 bedroom house on a 900m² block so the event is mostly outside.

Anyone able to point me in the right direction? We are in Hobson Bay council in Victoria.

Some more background:

The 'events' are usually between Wednesday to Sunday and are from 7pm to 10pm and have been going on for about 3 months now.
The people themselves aren't all that annoying to be honest. Besides some sometimes very loud praying they aren't actually any noisier than you'd expect 200ish people to be.

The main issue is the cars.

Our street is a normal outer suburban melbourne street with mostly 3 bedroom houses on it. Each night there would be 1 or 2 cars parked on the street.
Tonight is the biggest one yet (hence the post) and I have just counted 98 cars on the street that I don't recognise and its between 2 and 4 people that usually get out of each car (mostly families).

And they park like absolute d***heads. They park over and in peoples driveways and often on other neighbours front lawns (actual lawns, not just the nature strip).

Im not even too sure how to comlpain to council to be honest. How do you photo 100 cars on a street at night time and prove which address they are going to?

Home & Garden

Comments

        • LOTU on 30/07/2023 - 18:40

          Depends where in Hobsons Bay he is, if near the Altona Meadows KFC they regularly run out to buns and chicken.

      • 87percent on 30/07/2023 - 08:43
        +3

        Feel free to use my Flybuys card to buy drinks, and also my Maccas account to order

        • Jake17 on 30/07/2023 - 14:02
          +2

          Is your bank card still saved to the maccas app? If so. I'll use you account

      • Mill House on 02/08/2023 - 20:20

        Bacon. Lots and lots of bacon.

  • Porker on 29/07/2023 - 21:33
    +33

    A place of worship/assembly needs a Council Planning Permit.

    Just advise Council of the situation so they can review.

  • hasher22 on 29/07/2023 - 21:40
    -3

    Don't think there's anything against the law regarding large size gatherings unless they are destroying other properties, disturbing the peace and/or noise. I mean, if they were holding a silent disco, you wouldn't know they are there.

    • mfazackerley on 29/07/2023 - 21:42
      +15

      Again I disagree. You need permits to have large gatherings to ensure there's parking, enough toilets, the place is safe etc.

      • hasher22 on 29/07/2023 - 21:52
        +3

        If you know you need a permit to such events/gatherings which is correlated with the council or city policies then go get the information directly from your council? Go directly to the source of information. If the council says X which matches up with your enquiry then raise an investigation, take a photo/video of your street and I am sure you can ask one of the attendees where the address is and go to the address and check it out yourself or follow someone to the address and take a photo.

      • Cohey on 30/07/2023 - 09:25
        -2

        Where is the evidence that you need a permit for such a gathering? If your so confident it exists show it. I can only find permits in reference to using public land for events.

        Also why are you reluctant to call the only people who can do something about it if anything, ie the police or council. You be can at least ask them questions.

        • mfazackerley on 30/07/2023 - 10:32
          +2

          They don't speak English.

          https://www.hobsonsbay.vic.gov.au/Community/Events-Festivals…

          • ozhunter on 30/07/2023 - 10:57
            +3

            @mfazackerley: If you are planning to hold an event or festival on public land, you will need a permit

            Where in that link exactly?

            Just call the council tomorrow and ask.

          • capslock janitor on 30/07/2023 - 21:32
            +1

            @mfazackerley:

            reluctant to call the only people who can do something about it if anything, ie the police or council.

            They don't speak English.

            Surely police & council have translating services …

          • Cohey on 31/07/2023 - 08:25

            @mfazackerley: That refers to public land.

          • MessyG on 31/07/2023 - 12:44

            @mfazackerley: The council will have translators to explain it to them, it's likely that they don't know. Just ring them and tell them what's going and give them a heads up they may need a translator. But usually you'll find that a couple of family members have good English and will become the spokesperson.

      • xrayed giraffe on 31/07/2023 - 13:46
        +1

        "I disagree. I can't find the law that supports my view, but it must be real"

  • TheRealCher on 29/07/2023 - 22:06
    +1

    Nahum 2:4 NIV

    The chariots storm through the streets, rushing back and forth through the squares. They look like flaming torches; they dart about like lightning

  • Archi on 29/07/2023 - 22:10

    What sort of religeous gathering are you talking about.

      • cookie2 on 30/07/2023 - 14:47
        +13

        Unnecessary and you have no basis for your attack. Your comment highlights your own issues and prejudice.

  • Mechz on 29/07/2023 - 22:16
    +3

    Start calling tow companies and get their cars impounded.

    • poboy on 30/07/2023 - 08:19
      +3

      Only for parking over driveways.

    • caitsith01 on 31/07/2023 - 16:55

      This isn't America, "tow companies" aren't going to come and tow random cars parked legally on public streets.

      • Mechz on 31/07/2023 - 17:28

        They will if they're on your private property.

  • Cave Fire on 29/07/2023 - 22:23
    +3

    Well.. are they hindu/indian? Closest thing I have seen is something called Sai bhajans. So this might be about ten cars max. Someone I knew used to have them every month basically. Noise level would be under a loud party for example. Neighbours usually put up with it. Then eventually one went crazy and would threaten them, even going as far as making a death threat eventually. Most of the time, they are able to book a hall or something and avoid issues.

    • mfazackerley on 29/07/2023 - 22:29
      +25

      Not going to go into what it is or who they are. I have no problem with them or the religion. Just the scale of it. It's a lot lot lore than 10 cars. I suspect they don't even know what they're doing probabl requires a permit

      • cookie2 on 30/07/2023 - 14:49
        +3

        Don't show here but try searching for some of the dates as a whole and see if it shows a religious group you can figure out. From there, if it happens weekly, try and figure out the next and do a nice recording on public land that you can share with council and police. An idea anyway.

      • Cave Fire on 04/08/2023 - 23:12
        +1

        Yeah, I'm hindu myself, so only asked to give closer/precise answers. They probably know what they are doing is wrong and out of "200" people one will speak english lol. It may even be that money is being collected here, so they can easily move to a hall or other grounds.

  • HardQuiz on 29/07/2023 - 22:44
    +10

    With 200 people present, I’d hate to imagine the toilet situation.

    Have you tried speaking to other neighbours and see if they share the same sentiment about parking or noise issues ?

    How did the host respond when they were told some of their guests are parking inappropriately ?

    • mfazackerley on 29/07/2023 - 23:34
      +1

      Other neighbours are pretty similar. It's one of those things where a few times and it's no big deal but we are starting to realise it's going to keep happening forever.

      Would just be great to be able to provide the property owner with a 'if you have more than x amount of people you need to do all of this'

    • H4nd0 on 30/07/2023 - 08:50
      +1

      Indeed. Next level COVID-19 toilet paper hoarding required ;)

    • dudebargain on 30/07/2023 - 20:04
      -1

      No residential toilet system can handle dumps of 200 people in a short period of time. For sure the seweage system is getting overloaded and OP needs to contact sydney water or risk the poop leaking onto the streets and peoples frontyard.

      I dont even know how the owners of the property use the toilet after 200 people took turns to destroy the porcelain. Just horrible.

  • Clear on 30/07/2023 - 00:39
    +4

    often on other neighbours front lawns (actual lawns, not just the nature strip).

    So much fun could be had with that.

    • capslock janitor on 30/07/2023 - 21:34

      could u be more clear

      • Clear on 30/07/2023 - 21:36

        Move the car, take the wheels…. the list goes on.

    • OzBarAnon on 31/07/2023 - 13:33

      That has to be illegal. Unless all of these neighbours have agreed to allow this, there's no way it's not a crime to just park your car on someone else's private property for an extended period.

  • randomusername2017 on 30/07/2023 - 02:39

    Did you not get an invite to Brigham's swingers parties?

  • franco cozzo on 30/07/2023 - 04:26
    -1

    ffs….get a church/mosque/temple!!!

  • morse on 30/07/2023 - 04:28
    +7

    Take photos and videos and submit to council (possibly anonymously) citing safety and street access concerns. It would be pretty difficult to evacuate people if there was a fire or something, hence private properties aren’t meant to be over crowded. Noise is also a valid complaint, even if not noisy 200 people is not quiet.

    The other thing would be the non urgent police line and just describe your concerns. They might pop over if they have time whilst it’s occurring and speak to the organiser.

    Personally I would go along the lines of safety and accessibility on the street. Concern that people/kids might not be seen crossing the road due to reduced visibility etc. Explain to whoever you report it to that it’s recurring.

  • Mugsy on 30/07/2023 - 07:41
    +1

    As others have said, talk to council first and go from there.

    Good luck with working through this matter OP.

  • Bob Svargis on 30/07/2023 - 08:04
    +4

    Call the Cops. They will attend if you can explain that their parking is preventing access for emergency service vehicles and blocking residential site access.

  • hueylewis on 30/07/2023 - 08:13
    +6

    HAHA l love the way that its as if the world will end if the religion is mentioned in relation to parking issues. Oooh, we can't offend anyone. Q. What happens when a person gets offended? A. NOTHING.

    • larndis on 30/07/2023 - 08:39
      -6

      So right huey! And your right to offend people is MUCH more important than anyone else's right to anything! Keep up the good fight brother

      • hueylewis on 30/07/2023 - 10:29

        correct, especially when they choose to be offended by everything.

    • mfazackerley on 30/07/2023 - 10:29
      +37

      I don't care about offending anyone. Mentioning the religion would just attract people commenting on the religion itself and not the issue at hand and that's now what I'm after and it doesn't provide the info I'm seeking

      • Senatekill on 30/07/2023 - 20:03
        +5

        big sign "PORK $5 a kg"

        • capslock janitor on 30/07/2023 - 21:35

          bring the pigs (cops) ;p

        • smartazz104 on 31/07/2023 - 21:24

          Or maybe it should say beef…

          • jackspratt on 01/08/2023 - 00:44
            +1

            @smartazz104: Yep - choose your own variety of bigotry, depending on your particular prejudices.

    • cookie2 on 30/07/2023 - 14:52
      +7

      Actually I think the problem would be that OP would be further attacked and then prob called a racist or bigot etc. Now that's the problem. The treatment of anyone that mentions religion.

  • payless69 on 30/07/2023 - 08:19
    +1

    Put a huge sign up in the park saying: Future site of open nudism.
    Soon you will get less or just in case they like it, just join them!

  • lenny on 30/07/2023 - 08:29
    +2

    Have you or any of the other neighbours raised it with the person hosting the events and highlight your concerns/issues? It might be a good starting point.

    • mfazackerley on 30/07/2023 - 10:32

      Language is a big barrier unfortunately

      • cheapaschips on 30/07/2023 - 22:53

        This sounds like an easy cop out to complain online.

        I'm sure one of them would be able to understand you wanting them to not throw the large gatherings…. And if not them surely one of the 200 that turn up in next gathering…

        But understandable if you don't want to deal with confrontation , just don't lie to yourself the real reason why you are seeking support online.

        • alxjpow on 31/07/2023 - 01:42
          +2

          Europe is a few year ahead of us in this regard.

          The language of disrespect doesn't need translation.

        • Euphemistic on 31/07/2023 - 08:31
          +1

          You don’t even have to talk to them about having the gatherings. Tell them the concerns about parking on the street and the need to involve council of it doesn’t improve.

      • OzBarAnon on 31/07/2023 - 13:37

        You mentioned that there have been instances of them outright parking on the lawns of seemingly unwilling neighbours. Surely that's enough to get police involved if it can't be resolved civilly. It shouldn't be that difficult to express "You can't park here" while gesturing to your property.

  • H4nd0 on 30/07/2023 - 08:48

    They most likely need a Level 3 Event Permit: https://www.hobsonsbay.vic.gov.au/Community/Events-Festivals…

    • Harold Halfprice on 30/07/2023 - 17:46
      +2

      If you are planning to hold an event or festival on public land, you will need a permit.

      Makes no mention of private land/property.

      • H4nd0 on 20/08/2023 - 08:24

        I noticed that after I posted. However, it would make sense to contact council and check the regulations.

  • 2esc on 30/07/2023 - 08:48
    +1

    Be discreet in your inquiries remember you have to live next door to them down the track. Definitely more of a parking issue though.

  • Minheim on 30/07/2023 - 08:49
    +2

    Generally parking on nature strips can attract fines let alone over driveways. Also regular large crowds for worshipping would seem likely to need a permit. Talk to council ans see if you can get a direct number for the ranger.

    • nwa on 30/07/2023 - 09:13
      +2

      Most suburban council rangers don't work nights, they would need to call police.

      • Lastchancetosee on 30/07/2023 - 10:08
        +2

        But maybe they'd make an effort. Imagine the parking fine revenue on that many cars on a weekly basis.

  • JIMB0 on 30/07/2023 - 09:06
    +12

    Sounds like a parking inspectors wet dream. They'd get their weekly quota on one day.

    • LOTU on 30/07/2023 - 18:44
      +1

      Hobsons Bay Parking inspectors only work on hot weekends around the beach's and make enough to slack off the whole year.

      • dwarves on 01/08/2023 - 06:02
        +1

        Around the beach’s what?

  • nwa on 30/07/2023 - 09:07
    +1

    How are the hosting 200 people ? Do they have a big tent in their backyard?

    • mfazackerley on 30/07/2023 - 10:33

      Combination of inside the house and a marquee out the back

  • kiitos on 30/07/2023 - 09:19
    +1

    Do they use a PA system so they can be heard?

  • BobD on 30/07/2023 - 09:22
    +1

    Offer to sling a slab to the local cops to come and sort it out.

    • Tleyx on 31/07/2023 - 10:29
      -1

      Isnt that bribery?

  • ChrisLevo on 30/07/2023 - 09:28
    +20

    There is a free app called SnapSendSolve which will help you.

    It lets you take photos of cars parked illegally and will send a report (time/date/address stamped) to the relevant authority.
    Photographic evidence means that the council officers don't even need to attend to issue fines.
    It gives your contact details to the authority but not to the offenders.

    Source: I am a graffiti removal volunteer at my local council and we gets heaps of graffiti reported via the app and I know that illegal parkers are also being reported and the reports actioned.

      • ChrisLevo on 30/07/2023 - 14:26
        +9

        Whatever…

        It reports:
        Graffiti,
        Illegal parking,
        Dumped rubbish,
        Vandalism,
        Trip hazards,
        Potholes,
        Abandoned trolleys,
        Damaged Telstra, NBN, water and power utility facilities,
        Abandoned cars, and more.

        I don't consider anyone reporting these a snitch, so why do you?

          • smartazz104 on 31/07/2023 - 21:27

            @Assburg: What are you worried about, only idiots who flout council laws should concerned.

            • spacemannn on 02/08/2023 - 08:07

              @smartazz104: It starts with reporting council breaches and ends with a totalitarian state under 24/7 surveillance. It's very Orwellian.

    • toniyellow on 30/07/2023 - 12:58
      +4

      I would second this.

      Had a neighbour in a house on a street that otherwise has a lot of units get shitty if any car ever parked in the street parking outside his house. He'd would just double park them in, blocking a whole lane for up to 12 hours.

      Its a side street and our Council didnt care when we called, or after the first 3 snap send solve reports, but after we just kept submitting them showing he blocked the street all the time, they finally got interested. Its a convenient way to keep a timestamped log of ongoing behaviour.

      • capslock janitor on 30/07/2023 - 21:42
        +1

        so far my few reports have never been actioned..
        i get a notif about council "viewed"the submission but nothing after

        but good idea as a log..
        tbh it felt like i was wasting time trying to make my neighbourhood better ;/

        • OzBarAnon on 31/07/2023 - 13:41

          I've only used it to report abandoned trolleys and fallen trees blocking footpaths. These seemed to get actioned quickly, but they were very straightforward (and the trolley reports just get forwarded to whichever company they belong to). Maybe it's just the council specifically being lax.

    • BeamMeUp on 30/07/2023 - 17:59
      +1

      Use SSS to report to council and do it every night it occurs. Get your neighbours to do it as well. This will get the council’s attention.
      If you get no action then contact your specific ward councillor and get them on to it.

  • Drakesy on 30/07/2023 - 09:30
    +2

    Regular gatherings would insinuate there's a possibility it's acting as a religious space/event space which would need
    1. A parking strategy - which they'd never get
    2. A use of land that is for other purposes than it's gazetted for (events space - not residential)
    3. pretty sure events/gatherings greater than like 100 people or something need to notify police/council.

    But yeah, just get the council to change the parking to residents only and see what happens

  • Tomcruise on 30/07/2023 - 09:40
    +3

    Are they renters? (Pray) they are. If so, get onto the real estate.

  • [Deactivated] on 30/07/2023 - 10:30
    +4

    So they're religious gatherings.
    I suggest you paint youself red, put on a horned hat and nakedly dance around waving a snake and trident.
    That should put an end to the problem, one way or another.

  • Assburg on 30/07/2023 - 10:37
    +1

    Sounds a bit like one of few things that might constitite a public nuisance.

  • 87percent on 30/07/2023 - 11:37

    One of the people that live across the road from us, seems to run an Uber/Didi depot from their house. They seriously have 10-15 cars at the house most times, and most of those cars are parked on the street. To get out of our driveway, need to do a 15 point turn sometimes.

    I contacted the council about it, and they said it’s a hazard to park directly opposite driveways

    • nwa on 30/07/2023 - 18:23
      +2

      How is parking opp driveways a hazard ? Even if someone says it's a hazard don't make it a parking offence.

    • Drakesy on 31/07/2023 - 13:06
      +1

      You can report it to the council that they're running a business out of their property. In my suburb they're pretty on top of it.

  • holdenmg on 30/07/2023 - 12:09
    +1

    Bikies?

  • jrvb42 on 30/07/2023 - 12:33

    Police will likely say it's a council thing, although some aspects they may help with.
    Council, even if they want to, might issue fines, but these may well get ignored, as they are impotent in enforcing the fines.
    And finally, if you do take any action, any relationship with your neighbours is going south real quick.
    Sorry, but based on my experience, you'll not end up with a happy outcome… Unless your associated with people who can help, but that ain't the police or council.

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