Workplace Cancelling Work from Home Completely

vv285 on 22/08/2023 - 11:56

So my workplace canceled WFH benefits completely and has asked people to come to work 5 days a week at the notice of a week a month ago.

Before joining the HR touted they offer 'great' flexibility and at max we will be asked to work 3 days from the office which now they completely reneged on. Most employees joined them a year ago based on such promises and now they've completely gone back on their promise.

This sudden change of rule might also be because the company is not doing well. Their share price has well below half and they might be looking to offload people without trying to lay them off. Not only that people with genuine work-from-home requests like people whose kids are registered in NDIS etc are being rejected requests officially and are being asked to take holidays or come to the office after taking care of their arrangements and working late etc.

Some of us work in IT and we really don't need to be in the workplace since its been proven over the last 3 years all over the world and they still insist that we have to be working from the office. Some people with no excuses do work from home though which angers most employees since there is a clear double standard between someone new and old employees.

Is this fair? Can something be done about this?

Education & Work

Comments

    • drprox on 23/08/2023 - 13:19
      +1

      That's an expensive day but I agree with the message

    • keejoonc on 23/08/2023 - 13:50
      +3

      Apart from the public transport cost, everything else doesn't have to cost more than it would cost you if you were to WFH. You are just lazy and that's why you choose to spend $12 for breakfast, $22 for lunch and $6 for coffee. Bring leftover for lunch, cereal/muesli for breakfast, have coffee that's provided for free at the office,
      You mention lost time, but what about the time employers lose because a lot of people get distracted and do other things while WFH?

    • johnno07 on 23/08/2023 - 13:57
      +6

      $40 worth of food every work day - this seems ridiculous.

      • dogboy on 24/08/2023 - 14:02

        Yep, agreed. That is just crazy wasteful.

        • Nebargains on 26/08/2023 - 09:39

          And lazy. Eat breakfast at home, bring your lunch. No reason to be spending so much everyday.

    • FlyingMiffy on 23/08/2023 - 19:36

      I just want to know where you are getting $6 coffees???

    • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:16
      +1

      The numbers here are so stupid the entire comment reads like it was copy/pasted from Reddit.

  • pformag on 23/08/2023 - 11:54

    Get back to the office.

    • pharkurnell on 23/08/2023 - 12:20

      They would but you dont understand how stressful daily commutes are for the body and mind

  • mrvaluepack on 23/08/2023 - 12:40

    What industry is this?

    • drprox on 23/08/2023 - 13:20

      If it's failing right now it's hard to know. Fading retail brand? Failing retail super fund? Some nonsense NFP maybe..

  • neophytte on 23/08/2023 - 13:58

    Recent article on the ABC news site: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-08-14/can-australian-employ…

  • B00stJuice on 23/08/2023 - 14:30
    -2

    About time this work from home nonsense was scrapped. Back to reality.

    • chris666 on 23/08/2023 - 18:07

      Agree

    • kaleidoscope on 24/08/2023 - 10:25
      +1

      It’s amazing how some bags of $hit heads ruined it for the rest of us.

  • one man clan on 23/08/2023 - 14:36
    +14

    Ozbargain really is the home of the bootlicker.

    • samfisher5986 on 23/08/2023 - 15:45
      -2

      Or maybe some of us can see things from the businesses point of view?

      Some people really see anything that stops them watching Netflix all day as evil….

      • newjerseydamo on 23/08/2023 - 16:27
        +6

        Or maybe it's the 1.5 hours each way between home and work, the noisy employees, the bright fluro lights, and lower quality tech that's at the office.

        • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:18

          You can always quit.

        • Nebargains on 26/08/2023 - 09:43

          Fluorescent lights? I haven't been in an office with fluorescent lighting for like 15 years. 1.5hr each way commutes? Find a job closer to home.

      • JDogg1329 on 23/08/2023 - 16:48
        +6

        Some people really see anything that stops them watching Netflix all day as evil….

        This concept is so hilarious to me, like what job exists where you can do zero work and watch Netflix all day every day?

        • star-ggg on 23/08/2023 - 22:36
          +4

          and why being in an office means they suddenly go from 0-100% output

        • samfisher5986 on 23/08/2023 - 23:13
          +2

          A lot of WFH jobs have little oversight

          • JDogg1329 on 24/08/2023 - 08:14
            +3

            @samfisher5986: Do you have any evidence of this? I work in IT and I can promise you there's plenty of oversight, exactly how much depends on the employer. Besides, how much "oversight" is there in an office really? Your boss might be sitting a few desks away in an open plan office, even if they're sitting right next to you, having Outlook open != being productive, all people need to do is click around all day and act really frustrated/annoyed, bam, they seem "productive". The idea that an office is day care for adults and we need managers to keep an eye on people all day or else the company will go bankrupt is crazy

  • pulpfiction on 23/08/2023 - 15:43
    +3

    They got you technically. You can get them.

    Do the exact hours required, not a minute over. In the mean time, find a new job. Tech is slowing, but it won't take you long.

    It sounds like the business us cooked, so it doesn't sound like fun for the next little while.

    • pencilhead on 23/08/2023 - 16:07

      Haha, our company has clauses that ban "working to rule"

  • christopher8827 on 23/08/2023 - 16:18
    +1

    You could always resign, there's a ton of other places that's hybrid or WFH.

    Choose with your feet - if I went into the office every day, I would be paying $50+ easily in public transport / Mykis and lunches weekly.

    https://www.theaussiecorporate.com/wfh-policies-2023/

    What's the company btw? You should probably leave a review on Glassdoor - I think its a massive bait & switch to do that though.

    • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:20

      Have you ever done basic math before?

      Why would the cost of your lunch be more at work than it is at home - you prep and eat it the same regardless of where you are.

  • JDogg1329 on 23/08/2023 - 16:45
    +17

    The WFH hate is so interesting to me, I think it's 100% the future for jobs that can do it. And I'm all ears if someone can explain how that's a bad thing? Less carbon emissions (My commute would be 300km's a week, 15,600kms a year), less traffic on the roads, less wear on the roads because there's less traffic on the roads, people can actually afford housing by living further out (I can't afford to buy a house closer to the office, but I also don't really want to spend more than 10 hours a week commuting and I think that's reasonable)

    I think people need to worry a little less about what's good for commercial real estate investors and worry a little more about what's better for society and peoples every day lives.

    At the end of the day if your employer won't allow WFH, that's the way it is and you'll have to find a new employer, I just find the anti-WFH propaganda interesting.

    • congo on 23/08/2023 - 21:16
      +7

      Companies saves a lot of money from not having to lease large office space and utilities. So the WFH hate is interesting.
      Maybe a lot of managers are on Ozbargain :-)

      • kaleidoscope on 24/08/2023 - 10:30
        +1

        I’m not manager and likes wfh personally. It’s just that when you see how many people abuse that freedom then it paints a different picture of it.

        I believe different sets of rules need to be put in place (idk what they look like) for the wfh to benefit both employer and employee.

        • congo on 24/08/2023 - 10:32
          +3

          Companies can tell via productivity?
          Get rid of the ones who are abusing the freedom.
          Not everyone is slacking off.

          • JDogg1329 on 24/08/2023 - 10:58
            +2

            @congo: Exactly this. Are KPI's being met? Is the work being done? Is the company making a profit?

            People slacking off while working from home is a management and HR issue not a WFH issue, the fact people can't understand this is insane to me. Forcing return to office is such a lazy sledge hammer solution.

            • kaleidoscope on 24/08/2023 - 12:54
              +2

              @JDogg1329: kpi’s are just one measure only and doesn’t really work well for a collaborative wider team when people aren’t at their desks and doing chores and $hit at anytime it pleases them. think about it :-).

              the alternative would be schedule meetings throughout the day which is total bs.

              • Usernames on 24/08/2023 - 13:13
                +2

                @kaleidoscope: What does work to measure performance of a collaborative wider team then? Need new KPIs to measure collaboration, and better use of asynchronous collaboration tools. Irrelevant where people are located. It’s just as hard to find people in a huge open office environment with meeting rooms and surrounding cafes as it is if they’re at home.

              • JDogg1329 on 24/08/2023 - 14:18
                +4

                @kaleidoscope: I fully acknowledge WFH isn't going to be suited for every team or every job but you surely can't be saying that me spending $75 in fuel and 10 hours a week commuting to an office so you don't have to book a meeting makes sense? Again, if people aren't at their desks and disappearing for the day that's a management/HR issue.

                • kaleidoscope on 24/08/2023 - 15:39
                  +1

                  @JDogg1329:

                  but you surely can't be saying that me spending $75 in fuel and 10 hours a week commuting to an office, so you don't have to book a meeting makes sense.

                  100%. I'm full supportive of wfh and the benefits of it, but what I'm saying is it's gone out of control. I believe this is because everything about wfh policies were just rushed in due to lockdowns and companies needed to keep their business operations continue.

                  if people aren't at their desks and disappearing for the day that's a management/HR issue.

                  Exactly, and from their point of view the easiest way to get back that control without going through each and every individual's needs around wfh is to simply cancel or restrict the wfh all together…

                  I work for a small company, and we got lot more than wfh benefits. However, thanks to some careless people' acts over time it recently came to a point that the management told everyone need to be available at their desks and be more communicative of the times they are away from their desks (i.e. pick up kids from school/ daycare, lunches, breaks etc…) or everyone will have to start reporting to work every day or so. Ours is just a very small company, and I can't imagine the chaos there is on a larger team / company with these matters. (Especially when I see what some of my friends at different workplaces do during work hours… it's not even funny)

                  • JDogg1329 on 25/08/2023 - 08:47

                    @kaleidoscope: I hear what you're saying, the minority ruin it for the majority

                    management told everyone need to be available at their desks and be more communicative of the times they are away from their desks

                    This seems pretty reasonable to me personally and how we do things at my workplace, there's definitely a certain level of trust and the flexibility has to go both ways. But I work for a larger company in IT so things are going to be different.

                    You're right that forcing everyone back into an office is the "easiest" way but I think it's worth fighting because it isn't the right way, while there does need to be guidelines and procedures in place that are going to be a little different from workplace to workplace, I think the WFH/Hybrid model has been proven to work, and in a lot of places works really well.

                    • samfisher5986 on 25/08/2023 - 09:25

                      @JDogg1329: Its the easiest way but its really the only way at this point in time.

                      WFH/Hybrid is nice for various reasons but it doesn't solve the fact that most people will be trying to do their WFH work at work so they can simply have the days off when they are at home and there's not much that can be done about it.

                      From a business/economic perspective I think we just need to move to a 4 day work week

    • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:22
      +1

      WFH also proves to employers that entitled crybaby wagies can and should be given the flick for much cheaper workers who can do the same thing online from overseas.

      • samfisher5986 on 25/08/2023 - 09:25
        +1

        When AI settles in, this is exactly what will happen.

      • kaleidoscope on 26/08/2023 - 01:48
        +1

        100%, that’s the unseen side of it (atleast not so much yet)

  • helpme on 23/08/2023 - 16:55
    -6

    I hope WFH ends, it's crazy how many people were priced out from their communities because people who earnt money for working in the city where housing is expensive decided they would move out. We should be encouraging higher density living and WFH doesn't really support that.

    • bokka on 23/08/2023 - 17:27
      +5

      Strange connection to make in my opinion. WFH stops high density living?

      • helpme on 23/08/2023 - 22:48
        -1

        Yep, a lot of people once they could wfh moved regional or more to the suburbs for land. Talk to any realestate agent and theyll tell you the same thing.

        House prices in regional areas now are like 2x-3x pre covid prices and people who live there are priced out.

      • helpme on 24/08/2023 - 18:56

        Also, much better to cool one building than 100 individual houses.

    • Champ888 on 23/08/2023 - 20:29
      +2

      What?!

  • Herbse on 23/08/2023 - 17:15
    +3

    Just quit and find something else. There's a line of people waiting to do your job in office if you don't want to.

    • Champ888 on 23/08/2023 - 20:31
      +1

      Now come on. Contrarian independent thought is misplaced here. Sympathetic group think only alright???

    • Name on 24/08/2023 - 17:51
      +1

      Depends on the job. We had an advert out for a year. Only finally got a quality applicant a month ago. Talking to mates at other companies, same deal. One said they've had a standing ad for about 3 years now. Same industry (civil engineering).

      • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:23
        +1

        Cool story bro.

        • Name on 25/08/2023 - 06:50
          +1

          Thanks, I'll keep you posted on any updates.

  • Wilson Wallace on 23/08/2023 - 18:00

    Here is a’ ultimatum I’d give you.

    You can work from home as long as we can monitor and track your device (More and more orgs are implementing such software)

    Or

    Go back to the office and not have anything tracked.

    • Wilson Wallace on 23/08/2023 - 18:03
      +3

      FYI - I’m not against working from home. I’ve been doing it since 2017. However mixing it up is nice.

    • some123 on 23/08/2023 - 18:15
      +1

      A few of my ex colleagues would love that. They really struggled when WFH. It was a hectic time workload and deadlines increased especially due to uncertainty. Standup meetings every day and even towards the end every few days.

      In the office it's settle down, coffee time (30mins), have a bit of a chat and read the news (30mins), do a bit of work, long lunch, work for an hour or two more before afternoon coffee before the cafes close (30mins) then wind down before hometime at 5pm.

      It's not tracking but at home we had to give status updates every day or two and those people actually had to work to get status updates. "Working" in the office has been great, status updates are once a week and they love the social aspect of it which they can't get at home (all those coffee breaks)

      • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:32
        +3

        Yeh its wonderful to know you are wasting 10 - 20 hours in a train… i guess some people have no lives and dont value their time.

        • some123 on 28/08/2023 - 15:00

          That's not me but some people I know, I've never taken it too easy to the point of taking the piss before.

          To people like them they feel like they're "winning" because the time on the train they can sit at work doing nothing because their KPI is being in the office.

          So they spend 2 hours a day on transport but they're doing nothing or chatting or coffee breaks 4 hours or more a day.

          Different mentality I guess. They don't have the hussler mentality where they want to improve themselves and get a better job. If they get a job that doesn't value presenteeism which most places don't then.

          One was unemployed for a while after not sure what happened to the others. But if it wasn't for WFH they would still be cruising along today. They got found out because they couldn't adapt to the new working environment.

    • hasher22 on 23/08/2023 - 23:37
      +10

      Or, here's another thought, if people are doing their jobs and meeting deadlines, they don't need to be micromanaged.

      Punishing people for being fast and efficient at their job shouldn't be a thing. Why should employee A spend all day working article A when they need to proof read so many times, getting opinions, following up etc….. vs employee B doing the same article when they know how to write it and they know it will be accepted?

      • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 22:24
        +1

        Those people are called management.

  • some123 on 23/08/2023 - 18:04
    +2

    Just find a workplace that spans the country or internationally. When I'm in the office it's just Microsoft teams because my team members are all based in different cities.

    I'm seated with people from different teams which I rarely see anyway.

  • baldur on 23/08/2023 - 18:08
    +4

    You can stop feeling like you deserve everything with no effort is a good start.

  • star-ggg on 23/08/2023 - 19:26
    -1

    The only ppl that like WFH are those that hate their home life. A half empty office reminds them of this so they want to force everyone to come in.

    • DontNeedThis on 24/08/2023 - 22:53
      +1

      Did you mean the only people who don't like wfh?

  • FlyingMiffy on 23/08/2023 - 19:29
    +3

    If its not a contracted entitlement, then its simply the OP feeling entitled. Those of us who worked prior to COVID know that whatever the work conditions, you are either make it work or you go elsewhere. The company is within their rights to set the employment rules. you are within your right to chose to work for them or not.

    • Randolph Duke on 25/08/2023 - 08:38
      +1

      I don’t see how it’s entitled - many employers were touting flexible working arrangement as a benefit during hiring processes. Problem is without it in writing in the contract very easy for it to be revoked, which is happening at more and more workplaces.

      Problem from my point of view is companies have expensive commercial leases for unused buildings, so it’s not really a productivity issue being solved.

      • FlyingMiffy on 25/08/2023 - 10:26

        A company with expensive leases is an expense thats already in the bottom line. Whether there are people in there or not makes no difference to that cost. The reason a business wants people back is because the business thinks there is an operational and a productivity benefit to them.

        • Randolph Duke on 25/08/2023 - 11:24

          Based on discussions I’ve had, paying for something that isn’t used annoys senior management.

  • Exorcist on 23/08/2023 - 19:34
    +8

    Reading the comments makes me realise the worst thing about Covid is all the boomers it left

    • yoshi864 on 24/08/2023 - 16:42
      +4

      OzBargain has some pretty loud boomer/conservative voices. Just look at any controversial deals like the anti-trans movie, free meals at mosques, or anything to do with Crypto.

  • SpicyStew on 23/08/2023 - 21:19

    yea, you could find a new job if what you want isn't in your contract

  • sauce2k on 23/08/2023 - 21:20

    Just quit mate

  • RADICALIST on 23/08/2023 - 21:58
    +3

    Sounds like your company wants to make redundancies but doesn't want to make it public.

  • syousef on 23/08/2023 - 22:02
    +5

    This thread is bringing out the worst in people.

  • Cusack on 23/08/2023 - 22:07

    Start sending the resume out. There’s jobs out there

  • ram4ram on 23/08/2023 - 22:25

    Is this WISR?

    Because your stock price has become dismal, Abu of Agriba would be ashamed.

  • [Deactivated] on 23/08/2023 - 23:09
    +1

    Is this fair? - It depends.
    Can something be done about this? - No, you don't make the decisions for the company. You only make decision about your employment contract with the company.

  • AustriaBargain on 24/08/2023 - 02:19

    Augmented rarity/VR is going to change all this soon. Why would an employer even want you in the office unless you are client facing when they can get you to wear a work VR headset which guarantees you won't see anything but work related stuff. Employees will be begging to come into the office after a few weeks of staring at literally nothing but spreadsheets and virtual 3D avatars of their coworkers.

    • drprox on 24/08/2023 - 08:01

      A frightening thought haha. Won't likely happen in our lifetimes but I could imagine it happening. I can't wear the VR suit anyway as I get pressure headaches from it, apparently….

    • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:31
      +2

      Simple the only people who want everyone in the office are the managers….

      because in WFH situations managers are basically worthless, what exactly do they do ? NOTHING… what do they do in the office, nothing but attend meetings which they congtribute nothing.

      • AustriaBargain on 24/08/2023 - 14:33

        Sounds like a lot of managers could be replaced by near future AI.

        • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:36

          The workers who get stuff done are not children and dont need a big mother or father to watch they are working. If you trust them to do the work, then let them do it. I fail to see why a manager who cant do the work themselves because they dont have the skill sis necssary.

          • AustriaBargain on 24/08/2023 - 14:51

            @CowFrogHorse: Someone needs to be aware of what workers are doing and what the actual bosses want. There needs to be a middleman because the actual bosses time is too valuable to understand what a large team of workers actually do day to day.

        • samfisher5986 on 25/08/2023 - 09:28

          The workers are going to lose their jobs before the Managers.. the Managers will be overseeing the AI.

  • Dreamcast on 24/08/2023 - 07:11
    +5

    Take two things from this.

    1. It's a sign to move on, rather than get comfortable. Yes it's not ideal for you right now. But apply for other work now and you may end up with a great opportunity.

    2. People in here would make horrible employees, managers, co workers, etc. Be happy that you don't work with either of them.

  • SydBoy on 24/08/2023 - 07:12
    +1

    it is not about fairness… if you have a micromanager or manager who lives within 30minutes from the work or manager who rather stay in office then to stay with his/her partner … will always going to force back to office …. it is inevitable… unfortunately.

    if you have manager opposite what i said above then he/she will never force nether even ask you to see your face as long as work is done… !

  • sashatheman on 24/08/2023 - 08:41

    Look for a new role outside the company. If the flexibility (lack of) is not working for you, show them that they will lose out.
    I personally would do that if my company said i have to be in the office 5 days a week. I don't have the patience for that shit.

  • misu p on 24/08/2023 - 08:56
    +5

    A lot of slave mentality in this thread. I get to decide if I want to go back to work and I will decide by walking away and finding somebody else to pay me.

    To the people that say "the employer decides", he decides on the rules, I decide if I want to follow them… maybe you would have the same option as me of walking away if you were good at your job…

    • SydBoy on 24/08/2023 - 09:10
      +1

      rightly said… employer decide rule and employee decide if they want to follow (then stay) or find something else (if they don't want to follow)… !!!

      many manager think that they get money out of their own pocket to pay the employee and lost the reality that it is the business that run by skill of the employee that pays not the manager who simply manage people … !!!

      I came across a moron manager who always offer 30% less pay to new joiner as he/she compares that to what he/she used to get paid 10 years ago … and in order to satisfy his/her mental weakness or weirdness she/he only employ migrant new to country who will accept any pay happily … ! (as she/he was migrant and always thought that the company obliged her/him by employing her/him as her/his first job) unfortunately some people just don't realise that they are living under psychological sickness … !!!

      • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:38

        If the employer wants people in the office, they should pay for the staff's time requird to travel back and forth.

        I fail too see why the employer should be allowed to make demands without payment….

        Plumbers, courier, doctors charge for coming to your home, and staff should also be paid…

        • SydBoy on 24/08/2023 - 14:49

          not just for travel time but also for transport cost … in sydney it cost at-least $12 to go to CBD and come back … and i think more in morning peak time.. !

    • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:41
      +1

      Lots of people are brainwashed by watching too much american tv, where everybody is on their knees to their work.. Boss doesnt want to pay overtime, boss doesnt want to pay for sick days, boss doesnt want to …so they have tips…

      Pathetic, show some backbone people.

    • drprox on 24/08/2023 - 17:16
      +1

      Yeah there's a lot of comments here that I 'suspect' are from those back to in the office full-time or never enjoyed the flexibility of WFH in the first place. They may also not be able to get a new job as readily as others. Otherwise I genuinely can't work out why they want us all back clogging up their transport, roads, cafes…etc

      Further, if those of us digging in all lose our jobs, lucky them! More job choice !

    • infinite on 24/08/2023 - 21:57
      +1

      Your either gonna follow their rules or you wont have an employer.

      Pretty simple.

      • misu p on 26/08/2023 - 08:24

        or…. and try to use your imagination… You find an employer with different rules… easy to do if you are good at your job.

        If you suck at your job then slave away mate.

        For me, it is: either they have rules that I like or they need to find another employee.

  • corvusman on 24/08/2023 - 09:19
    +11

    It’s funny how everyone suddenly forgot that average office worker actually works for about 3 hours on average each day.

    Dozens of studies from Before Covid times proved that, but somehow these days office-full-time is an epitome of amazing productivity 😁

    • SydBoy on 24/08/2023 - 10:40
      +4

      that is true .. productivity actually improved by working from home as people in sydney in particular can save easily 2 to 3 hr of commute life every day plus other time and money they waste to get ready and spend while away from home.

      The real reason all this push about telling people to go back is because top end of the town realise that their money making machines i.e. real estate (office buildings) and small business that takes high interest rate loan no longer interested or making money so that is why this push coming back to people go to office in city and company pay big time in rents and small coffee shop owner charge $5 for small coffee and pay 30% of that profit to banks … !

      so in nutshell it's all about money nothing about productivity or mental health (as said by bendingo bank CEO recently).

      • CowFrogHorse on 24/08/2023 - 14:30

        You forget people working from home saves tax payers BILLIOns on stupid projects like the metro.

        According to the government the NW metro cost $8B and they have 20M pax a year, run this for 10 years, that means each trip on the metro is costing tax payers $50. The workers catching the metro to work tax doesnt even pay for the cost of their trip.

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