Living Only Using Cash - Is It No Longer Possible?

bargain huntress on 22/01/2024 - 21:43

I have been considering trying ditching the plastic and the online banking and going cash only.
For a couple of reasons:
To resist the imposition of a cashless society - use it or lose it.
And there are numerous budgeting systems where people use cash only. For some people the physical cash is the psychological thing they need to stay on budget. David Ramsay's Envelope System is probably the most famous.

I was planning to test out paying bills at Australia Post.

Well look what they've done:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12990531/Aussie-out…

'Some billers charge a bill-payment fee for bills paid in person,' Australia Post told Yahoo.

'Australia Post charges the utility for processing the payment and it is common for companies to pass this onto the customer,' Telstra said.

Both blaming each other of course

Financial

Comments

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:27
      +3

      Cash payments work great, until they don't. How do you pay an electricity bill or similar on a Sunday?

      • jackspratt on 23/01/2024 - 14:16
        +2

        Wait till Monday?

        • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 15:32

          So exactly the same solution when digital payments don't work. Thanks for confirming my point.

          • elgrande on 23/01/2024 - 17:48
            +1

            @Typical16-bitEnjoyer: Quite different.

            If you can't buy food on Sunday and have to wait till Monday…ouch.

            If you can't pay a bill… meh.

            • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 23:48
              +1

              @elgrande: If an outage on a Sunday means you starve to death, then cash isn't the problem in that scenario.

  • affable on 23/01/2024 - 09:47
    +1

    The federal government should provide a digital currency card. We need a cash equivalent without the credit card surcharges.

    • jellykingdom on 23/01/2024 - 10:37
      +2

      I have noticed the steady creep of CC fees into pretty much every single aspect of life. I bet its going to need to be the next government intervention

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 23/01/2024 - 10:53

      Hey peasants here's our CDBC which you must use and we have full control over every aspect of how you use it. We promise we wont use it in the wrong way to limit your freedoms or restrict your speech. We promise you will never be without transport or food because of your political beliefs.

      • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 10:56
        +4

        …canadian truckers <cough> paypal <cough> trudeau <cough>

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 10:55
      +1

      They are planning an official cryptocurrency to at least partially replace the electronic australian dollar

      A CBDC - central bank digitial currency

      Its a bit scary and dystopian actually

      • EightImmortals on 23/01/2024 - 10:59
        +1

        A lot of people are pushing back around the world even though the government are pushing it. I think Corbett did a report on it late last year. His site is down ATM as he is doing an upgrade but I'll post back when it's up.

      • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 11:00
        +5

        Transaction Denied. You have exceeded your monthly Carbon Credit Limit allocation.
        Please acquire additional Carbon Credits via ApplePay or GooglePay to proceed with your purchase.

        • valuer on 23/01/2024 - 15:43
          +4

          That is the sort of future some are walking blindly into.

        • affable on 25/01/2024 - 16:16

          Instead in our paper cash world, just this week I have a tradesman saying he just did a $40k job in one day, saying it was worth getting up at 4am and not finishing until 10pm. I said is that gross or nett? He replied "Cash, so of course it's all gross profit". Yep he and his business partner do $200k EACH in cash work every year.
          I've yet to hear a tradesman boast of never doing cash work. I'll take the risk of government control, it's government issued cash after all.

      • Malik Nasser on 23/01/2024 - 11:16
        +1

        Its not all bad. There are some positive aspects to it as well (competition which reduces bank/merchant fees, quicker international payments, etc…).
        As long as it is additive to the existing financial system and does not cannibilise peoples ability to choose what type of money they wish to use.
        Choices are good.
        Forcing people to adopt a system is bad.
        They should just put it out there and let people adopt it at their own speed.
        If it is superior, then it will naturally take majority share.
        People just need to be aware of what it is, what they are sacrificing in using it, and to push back if there is any overreach.

        Also it is not a cryptocurrency, in that it is a centralised system run by a part of the government, so doesn't meet the typical description.

    • pinsanity on 23/01/2024 - 14:12
      +1

      Laying the groundwork for it already.

      https://www.ashurst.com/en/insights/whole-of-economy-digital…

      The second half of this decade is going to be interesting to say the least.

  • richadam on 23/01/2024 - 09:52
    +3

    David Ramsay's Envelope System

    What's stopping you doing that digitally?

    Most banks allow you to open multiple everyday accounts (with or without a card attached to it) that you can use as "envelopes". Heck, my bank even allows you to hide accounts behind a vault, so you can effectively hide money to stop you spending the money if you lack the self control.

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 10:53

      Good point

      I have actually done multiple accounts on and off for years

      It does help quite a lot

      I still have a lot of problems though

      • richadam on 23/01/2024 - 11:00
        +2

        Not being able to see how much is in it and not having a card attached to the account would help as well. Therefore it's more difficult to use the money and you don't see it every time you open the app.

        • valuer on 23/01/2024 - 15:45
          +1

          Those system are reliant on people being able to see and appreciate what they have available to spend. It's a method of control that is lost in a digital record, sort of how the brain remembers more of something that is written over something that is typed.

          • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 16:55

            @valuer: Interesting

            Thank you

            I do think i should try it, fees and all perhaps

      • johnno07 on 23/01/2024 - 16:12
        +1

        I feel like your problems aren't going to be solved by going fully cash. Rather you're just going to stack a bunch of inconvenience atop your budgeting inability.

        • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 16:55

          It is possible

          I have had that concern myself

          Any other suggestions?

  • gyrex on 23/01/2024 - 10:02
    +7

    Is there a correlation between the "cash is king" cookers and conspiracy theorists/flat earthers/homeopathy pushers/antivaxxers etc.? The reason I ask is that in my Facebook feed it always seems to be the same people peddling the batshit crazy ideologies are now jumping on the cash bandwagon.

    • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 10:31
      -1

      …the correlation is a lot of people would like a choice and a say in the matters that greatly affect them.

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:12
        +3

        Welcome to late stage capitalism. Buy from places that take your cash, or stop whinging, preferably both.

        • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 11:16
          -2

          nah mate. i'll (profanity) whinge as much as i like

          • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:21
            +3

            @franco cozzo: So, I tied an onion to my belt which was the style at the time. Now, to take the ferry cost a nickel. And in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on ‘em. ‘Give me five bees for a quarter,’ you’d say. Now, where were we? Oh, yeah! The important thing was that I had an onion on my belt which was the style at the time.

      • gyrex on 23/01/2024 - 11:16
        +7

        16% of transactions are made with cash. Just like gold died out, cash will also die out due to people voluntarily choosing to use more modern payment systems. Crying over a naturally changing marketplace is asinine.

        • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 11:19

          accessibility issues, privacy issues, control issues, issues surrounding liberty & freedom to spend your money how & where you like
          but hey lets ignore all that….times change. sometimes for the worse, it seems….

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 10:02
    +8

    I was planning to test out paying bills at Australia Post.

    Yay, love picking up a parcel that I got carded despite being home, and 30 oldies lined up paying a bill.

    Name any of your service providers that charge to pay using Bpay?

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 10:49

      Good points

      Ive heard people say they just hide the cost of electronic transactions in the bill or item cost though

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:09
        +3

        Ive heard people say that cash/cashless society fears are pretty unhinged and indicate other issues.

        • gyrex on 23/01/2024 - 11:26
          +2

          As I mentioned above, the same people usually dabble in other unhinged beliefs such as bizarre conspiracy theories, antivax propaganda, homeopathy/spirituality etc. - we used to house them in insane asylums but now they've got the internet to connect to other like minded lunatics to feed and validate their insanity.

          • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 11:28
            +1

            @gyrex: They love their conspiracy Youtube vids. Never seen any of them whinge that Youtube doesn't accept cash for Premium membership strangely enough.

  • lechuck123 on 23/01/2024 - 10:13
    +5

    I support your efforts and what you're trying to do. Just not enough to do it myself.

    I pay cash at bars and things that charge a card surcharge as I absolutely can't stand that crap. My main issue with cash is the coins, I don't want to carry them around.

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 10:47
      +1

      Thank you

      They are heavy, thats definitely a downside

  • Mitchtastic on 23/01/2024 - 10:16
    +3

    I like seeing all the old crazy people on facebook go nuts over a business being card only now, when those same people would've abused the chinese shops 10 years ago for being cash only and dodging the eftpos fees

    • franco cozzo on 23/01/2024 - 10:32

      thats some great imaginationing

  • stuffandthat on 23/01/2024 - 10:44
    +2

    A local cafe has all those cash is preferred signs up etc which got me thinking. At the end of the day they still have to take that cash and deposit it into their account so they can pay staff, suppliers, bills and everything else. Seems easier for them if everyone paid by card - they don't have to take that to the bank.

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 10:46
      +1

      I suppose they could do at least a lot of that with cash.

      Some people prefer because they like to be illegal and not declare all their income to the ato

    • eek on 23/01/2024 - 10:47
      +2

      Orrrrrrrrrrr, it goes straight to the post office to pay their bills, pay school fees, pay for vacations, jewellery. Pay for things that difficult to justify as 'business expenses'. Minimise taxable income, maximise expenses.

    • richadam on 23/01/2024 - 16:01
      +4

      It's easier to skim off the top if nothing is recorded properly.

  • eek on 23/01/2024 - 10:45
    +4

    Tell us you're a drug dealer or receiving cash income without declaring to the ATO without tell us you are ;) ;) ;)

  • pnt on 23/01/2024 - 10:51
    +3

    Next up - trying to use gold only.

  • payless69 on 23/01/2024 - 11:16

    Do they still sell lipstick for cash?

    • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 17:01

      Can someone explain all the lipstick references to me please?

      • payless69 on 23/01/2024 - 17:23
        +1

        Sorry I have been receiving too many emails.
        National Australia Bank just wrote to me:

        Great News! We are now on Tik Tok!

        Really what had NAB got to do on Tik Tok other than compromising their integrity even further.
        Now I do understand that more and more people prefer cash!

  • Cheap Gamer on 23/01/2024 - 12:08
    +2

    Gimme Da Caaaassssh!!!

  • yamahamoto on 23/01/2024 - 12:29

    Cash will still be here for a long time. Australians might use cash less but people visiting Australian won’t. Lots of Europeans are still using mainly cash.

    • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 15:43
      +1

      And Japan. I was shocked by the number of outlets that don't accept cards there.

      • smartazz104 on 24/01/2024 - 10:26
        +2

        Because Japan is stuck at around the year 2000; they love their fax machines too…

  • Antikythera on 23/01/2024 - 12:33

    there is no way Australia will ever go cashless.

    because the government regulators will never allow Pokies that accept credit card / eftpos card payments. currently the ATM must be outside the Pokies area of the venue and there is a limit on daily withdrawals per account. which is why true degenerates have multiple accounts.

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 15:34
      +2

      Easy solution. We go pokie-less first.

      • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 16:15
        +3

        One of the good things about living in WA - no pokies

        • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 17:05

          Wow really?

          • jackspratt on 23/01/2024 - 17:21

            @bargain huntress: Probably not.

            While WA does not allow traditional pokies in the wider community, the Crown Casino has 2000+ legal EGMs (Electronic Gaming Machines) on its premises.

            One could argue pretty convincingly that there is little difference between the 2.

            • liongalahad on 23/01/2024 - 20:04
              +4

              @jackspratt: massive difference as you have to physically go to one specific location to play pokies, for many people is a relatively long trip, as opposed to just walk to your usual pub. Massively reduced risk of people getting seriously addicted to the ugly pokies.

              • jackspratt on 23/01/2024 - 21:01

                @liongalahad: So in your understanding, what does

                no pokies

                mean?

                • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 21:09
                  +1

                  @jackspratt: Let me rephrase that - no pokies in pubs and clubs.

                  Happy?

                  • jackspratt on 24/01/2024 - 00:06

                    @R4: I am sure the entire internet is happy when a mistake is corrected.

                    • R4 on 24/01/2024 - 01:00

                      @jackspratt: Possibly but I'm sure that you are

                • liongalahad on 23/01/2024 - 23:50

                  @jackspratt: I didn't say there's no pokies in WA, read again what I wrote

        • Eeples on 23/01/2024 - 22:58

          Do you have those blackjack machines?

          Gosh I miss those.

      • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 17:05

        Wouldnt that be nice

    • whatgift on 23/01/2024 - 19:55

      That reasoning doesn't stack up - if anything, going digital will give better control on how much people spend on pokies, because digital usage can be tracked.

  • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 15:42
    +1

    I've gone back to using cash much more (where it's feasible), basically because if we stop using cash the government will take it away from us (they've already made a limited attempt to start doing this). I tend to try and use it at larger retailers, but at smaller, usually Asian, businesses I usually use a card as a lot of cash would not be declared. If cash disappears, democracy is effectively on its way to being over as the government will have total oversight of how you spend your money (as is happening in CCPland). Those on the left won't mind this as they dig government control but normal people would/should rail against this. We need legislation guaranteeing the use of cash (UK has done this). Retailers should have a legal obligation to accept cash, which currently doesn't exist.

    • valuer on 23/01/2024 - 15:54
      +1

      Many truths there.

      Retailers should have a legal obligation to accept cash, which currently doesn't exist

      Or, further, should have an obligation to provide a fee-free method of payment if they choose not to accept cash. There are so many outlets, particularly cafes, where it is not possible to buy items for the advertised prices.

      • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 15:59
        +1

        I thought, but correct me if I'm wrong, that a retailer that doesn't accept cash cannot charge a card fee?

        • valuer on 24/01/2024 - 20:49
          +1

          Yes they can - but it gets ambiguous about what is necessary to cover the need to 'advise' a customer.

      • SirCH on 24/01/2024 - 13:42
        +1

        should have an obligation to provide a fee-free method of payment if they choose not to accept cash

        Oh, you mean the law?

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 23/01/2024 - 20:13
      +1

      You could buy Visa debit cards and pay that way. ASIO isn't tracking you, you can chill.

      • R4 on 23/01/2024 - 21:42
        +2

        Just use cash, much simpler.

        I know ASIO isn't tracking me, I just want to keep certain financial affairs private .

        If that's not an issue for you then party on with that Garth.

  • Brianqpr on 23/01/2024 - 16:20
    +1

    Tax evaders getting nervous I see.

    • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 23/01/2024 - 19:01
      -4

      All taxation is theft.

      • bargain huntress on 23/01/2024 - 21:02

        How do we get roads and hospitals without tax though?

        • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 24/01/2024 - 09:04

          Lol, everyone always says "what about the roads!?"

          The simple answer is people want to drive on roads and people want to keep building roads. Tax is no barrier to any of that.

          • gyrex on 24/01/2024 - 09:20
            +1

            @OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Everyone says it because most people have the requisite intellect to appreciate that public infrastructure and services requires money (raised by tax revenue) to build and maintain them. It's a shame you're not "most people".

            • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 24/01/2024 - 10:46

              @gyrex: On the contrary, most people put zero effort into learning about how things could be done and lack even the smallest hint of imagination. That and the fact that they are idealogically bound by their beliefs about the world. Its a shame you are most people.

          • bargain huntress on 24/01/2024 - 10:48

            @OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Would people have to build and maintain the roads they want to drive on themselves?

            • OBEY YOUR MASTERS on 24/01/2024 - 11:09

              @bargain huntress: I guess it would depend on who drives on the road and what the purpose of the road is. One way or another you always pay for what you use. If the road exists to tranport products then it will be built into the cost of the product. If the road is a driveway to your house and you are the only user then you will probably pay to fix it. But then again you wont be paying a buttload of tax in every single aspect of life so you will have adequate funds.

              • bargain huntress on 25/01/2024 - 15:12

                @OBEY YOUR MASTERS: Ok. That makes some sense.

                How would we organise the building and repair of a highway? Because lots of people use those all the time. Would someone have to own it and building and maintaining it is how they make their living from tolls?

                Also how would we get from here with a government and tax to little or no government and no tax? It sounds like you would need a nasty revolution and there would be heaps of corruption? For example oligarchs would buy or be given all the highways for cheap and then make money from the tolls?

  • Ghost47 on 23/01/2024 - 16:46
    +2

    Michele Bullock floated the idea of going cashless in December. She said that since less people are using cash it would cost more to service them or something.

    I get where people are coming from; if less people use cash then it will eventually cost more to keep ATMs open, bank branches open etc. but at the same time card transaction fees should decrease (or disappear altogether) if more people are opting to pay with plastic, but is that happening?

    I'm personally against becoming a cashless society; we've seen that telco networks are held together with sticky tape and glue, we simply aren't ready to go cashless IMO. Change for the sake of change again because someone out there is trying to justify their Chief of Innovation job.

  • TEER3X on 23/01/2024 - 17:28
    +1

    No way I'm giving up cash, they'll track me for sure.

    I don't even have internet.

  • SpicyStew on 23/01/2024 - 18:50

    buy & use gift cards

  • whatgift on 23/01/2024 - 19:37
    +3

    Cash is dying - there is only one company in Australia who actually transports cash now, and they admit it's fast becoming an unprofitable business. Once we go cashless then surcharges will hopefully disappear, and providers will need to have redundancy systems in place.

    While people who want to keep using cash will have some avenues to do so, they will soon be left behind and will struggle with the change. Intentionally resisting it will not change the situation, and it's been coming for a long time. People need to learn to manage their finances in a digital world, which is easier than it ever was.

  • liongalahad on 23/01/2024 - 20:01
    +3

    I am the diametrically opposite, I just hate cash with all myself. Long live the cashless society

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