Unbanning of CoTD

Cripto on 29/10/2010 - 00:25
Last edited 29/10/2010 - 00:30

hey i know the story isn't public, but it goes something along the lines of COTD staff were backing their own deals. i think we should still be able to post deals when they're good, and maybe QQQ can give us further discount like usual if he feels like it. dunno why a few COTD staff caused the whole domain to be banned, banning them is all that is required.

i know sockpuppeting is a big offense, and any act of it will cause a banning of accounts and possibly business. but it's not like COTD is a new startup company, it's well known and i'm sure alot of people on here still buy from them.

i reckon it's not a good reason to ban the whole posting of the domain, but rather just banning the IPs of the staff involved in sockpuppeting. there can't be that many of them right? COTD are so rich i don't think they care that much about their site being posted on here imo. so in the end it's just the members here losing out on exclusive discounts we once got.

but then again i don't know the whole story and how severe the sockpuppeting was or who was involved, so maybe staff can comment further. it's just a pain to see COTD deals posted in the forums now, having to check two places for good deals. keeping in mind bad deals of theirs just like any site will get negs and won't appear, whereas the good ones will get +ve, so it all comes down to the community. therefore they only get the exposure they deserve.

let me know what you guys think, thanks

General Discussion

Comments

  • [Deactivated] on 29/10/2010 - 00:33

    I hate it when the deals are good and all people do is complain about the servers and how they couldnt bite! them…

  • neil on 29/10/2010 - 02:34
    +9

    Cripto, I see what you are saying. The ban prevents users from accessing COTD's possibly good deals. That hurts the community. Companies artificiality commenting and voting for deals goes against the ethics of what this site does and how it works. That hurts the community. Personally, if I had to weigh holding the integrity of our voting system vs. not getting some deals temporarily I would pick the first.

    If we make an exception of COTD, then we would have to make it for others. Businesses would use COTD as a an excuse. Note this isn't the first time these guys have done this.

  • overlook on 29/10/2010 - 02:51
    +1

    i dont know what deal did we miss? truthfully, i have never ever BITTEN any of those extraordinary deal such as ps3 for 199…other than that, their daily deals are quite average…if they break the rules and got banned there isnt much lost from me…most ppl already gotten on to their email notification system…if they also choose to delay the sending of email, who to blame?

  • Cripto on 29/10/2010 - 03:06

    I guess your right neil, but haven't all the puppets been banned except QQQ? i think as long as COTD employee puppets aren't welcome here, there will be no imbalance. i think only the startup companies with bad deals have been caught for sockpuppeting, unless there have been other reputable bans? i'm not sure, but the ones who do get banned for sockpuppeting are usually international or just got no idea about anything lol, i doubt they'd use cotd as an excuse.

    @jasecs, i think you've totally missed the point i don't know how to respond lol

  • arcticmonkey on 29/10/2010 - 07:39
    +1

    Whinge, whinge, whinge. Is it that big a deal to visit the site?

    I didn't think my opinion of COTD could get worse but with the recent developments, it has.

    Voting up your own deals? Pathetic really.

    • Cripto on 29/10/2010 - 13:41
      -2

      someone else who totally missed the point, i would consider maybe reading the initial thread

      don't let your emotions get the most of you people and read the proposition and benefits :)

      • StewBalls on 30/10/2010 - 15:05

        I think you've made valid points! It's a complex situation that really needs to be thought out!

        I'm not gonna mince words here, I come to OzB for bargains, end of story! I won't pretend to be acting in anyone's best interest but my own by looking here! Then enjoyment I derive from harassing you guys & engaging in avoidance behaviours is all secondary gain! ;)

        Now, I might be a bit over COTD, but I still check their site frequently in case they have something I really want (and that I can be prepared to wait ages for)! Now, for those newer OzBargainers who aren't so familiar with the various online retailers to miss out on that opportunity simply because some COTD muppet has been stupid, is not fair; and I'm sure neither in the spirit of the site or the intention of the mods!

  • Mikinoz on 29/10/2010 - 08:41

    Why cant we all just get along lol

  • StewBalls on 29/10/2010 - 10:40
    +7

    I just don't understand why companies continue to use sockpuppeting?

    Surely marionettes, animatronics or a ventriloquist's dummy would be far more difficult to spot! :p

  • leonheart1 on 29/10/2010 - 10:47
    +1

    How about we let the users of Ozbargain decide?
    Have a vote or something. :)

    • Mikinoz on 29/10/2010 - 13:45
      +7

      Now thats a great idea! , although we all know voting doesnt work around here…..

      • Tenebrae on 31/10/2010 - 20:38
        +10

        No, this is simply a more indirect erosion of the rules. COTD knows the rules (no sockpuppeting), and violated them numerous times. The rules have been enforced. Can it get any more straightforward?

        If any retailer, big or small, wants to use this website as a vehicle to greater (positive) customer exposure, they must be willing to do so on the terms of the site's owners and operators. Deliberately (and repeatedly) attempting to misuse the site shouldn't be treated leniently - they deserve every bit of bad publicity they get out of this.

        • Mikinoz on 31/10/2010 - 20:48

          Umm you may have replied to the wrong post, otherwise your reply makes no sense as a reply?

          i do agree with your rant though, mostly.

        • Tenebrae on 01/11/2010 - 02:05

          Yeah, I meant to reply to the same post you did unfortunately. Sorry for the mixup!

        • leonheart1 on 01/11/2010 - 02:12
          +1

          So you were replying to mine then.
          Well just hold on- you're assuming I want them unbanned.

          Hellllllllllllll NO!

          I want them to stay banned for all the grief they've caused us ozbargainers but I wanted it in more than just mere words.
          Votes seem to be the most definite option and that's why I suggested one. I wanted everyone to vote against COTD, not with them.

        • Tenebrae on 01/11/2010 - 10:27

          While it is true that I made that assumption, I don't think it was essential to my argument.

          Firstly, because there's no point holding a vote when you already have an intended outcome (the point of a vote is to provide an outcome for an unresolved dispute, not rubber-stamp an already decided outcome).

          Secondly because a vote would still be further action on the matter that could be misused later as a precedent for other rule-breakers to draw things out. "Oh ok, we broke the rules and you banned us but instead of keeping us banned why not open it up to a user-wide vote? You did it for COTD!" Sure this time you'd probably get everyone agreeing to enforce the ban, but next time might be different.

          When there are clear rules, and clear consequences for breaking them, any kind of elaboration or alternative action serves only to weaken both the rules and the punishments.

  • samfisher5986 on 30/10/2010 - 00:09

    The main problem is that they have been banned on what the mods managed to figure out.

    Unbanning them might mean the next time they try they figure out a way to do it undetected.

    We know their intentions so perhaps its best to keep them banned, or maybe only allow people who have been registered for 1+ years to vote or something.

    • [Deactivated] on 30/10/2010 - 01:10

      hm…1 year might be too much O_O

      just leave me out of this…haha

      • StewBalls on 30/10/2010 - 15:10
        +3

        NO SOUP FOR YOU, one year!!! ;)

        • Pizza The Hut on 01/11/2010 - 13:35
          +3

          No stew for you, one year!!! :)

    • POWERevolution on 01/11/2010 - 05:38
      +3

      We know their intentions so perhaps its best to keep them banned

      Banned COTD for life!!!

  • Davo1111 on 01/11/2010 - 00:06
    +2

    I would have sympathised, but they have been caught for sockpuppeting twice this year.

    imho after the first issue it wouldn't be hard to send an email around the office "don't go on ozbargain and vote for our deal"

    • Tenebrae on 01/11/2010 - 02:06

      They have… an office?

      I always got the impression that COTD was a big basement job. =P

    • AntMan76 on 01/11/2010 - 13:47
      +2

      Where will they find time to email their staff when they don't email their own customers, not to mention finding time in between tv appearances.

    • arcticmonkey on 01/11/2010 - 23:21
      +2

      If COTD are unbanned after repeatedly breaking the rules, I'll lose a lot of respect for OzBargain.

      • scotty on 01/11/2010 - 23:33
        +2

        That is also a problem that OzBargain is facing with its members.

        CoTD has great number of bargains in the past and I personally would like to see them here again. I also believe that it is also what the majority of OzBargain users want. However, they were banned for rule breaking, and we do need to make a hard stance. The problem of sockpuppeting is seriously hurting the Internet communities.

        Anyway. Unbanned or not, OzBargain is going to lose some respect form some users anyway.

        Catch of The Day was on temporary ban and will be automatically unbanned on 12 Nov.

        • arcticmonkey on 01/11/2010 - 23:44
          +1

          So are you allowed to sockpuppet twice before facing permanent disciplinary action? If so, it seems that businesses are free to sockpuppet on repeated occasions and still be allowed on OzBargain. Well, I hope the rules are consistent and no businesses are permanently banned for sockpuppeting once or twice.

          What happens if a business offends for a third time?

        • scotty on 02/11/2010 - 00:20

          @arcticmonkey — the rules are there for a reason, and it is not about blindly executing the rules for the sake of it.

          "Consistency" is good when you don't have to pay too much thoughts on the consequence and whether the action brings the best outcome to all parties involved. Easy for me & the moderators — but I don't think the result is always desirable.

          What we are trying to achieve here is still bringing bargains to the community. Catch of The Day has long posting history on OzBargain and many members have benefit the bargains posted by them (thus why this thread was created in the first place). I also understand that the recent ban is related to the new brand they introduced (ScoopOn) and new staffs voting on deals from both brands.

          I'll try to talk to QQQ this week to make sure staffs @ CoTD and ScoopOn are aware of the situation.

        • scotty on 02/11/2010 - 00:23
          +1

          Btw I am actually quite surprised how many Australian shops — many are multi-store retailers — game on Internet communities. Most are actually done by zealous staffs without authorisation from the management (as I've been told by the managers/executives :)

        • POWERevolution on 02/11/2010 - 00:45
          +4

          Catch of The Day was on temporary ban and will be automatically unbanned on 12 Nov.

          NO! The banned should stay that's why we created rules… If you unbanned them then you might as well delete the rules.

          If COTD are unbanned after repeatedly breaking the rules, I’ll lose a lot of respect for OzBargain.

          +1

      • Pizza The Hut on 02/11/2010 - 13:23
        +2

        +1

        If I see something good written about a store I like to think it is genuinely made by an independent customer and not by the store. the only way to stop dishonest comments is to hit those stores hard.

      • Tenebrae on 06/11/2010 - 19:57
        +1

        But being unbanned on the appointed day IS keeping the rules - the automatic ban had a fixed term, which expires on that day. To artificially extend a ban would be to disrupt the normal order.

    • QQQ - CatchOfTheDay on 09/11/2010 - 22:12
      +4

      Sent to all employes dated 30th September, from our chief operations officer:

      "As you all know there are a lot of forums, social media websites, blogs etc that have comments both positive and negative about COTD and Scoopon.

      Refrain from commenting on any of these posts, forums, blogs or social media sites regardless of what your comments are, even if you are doing it from your own Facebook account, Twitter user ID or other personal ID.

      Anyone who ignores this policy will be dealt with accordingly including dismissal.

      Regards"

      • Horizon on 10/11/2010 - 13:37
        +5

        Sprung!

        Another blatant sockpuppet post…

      • arcticmonkey on 10/11/2010 - 22:37

        "Anyone who ignores this policy will be dealt with accordingly including dismissal"

        Ouch!

  • infernal_max on 02/11/2010 - 03:46

    if COTD cared about reaching thier customer base here at ozbargain, they wouldnt of been tempted to break the site rules. I for one, am glad we can interact with each other over bargains we can buy and not have twitter like updates about who got one, how close someone missed out on it, then conspiracy theories about what system setup has the best chance of making it past the servers

  • arcticmonkey on 02/11/2010 - 12:52

    Exactly, Power and Infernal. If there are different rules for different people, OzBargain may as well just throw the rulebook away.

    I hope other merchants don't get permanently banned after one or two cases of sockpuppeting or that would be mighty hypocritical indeed.

    • Davo1111 on 02/11/2010 - 13:32

      It depends on a range of factors, but many overseas sites get permabanned.

      We really need to develop strict guidelines on this.

      What would happen if COTD was banned forever? would people still access this site?

      • infernal_max on 02/11/2010 - 15:05
        +1

        I say this in jest, but i think it's a good idea, how about a wiki hall of shame? Like those crime stoppers boards you see at some shopping centres lol with a brief description of their crimes against us ozbargain hunters!!

        • Davo1111 on 02/11/2010 - 15:13

          hmm we want to do that, but there are a few issues

          • Still won't make a difference, x store is banned for sockpuppeting
          • the mods don't run this place like a courtroom, we are judge, jury and executioner. So hypothetically someone could be "shamed" by mistake.
          • Defamation
          • levels of sockpuppeting different offences. Is voting for your own deal the same as setting up fake accounts?
          • If you apologise or give a suitable reason, is that ok?
          • Could names be removed from the list? What if the site/store is sold on to someone else?
            etc etc

          We would like to create a way that explains to general users why someone has been banned, but are yet to find the best way to do this.

  • stralya on 02/11/2010 - 16:04

    Rather than be negative about it, is there an opportunity to build a constructive approach going forward? Maybe one of the conditions of COTD being allowed back in be that they do something useful for OzBargain. Some ideas i can think of:
    - COTD offer prizes for comps that Ozbargain could run (like the laptop competition a few months ago);
    - COTD allow Ozbargain members to 'reserve' or pre-purchase items before a sale commences so we are not victims of a server meltdown.
    - COTD 'bribe' the current Ozbargainer community by providing a freebie from time to time.

    • polkadots610 on 02/11/2010 - 16:09

      One problem. There are soooo many ozbargainers, plus it's free to sign up. So even if COTD were to give out freebies and ozbargain-only deals, there will still be complains about the freebies/bargains getting sold out too quickly, or servers crashing etc.

    • arcticmonkey on 02/11/2010 - 16:11

      It doesn't look like there are any conditions in them coming back. I guess some businesses can repeatedly break the rules as they see fit.

      It's beginning to look like OzBargain is run by Toothless Tigers.

      • scotty on 02/11/2010 - 16:23
        +2

        You got an axe to grind? Feel free to leave if you think the site is not operated in the way you want.

        As I have already stated, the purpose of the site is to share bargains, and I do understand that CoTD is under circumstances of expansion and might have staffs that aren't familiar with the rules — however lets not forget good bargains they brought previously.

        Have CoTD been punished? Yes. That's why this thread exists as they have been banned (30 days ban expires on 12 Nov). Still don't like CoTD? Then you don't have to click through their links.

      • Davo1111 on 02/11/2010 - 16:30

        Instead of arguing, perhaps suggest some moderating guidelines, so that we can ban to your liking :)

        • arcticmonkey on 02/11/2010 - 21:51

          The moderating guidelines are there - it just sounds like they are being enforced for some offenders whilst others get off lightly.

    • Davo1111 on 02/11/2010 - 16:25
      +5

      tbh i dont think COTD should be able to bribe their way out of the naughty step. Kind of ruins the credability of OZB.
      I appreciate the idea though

      • Tenebrae on 07/11/2010 - 20:12

        Yes, this is absolutely right. If we allow reps to return to good standing more quickly by providing "incentives" or "goodies" for OzBargain members, we're effectively saying "big businesses can go ahead and take advantage of our huge membership, we just care about a good deal - the rest of you little stores get the boot".

  • andy19363 on 02/11/2010 - 16:39
    -3

    I think by banning this particular store, we will only end up hurting ourselves. I'm not sure COTD needs ozbargain particularly…..yes it's nice to have ozbargain on board, but in reality, they do pretty well on their own. I suspect a majority of ozbargainers visit on a daily basis, irrespective of cotd's status and reputation.
    Past cotd deals are almost always strongly positive, indicating that the community are generally favourable to their deals. Removing the ability to highlight such deals means some could be missing out on what could be very good deals……ie Ozbargain loses.

    some examples…all over 50+'s
    http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/27187
    http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/25700
    http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/25992

    more here….
    http://www.ozbargain.com.au/deals/catchoftheday.com.au

    I say manage the individual deals…..if there is sock puppetry, address it and carry on…….

    • Mikinoz on 02/11/2010 - 17:33
      +8

      I disagree, i dont think Ozbargain needs COTD

      Most of the comments are compalints about the way the deals are done ie the sales where its like gambling to buy something 1 in 50 maybe unless its total crap or delays in delivery etc

      There is so much out there bargain wise, everyday there is another place to find a bargain, lets not turn the rest of the bargain vendors into COTD please…..

      I wish we could not allow them back, but then i am not a mod for goood reason!

      • scotty on 02/11/2010 - 18:49
        +2

        i dont think Ozbargain needs COTD

        No. It is not about whether A needs B and vice versa.

        But does CoTD bring the kind of bargain people want? If voting is of any indication, then I think the answer is a definite yes.

        Again, they are currently penalised for issues with the site rules and I am working it out with QQQ to figure out the cause.

    • infernal_max on 03/11/2010 - 02:38

      dude, open a new web browser page and go to thier website, problem solved

      • andy19363 on 03/11/2010 - 09:20

        not necessarily……..every now and again they will have subscriber only specials - not visible from their normal website (640gb samsung portable drive last night, for example). Some might appreciate a 'heads up' when that kind of thing happens.
        There's also the possibility for discussion about a particular product, how it works, the value of the deal and perhaps reviews from previous purchasers.

        • infernal_max on 05/11/2010 - 03:44
          -1

          that loss isnt because of ozbargain though, its COTD that has removed that benefit

          im a lost guy am I? Im a COTD customer myself, so how am i lost? And I never ordered those kinder eggs, so i dont know what provoked that comment, all this banter between you and myself could of easily been avoided if you gave a straight forward answer without all this psuedo intellectual bullshit youve posted.

          dont post in the general discussion forum if you want a thread about a specific topic and generally discuss something

        • Cripto on 05/11/2010 - 04:30
          -1

          you're a very lost guy infernal, i think you just have a growing hate for COTD coz your kinder eggs didn't come in time

          to add to andys' great points, COTD have also given special deals exclusively to their Facebook users or the OzBargain community, something like a couple days before public release. that meant even subscribers/COTD junkies didn't get the deal until we were done with it.

          then there was a point where QQQ was tipping off info about future exclusive deals and some people on here unexpectedly guessed and leaked the links, which made it beyond amazing. that's something i forgot to mention as one of the many benefits :)

          anyway the point of this thread was to get COTD unbanned due to the various benefits for Us. it was speculated that COTD was permabanned so i started this thread. but turns out they were only on temp. ban, and soon their deals will be permitted again. i just hope QQQ keeps the other guys in line from now on.

        • Cripto on 07/11/2010 - 22:59
          +1

          the kinder eggs was a joke, sorry i should have made it more clear :) i answered you more then enough, and i said if you have trouble understanding parts i can break it down for you. it's not my problem if you don't understand any parts of my posts.

          the general discussion forum is used for talking about shops and retailers, and anything related to finding a good bargain as included in the description underneath the header in case you missed it. if you haven't already taken the time to read my first post (the thread), then you would know this thread is talking about a shop/retailer and proposes to help find good bargains.

  • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 02:06

    i was gonna write a big essay the other night with some really good points and why some of the replies are so irrelevant and show poor intelligence/knowledge. but then i got lazy, i think the only person who's on the ball is scotty and maybe a couple others. but either way i won't cause any negativity since COTD is being unbanned soon :D

    • infernal_max on 03/11/2010 - 02:36

      i dont really understand what you are trying to achieve posting that comment cripto, especially posting the :D at the end. It's not like you have been banned from COTD i assume, how could you possibly be happy that thier ban is almost at an end?

      • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 03:13
        +1

        sorry infernal i don't understand anything you're saying, at all. please read my first post, i made it as concise as i possibly could.

        • infernal_max on 03/11/2010 - 03:26

          if you dont want to answer dont, but why post a bullshit answer like that?

        • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 04:07

          lol no need to get upset. i didn't intend for that. i'm not trying to achieve anything from that comment, just to let some of you.. know that you need to really read the thread and not just see COTD in your own experience/judgement. i'm not sure what me being banned from COTD has to do with anything, but if you want to know why i'm happy their ban is almost at an end, then please, read what the OP said (which is me if you didn't notice) and tell me what part of the thread you don't understand in regards to me supporting COTD being unbanned. i'm not really sure how to explain my stance on this if you don't ask proper questions. but judging from your comments, i think you really don't understand what i'm trying to propose for the community here. but don't hesitate to ask, as not everyone is on the same page, so i'm willing to break it down for you.

        • ozhunter on 03/11/2010 - 04:11

          Cripto he wants to know why you even bothered posting this comment.

          i was gonna write a big essay the other night with some really good points and why some of the replies are so irrelevant and show poor intelligence/knowledge. but then i got lazy, i think the only person who’s on the ball is scotty and maybe a couple others. but either way i won’t cause any negativity since COTD is being unbanned soon :D

          What is the point of it? Just looks like you're saying no one understands.

        • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 04:20

          ozhunter, i don't mean to be rude, but based on the majority of comments, i really don't think some people understand where i'm coming from. but i am willing to explain if you ask questions based on my thread. just remember, this thread wasn't made so we could discuss how well COTD does business, or how we feel towards them.

  • infernal_max on 03/11/2010 - 05:35
    +1

    why cant you give a straight answer?

    • Mikinoz on 03/11/2010 - 09:41

      Was thinking the same, he earns his name though!

      • infernal_max on 03/11/2010 - 14:45

        I'm glad I'm not the only one lol

    • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 15:07

      infernal are you talking to me? i've taken the time to answer you straight out. what haven't i answered that you want to know so badly?

      • infernal_max on 04/11/2010 - 00:35

        You haven't answered anything that I have asked
        you, just posted jibberish answers.

        • Cripto on 04/11/2010 - 00:58
          -2

          lol.

          look i've already responded :)

        • infernal_max on 04/11/2010 - 04:57

          yeah you responded, but you didnt answer it

        • Cripto on 04/11/2010 - 05:54
          -2

          the response is my answer, what part of my answer don't you understand.

        • andy19363 on 04/11/2010 - 09:12
          +2

          too many syllables?
          Words of more than 4 letters?

  • overlook on 03/11/2010 - 09:47

    so all these just to get COTD unbanned from ozbargain..i think they did great job

  • andy19363 on 03/11/2010 - 10:11

    ok…real life scenario…
    Consider yesterday's 'subscriber-only' special, samsung 2.5 640gb portable hard drive for around $85 delivered…..(now sold out). It sounded to me like a good deal….

    Points to consider…..

    a) People just visiting COTD website do not see the deal…it's not on the main site
    b) Is it a good price? (yes, I know each interested individual could visit static ice…)
    c) is it a good drive? (yes, I know each interested individual could search around for reviews)
    d) does anyone actually own one who could give feedback?
    e) is the retailer reliable?

    all of the above questions and more could be answered in the one place…..

    We should be looking at individual deals, not retailers…….retailers are clearly a factor, but I don't think should be the main focus…..retailers fall in and out of favour all the time on here.

    • Mikinoz on 03/11/2010 - 14:58
      +1

      The questions are quite favourably for COTD

      here's my answers

      a)Sign up for the SOS deals then you wont miss it, if you miss a deal of interest , no loss of life
      b)Good price vs waiting ages , not for me , by the time it arrives it will be cheaper elsewhere
      c)Not for everyone its okay, it cant be used in notebook
      d)I own one and its nothing special
      e)Not as reliable as a bricks and morter as we have seen from the posts, QQQ attempts to help

      Yes they can be answered, by a big who cares , get over it , its just a hard drive and its a retailer like others which will be superceeded by something better sooner or later

      Ps why are you asking so many questions in your points to consider? is it a point or a question?

      • andy19363 on 03/11/2010 - 15:33

        The scenario is not particularly cotd focused, could be any retailer, and indeed any product.
        The points are, I guess, things that people might like to consider about any posted bargain.

        I was not looking for the questions to actually be answered, (note that the drive was sold out when I posted), more of an example of why postings are useful. If cotd is banned permanently, such postings will not be permitted and ozbargain members will lose out on the deal itself, and any useful discussion around it.

        is it a point or a question?

        It's points to consider….that's why I didn't expect anyone to answer the specific questions, but thanks anyway….I guess you've also illustrated my point by providing me with good information on the drive and the retailer, which couldn't happen if the deal is not posted.

  • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 16:57
    -1

    seems like people are really getting out of their way to defend their beliefs with really bad answers. don't worry andy you're on the ball as well, i couldn't agree more that retailers are simply factors which fall in and out of favour all the time on here.

    i will try to respond to some of your thoughts. this thread wasn't to see how well COTD operates with its business operations, or how fast they send out emails, or how much grief they've caused, or how good the deals are, or how fast they ship products, or why i didn't get to bite extraordinary deals. i somewhat sympathize with you and therefore you can make your own thread for that. but it is irrelevant to what is being proposed here.

    i think that new/zealous staff breaking rules is irrelevant to the benefits for us. benefits are that, out of all their deals (despite which ones we may think are crap) the good ones (based on us/community voting) are being delivered to the front page of OzBargain for our convenience. we shouldn't have to open a new browser or check our emails, or subscriptions like some of you suggest to see deals from a particular site. that ruins the purpose of this site, we might as well just not visit this site and check our subscriptions from numerous sites to see which ones are good. OzB deliveres that convenience by allowing users to share those subscribed/public deals with the community.

    when and if there are good deals from COTD, they should be available. good deals are not based how individuals feel towards the company based on their personal or shared experiences. they're based on the community votes which either make the deal popular or not just like any other deal. a deal that the community believes to be good should not be hidden because some of the new staff from COTD and their sister site ScoopOn may have not known the rules. QQQ or management had no idea of this, all that is required is that we ban the individuals involved that didn't know the rules or decided to ruin it for QQQ and the whole OzB community. thinking about it, there's a few incidents where 1 staff of COTD has decided to do something that caused a catastrophe for QQQ, and he tried his best to fix this for COTD and the OzB community. but we're not here to judge their hiring process or severity of their management.

    i'm not sure if there's ever been a company that disputed their ban, this is probably because they knowingly did it or felt guilty and had no real basis for arguing. so there's probably no big deal with anyone using COTD as an excuse. from the looks of it, the sockpuppeting is generally really bad anyway, i.e. they make new accounts to comment/upvote themselves, and they've only been registered for a few days. i do partially agree when alternative actions arise it will blur the consequences and potentially weaken the system but discretion is fundamental in this case. because what COTD has to offer as opposed to these international companies who don't have any respect and just try to use this site as advertising is COTD gives us really good deals occasionally, and exclusive discounts on top of that based on feedback and/or interest.

    anyway, it was new staff from both brands upvoting a ScoopOn deal. i don't think this is severe as a majority of other sockpuppeting cases, hence the ban being lifted is reasonable. if there are any other companies who want to dispute their sockpuppet ban, then i personally think they also should have a chance, but like i said i don't think any of them will because they all knowingly did it and have no argument whatsoever.

    main points are: convenience of good deals from all sites being submitted (crap deals easily disappear no need to stress). exclusive discounts given which allow the OzB community to save even more. not having to check the COTD website or forums separately.

    there's always going to be people who will buy from COTD for their own reasons, and coupon codes can really benefit them.

    • Mikinoz on 03/11/2010 - 17:01
      +3

      A version of war & peace doesnt make it right , how about next time you sum up in one paragraph

      Please dont write a novel, i will never get back the 5 mins it took to read this lol

      • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 17:21

        some were just begging for it :)

        Summary:

        main points are: convenience of good deals from all sites being submitted (crap deals easily disappear no need to stress). exclusive discounts given which allow the OzB community to save even more. not having to check the COTD website or forums separately.

        • Mikinoz on 03/11/2010 - 18:11

          Thank you for making it a mini version for me :)

        • Cripto on 03/11/2010 - 18:19

          actually i just quoted myself haha

    • cwongtech on 09/11/2010 - 00:04
      +3

      TL;DR

      • infernal_max on 09/11/2010 - 02:06
        +1

        lol, great contribution there cwongtech

  • Luminary on 07/11/2010 - 00:23

    So, they just created numerous accounts to vote for their own deals? How can you tell they did it on purpose and it wasn't just a worker who thought it was a good deal. Did they admit they made the accounts to vote up their deals? Im sure they have better things to do than create fake accounts.. If the deal is good, the votes will say so. Not for or against the banning, taking a neutral stand here.

  • neil on 07/11/2010 - 01:03

    I don't think it's been made clear here that there is an agreed set of moderating guidelines when it comes to sockpuppeting. There is a minimum sentence in 99% of cases and the length of the ban can depend on:

    How many different deals the sockpuppeted account voted on.
    How many different sockpuppeted accounts there were.
    Making a sockpuppeted comment.
    Whether or not there is an explanation.
    Whether they deny the accusations.
    If the explanation is truthful.
    Steps to make sure it doesn't happen again.

    So 1 account voting on 1 deal is a normal offense.
    Multiple accounts making fake comments a major offense.

    I'll just put a hypothetical example to explain the moderating in a nutshell:
    Joe robs a bank.

    Whether or not Joe robbed the bank to buy a Ferrari or to feed his starving kids is a moot point. Joe still robbed the bank and is guilty of doing so. Not knowing that it was illegal to rob a bank is no excuse. His reasons for robbing the bank only help to determine how long the sentence will be. His eligibility or parole after his sentence into the real world is based on what steps he has taken in prison to rehabilitate himself and his likelyhood of reoffending.

    Whilst there are certainty a number of permanently banned sites and users here, there are a lot more who have, after breaking the rules, come clean, outlined steps for mistakes to never happen again and are model citizens here on Ozbargain.

    • Tenebrae on 07/11/2010 - 20:17
      +1

      neil forgive me for nitpicking, but your jurisprudential analogy is absolutely terrible. There have been innumerable cases in both common law jurisdictions (like our own) and others where the reasons for committing a crime (re: feed starving kids) play a crucial part in determining culpability. Then there's the fact of ignorance actually being an acceptable defence in certain circumstances.

      Now it should go without saying that I don't believe retailers like COTD have starving kids that can be fed only by sockpuppeting on an internet bargain aggregator website, or that anyone clever enough to sockpuppet could possibly be ignorant of its poor form. They're just the two points that jumped out at me as markers of bad analogy.

      • infernal_max on 08/11/2010 - 00:46

        however true, you still get the point dont you?

      • StewBalls on 08/11/2010 - 00:58

        I don’t believe retailers like COTD have starving kids

        Those poor starving sockpuppets gotta eat too! :o

        Dude, all jokes aside, seriously…you are being way too pedantic about that analogy; as max said, you surely got the salient point, didn't you? This isn't really the place for moot court! :p

        • Tenebrae on 08/11/2010 - 20:16
          +1

          BUT

          IT

          WAS

          FUN

  • missmiss on 10/11/2010 - 12:04

    is anyone else finding that COTD is down?

    • andy19363 on 10/11/2010 - 12:33

      nope…

    • Mikinoz on 10/11/2010 - 12:57

      maybe thats just wishfull thinking or your IT admin had done the smart thing and blocked them ;)

      • andy19363 on 10/11/2010 - 14:25

        it also depends on the timing…….it often gets hit hard at changeover time by everyone, (including all the haters), checking out what the deal for the day is…..

        • Mikinoz on 10/11/2010 - 14:27

          So what was the deal of the day today then :)

        • andy19363 on 10/11/2010 - 14:36

          $10 cheap crap day…….which is probably why it was easy to access 10 seconds later :)

  • troyww on 10/11/2010 - 13:36
    +1

    Keep them banned . They are spam professionals who post ridiculous non deals backed by an army of employees who spam their own spam .

    Just look at the sleazy comments in this thread from pro COTD supporters/employees . With all the sucking you could of fooled me that COTD don't need Ozbargain . I will be very disappointed if they return and urge others to neg their deals .

    I think Ozbargain has been run with great integrity over the years and I continue to return because of the genuine deals and lack of spam . There are thousands of "deal" sites out there but 99% of them are merely spam filled advertising sites .

    • andy19363 on 10/11/2010 - 14:25
      +2

      ahhh troy….I note, despite the hate, you have still found the heart to dish out a number of positives to cotd….including this one
      http://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/30139
      from August….

      which, I suppose, demonstrates that, every now and again, it posts reasonable deals…..

      • troyww on 10/11/2010 - 14:28
        +1

        Wow really going the distance there :)
        Probably didn't realise it was from COTD .
        I should be a little more discriminating when voting .

        • Mikinoz on 10/11/2010 - 14:34
          +2

          Hahaha mate if Andy were your GF you would never hear the end of anything lol

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