Hi OzB community,
I posted a JB Hi-Fi gift card for sale today on Gumtree and was caught in a fraud.
The customer sent me a drivers licence of an individual by the name of Johanis and tried to re-assure me he will make payment for my JB Hi-Fi gift card once I've sent through the gift card and pin (stupid me!). I'm wanting to see if anyone here has experience dealing with these sort of issues before and what are the options from here to recover my lost funds.
It was a $500 egift card.
@curiousman: well you need to contact police with that, it would be sent to an address or click and collect
@screensaver: Police don't care about civil matters like that. You might get an event number if it helps your insurance but that will be it. They won't investigate anything.
@Quantumcat: If this person stole the gift card out of my pocket would the police care & would that be classified as theft? Is it because OP sent it willingly to the other party that it’s a civil matter?
Is it because OP sent it willingly to the other party that it’s a civil matter?
Yes I think so. But even if it was actually theft I don't think the police would care. They did not care when my motorcycle was stolen. They did let me know when it was found but they weren't interested in the gloves and helmet that were found inside the seat that weren't mine (for prints), or the fact that I found a witness who saw someone she knew at school riding it. I even asked what they would do if I found CCTV footage of them with the bike and they said I would have to go through small claims court to recover money to fix the bike, and if the person had no money it would probably be a waste of time! I don't know what the threshold of value is for them to start caring but if a $3k motorcycle isn't enough (in a country town no less where there isn't much for them to do), I doubt a $500 gift card is going to rate very highly on their list.
@Quantumcat: I wonder if this would pan out the same way if the prime minister's motorcycle was stolen…
@chubbychicken: Yes. OP willing sent the card. Don’t matter that there was a broken promise. It’s not a matter for the police. Don’t waste their time.
@Quantumcat: The license provided was almost certainly a fake or stolen one. If you push that angle it isn't a civil matter, identity theft or use of a fake ID is a crime.
@curiousman: He prob bought another gc using this one online, try talk to jb see if they can reverse it if is hasn't been spent.
Contact JB and give them details. They won't take responsibility but if you have proof of purchase they may do something to stop posting it etc.
Please for the love all that is top tier chocolate, do not send items/code/picture before the funds gets released into your account.
Cash still king.
gotrice
gotscammed FTFY.
Perfect username.
If this was actually a fraud, you need to report it to the cops.
Chances are they'll take your report, then file it in the square, plastic, floor filing bin, but if they actually got off their @rse they could probably work out with JBHifi when it was redeemed, what for, and possibly even the mailing address the item was shipped to (if it was on online order).
Sorry you were scammed. Good luck.
Based on the feedback thats been shared regarding action taken by the cops, im quite deterred from doing it as it sounds like a process and a half itself!
If possible, id rather invest my energy and resources into potentially seeking some sympathetic returns from JB. Thoughts?
If possible, id rather invest my energy and resources into potentially seeking some sympathetic returns from JB. Thoughts?
Haha, what?
not gonna happen
sympathetic returns
A box of tissues?
No offense but what is wrong with you?
How can they be sure you will not sell the sympathetic returns again? Obviously, they lost you as a customer when you are willing to sell their gift cards.
seeking some
sympatheticwillful blindness returns from JB. Thoughts?
FTFY
Yeah, nah.
So rather than making an effort to get your money back, you'd rather sit on your ass and ask JB to compensate you $500 despite it being your own fault?
First up, sorry for your loss. Its gone now. Report it to the police and move on.
re-assure me he will make payment for my JbHifi gift card
Out of interest, how much had you 'sold' the card for? ie what did they promise to pay you for it?
$485
Ouch… But only asking for a $15 discount on a $500 gift card should have been a warning sign too. You know the old saying, if its too good to be true…..
market rate was around $480 so i thought $485 was pretty competitive and reasonable but you're right!
@curiousman: Check classifieds. Market rate is 10% off, or at least 7% off. Not sure where you got 3-4% off as market rate.
@lilkid28: Agreed, in my mind it would have to be 10-15% off to make the risk/hassle worth it.
Saving $15 on a $500+ purchase to me isn't worth the hassle of arranging/paying/dealing with a giftcard.
@curiousman: I was feeling sorry for you until this. You tried to scam him with a crap price and he beat you to it. You play the game, prepare to get punked sometimes.
Could've asked for HALF upfront, to mitigate some risk.
wonder what they bought with it? probably an e scooter or ps5
Something to scam their buyers, I imagine.
They must not have known that e scooters are not legal..
Depends on the state/area - Legal in Brisbane. I was always surprised that JB sold them in NSW when it was illegal to use on public footpaths/roads (except for a trial at Manly I think)
I would have purchased a G915 keyboard in white.
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/products/logitech-g915-tkl-tenkeyl…
Maybe they bought another giftcard?
Lol, who buys a $500 gift card for $485 off gumtree, op got greedy hence scammed, usually the way.
Correct!!!!!!!!!!
+1
I wouldn’t buy $500 GC for even $400. Id pay $300-325 cash at JB Hifi to confirm the card value.
Can you please give me your Bitcoin? I promise I’ll transfer the money
you got any more gift cards
i need some
I already sent you my licence, sorry I'm stuck on an oil rig that's why I couldn't pay you
I promise I will pay you give me another chance, send me 20k gift cards and I pay you 1m
just stuck on lol rig, gove me 10 days to clear the funds, need gift cards now
I need iphone to… live, test my oxygen levels
send now
go
now
don't stop
I thought you were at an army base or on a ship with the navy
that was last week br0
next week i'm off to india for my wedding!
alright make sure you don't bring back the covid
all flights suspended now
report to police as theft.
JB Hifi will have video of the person collecting the item. they would have show ID, possibly sign to collect the item.
you may not get it back, but they may catch the person.
Dont listen to others here, if no one ever report this , these scum arent getting caught
Police will not care
$500 lost via irresponsible transfer will not warrant a detailed sting operation or CCTV review, identify and arrest.
It would cost more than $500 in police and JB time to even attempt it.
Still should report though for statistical purposes and policy review.
You don't have much faith. I don't blame you, having been victim of theft also I understand, they don't get back to you often.
But if we never do anything these scum don't get caught. 500 may be one of 100 people these scum have scammed.
JB will have a team who look after theft etc and work with police. It wouldnt be that hard to trace this.
Not theft. OP sent willingly. Not a police matter.
Theft by deception is still theft.
Based on your logic fraud would also not be a police matter.
It's theft. Unsure how you would think otherwise..
You never seen those cases where bank send people a million dollars in error and they spend it all. What do you think happens then?? Just one well known example
The bank takes them to court. Still not a police matter.
The bank on that case knows who spent the money also. This guy has no idea who has “stolen” from him. Police aren’t going to investigate this.
@itsme56: Police are involved. Often the person is charged with theft. What makes you think they aren't involved?
In this case it's police job to investigate and it wouldn't be hard with video surveillance and tracking of where and when the gift card was spent
@taoz: Do you remember the thread from last month about the guy that got scammed out of his entire house deposit of ~100k? He could barely even get the police interested. And he had loads of evidence to give them. Was left to insurance people and lawyers to sort out. No chance are police going to be bothered investigating a $500 gift card.
@Quantumcat: Exactly, these are civil matters. Police are not private investigators or lawyers for private cases like this.
@taoz: Sure. But you need to know who it is and evidence to prove it in order to press charges. The bank example is very simple to obtain those key details.
In this scenario there is literally no evidence. CCTV is also not evidence. It’s OPs word. Police can’t investigate everything based on someone’s word. Police also can’t just go into JB and ask them to release details about a purchase based on OPs word. You’d need a warrant/court order for JB to release that information. So again, OP needs to take the fraudster to court.
It's stealing (aka theft) - as an example from Queensland (same applies elsewhere in Aus):
"Sections 391 of the Criminal Code Queensland states: A person who fraudulently takes anything capable of being stolen, or fraudulently converts the person's own use or to the use of any other person anything capable of being stolen, is said to steal that thing."
…and therefore a matter that involves the police. Alternatively its arguably a number of other offences regarding fraud, cyber crime etc if you look into it. Still a matter that involves the police.
It is likely ALSO the tort of conversion and/or civil fraud, but that doesn't mean it isn't illegal under the criminal code and therefore a police matter.
Doesn't mean however the value is significant enough they will do any sort of investigation… as stated above, I don't believe they will.
They target things they think they can easily solve proportionate to the magnitude of the damage. They aren't going to spend thousands in investigation costs to catch someone who fraudulently attained a $500 gift card unless it was a very easy case to solve with everything laid out for them and/or they felt it would be a repeat offender they needed to stop due to magnitude of ongoing damage.
I have been scammed before on gumtree (buyer). Reported it to acorn, had a local detective assigned to the case. About 3 months pass and I get a letter in the mail with the formal details of the case open. Another 6 months pass and I get a call saying the person has been arrested and the money can be returned to me. Whole ordeal took around a year.
Absolutely agree here. Being defrauded is one thing. But not doing anything is on us. Even if the police couldn't help, they will still make it difficult for the criminals. And one criminal less is still a fewer victims of their crime.
That's why it is called Scamtree
always cash or osko first
once ive sent through the gift card and pin (stupid me!)
hmm!
Not sure if this is a troll post, if not then I pray for you OP.
Not sure if mentioned above but bank deposit is not safe at all, same goes for any reversible payment method.
Scammer pays with a hacked bank account, a week later you get a call from your bank's fraud department letting you know they have to reverse the transaction and close your account for good measure.
For this reason the only safe way to sell things at a distance is cryptocurrency, as always make sure you get the cash before you hand over the stash.
Hard lesion learned, just move on !
and very painful lesion too. :-)
I will make up your losses.
Send me your other $500 JB gift card number and PIN first, and I PROMISE on my 10 year ozbargain membership I will transfer you $750 for it …
Extra 250 just to make up your losses less.
Common scam, it's easily resolved just post your Credit Card and CVC code and I can get the refund processed in 48hrs.
It seems you scammed yourself!
What has happened has happened. However, I am thinking you may have an odd chance that they have used an online account to redeem the gift card. Although the account may be used exclusively for fraud, some of the information might be used for a genuine transactions. This could be their address, mobile whatever. I am not suggesting that the fraudster is a fool, but most criminals leave a trail or get complacent. But to do this you will need someone in the JB HiFi Commercial section to see worth their while to investigate it further to see if the account information gets additional hits. They might find more fraudulent accounts too. They can make it difficult for the fraudster by de-activating the accounts until secondary checks information is provided. Also not sure if JB HiFi maintains IP logs for larger purchases, or that even though a purchase has been made, that it has not yet been dispatched. All this might work only if JB HiFi supports you. Just because you have lost the first round that it is not necessary that we should make it easier for a fraudster.
Sorry for your loss. I understand the feelings. Just forget about it and learn from it. I lost $1500 on gumtree buying a camera eight years ago.
Uhhh, how could you do anything so stupid? mm
Definitely go to the police about it. It may be identity theft or they can get the person for stealing/using someone else's drivers license. Its worth a try. You will need proof of all the interactions between you and the scammer. The scammer may have other criminal activities against them so you may get somewhere if they catch them for other activities. Just a thought. God luck.
Can you post a screenshot of the online order that shows under your transaction history?
I got confused by this too, however I think the OP meant that they checked the gift card balance online, and it said it was used for the scammer's online order.
Op has been a member for a long time and as such deserves to loose the money a he has NOT taken the huge number of previous Gumtree warnings that it is CASH CASH and CASH only.
And being a member of this planet for some time should enable you to spell properly but it didn't.
OMG, how many times can the same scam happen before OZB people learn!!
Member since 2010
too old to advice i guess
people get into trap when scammers offer full amt for the gift card without negotiation.
I learnt from ozbargain, scumtree, one of the coolest thing I heard from forum.
Somewhat related. But what happens if it was the other way around? Buyer pays first but never receives the gift card? If they make a post on ozbargain, would've everyone say "make sure you receive gift card first before making payment"?
That's why nobody says that. Everyone says cash only.
gumtree = in person transaction only
In the buyers POV, cash is not 100% safe either, especially for gift cards or things where it is to be redeem later on. Most gift cards can be redeemed online and only need the card number and PIN. If you were a buyer and only requested card number and PIN via email/DM etc, unless you redeem the card immediately, the seller can always use the card, leaving you scammed.
Police don't investigate stupidity because you can't legislate against stupidity.
I’ll pay $600 for a $500 card! I’ll promise to pay you after I validate your card is legit, you know I want to make sure you are not trying to scam me with a $0 value card.
The croissant dictator hair suits him.
Word of advice. If a pale looking guy with sharp looking fangs comes knocking on your door and asks you to invite him in. Don't do it!
Why not? What if he needs assistance?
Or a gift card
What if you have a tough grandpa?
tried to re-assure me he will make payment for my JB Hi-Fi gift card once I've sent through the gift card and pin.
You what mate.
Can you sign the transfer papers and let me drive off with your car, I'll send you payment the second I get home. Promise.
Hey OP, next time you get a JB gift card just give it to me and I will kick you in the nuts. Same outcome overall.
This is rookie. Always always ask for cash
Seriously?
it was quite vague, it was simply an online order under my transaction history