Would You Support an Increase in The Medicare Levy (for New Services or to Maintain Full Bulk Billing GPs)?

Unorthodox on 04/08/2022 - 12:53
Last edited 04/08/2022 - 13:17 by 1 other user

I think everyone is aware of the discussions on Medicare and free health-care being eroded in Australia.
Examples of some key talking points:

  • GPs that were bulk billing are now moving to full fee or mixed billing.
  • Increased calls for standard dental to be added to Medicare
  • Mental health consults requiring more time and specialists vs GPs
  • Patients going directly to Emergency
  • Health checks declining due to cost of visits being a deterrent
    Etc

Given these and any others you may comment, would you support an increase in the Medicare Levy?
There has been some modelling with specific increase but let's just say it's an increase anywhere from 0.5% to 3%.

Poll options are limited but would also be interested in comments for who would prefer a progressive increase as well etc.

Note: there are debate points on Private Health Insurance subsidies, junk policies and applying the Medicare Levy Surcharge but I'd like to leave that out of the poll.
Please do add comments if you have any thoughts (e.g. paying the surcharge instead of getting a junk policy and preferring an overall increase to the Levy instead of the requirements for PHI).

Poll Options

  • 534
    Yes - to add new services (e.g Dental, dedicated mental health) & maintain full bulk billing at GPs
  • 38
    Yes - to maintain full bulk billing at GPs
  • 6
    Yes - overall increase with no specific focus areas
  • 29
    No - Mixed billing is the way forward
  • 163
    No - Would not want to pay more
Financial Medicare

Comments

    • xdigger on 04/08/2022 - 13:54
      +3

      Just to add on, I support more Medicare funding for full Bulk Billing GPs, however that increased funding from a fixed federal budget flows to Medicare over say the defence budget. The fact that the Medicare fee to GPs has not increased in line with inflation in the last two decades as reported in ABC News, shows how much a priority healthcare is for the current government. And unless we join another Vietnam war under the Star-Spangled Banner I don't think we need to spend hundreds of billions on nukes and submarines while we lose the bragging rights of having free universal healthcare compared to USA.

      • lancesta on 08/08/2022 - 12:09

        Defence spending has gone pretty insane to be honest. It's political suicide to cut it back though. At least if we have to spend the money, use it for natural disaster recovery and stuff like that. At least then they'll get some real missions to go on lol. Plus it's actually a great way to test their logistics, practice recovery operations and of course help people in need. "Bringing in the army" shouldn't be a big deal imo, it should be a quick action that's proportional to the disaster (aka 10,000 people probably isn't needed in a small rural flood).

        • xdigger on 09/08/2022 - 10:25
          +1

          Agreed. The thing with Defence budget is that hundreds of billions are allocated to just nuclear submarines (Navy branch) alone, while an mere extra $10-20 billions allocated to Medicare would suffice to give every Australian free bulk-billed GP and allied health visits. Its pointless debating this really if we are not so beholden to maintaining America's hegemony in the world at our taxpayers' costs.

          • lancesta on 10/08/2022 - 09:25

            @xdigger: Yeah it's insane to think about. Money spent is almost always taken away from another area. With how bulk billing works now, "free universal healthcare" is being eroded and that's our trade-off. But "national security" is obviously the biggest target. All that and I'm not even sure if we're gonna defend Taiwan if it gets to that, as I doubt we're gonna be invaded anytime soon. At least be nice if they spent money more sensibly anyway.

    • Grunntt on 05/08/2022 - 12:09
      +1

      bulk-billing GPs for only getting paid $30-40 ($10 nett after nurses, staff, taxes)

      You may like to check the amount they actually make as compared to the generally accepted numbers tossed around.
      Many GPs in medical centres retain at least 70% of receipts (with a minimum $ figure included) and the business' 30% pays for staff/rent/costs.

      • jazoom on 06/08/2022 - 12:29

        You may like to check. I've been at many practices and know many other GPs and the range I've seen is 45% to 70%. I've never seen higher than that so your statement of "many" and "at least 70%" is just silly. It's actually pretty rare to see it above 65% these days.

        The person you replied to also included taxes in their calculation. Furthermore, GPs are almost always contractors so also have to pay their own sick pay, workers compensation insurance, holiday pay and superannuation. Of course there's professional registration, professional development, college fees and medical insurance to pay. For a while HECS also needs to be repaid.

        Sound like a great deal?

        • hayne on 07/08/2022 - 01:28

          The average GP earns between $200k - $350k per year. https://www.medicalrecruitment.com.au/doctors/gp-salary-guid…. From what I've seen, getting to keep 60-65% of receipts is pretty standard.

          Don't get me wrong. They deserve it - six years of highly intensive study, followed by working long hours in hospital as registrars before they finally can even become a GP in their late 20s. Not to mention the fact they are contributing to society by making us healthier and potentially saving lives.

          But let's not get too caught up in thinking GPs get a rough deal, once you're through the rough patch it's a pretty rewarding career (both non-financially and financially).

          • jazoom on 07/08/2022 - 16:57
            +1

            @hayne: FYI they work as interns and house officers in hospital. They usually work as registrars in private practice.

            Also I doubt most GPs get that much because from what I've seen over the past few years, most GPs don't work 5 days per week anymore. It's a very mentally draining job. That's why I don't work as a GP anymore. :)

            And I'd take data from a Medical Recruitment agency with a grain of salt. They have an incentive to make pay look big. And possibly more respondents to their survey would be willing to answer if they make more money than if they make less.

            • lancesta on 08/08/2022 - 12:11
              +1

              @jazoom: Yeah the uni and training required is pretty rough. I'd say if they're not on 100k a year at least, base salary outta uni they're probably being underpaid.

          • xdigger on 09/08/2022 - 10:29

            @hayne: Tradies make $150-250k per year with a third or a less of the training required to be a doctor, and not need to graduate at the top one percentile of their cohort. No sane teenager would want to be a doctor for the money unless they are truly passionate about the job. This is partly why Australia still needs to import more nurses and doctors from developing countries.

    • Windows7forever on 07/08/2022 - 08:30

      Amen.

  • peppet on 04/08/2022 - 13:36
    +4

    My doctor won't give me a new quarterly script without me coming in for a face-to-face, they no longer bulk bill and each visit is $20. It's mental health related so my other local doctor wouldn't give me the script without getting to know me first. Wtf?

    Didn't realise it was such a widespread issue, I must be living under a rock

    • xdigger on 04/08/2022 - 13:43
      +6

      I did a back of the envelope calculation once with my pharmacist sister-in-law and found a bulk-billing GPs only getting paid $10 nett after nurses, staff, taxes for 20 minutes of their time. So I do not begrudge doctors for wanting to charge more.

      There is a lot of money to be spent in the National Budget, (and more to come if they tax miners more like the Greens suggested), but unfortunately there is much corporate political lobbying and currently healthcare/education/aged care are not at the top of the agenda (paying hundreds of billions for American-made nuclear submarines is though).

      • peppet on 04/08/2022 - 13:46
        +2

        We're also seeing a lot of funding cuts which is ridiculous. I work in healthcare and really sympathise with overworked providers. There seems to be a very obvious win-win by reallocating the budget but I suppose it doesn't help dodgy political agendas

    • bobbified on 04/08/2022 - 14:23
      +3

      My doctor won't give me a new quarterly script without me coming in for a face-to-face, they no longer bulk bill and each visit is $20.

      Mine won't give me more than six months at a time and there's a reason for it. They're supposed to do a proper assessment every so often to make sure that the dosage/type of medication is still correct and no adjustments to the script are required.

      It's mental health related so my other local doctor wouldn't give me the script without getting to know me first.

      That makes sense though. It would be a problem if someone just rang up a random doctor to ask for certain medications and the doctor just dispensed them like lollies (although I'm sure lots already do that!).

      • peppet on 04/08/2022 - 14:29
        +2

        I understand why they do it. I wouldn't mind paying $20 twice a year if she'd give me all my scripts at once, but I've got multiple at different intervals that I need to come in separately for because she won't (understandably) give them to me in advance. And I wish she'd give me 6 month scripts. All she asks me is how I'm doing, I answer, and she gives me the script regardless of whether I'm doing good or not.

        • bobbified on 04/08/2022 - 14:31
          +2

          All she asks me is how I'm doing, I answer, and she gives me the script regardless of whether I'm doing good or not.

          haha! I did say "supposed to" do a proper assessment! 😆

          Edit: Mine is $120 (less the $35 medicare rebate) each time and I managed to get away with not paying it during the last couple of years by using telehealth and electronic scripts. But all that's over… got to open my wallet again now!

    • muzzamo on 04/08/2022 - 14:26
      +4

      @peppet - for your quarterly script, see if you can get it from doctorsondemand.com.au . I think most non-controversial (e.g. drug of dependence) scripts can be issued from there.

      You fill out an online questionaire with questions tailored to the medication, and within a couple of hours a "doctor" issues the script. You can then get it given to you as an e-script or my preferred option which is to have their pharmacy express post it to you, with up to 3 repeats. (requires signature though which is annoying).

      They would be using real fully qualified doctor i'm sure, but i have a feeling they are trained in australia and working from home in a low cost country, likely India. The "consult" is only $15.

    • randomvis on 06/08/2022 - 23:34
      +1
      1. If you don't show up face-to-face, that GP doesn't get to bill for their time
      2. Their time is not free and that script takes time to be written up and documented in your file
      3. You can overdose on your meds and that other doctor sure as hell won't write you a script because if you do overdose, they can be liable.
      • peppet on 08/08/2022 - 05:07

        I used opt for telehealth appointments because I don't have the time or means to go in person (also covid), I got billed for telehealth. I understand it takes time to write and document a script, it takes her all of about 1 minute when I go in person and she rushes me out. She also doesn't ask any questions regarding my health or experience with the meds, and doesn't care about side effects, so not sure why I need to be there. I'm only taking these because she asked me to test them out, and has offered no advice on whether I need to continue, just prints a new script. I can't find a new doctor to build rapport with because of the above. These meds cannot be ovedosed on without some extreme diversion which they won't be liable for.

        My gripes are very personal and specific to my doctor.

  • mboy on 04/08/2022 - 13:45
    +6

    On a personal level, I've often found that Bulk-Billing GP's in my area are more focused on getting patients in and out as quickly as possible, and therefore generally don't take their time to perform a thorough diagnosis, compared to their billed counterparts.

    I don't know if it's just me? But if it's not, there's probably an argument to me made about the quality of the healthcare, and maybe people would be generally better off paying a small fee to get better outcomes from their GP visits (as marginal as that may be)?

    • Unorthodox on 04/08/2022 - 13:52

      Really good point and I've seen/heard of similar.

      It's good that there are now more options when booking an appointment for standard consult, prescription, long consult etc which should help with triage.
      I think the idea of medical centres that can triage and charge appropriately for that level of time or complexity effectively will help.

    • Jikx on 05/08/2022 - 21:18
      +1

      Absolutely true.. because the BB doctor has to see twice as many people to earn the same amount. In fact, medicare actively pinishes you for spending more time!

      6 minutes is paid the same as 19 minutes..20 minutes same as 39 minutes. It's insane!

    • MrThing on 06/08/2022 - 08:05
      +1

      For some ppl thats what they want in the current system

      I only ever need to see a gp for specialist referrals, scripts or sick notes.

      I wana be in and out asap, i dont want to chat about other unrelated stuff

    • prinsenhof on 06/08/2022 - 10:18
      +1

      I've had the same experience. Also for me they were only willing to address 1 issue per visit. As it takes about an hour of waiting to get in, I usually don't return and let the other issues be.

      Now I go to a paid service, much better and they just don't listen to what my issues are, they take the time to explain to me why they are happening and also the several options I have to both fix them and deal with the symptoms. Night and day in terms of quality.

  • AustriaBargain on 04/08/2022 - 13:48

    Yes, but I also think some of the extra money should be used for auditing doctors too. GPs taking on patients and diseases they aren't qualified to manage just to fill their books with more consults is a waste of money. Doctors too lazy to read prior medical records, but all too happy to book dozens more sessions doesn't help either. I don't see a bulk billing doctor but I wish they would bulk bill, the gap they charge is pretty big. I don't want to see a doctor that is employed by or whose clinic is certified by the state though. You should be concerned if your doctor is ultimately answerable to a government or politician.

    Dental should be covered by medicare too, or something like medicare. The federal government should pay for it, not the states, because it makes no sense for each state to come up with their own solution.

  • Drakesy on 04/08/2022 - 13:50
    +1

    I like the partial user pays model personally, disincentivises people to abuse the system

  • mbck on 04/08/2022 - 14:14
    +6

    The question isn't so much about how much more money, but how do we increase efficiency. There's TOO MUCH waste. From the top to the bottom.

    • xdigger on 04/08/2022 - 14:18
      +1

      I voted no even though I do sympathise with bulk-billing GPs for only getting paid $30-40 ($10 nett after nurses, staff, taxes) for 20 minutes of their expertise, but no way I'm for paying more in income taxes (essentially what the Medicare levy is), while our government continue to piss away hundreds of billions on nuclear submarines to make Australia a nuclear target, billions on Jobkeeper for profitable companies and churches, and $25 million dollars flagpoles. Also an unspecified amount spent on the non-urgent care of other first world country citizens via Reciprocal Health Care Agreements (see thread https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/715123)

      This government needs to better prioritise its Budget spendings and cut out corruption and bloody well serve its Australian electorate, not increase taxes on the hardworking middle Australia.

  • netjock on 04/08/2022 - 15:12
    +3

    Never enough money.

    Can't just pick a cause and then ask. That is like asking all the kids in the house whether they want more chocolate. Everyone will say yes and before you know it there isn't enough money for fuel to drive to the shop to buy said chocolate.

    You need to have a good analysis of reasons why people go to GPs to fix up those who go faking illness for a sickie. Those who might have lifestyle induced illnesses and put money into prevention.

  • singlemalt72 on 04/08/2022 - 15:14
    +6

    I would support an increase to the levy to include dental in medicare.

  • WreckTangle on 04/08/2022 - 15:15
    +2

    I would support increase if it included dental

  • Halc on 04/08/2022 - 15:25
    +4

    currently <3% of the health budget is going to rebates for primary care, what makes you think any slight increase in levy will make any difference, even if extra services are not added?

    nothing will change unless the voters make more noise about the inadequate rebates - but the politicians are skilled at deflecting attention from where the problem is and dishing out the blame to everyone but themselves. it's always sneaking articles about why healthcare is unaffordable, getting some old geezer with a professiorship who hasn't been in the real world in 30 years to produce a tax payer funded report, sprinkle a few trash news articles about how greedy doctors are, and making token shows of opening a few "super centre"s over the whole nation, and voila. rinse repeat each election cycle

    • xdigger on 04/08/2022 - 15:39

      Wow, I didn't realise that only <3% of the health budget is slated for primary care!

      Guess we can kiss goodbye to free universal bulk-billed healthcare and say hello to our shiny new American-made nuclear submarines then.

      • Halc on 04/08/2022 - 16:31
        +1

        say hello to making an agreement to possibly obtaining an america-made nuclear submarine at an undisclosed future date which may or may not happen*

        fixed for you :)

  • pharkurnell on 04/08/2022 - 15:38
    +3

    I would if I really thought that it would go where its aimed at.. .but we know it would just go into general revenue so some parasite politician can have a 20% payrise.

    • MrThing on 06/08/2022 - 08:02

      Strange how politicians always get decent payrises or great super perks or plum private sector jobs after they retire, or a pension for the rest of their lives

      • pharkurnell on 06/08/2022 - 14:39

        Sad thing is people think politicians are there for the "people"…. no they are there for themselves….been th way since the 70s

    • Bohlen on 06/08/2022 - 16:25
      +1

      This article is a great example of waste.
      Spot the parasites!

      "The public has paid out more than $360 k in the last quarter, for expenses for six former PMs.

      Six former prime ministers slugged taxpayers more than $360,000 in three months for office facilities and administration as well as telecommunications and car costs, the parliamentary expenses watchdog revealed.

      Former Liberal prime minister Malcolm Turnbull's tally came in at the highest, claiming more than $91,000 from the public purse - more than $88,000 of which was for office facilities - between October 1 and December 31, 2021.

      The Independent Parliamentary Expenses Authority also revealed John Howard charged taxpayers more than $87,000, including $75,000 for office facilities, almost $5500 for other car costs and almost $1280 for domestic fares.

      Tony Abbott's bill came to more than $78,000 in three months for parliamentary expenses.

      Kevin Rudd's and Paul Keating's total came to just over $39,000 each, while Julia Gillard's was slightly lower, at just over $29,000."

      • xdigger on 09/08/2022 - 10:32

        Agreed. Politicians and c-suite level government bureaucrats needs to have their salaries halved for not really doing very much, or even being a net contribution to Australian society.

  • mantra on 04/08/2022 - 16:03
    +2

    i hope they make chances to accessibility of the scheme
    i have complex needs where i cannot access or communicatee with doctors

    i get over well over 100k of support from NDIS per year which wouldn't be required if my therapists could access doctors on my behalf, instead i've been left without medical care for over 3 years to become more chronically ill while support needs continue to grow higher

    i've been able to self fund telehealth but becomes traumatic when a pension is never going to able to cover the complexity of my needs and lose all ability to engage from frustration of the system, i have no idea why NDIS is happy to fund more deterioration year on year, hurts me real bad when i can see high likelihood of recovery if all my needs could be met at once

    the amount i'm suffering pain/mental health/neurologically just leaves me suicidal and the system cannot do anything to help, mental health services treat psychiatric illness but my body has a metabolic issue that's preventing it from processing any medication, so just taking it day by day and hoping for the best

    • xdigger on 05/08/2022 - 09:37
      +1

      Sorry to hear that. Just curious what condition attracts 100k of NDIS funding per year?

  • Richmond Tigers on 04/08/2022 - 16:41

    Simple fix, no one should EVER have to go back to a GP for a script refill. That would free up GP's exponentially.

    Also it should be easier to be a GP, all they bloody do now is triage people onto seeing specialists. They do nothing. I could be a GP really….

    Patient - "I have a sore knee".
    GP me - "here is a referral to a knee guy".

    • Stuntdriver on 05/08/2022 - 08:07
      +1

      Very true, my son and wife are both on long term medication always going back just to get a new script. \

    • MrThing on 06/08/2022 - 07:57

      Script refill should be a telehealth, with no refill available until a period of time b4 the old one runs out to avoid abuse. Put drugs which can be abused - like painkillers - on a list of must see doctor f2f.

      Sick notes to be able to be issued by nurses at the gp practice - in addition to the pharmacy ones available now. I use a telehealth provider for sick notes atm called quoctor - no rebates but i have no option as i can never get a gp appointment day of, and its irresponsible to go to a pharmacy if your sick with a flu or cold to get a sick note

      Renewed referrals to specialists done via telehealth

      New specialist referrals see GP f2f for the first referral. Dont want to start seeing specialists being clogged up anymore with hypocondriacs

      So much of this is just admin stuff which needs to be streamlined to allow ppl who need to see a gp priority

  • shaybisc on 04/08/2022 - 17:32
    +1

    Heard on radio this morning a woman getting paid $3500 a day as a GP locum at Launceston.

    • bobbified on 04/08/2022 - 19:55

      Regional healthcare has been big money for quite some time

    • MetaLaugher on 06/08/2022 - 03:28
      +1

      Because no-one wants to work there full time. You need to incentivize massively qualified people to go to regional centres / rural communities.

      • Unorthodox on 06/08/2022 - 21:52

        Very true - one of my friend's brother is a dentist in rural Aus and takes home more than half a mil per year.
        That said, he regularly travels home as there's no social life and pretty much a dead end for his late 20s/early 30s.
        He's also mentioned that rural areas tend to have more crazies and junkies and many general healthcare people don't feel that particularly safe.

  • Benoffie on 04/08/2022 - 18:40
    +5

    Not only do I support it but I think free dental should be included and private health scrapped (certainly the rebate and compulsion).

    If the billions into the rebates went into public health, we wouldn't be in this mess.

    • Stuntdriver on 05/08/2022 - 08:09
      +4

      agree, so wrong that people can avoid the MLS by getting cover that doesnt cover you for anything, basically just a handout of taxes to private health companies.

    • kaleidoscope on 07/08/2022 - 02:17

      but I think free dental should be included

      This can really mess up an already exhausted health sector and people will have to wait for long time to get an appointment. So no maybe?

      • Benoffie on 07/08/2022 - 11:04

        It's already there just not free for everyone.

        Dental health is a major factor in other health conditions so improving oral hygiene should be a national target.

    • jerrus on 08/08/2022 - 09:43

      A huge chunk of the private money goes into the public system, every time you goe to a public hospital they ask for your private insurance so they can bill them for it.

  • Leiothrix on 05/08/2022 - 08:16
    +3

    Nope. The government should be paying for all services that it provides out of general revenue.

    Having the ML/MLS in the first place just demonstrates their lack of ability to do their job.

    • xdigger on 05/08/2022 - 09:32
      -1

      Yeah mate only <3% of the health budget is slated for GPs bulk billing, but hundreds of billions are available for nuclear submarines… The money is definitely there.

      • MrThing on 06/08/2022 - 07:50
        +3

        Plenty of money available to subsidize qantas and hardly normal during covid. Didnt get much return on our money there either

  • lilbudgie on 05/08/2022 - 08:51
    +1

    I live Regional and there has never been any bulk billing doctors where I live so it spins me out when I hear of people complaining that they are getting less options. There are some exceptions though. the doctors here will sometimes bulk bill if it is a follow up appointment if you have paid initially, or some reduce the fee for pension card holders. Before options like telehealth and pharmacy sick certificates I, like many others often just went to work when we should of stayed home. Apart from the cost it was also very hard to get an appointment and very rare to get one that particular day anyway. We had the free home call doctor for a little while and they just got slammed with getting booked out within minutes. The practice that was running it decided to open for a few hours on Sundays and charge instead. We pay just as much tax as everyone else though.

    • xdigger on 05/08/2022 - 09:27
      -1

      As someone mentioned above, only <3% of the health budget is slated for GPs bulk billing. But hundreds of billions are instantly available for nuclear submarines that funds the global war industrial complex and also makes us a nuclear target. Shows you how much the government cares about its own citizens doesn't it?

  • ribze1 on 05/08/2022 - 21:33
    +3

    GPs could be more efficient, even if at the cost of being less "caring".

    I was a walk in with my sick 2 year old at our GP and waited 2 hours to see her. Two of the appointments in front of us included:

    • script refill
      • covid booster, patient was offered the services of the nurse but wanted the GP to do it

    The first could have been a telehealth, the second should have been administered by the nurse no matter what the patient wanted

    • randomvis on 06/08/2022 - 23:45

      About a year ago at my wife's clinic a patient got their COVID shot and had an anaphylactic reaction. The GP spent over an hour saving their life. After getting back to their regular patient list, the next patient angrily said to the GP,

      "What took you so long!?"

      The GP replied,

      "A person was dying and I had to spend that time getting them ready to be picked up by ambulance".

      To which the reply was,

      "Well that's not my issue, you are late."

      I'd imagine that would be someone like yourself because you don't understand what goes on behind the scenes. They are probably late because they had multiple cancer results, mental health breakdowns etc…

      Just to add, if you pay nothing for the consult, you have zero rights to complain about the service.

      • ribze1 on 07/08/2022 - 13:26
        +1

        You're not comparing apples and apples, had the booster lady had a reaction then there were 2 GPs on hand who could have helped, not like they wouldn't leave their rooms for an emergency.

  • Brianqpr on 05/08/2022 - 21:57
    +3

    Get rid of private health insurance and put more into Medicare, job done.

  • Save Medicare on 05/08/2022 - 22:11
    +4

    I'm all for investing more into primary healthcare. Money invested into prevention and chronic disease management keeps people happier, healthier, and for the capitalists around in the workforce longer. It's much cheaper to keep someone healthy than to support someone with multiple acute on chronic organ failures in the ICU so that they can live another six months severely debilitated.

    • randomvis on 06/08/2022 - 23:47

      That would be nice— but most people want results via a magic pill with zero personal effort.

      Large amounts of money invested into prevention is typically wasted. How much have we heard the phrase "diet and exercise"?

  • MetaLaugher on 06/08/2022 - 03:26
    +1

    Yes. I'd happily pay more so that I, and my fellow Australians, can enjoy a higher quality of life. Not addressing these health deficits not only contributes to more suffering (which is enough for me to pay more for), but is a net negative on our economy and scoety. Everyone benefits from comprehensive healthcare coverage - quite literally from the bottom-up.

  • dragonos81 on 06/08/2022 - 05:40
    +3

    Yes, coming from Germany I'm used to it. Paying around 15% (shared by employer and employee) of gross income for health.

    Let's compare my experiences:
    Had an non-life threatening accident in Germany and was rushed to hospital, seen within minutes. I had an accident here (15cm open wound on face, cheek separated … teeth showing with closed mouth!) … I had to wait over 10h in the ED.
    My medication in Germany was charged around $15 / quarter. For the same medication I'm charged over $120 here.
    No gap payments in Germany. Here I was charged $350 in gap payment for a 45 min appointment with a specialist and that was after he already got a medicare rebate of over $200!
    In Germany, I had an elective surgery within 2 weeks. I had a recurrence (15 years later) … on the waiting list for over 3 years here.

    Some people get to chose between public and private insurance. If you're privately insured you get billed directly and get reimbursed by your private insurance (if the procedure is covered).

    • Unorthodox on 06/08/2022 - 21:53

      Thanks for sharing those insights, it's good to hear scenarios from other countries instead of just a general comment of universal healthcare.

    • GourmetFoodie on 08/08/2022 - 20:01

      Very helpful. I’d pay if we got the German model. But the model here is inefficient as hell and I refuse to pay more into it so people can abuse it.

  • MrThing on 06/08/2022 - 07:48
    +7

    We need special seniors GPs for all the seniors who just want to go and have a chat or complain about their ridiculous ailments like an itchy finger or hair out of place or sue down at the shops hasnt called her in 4 days

    Its impossible to get a gp appointment where i live with under a week wait and whenever I go get an appointment thr place is rammed full of seniors

    • Halc on 06/08/2022 - 15:05

      Old frail people get sick more. Who would have thought

    • Unorthodox on 06/08/2022 - 21:56
      +1

      Very interesting point and probably goes to show how much less profitable it is to maintain full bulk billing for pensioners… obviously a young healthy person who goes in and out yields better and therefore subsidises it.
      Now it's just how much more subsidisation is acceptable with the degree of co-payments.

    • GourmetFoodie on 08/08/2022 - 20:01

      I agree.

  • Thaal Sinestro on 06/08/2022 - 09:36
    +2

    Outpatient visits are completely free in Canada and the UK. That is the way it should be.

    The Australian government needs to properly fund healthcare, including dental care. Poor people can get free dental checkups from state governments but the queue is 2 years long in Queensland. Fund healthcare via a capital gains tax on all residential housing. Housing goes up by 10% per year on average; place a 10% tax on the median increase in housing prices. People are making a fortune through property; make them pay for quality healthcare for all Australians.

  • tryagain on 06/08/2022 - 09:57
    -1

    Bulk billing rates are still pretty high, There are always those who will charge more because there are some willing to pay. It's also in the interest of a local Drs Practice to paint the picture of it being necessary and more widespread than it actually is. Adding more services like dental might be worthwhile, but bulk billing rates seem OK to me.

  • diddy50 on 06/08/2022 - 11:48
    +1

    We pay massive amounts of tax, perhaps government can better spend our money, be more efficient and effective with the taxes they have all ready collected.

    Just a thought

  • ECE on 06/08/2022 - 11:50

    Yes, health is wealth.

  • Jikx on 06/08/2022 - 12:26
    +3

    I can see why doctors don't want to be GPs anymore from this thread alone..

  • lonewolf on 06/08/2022 - 12:38
    +2

    I think we pay enough taxes, the government is outright corrupt in a lot of its spending of taxpayer cash and whenever dodgy things come out, nothing happens to the people involved. At worst they just quit their job and go on to "consulting" for the companies they helped with tax payer money.

    from another angle , Are we saying GPs are not getting paid enough? a lot of my family overseas who are doctors all talk about how their colleagues etc want to move to australia as you make a lot more money as doctors down here than you do in a lot of other countries.

    • xdigger on 09/08/2022 - 10:35

      Yes, there is minimal accountability in government unless we have a federal corruption commission. Don't think anything happened to the blokes who stood to profit from the $25 million Sydney flagpole which wouldn't have been discovered if not for ABC reporting.

  • kaleidoscope on 06/08/2022 - 14:40
    +1

    Meanwhile, we need to stop dodgy practices by gps and clinics. I’ve noticed that most of the times I go to my gp, after my consultation he asks how’s the kid or mrs is doing (it wasnt consulting, just asking how they are etc etc).We thought he’s being considerate / caring but later i’d find a charge for them as consultation in medicare. It’s not visible unless you log in and check these

    • Unorthodox on 06/08/2022 - 21:58

      Bloody hell that's unacceptable… I'll have to check mine and for the parents as I did encounter an issue with a telehealth call during covid and the GP didn't fill in a referral properly and then charged me again when I called up to get it rectified.

      • kaleidoscope on 06/08/2022 - 23:13

        Bloody hell that's unacceptable

        I feel like I should report this. But I’m not sure where to. I’ve asked friends who visit this clinic and they’ve said the same about billing. It’s more visible when we had inlaws and parent that were covered under bupa. (no cost to us, but billed through medicare or bupa)

        • dmcneice on 08/08/2022 - 08:16
          +1

          It's illegal to bulk bill a consult for a person who isnt there, part of the item descriptor is the person must be there. That rule can be incredibly frustrating at times. I've had patients whom had severe ASD and social anxiety and their parents would come in for a consult, and I couldnt bulk bill them without seeing the patient physically.

          If the GP above is doing that, report them to Medicare Australia.

          • kaleidoscope on 08/08/2022 - 09:01

            @dmcneice:

            If the GP above is doing that, report them to Medicare Australia.

            Cheers.

  • terrypoon on 06/08/2022 - 19:43
    +2

    The higher income earner pay more Medicare Levy. While in general, the higher income earner have better health literacy. They are more healthy and require less health care services. They are paying more for the less service compare while they lower income earner.

    As a health care profession, I see people abusing emergency/ambulance services everyday. Many of them saying they could not get a GP appointment until 2 weeks after, so I am kind of understand their situation.

    So as a citizen, no. As a health care profession, yes.

  • Geryatric on 06/08/2022 - 21:05
    +1

    I pay around $8,000 a year in Medicare Levy and Medicare Levy Surcharge, and another $7,500 a year for private health insurance (family). I have been to the Doctor 4-5 times in the last 10 years (touch wood). All visits are under 5 minutes in and out, GPs take blood pressure types some notes into the computer then writes a script for antibiotics. How much more should I pay?

    • xdigger on 09/08/2022 - 10:38

      Australia undervalues you as a productive high-income earner, period. I know of mates on $300k a year in technical positions with patents under their belts moving to lower tax environments like Singapore where the tax rate is like a flat 15%. They then contribute to the Singapore economy instead of Australia.

      Australia has lost highly intelligent citizens as as result of its high personal income tax policy.

  • keepsake on 06/08/2022 - 22:01
    +1

    Yes. People forget that like insurance you wish never to use it but it there when you really needed. People pay thousands of dollars for life, car and house insurance and some will never lodge a claim in their whole life but still happy to pay, I don't understand why not paying more for Medicare. Because you are well off now does not mean life will always be the same and touch wood no-one will ever be in the situation where their life is turned upside down because of illness. it is a YES and YES for me!!!

  • DeeTrance on 07/08/2022 - 08:36
    +3

    I would rather pay Medicare levy, even at 3% annual increases than pay junk health insurance policies to subsidise Health executive salaries. I was doing this for years.

    Unfortunately, after I got married we are assessed as a couple, therefore my Wife was getting punished with Medicare levy penalties for my choice of not wanting to take out junk health insurance policies. My wife has full private health cover and she still had to pay Medicare levy because I didn't have a junk policy. It p1zzes me off this penalty exists.

    So now I'm forced to take out private health cover which I don't want to, as I'd rather pay the Medicare levy which goes towards the government and our public health care system.

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