I Want to Sue My Lawyer

Hi OzLegal,

A mid-tier commercial law firm has been acting for me on a litigation matter over the last 6 months.

In the beginning, they made some effort to understand and take on the case - all seemed well with regular communication and updates.

But more recently, (last~8 weeks), they've gone radio silent. No response to emails and not returning my calls. I know they're busy but this is pathetic.

Where do I go to make a complaint? Is this a common occurence in the legal industry? Any other advice on how to resolve this?

I've paid ~$5,000 in fees but they've only done the ground work with no resolution.

Comments

  • Please note: OzBargain is currently under legal threat from an unrelated solicitor firm, from a forum post similar to this. Just to be safe, moderators have decided to edit out the name of the company in this post for now. Please be considerate when you post comments.

    • +45

      The Google review one?

      • Please don't mention them unnecessarily either, as it will complicate matters.

        • +134

          If you guys need funding there should be a heaps of users who will help out based on the number of posts in "THE" thread….. I was one of them and will donate if OZB needs to hire a solicitor.

          • +20

            @AndyC1: I'd be happy to contribute as well.

          • @AndyC1: I can understand that they feel better off avoiding complicating things, as being sued is a huge headache even if it doesn’t cost you money and you win, it’s still a bunch of time and stress. Do not recommend.

            • +4

              @[Deactivated]: This. I'm sure ozbargain can come up with the money to defend, but its just a waste of time and time is more expensive than money.

            • +1

              @[Deactivated]: I’m sure all the people egging that person on to fight it will be happy to contribute to the costs of fighting it (probably to the tune of hundreds of $$$).

              But my guess is they won’t.

              Exact reason I chose not to name the insurer I had the issue with.

          • @AndyC1: Me too

          • @AndyC1: Yeah. But it is only a 'should'

            The solution isn't legal, anyhow.

            B I K I E S!

        • I can close some of my eth's short position & support scotty

        • +10

          wow … please yes somehow keep the community updated on this - this is just wrong, what has The Internet come to :(

          PS goes without saying that I and I am sure many many others will support OzB with whatever they can

        • how come i can't upvote moderator comments?

      • +47

        All those negative reviews have been scrubbed, and there are a huge number of 5 star reviews in the last 3 days (all with 2 or 3 thumbsup each).

        It's clear what that means.

        Abhorrent behaviour by that company. Those are all obviously FAKE reviews

        • +14

          I recently put a negative Google review about a company I used for work on my house. Was immediately threatened with defamation so removed it as I don't need the hassle.

          Completely undermined any trust might have had in the Google review system. Seems you can't even post an honest opinion any more.

          • +1

            @Brianqpr: Maybe I should delete all my Google reviews?

            They don't benefit me after all.

            Did they threaten you via a reply to the google review?

            • @idonotknowwhy: No it was by email. I had complained to them directly and basically been told to f**k off, so put up a negative review. Had a reply within a few mins saying they'd handed it over to their lawyers. Not a high volume business so wasn't hard for them to work out the review was by me.

          • @Brianqpr: Wait… how? Unless you have your full name and address in your Google bio for all to see - how do they even identify you?

          • +2

            @Brianqpr: create a new google account, unrelated to you in name, and then review it again.

        • +3

          I saw when they were all posted. Quite funny when a bunch of 5 star reviews popped up and they were all 16 hours ago 😂

          • +1

            @Emphasise: Curious, can you report them to google for fake reviews?

            • @Name: It would probably be pretty hard to prove.

            • +1

              @Name: Would be a paid service which google secretly own anyway.

          • @Emphasise: Can you please DM me their name? Curious. Sorry, I missed the other thread.
            No wonder Lawyers are scum. They will use scare tactics to get their way.

        • Could you please let me know of the company in pm?

      • 😂

      • link?

    • +21

      Can a forum be legally accountable for a posters content on it that doesn't break the law? Crazy.

      Perhaps we need a section 230 equivalent :)

      • +2

        Forum comments can be considered "published" content: https://www.itlawyer.com.au/atl-blog/16/9/2021/high-court-ho…

        • +21

          Yes, the Voller case demonstrated that forums or social media need to moderate user-generated comments, which we have always done — to the point that we are getting so many 1-star reviews from banned users saying we are over-moderating…

          • +23

            @scotty:

            we are getting so many 1-star reviews

            Guess you know who to call if you want to get them taken down…

          • @scotty: Had a quick glance of these reviews.

            Surely, those reviewers confused OzBargain with the Australian subreddits.

            I believe the OzBargain forums's biggest issue is users just posting up straight-up nonsense. But even then, I don't find many of such posts here politically toxic. It's just literal nonsense often by new accounts and with no responses to their original post.

            • +2

              @tallkid123: There's probably a lot of small business' selling $2 aliexpress crap for $20, then getting all pissy when called out for it.

            • fozzie on 28/08/2022 - 11:58 Comment unpublished. (Requested by Commenter)
          • +5

            @scotty: lol, "OzBargain is Worst Website Ever in History"

            "Mod's will ban you on a whim". Can't imagine what awful BS they were posting considering some of the stuff I see posted here by people who aren't banned.

      • +16

        Whirlpool has fought off similar scumbags before.

      • -1

        Anyway can sue anything about anything if they're dedicated and get some lawyers to make a case out of it.

      • You should check out Netflix's, The Most Hated Man on the Internet. Gives you a good eye opener into why forums and websites cannot turn a blind eye or be allowed to indemnify themselves from content they are hosting. Unfortunately in circumstances such as the one mentioned in this thread the poor website gets caught inbetween. But still, that's the law for you.

    • +12

      Wow so they’re actually threatening you now.

      If it gets to the point where you are going to court I’ll happily donate to a gofundme (like what Crikey has done against Lachlan Murdoch).

      People who bully others are trash humans and deserve to be put in their place.

    • +7

      Lawyers need to tone down the butthurt

    • +15

      You can still see the name in the revisions, but I guess it won't come up in Google searches

    • Honestly I agree with freedom of speech and all that but posts like this are often frivolous and extremely anectodal and only go to cause ozbargain issues.

      Very often lawyers or even doctors will just not say much to the client or just ignore as sometimes the problem itself IS the client.

      If there isn't any substance provided in the post I'm not sure how people can help as I assume it will be hard for OP to provide specific details of any case, IF there is one.

      Googling 'where can I complain about a lawyer'
      take you right here as the first search…

      How to lodge a complaint | VLSBC - Legal Services Boardhttps://www.lsbc.vic.gov.au › consumers › how-lodge-c…
      19 Jan 2022 — Step 1: start by getting in touch with your lawyer first · Step 2: make sure your complaint is one we can handle · Step 3: share your concerns …

    • Herbse on 28/08/2022 - 13:31 Comment unpublished. (Defamatory)
    • +5

      Are we in Australia? or North Korea? Whatever happened to freedom of speech. How's anything defamation, if it's the truth.

      • +3

        The commonwealth has never had such a thing as Freedom of speech. We're just fortunate enough that the ideals of democracy propagate down through policy and the people, and result in LESS censorship than North Korea or China.

        There is still some censorship however

        • +5

          It is not entirely correct to say Australia doesn't have some form of guaranteed "freedom of expression". Although there's no Australian equivalent of a US style "Bill of Rights", the High Court of Australia has made it very clear that the Australian Constitution has an "implied freedom of political communication". Basically it just means people can talk about politics freely. It is an "implied freedom" because the Constitution never actually said this, but the HCA has interpreted the Constitution in such a way that, for the prescribed democratic form of government to work and for people to vote, such a freedom must necessarily be "implied".

          So yes, there's SOME guaranteed freedom, but it's rather limited, and not expressly laid out. In theory the High Court could re-interpret this but in reality it's not really likely, given it's very much entrenched law by this point. But who knows, Roe v Wade was also entrenched law in the US before it was overturned by the US Supreme Court.

          • @xiabonan: Thanks for the history lesson. I've never heard it explained in this much detail to me before lol

      • We've never been entitled to FOS in Australia, just popular speech + popular acceptance of some dissenting speech

      • While I do not believe this to be true, one of the common argument to push for defamation is that it protects the integrity of freedom of speech, so that the ones who voice their opinions for legitimate reasons should not be grouped together with those using it for hate/discriminatory/vexatious reasons. That is why defamation law suits are so common in the so-called land of the free, the US.

        Also this doesnt matter because theres nothing about right or freedom of speech in our constituion. Only an implied freedom of some sort that requires you to interpret the letters in a very arguable manner.

    • +6

      Don't back down. Hate seeing these companies bulldoze those into submission.

    • This is a free country with right to freedom of speech and expression. More power to OzB and more power to those who stand against atrocities.

      • +3

        The law firm is claiming they were defamed by the publisher "Ozbargain". Unfortunatel/fortunately, that is also a very strongly protected legal right. Many online publishers have lost, all the way up to the High Court.

        In a similar story, Google (Youtube) was forced to pay out $715,000 to NSW politician John Barilaro this year for similar claims. Legal costs were estimated to be closer to $100k.

      • +1

        Unfortunately not for us.

        US has free speech because of the first amendment, we do not.

        • First Amendment applies within political context only. You can criticize the government without retribution from government.

          Anything outside this, there's no protection, just like the Amber Heard case.

      • There's no such right, it's not explicitly written in our Australian Constitution.

      • +1

        It irks me greatly when Australians tout the "free speech" crap. You watch too much USA TV.

    • I'm really curious, who try to threaten ozbargain? Can some kind soul plz pm me the details

      • Me too.

    • Has there been an update on this? Is OzB still under legal threat?

      • +4

        See summary under our Merchant Takedown Request thread. Haven't heard from them since early this month, after our lawyer replied to their request.

        • +2

          I did not know this thread existed, thank you!

          Upon reading, running a forum sounds a lot more stressful than I thought… Big love to the OzB team 🧡

  • +54

    Whatever you do don’t post a review on google with a report of the facts and only the facts….

    • +2

      Don’t post a 1 star review at least

      • +5

        Nah that 3 star guy got a threat too didn’the

        • +7

          How come they are getting dozens of reviews on a daily basis?

          Are they all paid reviews?

          • +4

            @Ash-Say: 27 in one day!

          • +7

            @Ash-Say:

            Are they all paid reviews?

            Considering there are examples of same surname people posting mins apart , 100 percent there is some benefit being provided for reviews.
            As if a husband and wife would both jump straight into google to sing praises about a law firm at the exact same time.

          • +6

            @Ash-Say: Most of them are from accounts with only a single review too, I noticed.

            • +8

              @ParmiAndChips: And from what I saw a few weeks ago, always refer to a specific person at the company, not an overall review. It's so obvious that something weird is going on.

              • +7

                @Ghost47:

                It's so obvious that something weird is going on.

                And Google is allowing it to happen. Either they have also threatened Google with similar lawsuits, or Google doesn't care, or both.

                • +10

                  @DoctorCalculon: I agree. Google isn't doing enough to combat fake reviews, whether they're negative or positive. We live in an era where misinformation is rife.

                • +1

                  @DoctorCalculon: It's quite easy to get a review off Google pulled.

                  Used to work for a builder and it happened all the time.

                  • @Korban Dallas:

                    It's quite easy to get a review off Google pulled.

                    Could you please explain how this is done?

                    If I am running a business, and someones trashes it completely (fake or not) on Google Reviews, I just contact Google and they will take it down? That simple?

                    • @DoctorCalculon: Yep.

                      Used to engage a lawyer but now they have a direct door to the Google team responsible for deleting reviews and just go through that channel.

                      Basically it needed to be a client and if they didn't have their correct name associated on the review it was pulled.

                      • @Korban Dallas:

                        Basically it needed to be a client and if they didn't have their correct name associated on the review it was pulled.

                        Does the reviewer get notified when this happens? A lot of folks would not want to disclose their real names publicly to avoid being doxed by the business (which has happened by a ski resort business, as an example).

                    • @DoctorCalculon: My friend - if you are a dr and want a review pulled forget it.
                      I got a one star review from someone I asked to lose weight before surgery.
                      Saw me once for 20mins
                      Google told me to stuff off.
                      They used to pull off reviews 3 or 4 years ago but not now.

                      • @TheCutter:

                        They used to pull off reviews 3 or 4 years ago but not now.

                        I guess this clearly doesn't apply to the shady lawyers here.

    • +6

      They already have a few one star reviews.. It's interesting their one star reviews have a lot of thumbs up, it's probably safe to assume there's a few other people out there that aren't happy with them…

      • +11

        i think the post on ozbargain might have had something to do with that.. i suspect quite a few people went around upvoting the negative reviews.

        i wish people hadn't created all those fake one star reviews based on that post, they just made it a lot harder for that dude who made the post

        • +3

          I was referring to the Google reviews for the company mentioned by the OP here… (this post had only been up for a couple of minutes so all the thumbs up on the bad reviews wouldn't have come from here)

          and I agree, with that other thread, due to people posting fake reviews the OPs honest review was removed also, the fake reviews benefitted the company, it gave them good justification to request all the recent bad reviews to be removed… ,

      • +1

        Now they have a heap of 5 star reviews from people with only one review.

    • Why not? Unless you have your full name and address in your Google bio for all to see - how do they even identify you?

  • +3

    There should be a state government agency that takes complaints. That's a good first step as it's free. It's OLSC in NSW. I'm sure you can google for your state.

    • +3

      The VIC/QLD LSC is fine but the NSW OLSC is a lying dud. Zero stars.

    • Thanks

  • +6

    Litigation matters take a long time. Unless you're under some sort of court mandated deadline, or the other side is giving you some deadline…. I'm not sure there's much else to do? Even if there is, your solicitors would prioritise their cases based on what activities are due when. And if some sort of extension is required they'll deal with that or negotiate for that.

    If you're wanting some sort of solution or advice, you might need to either just wait for the solicitors to get back to you. Or if you want more attention, unfortunately it might mean ull need to find a solicitor who isn't as busy.

    At the end of the day, unless you're being penalises or suffering some sort of loss as a result of them not returning your emails and calls… Little else to do apart from find a new solicitor. (which will cost u some money for them to get up to speed by the way).

  • +14

    Drive to their office and find out whats going on directly.

    • +1

      now theres a thought.

    • That's if you don't back down easily and can get past "Do you have an appointment?" "No? Sorry, we're not able to have anyone meet with you at the moment."

  • +2

    I've paid ~$5,000

    Isn't $55k the magic number that gets their attention…

  • +6

    First step I would do is to call and ask to speak with a principal of the firm, as you are not happy with the way your matter is being handled.

    If things don't get better from there and/or you are still not happy with their response, you would talk to the law society in your state to discuss making a complaint.

  • +1

    Lol OP is from Brisbane, no surprises as to which firm this could be.

    • VIC

      • Fair enough, went by your profile.

      • +4

        Then, you should lodge your complaint/s with Vic LSBC. Google 'Vic LSBC'.

  • +2

    I think there may be more to this story that OP is letting on?
    Logically, no lawyer is not going to ignore a fee paying client without a justifiable reason.

    • +4

      Not necessarily. Close to 100% of any profession are decent people but there are plenty of crooks and crazies out there.

    • They're just extremely slow and my case is clearly not a priority for their firm… it's unprofessional behaviour that they aren't remaining transparent with their client.

    • +7

      You clearly haven't dealt in family law. So many complaints of lawyers ignoring their client right up until the night before a court hearing.

      • Just asking, wouldn’t a lawyer only hurt himself financially by doing that ?

        • +7

          Nope. They get your money. They prey on desperation. You sign contracts with them when you first engage them and most people don't have the money to fight them by hiring another scum bag lawyer.

          • +1

            @subywagon:

            sign contracts with them

            But thats just like a formality, right ?
            Does a client not always have the right to switch representation at any point he wants to ?

            • +2

              @Gervais fanboy: You're not locked in as such, but you're signing an assurance of payment. If you have the $$$ to switch representation mid way through or near then end of course you can fire them. You've still gotta hand over a house deposit to your previous lawyer.

      • +4

        Family law firms are basically parasitic entities that extort money by preying on the nativity of the clients without experience dealing with the dysfunctional Australia legal system

  • +1

    Also there are other places to leave reviews, trustpilot, facebook, and product review are some

    • -3

      Do you use them all, Pamela? For every time you have a whinge, do you just go loco on the socials?

      • I use my real name on reviews

        • -2

          Sure, you do ……. just like the way you changed your user name on here

          • +8

            @[Deactivated]: you are beginning to sound like a bully

          • +4

            @[Deactivated]: Chill out dude…
            You are getting worked up over nothing.

            • -1

              @Gervais fanboy: lol

              Like those whingey posts of late where ppl don't like Woolworths, Chemist Warehouse, et al. for some banal reason

              • @[Deactivated]:

                whingey posts of late where ppl don't like Woolworths, Chemist Warehouse

                lol I’m a little confused about why you brought that up.

                • @Gervais fanboy: Why do you think?

                  I consider it quite appropriate when those posts read like a bunch of folks getting their knickers in a knot over not much at all

                  Perhaps we should all simply respond with your comment:

                  Chill out dude…
                  You are getting worked up over nothing.

                  next time they go nutso on here

                  • +1

                    @[Deactivated]:

                    when those posts read like a bunch of folks getting their knickers in a knot over not much at all

                    Yeah okay but you shouldn’t justify one overreaction by citing another overreaction from someone else…

                    Logically, it would be counter-productive.

                    • -1

                      @Gervais fanboy: Nah, not counter-productive ……… just shining a light ……… a mirror, if you will :)

                      • +1

                        @[Deactivated]:

                        a mirror

                        Wow, only took you like three comments of beating around the bush to finally gather the minerals to say what you really wanted to say…
                        Firstly, I don’t even remember making a comment on any C Warehouse posts on this site. So you are already wrong about that mate..
                        Secondly, I am more than happy for you to cite an example of where i have overreacted like you just did. Because that would indeed make me a hypocrite, something that you have just alluded to.

                        For disclosure sakes : I have only turned red once or twice on this site where someone came at me personally and even then I apologise right away on my own accord.

                        • -1

                          @Gervais fanboy: Dude, what minerals are you on?

                          Best hop back to that other OP with all the right/left view points and not forgetting past transgressions & the like. You know, the usual crap certain peeps go on about every so often because because they lead such exciting lives otherwise.

                          • +1

                            @[Deactivated]: I asked you to cite an example of me being triggered like you just got and this is what you came back with ?

                            Me having a civil discourse on something political, seriously ? This is the best example you got ?

                            What happened to that Woolworths/Chemist Warehouse delusions of yours ? Didn’t feel like indulging any further ?

                            Honestly, you are about as cuckoo as the grandma ^^ that you were just having a go at.. Atleast granny don’t bite like you do…

                            • -3

                              @Gervais fanboy: I think you may need a new prescription because it doesn't look like your 'minerals' are working out for you.

        • Abbreviated to SSPam?

  • +12

    Check the revisions tab for the name of the lawyers

    • +1

      LOL. Nice one.

    • +1

      That's lol as that OzB would allow previous revisions of posts to be publicly viewable. Kind of defeats the purpose of moderating posts if they're trying to avoid being sued.

      • +8

        The revisions are logged in users only & not publicly viewable (even though reg an OzB account is open to public). That means it won't be indexed by public search engines such as Google. We can also remove old revisions but deliberately chose not to do so in this instance.

    • Allegedly, there might be a link if you Google it.
      And that link may allegedly be archived on the Wayback machine…

  • +3

    I have seen company's go on air tasker and ask for X amount of 5 star reviews for $X
    Shameful practice

  • $5k. That's not much in legal terms is it?

    • No, it's less than half what I was quoted. They can't even bill be on time… the sheer incompetence.

      • Even reading an email could be cutting into the billable hours they could be spending on other clients. The more emails you spend the worse the value proposition on you as a client becomes.

      • +1

        It is a profesional conduct issue. They are repsenting you they are not opponets of you thus why you can only lodge complaints but not sue. if the lawyer was your next door and sold you his defective car than you can sue him. Thee issue here is whether he misconducts his profession as a legal professional under the acts and rules.
        Google and find 'Legal Profession Uniform Law Application Act 2014' and 'legal profession uniform general rules 2015' to which all Vic legal professional subjec to. LSCB will loo into these wthether your case has merit to go with, and if so to determine whether which sections and or regulations have been breached by them.

    • I like how $5000 is 'not much money'. Not enough to arouse the interests of a lawyer. No wonder the industry has the reputation it so richly deserves.

      • I can't say I disagree. We recently engaged one at work, $5k was the initial & we're at $25k already

  • $5,000 doesn't buy you much lawyer time. If there's more action needed you might need to offer more money.

  • +2

    First thing you should do is advise the law firm of your complaint and have it taken up with a partner. If you still aren't getting anywhere you should speak to the legal society/BAR of your state who has a mediation service for these kind of issues.

  • If possible, hold off paying costs until matter is resolved.

    • From OP's thread description:

      I've paid ~$5,000 in fees but they've only done the ground work with no resolution.

      • Possibility they may bill extra time, especially if OP escalates the matter.

        I've had a situation with a fixed cost agreement. My assigned lawyer didn't turn up to court then disappeared off the face of the earth. The firm tried extracting further cost from me. Didn't bother responding to then and they wrote saying they let me off the hook.

        Wish OP and Ozbargain the best against these bastards.

  • +1

    God I hope everything turns out good for you. It's hard to fight people that know the law, especially if it's their bread and butter and you're going after them directly.

    Would you be able to have the matter transferred to someone more competent? Your health and mental wellbeing is worth more than $5000.

  • +1

    theres the law society of whatever state you're in for these types of situations. definitely worthwhile as leverage or a threat as your means of resource ie. showing that you're serious about kicking their ass into gear, but honestly firsthand experience, they are can be a huge timewaste and also very corrupt. direct experience of leading members of legal society's, engaging in outrageously unethical malpractice in cases i've been involved. literal outright misappropriation & theft.

    delay paying costs, and or directly complain and if possible depending on the importance of what you're trying to do, seek better representation to take over. suing would be a complete waste of time regarding that amount. if even possible, theres a heavy burden of proof for that kind of thing in general, and as above not to mention the legal fraternity are scum fully aware they're engaged in collective racketeering & they generally look after their own… also, generally to sue your representation, your case needs to conclude to a point where it is clear your representation has failed or engaged in malpractice thats identifiable and resulted in a loss to you eg. clear ineptitude/malfeasance on their part, in relation to your outcome, and that generally means showing they've failed you in law or process, in ways that should be basic. but again, $5000 is not even close to that being realistic or worthwhile… sad & as relatively small or huge to you as that amount may be, a few $k doesn't really go anywhere in legal land unfortunately.

  • +1

    Depending on your location, lawyers are policed by a governing body, I know in NSW lawyers need a certificate from law society of NSW, and Law Institute of Victoria. I'm not sure how they take action against dodgy lawyers, but I know they can recoke their practicing certificate but not sure about how. Go check them out

    • I went through the Law Society of NSW to complain about a maggot lawyer.
      He wrote a reply admitting his bad character and they considered it matter closed.
      Waste of time… and money

  • +4

    I’d hate to see Australians becoming weird like in the US where everyone is ready to file a law suit for whatever reason.

    • Seems like some people are already leading the charge.

    • It's hard not to be like that nowadays.

      Behaviour has changed, people do not own up to their responsibilities (fix damage, make things right etc) without at least the threat of legal action.

      When is the last time you saw someone actually leaving a note after damaging a car (I spend a lot of time in public and see lots of accidents, I cant even count the number of times I have had to write down someones rego for the damaged party).

  • For this one or previous ones, if you create gofundme, I will be happy to contribute.

  • +1

    If in Victoria, there is the Victorian Legal Services Board + Commissioner that you can lodge a compliant to. Done it for both costs related matters and also unprofessional conduct. It works and it's pretty straight forward, but it acts like VCAT - you need to demonstrate reasonable grounds and also to have attempted to resolve direct with the legal services provider first.

  • +4

    My limited experience with a lawyer was the same. Had a deadline to submit documents. I called, sent emails and no reply. Promises and meetings were cancelled. Had a meeting at 5PM. I called her instead and was notified at 5.10PM that meeting is cancelled due to time contraints - via bloody email.

    I had enough and complained to the principal of the firm who finally got things rolling again.

    Either they're overworked, don't care etc. It was a lack of professionalism.

    • +1

      We're all overworked, but it's a pretty poor excuse for weeks of no response…

  • +2

    I've recently had an experience as well. Just confirms my view of them. Cunning money hungry bxstrds over all. I'm sure there are many exceptions, but a profession where $400/hr can be quoted and then even after agreeing to accept that they do absolutely fxckole and drop the case because clearly there will not be money in it for them. In the mean time leaving me in a lurch. I've seen them at work for friends where they just drag things out ad infinitum to clearly keep milking situations…. maybe (at age 57) I'm seeing it wrong, but I consider them the most unethical profession in the world. Very sad for the maybe 10-20% honest ones …

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