Landlord Refuses to Pay Plumber Bill and Property Manager Is Asking Me to Pay It

TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 20:39
Last edited 05/12/2023 - 10:07 by 2 other users

So, last week I got the water coming out of all the drains from my apartment and started flowing into my bedrooms, I raised it up with the property manager and she eventually sent a plumber to have a look, this guy spent around 20 odd mins and next day the manager sent me an invoice of $350 saying the owner refused to pay it and now wants me to pay instead saying I should have maintained the drainage and my only argument is I should have been informed earlier if that's for me to pay.

What do you guys suggest here as myself and the owner are still going back and forth with these arguments?

Edit: Since I was asked for more info: The plumber suggested that the blockage was due to the hair and residue over the period of time and he just plunged it to get it out, it wasn't toilet though, and it seems like the blockage was in my apartment only.

And I've also suggested to meet the half way but he is being a bit adamant about it.

Poll Options

  • 101
    I'm supposed to pay?
  • 484
    The owner is liable to pay?
Home & Garden

Comments

  • Gunnar on 04/12/2023 - 20:44
    +24

    Do you also have a dud dishwasher?

    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 21:54
      -1

      No

        • TaurusHead on 06/12/2023 - 10:47
          +16

          well $350 is also nothing compared to $970,000 Rolls Royce CULLINAN, so should I just pay it up?
          Mate money is not the point here, the point is who is supposed to own it?

            • TaurusHead on 06/12/2023 - 12:18
              +8

              @RTX9090Ti: You are way ahead of yourself as the username checks out, the plumber has been paid off, I'm just trying to understand from you guys whether I'm supposed to pay back to whoever paid to plumber or it's landlords responsibility or we both pay 50/50.

                • TaurusHead on 06/12/2023 - 12:51
                  +6

                  @RTX9090Ti: Mate, we believe our money should be well spent and that's why we both are here on Ozbargain along with others, as far as the time is concerned, I wouldn't know how much power do I have as a tenant if it wasn't for this post in the forum and these arguments we are having… . so doesn't feel like I'm losing much here . .

                  • RTX9090Ti on 06/12/2023 - 12:54
                    -8

                    @TaurusHead: Yeah but owner refused to pay as you said, what can you do? not much choice. and its only $350. if its $3500 yeah maybe go to fair trade or something.

                    • TaurusHead on 06/12/2023 - 12:59
                      +3

                      @RTX9090Ti: The agent is still in a talk with the owner and if owner can refuse so can I, but I just wanna do the right thing, having said that I don't wanna set the wrong expectation to the owner that he can just keep running away from his responsibilities either …

                      • RTX9090Ti on 06/12/2023 - 15:08
                        -8

                        @TaurusHead: They can evict you and make excuse about it. so better up just pay and be done with it. its only $350.

                        • Cheaplikethebird on 06/12/2023 - 17:51
                          +12

                          @RTX9090Ti: Spotted the landlord

                        • johnno07 on 07/12/2023 - 11:43
                          +4

                          @RTX9090Ti: If OP gets evicted for not paying a $350 bill that is the owner's responsibility, then I would consider that a bullet dodged. Imagine what other sort of bullshit the owner would pass onto them if they let this slide. In saying that, if the OP has been flushing wet wipes down the loo, that's a different story.

    • HeWhoKnows on 05/12/2023 - 22:02
      +28

      OP has left out key information
      Very biased post

      The plumber spent 20 mins there and did what?
      What did the plumber find.???

      Id guess the plumber found that OP caused the problem and hence is liable for the plumbers bill.
      Thats the only conclusion that can come from anyone with experience in this area.

  • timthetoolman on 04/12/2023 - 20:44
    +45

    Really depends what the actually issue was?
    Did you flush sanitary pads down a toilet or was it just a build up of crap over time?

    • PopCounty on 05/12/2023 - 21:19
      +6

      This.
      And there should be another poll option as ‘Depends’.

      • youknow on 08/12/2023 - 13:15
        +1

        Flushing Depends would definitely cause a problem!

  • bobbified on 04/12/2023 - 20:51
    +13

    What does the plumber's report say the cause of the leakage/overflow was? How did the issue get resolved?

    • Drakesy on 06/12/2023 - 21:16
      +1

      Turns out it was the OP's hair…

  • Muzeeb on 04/12/2023 - 20:58
    +24

    Definitely wasn't on a Sunday because the Sunday rate for 20 minutes work by a plumber is $420.

    • ihfree on 04/12/2023 - 21:05
      +11

      Only $69 on a weekday

      • Muzeeb on 04/12/2023 - 21:18
        +6

        Only if they're being niiiiice

        • cille745 on 06/12/2023 - 16:41

          $2 if Muzeeb finds you a coupon code to use

    • HeWhoKnows on 05/12/2023 - 22:05
      -1

      Very good Muzeeb

    • vchar on 06/12/2023 - 15:06

      that's a lot cheaper than the one I was charged last time. It costed me $350 for a less-than-5-min job :D

  • ihfree on 04/12/2023 - 21:09
    +2

    Can't really make suggestions without more information.

    What else have you been told? Did you discuss the issue with the plumber?

    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 21:57

      I didn't know the issue at all, property manager sent the plumber and he ended up fixing the blockage in 15, that's all.
      There was no talk about money, not with the property manager/owner or the plumber.

      • shutuptakemymoney101 on 05/12/2023 - 21:11
        +2

        Ask to see the plumbers report?

        You seem a little shocked that everyone involved in your problem didn't provide their time, expertise and equipment for free, of course someone was going to have to put their hand in their pocket and pay.

        Once you see the plumbers report you will be able to figure out whether or not that person who needs to pay should be you.

        • Danstar on 06/12/2023 - 19:46
          +3

          If it took the plumber < 15 and this guy has been in the place for 3 years. That answers the question

    • siresteelhell on 05/12/2023 - 20:09
      +4

      How long have u been in the apartment?

  • freefall101 on 04/12/2023 - 21:36
    +25

    I definitely wouldn't pay for it, because they'll turn around and also blame carpet/flooring damage on you as well.

    But take it slowly. Read your agreement and your applicable state laws (even just googling what the laws are around plumbing in your state will probably turn up a pile of results, this isn't new). Look at the invoice for what caused the issue.

    Water coming out of all the drains in the apartment and flowing into bedrooms sounds insane though, unless you were emptying a bathtub at the time and it was properly blocked it sounds like a building issue. Which is definitely not your problem.

  • jv on 04/12/2023 - 21:42
    +8

    Sounds to me like the blockage is due to hair and residue over a period of time…

    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 21:43
      +1

      That's what the plumber said.

      • jv on 04/12/2023 - 21:48
        +53

        I'll send you a link for my payment.

      • Tee Rex Arms on 04/12/2023 - 21:48
        +5

        FFS…

      • Drakesy on 06/12/2023 - 10:44
        +5

        And the truth comes out

        Sounds like you're on the hook unfortunately

        Although if its an old house then you may have some recourse

    • life is suffering on 04/12/2023 - 22:03

      you heard that?

    • shutuptakemymoney101 on 05/12/2023 - 21:28
      +6

      Clearly a Landlord fault then, nipping in to take showers when the tenant goes out.

      • Papa Huggies on 07/12/2023 - 14:23
        +2

        Plot twist OP lives alone and has whatever disease Jada Smith has

        • youknow on 08/12/2023 - 13:17
          +1

          Get her name out of your mouth!

  • AustriaBargain on 04/12/2023 - 21:54
    +10

    How does the owner know it was your hair?

    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 21:55
      +16

      The plumber may have provided the DNA reports back to the owner

      • jv on 04/12/2023 - 22:15
        +14

        Plumber used to be a Forensic Scientist….

  • WoodYouLikeSomeCash on 04/12/2023 - 21:57
    +2

    How long have you been in the property for?

    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 21:57
      -2

      more than 3 years

      • WoodYouLikeSomeCash on 04/12/2023 - 21:58
        +9

        Then it’s pretty hard to disprove if you’ve been in the property for the time period whereby the hair residue built up.

        • garetz on 04/12/2023 - 22:50
          +3

          Makes no difference, the maintenance of the property is the owners responsibility. If there was proper maintenance then this would never have happened.

          • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:32
            +12

            @garetz: This is partly on the tenant. It should never have gotten to this point. The tenant should have informed the owner that there was an issue long before the water came gushing back up the drains.

          • cookie2 on 05/12/2023 - 07:09
            +7

            @garetz: I agree. Pipe maintenance isn't a reasonable expectation. As long as it's being used normally and is a suprise to the tenant then it's on the landlord to pay. That's the annoying side of home ownership and rental expenses.

          • SlickMick on 05/12/2023 - 09:49
            +10

            @garetz: Maintenance like putting hair in the bin rather than letting it go down the drain? Should the owner come around every morning, or how do you propose?

          • cameldownunder on 06/12/2023 - 12:42

            @garetz: How is the owner responsible of renter's hair loss ? Or what if a renter ( not OP ) has the bad habit of draining the cooking fat down the kitchen sink and causes a blockage ? If used correctly, toilets, sinks and water drains do not clog up. I had a toilet clogging up, because daughter discarding hair in the bowl, and son using one of those funny toilet papers instead of the normal TP. All other sinks and water drains sill work.

          • Drakesy on 06/12/2023 - 12:53
            +2

            @garetz: Actually, it does

            Root incursion is the landlords, blocked drains due to hair/detritus from cooking would lie with the tenant.

          • bman20 on 07/12/2023 - 13:55
            +1

            @garetz:

            the maintenance of the property is the owners responsibility

            You are making stuff up. This is certainly not the case. Tenants have a responsibility to maintain aspects of their rental, drains and gardens are two such items. Better to not confuse the matter with incorrect statements of fact.

  • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 22:06
    +11

    Did you have any issues with drainage before this? You would think if it was a build up over time then you would have noticed your sinks, shower or whatever draining very slowly or being quite smelly.

  • zombrex on 04/12/2023 - 22:12
    +10

    Did the owner fit hair catchers over the sinkholes?
    A blockage after 3 years would fall under fair use / normal wear and tear.
    All humans naturally shed hair over time.
    I would refsue to pay.

    • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 22:17
      +16

      It's also something that you should notice before it gets this bad. If it was your own home you'd do something about it before water comes gushing back out of all of your drains.

      • Chandler on 05/12/2023 - 09:40
        +2

        you'd do something about it before water comes gushing back out of all of your drains.

        Do you regularly inspect your drains for blockages?

        Unless OP noticed slow drainage or smells coming from the drains, then how would they know/suspect there was a blockage?

        • ozbs25 on 05/12/2023 - 09:53
          +4

          You don't need to inspect your drains. I can only go with the info the OP provided and they said the plumber said this was something that happened over time. You should notice a problem at some stage before the blockage is so bad that water comes gushing back up.

          When there is a problem inside your pipes, you notice it. Water pools up before it drains when it didn't before. It's pretty simple.

          • Chandler on 05/12/2023 - 10:01
            +3

            @ozbs25:

            Water pools up before it drains when it didn't before. It's pretty simple.

            That is why OP got a plumber in:

            So, last week I got the water coming out of all the drains

            I agree with what you're saying, and without more information from OP its hard to make a call regarding it. Their water/home habits could make it hard to notice before it's spilling out of the floor drains. If, as I mentioned, OP noticed slow draining or smelly drains then yeah they should have done something about that which could have prevented the backflow. But without that being noted, then how do you tell?

            Drains won't necessarily be noticeably smelly; and the only time where a significant volume of water is being drained in my house is the kitchen sink, bathtub and shower. And the shower is the only one of those where I would be sticking around to notice slow draining, which depending on how slow we're talking could still go unnoticed, since there's a constant flow of water - you're not draining a large volume like you would in a sink/bath.

            • ozbs25 on 05/12/2023 - 10:08
              +2

              @Chandler: This is a tricky one (wrt who pays), and I am not sure what I would do to be honest. I have not voted.

              Maybe if the tenant was great in all other areas of maintenance I would just wear this one and give them direction on how to deal with it in future. If they were bad, maybe I would still wear it but not extend the lease. There are other possibilities but I don't have the time to go into it all right now.

        • keejoonc on 07/12/2023 - 15:19

          Lol are you joking? If it got this bad, surely whenever the OP was having shower, the water wouldnt have drained properly or at best, very slowly, which most would notice.

          • Chandler on 07/12/2023 - 15:24

            @keejoonc: I get a shallow pool of water in my shower, but this is due to poor workmanship/design (slope), not poor drainage.

            I agree that OP probably should have noticed, but I personally don't want to definitively make that statement without more information.

            • keejoonc on 07/12/2023 - 16:31

              @Chandler: It's easy enough to tell whether water is due to the drain blockage or some other issue.

    • jv on 04/12/2023 - 22:17
      +1

      All humans naturally shed hair over time.

      Not all…

      • Sye on 04/12/2023 - 22:34
        +6

        Looks like he has shed all his hair

        • jv on 04/12/2023 - 22:52
          +1

          Nah, he was born like that.

          • SBOB on 05/12/2023 - 07:11
            +5

            @jv: Maybe it was Maybelline

  • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 22:18
    +8

    This is on the owner. I, certainly, would push this back onto the manager. We’ve lived in our house for 30 years and haven’t had that sort of blockage in our showers.

    • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 22:24
      +1

      You're very lucky then. We have had to use some sort of drain cleaner in most of our drains at one time or another. I had to take apart the plumbing under our sink and we found that it was almost completely clogged. We were having issues with water flowing back into our dishwasher even after multiple attempts at cleaning the kitchen sink.

      • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:11
        +1

        Generally if you get a sink clog then it doesn’t go further than the sink. You put drain cleaner down it and it breaks up.

        • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:19

          Yes I know but it was bad. When I took the p-trap out it was almost completely blocked by a big ball of who knows what. It was so so smelly. Obviously once we got rid of that everything was fine again.

          • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:40

            @ozbs25: Actually sinks, especially kitchen sinks, can be bad because people put things like grease down them without pushing a lot of hot water to go with it. This is why we scrape off as much as possible into the bin before handwashing things. We also ensure we rinse down the sinks properly to stop things clogging.

            • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:41
              +1

              @try2bhelpful: Yes, we try our best to do all that too.

            • penting on 06/12/2023 - 09:17

              @try2bhelpful: even with hotwater it will still blocked. it just blocked further on the pipe.

              • try2bhelpful on 06/12/2023 - 09:45

                @penting: It should flush out unless you are pouring a lot down the sink.

              • Papa Huggies on 07/12/2023 - 14:27

                @penting: If you wash it far enough it's in the network though, and therefore with bigger pipes, other people maintaining, and most importantly, no longer your issue.

                Selfish? I suppose. But it saves you calling the plumber cos you've made a soapbar out of bacon fat underneath your kitchen.

    • jv on 04/12/2023 - 22:53
      +1

      This is on the owner.

      Why ?

      • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:09
        +5

        Because they are his drains.

        • jv on 04/12/2023 - 23:10
          +3

          Did he block them?

          • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:14
            +10

            @jv: He is responsible for maintaining them. It is like saying if the oven breaks down then it must be the renters fault because they are the ones who use the stove.

            • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:22
              +6

              @try2bhelpful: That's a ridiculous take. The tenant has to take some responsibility for the house. If the tenant is so filthy and doesn't clean the oven and that's what breaks the oven, how is that on the owner?

              • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:33
                +5

                @ozbs25: If the drains are clogged, or the oven breaks down, it doesn’t mean it is a filthy tenant. It sounds awfully odd that this hasn’t happened before now. It is highly unlikely there will be a build up of three years of hair.

                • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:40
                  +3

                  @try2bhelpful: But the person living there has to take some responsibility for the place they are living in. I only brought up the point of a filthy tenant as you're saying it's always the owner's responsibility to fix things.

                  If you notice something isn't quite right why would you just keep using it until it's broken. Isn't it smarter to just nip it in the bud? Either do something simple and fix it yourself, or tell the PM or owner, hey something is not right. Maybe if you do something now it'll be a $10, 10 minute fix rather than a few thousand dollars, a few months down the track.

                  • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:51
                    +5

                    @ozbs25: Don’t, necessarily, disagree but if you don’t know why something is broken then trying to fix it yourself might make it worse, then you are on the hook for repairs.

                    Tossing some draino down the pipes, now and then, is probably a good idea. In fact if I was the landlord here I would pay the bill then provide some detailed instructions on basic household maintenance to avoid further issues. This could include the proper way to clean an oven and how to unclog pipes.

                    If I was a landlord I would prefer my tenants don’t have a shot at repairing the hot water system or the stove if they failed.

                    • ozbs25 on 04/12/2023 - 23:55

                      @try2bhelpful: I'm only talking about simple, simple things. If it's anything more than draino or tightening a screw, something like that, inform the PM. Sometimes all it is is spraying some lube on/in something so that everything runs smoothly again. Depending on the problem and the owner, the owner may just buy a can of lube and ask the tenant to just spray "it" every once it a while. Obviously it depends on the tenant. Some tenants wouldn't be comfortable with even that.

                      • try2bhelpful on 05/12/2023 - 00:16

                        @ozbs25: I know it sounds like common sense but landlords providing a basic rundown of household repairs might not be a bad idea. Leave a plunger, and some screwdrivers, with a set of instructions how to deal with basic issues. Then have a “ring me” before getting someone in to fix stuff.

                        It might be because I was a PM but I learnt not to assume people have basic skills, or are comfortable to do something,

                    • TaurusHead on 04/12/2023 - 23:58
                      -1

                      @try2bhelpful: I second that

              • Slinky0111 on 05/12/2023 - 16:04
                +1

                @ozbs25: A renter would have periodic inspections, usually every 3 or 6 months and ovens need to be cleaned for this. Unless you're cooking a pork roast every single day there is no reason an oven should break due to poor cleaning if getting cleaned for every inspection.

            • jv on 04/12/2023 - 23:34
              -1

              @try2bhelpful:

              He is responsible for maintaining them.

              Not if you blocked them.

              • try2bhelpful on 04/12/2023 - 23:36

                @jv: If the tenant did block them. After three years of no issues I would be looking a tad further as to why?

                • jv on 05/12/2023 - 00:15
                  -2

                  @try2bhelpful:

                  If the tenant did block them.

                  Yes, with their hair.

                  • try2bhelpful on 05/12/2023 - 00:16

                    @jv: Yeah, because you repaired the drains.

                  • CommuterPolluter on 07/12/2023 - 20:04

                    @jv: Anybody who’s lived with a woman (or long haired man) knows how much hair they - naturally, and through no fault of their own - shed in the shower. Without proper maintenance this can lead to blockage of the shower drain; however, if the whole house is flooding then the system is not fit for purpose.

            • SlickMick on 05/12/2023 - 09:54

              @try2bhelpful: No, it's like saying if the oven gets dirty they need to clean it…. but if they don't clean it and it ends up being destroyed, yes it's the renters fault and they are the ones to replace it

              • try2bhelpful on 05/12/2023 - 16:51
                +3

                @SlickMick: Never seen an oven breakdown due to lack of cleaning.

                • ozbs25 on 05/12/2023 - 17:00
                  +1

                  @try2bhelpful: Replace oven with dishwasher then. The point is just because you are a tenant doesn't mean you absolve yourself from all maintenance.

                  • try2bhelpful on 05/12/2023 - 17:43
                    +3

                    @ozbs25: And being a landlord doesn’t mean you are absolved from problems with plumbing and fixtures in the house. Issues with plumbing are often hidden from sight. Frankly I have no idea what might be down in the pipes of my house just as there are bits of my stove I can’t get ready access to.

                    • SlickMick on 06/12/2023 - 08:51

                      @try2bhelpful: You're responsible for what you put down there. If you don't consider the consequences, you will eventually have a messy job and/ or a bill to pay. The landlord has nothing to do with what the tenant puts down the drain.

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