Travelling for Work, Is It Fair to Wake up 4am to Catch a Flight?

Decorot on 10/10/2019 - 21:07
Last edited 10/10/2019 - 21:07

Hey team, i think my employer is really abusing me, it's my first job travelling for work so i'm not sure how it's supposed to be, "small" busines with no clear policies.

I work 9am-6pm, if i do overtime it's unpaid

I fly for work 1x a month
they usually book the flights for 7am (but i still work til 6pm)
departure 7am means arrive at airport 6am which means leave home 5am which means wake up 4am, not to mention 1h (unpaid) packing up on sunday night
Then the return flights…
Start work 9am, fly back 5:40pm, end up getting home 8pm.

doesn't sound fair but seems that my boss thinks all the travelling is just part of my role

anyone else travel for work here? how is your arrangement usually?

I love my job but don't know how to approach this, or if i should just accept it as it's normal?

Travel

Comments

  • afoveht on 10/10/2019 - 21:09
    +165

    It's normal. But it is unfair.

    • capslock janitor on 13/10/2019 - 22:00

      That hurts knowing

    • trapper on 14/10/2019 - 12:58
      +6

      In my experience after an extra long work day or early/late flights it isn't unusual for people to come in 'late'.

      Just let the boss know you might need a bit of a sleep in to recover after the long hours, will be in around 10:30am etc

  • trex on 10/10/2019 - 21:12
    +33

    Flying 1x a month is not unreasonable. You could try asking your manager whether travel time can be claimed back as time off in lieu. I usually fly off on a weekend and have never claimed any time off in lieu back since there are upsides to business trips such as reimbursed meal, etc.

    • Decorot on 10/10/2019 - 21:17
      +2

      that was a valuable comment, thanks Trex, i do get the reimbursed $40 p/day meals which is fair enough as i can't cook. but that's about it, what other benefits do you have?
      gosh flying on weekends is no good

      • trex on 10/10/2019 - 21:35
        +1

        No real other benefits. I travel once every few months and for about a week away from home. I don't get any meal allowance rather it is reimbursed at cost (provided that the cost of the meal is reasonable). Occasionally it includes a few drinks.

      • knobbs on 10/10/2019 - 23:07
        +61

        $40 a day is very low according to the ATO, should be about that for dinner alone lol

      • PCHammond on 10/10/2019 - 23:30
        +21

        Is it $40 cash allowance or reimbursement? If it's reimbursement then that's really low. Even as cash it's pretty low, basically $10 for brekky, $10 for lunch, $20 for dinner.

        At my last role, it was $150 reimbursement daily. My current role is over $150 for dinner alone (but I usually spend about 30)

        • trex on 11/10/2019 - 00:02

          Reimbursement is when you get paid back (reimbursed) for what it cost you so OP's $40 daily is a cash allowance.

          Do note that such cash allowance based on per diem is subject to income tax unless if it falls below ATO's Reasonable Travel Allowance Rate. Your $150 for dinner alone is way above ATO's rate for dinner so it (probably along with amounts for breakfast and lunch) should be treated as a taxable allowance and attract PAYG. Total amount paid to you in a financial year should rightfully be reported in your Payment Summary and subject to Income Tax.

          • Dr Techno on 11/10/2019 - 09:45
            +20

            @trex: when I travelled I was on $90 per diem, I would hit up the 90 cent noodles a few times = profit :P

            • trex on 11/10/2019 - 09:51

              @Dr Techno: Perks of travel.. lol

            • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 09:59
              +1

              @Dr Techno: I used to do something similar too. Keep the profit and buy nice toys.

              Was fun days.

          • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 09:57

            @trex: Sorry, I must be using different definitions since I am terrible at tax.

            Among my colleagues and industry, we use "cash allowance" as when they give you the allowance nomatter if you spend it or not. For example if you get a $40 cash allowance, you keep the $40 even if you don't spend it all.

            A reimbursement is when we are only paid what we spend. So if we have a $150 reimbursement and we spend $20, we don't keep anything extra. It doesn't get added to our salary. At my current role I just use my company card to pay for my meals.
            The ATO site considers this as an exemption I believe:
            -you expect your employee to spend all of the travel allowance you pay them on accommodation, food, drink or incidental expenses
            -you show the amount and nature of the travel allowance separately in your accounting records

            But I am terrible at tax. Every job I have worked at since university has given me an allowance or reimbursement of some sort. One gave me a cash allowance and I did pay tax on that, whereas the rest it was all via reimbursement.

      • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 08:30
        +11

        i do get the reimbursed $40 p/day meals
        He's having a lend.

        Where I work we use the ATO guidelines for meals and accommodation unless the accommodation actual cost is more than the guideline (we aren't supposed to be out of pocket and if you are in a mining area the accommodation can be crazy expensive).

        Refer to TD2019/11 for the rates.

        https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/PAYG-withholding/Payments-yo…

        If you earn <$124480 the meal allowances are:
        breakfast 28.15
        lunch 31.65
        dinner 53.90
        plus we get "sundries 19.50"

        If you earn more than $124480 then you get more as you deserve lobster and caviar :-p

        If we are doing a long day trip like yours then fatigue is also an issue so we get a taxi voucher to/from airport/home (which can work out as $200 each way).

        unless you are being paid crazy money then your employer needs to step up to the plate and do the right thing.

        • ThithLord on 11/10/2019 - 09:55

          Those amounts are for claiming deductions on your tax, aren't they? Is it still considered the same reasonable amount if work is reimbursing? I'm asking cos I've been in the same position but was asked to keep expenses around $60 for all three meals, per day. Wasn't difficult, but it did hamper me at some times! lol

          • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 10:10

            @ThithLord: Nope I get paid that as a tax free allowance and it appears on my payment summary as an allowance. By being paid that you can't then double-dip and claim the meals on tax.

            It is an ATO guideline so your employer may choose to ignore it.

            in 2016/17 i was travelling overnight 10 days a month. The allowance appeared to be quite lucrative but there was no "away from home" allowance (previous employer paid $100/night for the inconvenience) so what you can save on meals (and accommodation) is your gravy for the trip.

            • ThithLord on 11/10/2019 - 10:12

              @brad1-8tsi: May be a difference between allowance/reimbursement - all my meals were reimbursed, but accommodation/airfares/hire care already covered by my employer

              • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 10:26
                +1

                @ThithLord: We have ~30-50 people away from their normal workplace most days. It's easier to pay the allowance than have the admin of checking each receipt and having the issues of people not getting / keeping / losing receipts or claiming a partial receipt plus you get the dodgies that try and submit old receipts or have the most expensive meal because the company is paying or the ones that have a moan because they don't eat much.

                Easier to give everyone the same amount to spend as they see fit.

                One of my colleagues just eats protein bars all day and stays at the mankiest, cheapest place he can find. He probably makes an extra $150/day.
                Personally, I don't like eating take-away all the time so i go to the supermarket and buy groceries for breakfast and lunch and have dinner somewhere nice.

                • ThithLord on 11/10/2019 - 10:46

                  @brad1-8tsi: Much the same at the company I work (it's a Bluechip company). I just don't stay in many accoms with a kitchen

                  • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 10:56
                    +1

                    @ThithLord: yogurt, fruit, hummus, flat bread, muesli, tiny LL milk, prepack salads and a small soft-side cooler bag, plastic container as a bowl, spoon and a sharp knife.

                    We are anywhere from 30-120 minutes from the nearest town

            • sabracad on 11/10/2019 - 19:40
              +1

              @brad1-8tsi: If it's appearing as an allowance on your payment summary it isn't tax-free it is taxable. Deductions can generally be claimed against taxable allowances potentially subject to substantiation requirements. Reimbursements are generally not subject to tax and hence don't appear on your payment summary. Deductions can't be claimed for reimbursements because there has been direct offset of the cost incurred.

            • macfanboy on 13/10/2019 - 13:16
              +1

              @brad1-8tsi: The allowance is not tax-free, it is simply not taxed when they pay it to you.
              When you lodge a tax return it will be included in your taxable income and then you will pay tax on it.

              You will also be able to claim against it.

              No such thing as tax-free allowances, they are simply not taxed at the time of payment.

              • dufflover on 13/10/2019 - 14:13

                @macfanboy:

                No such thing as tax-free allowances, they are simply not taxed at the time of payment.

                Used to get paid a tax free allowance, but yes you're right in that it's not actually tax free; just that the employer has already paid the tax part of it.

        • 2ndeffort on 11/10/2019 - 14:16
          +6

          I had dinner with the CEO of a multinational a couple of nights ago. He told me they went from receipts to a daily per-diem and he doesnt care if people are eating 2 minute noodles in their hotel room and banking their per-diem payment difference. He saved a packet by getting rid of the staff that used to check all of the expense claims and their former wages offset any negatives of a per diem payment policy.

      • mrvaluepack on 11/10/2019 - 10:49
        +2

        Yeah, thats low. My company has allowance for $60 per meal and able to claim back time in lieu or "work from home".

        • abuch47 on 11/10/2019 - 19:28

          our industry is $120 daily food and accommodation. wages though.

          • SBOB on 11/10/2019 - 19:35

            @abuch47: $120 a day for food AND including accomodation?

            that cant be achievable right?

            • abuch47 on 11/10/2019 - 20:08

              @SBOB: $70 for accommodation and $50 for food (just over $15 per meal). one time the boss found a deal at $50 per night in the caravan park cabin. We didnt get that extra $20.

              • mrvaluepack on 11/10/2019 - 20:41

                @abuch47: Jeez, luckily my company is rich. 4-star hotel is the minimum and maximum standard for overnight stay.

              • SBOB on 11/10/2019 - 20:43
                +1

                @abuch47: ouch
                thats way (way) too little (especially for accom)

                I'd need way more than $50 food allowance just for alcohol to be staying in caravan park cabins for work trips ;)

      • 2ndeffort on 11/10/2019 - 14:14
        +1

        Join the relevant frequent flyer program and bank the points your work is paying for. i think technically you are supposed to declare these as a fringe benefit if you use them, I've never met anyone that declares them. Also try to stay at the same hotel chain and join their rewards program. You might bank enough points over a year for a night away or some cheap flights.

        • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 14:28

          This. Also I find Accor to be the best for Australia due to having hotels bloody everywhere here and overall spend counts to status as opposed to nights alone.

          I've got many free nights worth of points. That's gonna make holidays cheaper

        • larmesdelhiver on 12/10/2019 - 11:43

          This. The way Qantas structure the points & status credit with guaranteed 800 or 1050 or higher depending on your status means that basically you would get a free flight for every 11 flights. So in the case of OP it means a free rt flight every year. I think that's a good bonus.

      • nikey2k27 on 12/10/2019 - 10:37

        Your luck went i travel for work it red eye 5.55am - 8pm home so i have get up 3am be airport before 4am park my car i hate it.

      • jellykingdom on 12/10/2019 - 12:43
        +1

        Damn $40 per day?????? How is that enough for whole day??

        My previous job was (within reason) unlimited, but simply reimbursed. Accommodation was the same, so I used to Cash rewards it and pocket the cashback.

  • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2019 - 21:16
    +9

    There's a bit more to it for me like what your job role is and what your paid.

    • 2ndeffort on 11/10/2019 - 14:20
      +4

      Yep if you're a CEO on a couple of mil then I'd say it comes with the territory

  • rgr on 10/10/2019 - 21:22
    +2

    wtf bro, i get up at 4am to fly interstate for the day e.g. sydney and come back at around 8 - do this probs twice every 3 months. what airline you fly? if it's jetstar then that sucks but if it's qantas than you're good. imagine the money you can pocket from expenses. make use of the flyers points if you can also, eventually the routine pays off with some nice perks

    • vikvance on 10/10/2019 - 21:48
      +1

      Travelling to and from the office is not a claimable work travel expense.

      • trex on 11/10/2019 - 00:09
        +31

        You can't claim for trips between home and your normal work place. You can claim travel from your home to an alternative workplace that is not a regular workplace for work purposes, read this.

        • spal on 11/10/2019 - 05:15

          You sure know your stuff Sir/Ms.

          • trex on 11/10/2019 - 23:21

            @spal: Thanks. Part of my job ;)

        • LXE3 on 14/10/2019 - 21:49

          What if you work from home?

          • trex on 15/10/2019 - 22:44
            +1

            @LXE3: There is provision for work travel expense if your home is the base of employment but you should check with your accountant on your situation.

  • aspirepranesh on 10/10/2019 - 21:24
    +3

    My role involves being on the road to meet clients, leaving at 6.30 am and back at 6-7pm sometimes. I am not expected to be in the office, but have the flexibility to work from home (which saves a lot of travel time) but I do fly once a month (sometimes back on Saturday morning flight from NZ)

    For the flexibility they provide me, I am more than happy to take the early morning flights considering I do get a food allowance while I am travelling.

  • garbagetnt on 10/10/2019 - 21:24

    it really all depends on your relationship with the employer, who's organising the logistics and the agreed timing with the client.
    this can mean it's part of the job or you can negotiate some time in lieu or something to that effect.
    best case scenario, negotiate to fly at more reasonable time like 9/10am and return at 3/4pm but all depends on the situation and circumstances.

  • vikvance on 10/10/2019 - 21:43

    Depends what you mean by "normal", but yeah, in a previous job, I had to roughly the same thing.

    Had to fly to Melbourne around once a month. Flights would be booked for 7:30, so we could be in the Melbourne office by 9. I live far away from the Airport, so had to get up at around 4:30, so I could avoid the morning rush hour traffic and arrive in time to catch the flight.

    And, yeah, I hated the job & was happy when I left it.

  • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2019 - 21:48
    +5

    Do it. Be the yes man. :)

  • SBOB on 10/10/2019 - 22:11
    +16

    You lost me at non paid overtime
    I travel a bit for work, but there better be some incredibly good salary or perks to not get paid overtime

    • TimOfEastBNE on 16/10/2019 - 14:46

      it's probably not non-paid overtime, I expect he is on a salary rather than an hourly wage, and the salary is worked out based on the expected number of hours (including overtime) needed to fulfil the duties of the role. So it is more likely "overtime for no additional payment". The employer has already factored that into the salary.

      So many employees do not understand that a salary means you have already been paid to do your overtime, whether you do it or not.

  • Halo375 on 10/10/2019 - 22:19
    +16

    Ask to fly out the night before or to take a later flight. Seriously - speak up for what you want, you’re not a slave.

  • Donaldhump on 10/10/2019 - 22:27
    +4

    I used to fly to Mel and Syd once each per month for a week, my employer did the same, and I told them, to fly me Sunday night if they want me there by 9am local time, they refused, so I refused to go… I am not a morning person, they made some one else go… I lived in qld so even worse as no day light savings… if company wants you to travel that comes from their time not yours

    I thinks it’s abuse, they should fly u the night before of at 9am… who the hell can sleep shi*ing their pants they won’t wake up

    Then later on the chucked the Perth one in and said I needed to sly Sunday…. I didn’t stay much longer

  • Kenb0 on 10/10/2019 - 22:43
    +16

    I used to fly every week from Melb to Sydney for work for a few years for a consulting role and got used to the flying.

    • if departure is at 7am, why do you need to arrive at airport at 6am? I used to arrive half an hour before departure time, go through security and straight onto plane as I had checked in night before, I did travel light and carry on only though so didn't need to check in anything

    • you take an hour to go from your home to airport, fair enough, that can't be helped, why do you need to wake up an hour before you leave? I used to wake up 15 minutes before i left, had a quick 5 minute shower, got dressed quickly and straight into waiting taxi/car to take me straight to airport, and I would catch up on my sleep in the car, have an on the go brekky if really hungry but ordinarily would just wait till got on plane to eat the brekky provided. As part of of our travel policy, we could book a chauffeured car rather than a taxi as the cost wasn't that much different and guaranteed a ride rather than the inconsistency of cabs

    • 1 hour packing on sunday night? Why so long to pack? It would take me 10 minutes if that to pack and shove everything into the case. I have my travel toiletries already packed from the week before so it was just pick some clothes and put them in small travel case

    • Homr on 13/10/2019 - 14:27

      ^^this guy knows travels

      You must racked up some good QFF points

      • Kenb0 on 15/10/2019 - 02:03

        I may have a fair bit in the 7 figure range….one of the few perks of working for a big company on an out of town gig for quite a few years I guess. Still a bit shy of lifetime gold though and way off lifetime platinum :)

    • EtherealArchelon on 14/10/2019 - 12:49
      +1

      Yup, no idea why he needs an hour before leaving for the airport.
      Put on pre planned clothes, leave.

      Shower the night before and eat breaky at the airport seeing as you have so much time there.

    • Donaldhump on 10/10/2019 - 23:23
      +13

      He isn’t self employed it’s not their client, it is their employers client, so they should be paid overtime or time off in lieu

      Why should any employee tolerate getting up three hours earlier and essentially using there own time , for no extra money

      One off maybe not as part of the role

      • PCHammond on 10/10/2019 - 23:34
        -7

        Because it's part of the role. If you don't like it then you find another job.

        I've worked from 6am until 12am before without overtime because it's part of the job.

        I've worked 15 days in a row because stuff needed to be done and it's part of the job.

        I've spent about 1/3 of the nights this year so far in hotels or in a plane, because it's part of the job.

        Things need to be done and so I do it. Because it's part of the job and it's part of my salary. My salary is paid to achieve goals and if I have to work extra hours or whatever, then I do it.

        • Donaldhump on 11/10/2019 - 00:51
          +21

          You’re paid to work 37.6 hours a week, by all means do extra when it’s needed, but if you do extra every week your employer is laughing at you.

          If you chose to work 50 hours a week to get your job done your choice. I just hope your getting good coin

          But if u r doing that every week why don’t you get s contract by the hour job

          And ur salary isn’t paid to achieve goals, it’s to work 37.6 hours a week, if ur goals can’t be achieved in 37.6 hours a week they need more employees. On the other hand if u could achieve ur goals in 20 hours can u play golf Friday and ur employer is cool..? Even better can u outsource it to overseas worker?

          • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 08:42

            @Donaldhump:

            If you chose to work 50 hours a week to get your job done your choice. I just hope your getting good coin

            At a previous employer i was told "If you need to do more than the 40hours/week that you are contracted to work then maybe you aren't good enough to do the job."

            At my current employer there are lots of folk on my grade doing way more than the 36hours we are contracted to do. They aren't asked to do it, they just do it. The more work they do, the more work gets thrown at them.

          • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:04
            -6

            @Donaldhump: No. You're paid to do what it says in your contract. My contract says "a typical work week is 37.5 hours" but it does not state anywhere that I am being paid for 37.5 hours a week.

            And yes, if I achieve my goals in less, my employer is cool with it. Results matter the most. And no, I can not outsource it.

            "good coin" is subjective, but yeah, once you hit a certain salary you also start having to work much harder.

        • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 08:37
          +10

          If "it's part of the job" then you are either getting paid a truckload to compensate or it's a crap job.

          My ex did a lot of unpaid overtime but her salary was twice mine. I got paid overtime or time off in lieu for extra work.

          When we did the sums we were on almost the same hourly rate.

          • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:05

            @brad1-8tsi: I don't know about OP's job, but I (profanity) love my job and I'm paid pretty well for it (in my opinion).

            I don't calculate my hourly rate, but working those long hours doesn't happen too often and my employer would expect me to start late if I finish late, without having to use leave.

            • brad1-8tsi on 11/10/2019 - 10:14

              @PCHammond: well paid is good

              Give/take is like gold. Most jobs that I have left is because the employer wasn't flexible.

              As long as you think you are fairly compensated for your effort then who am I to say you are wrong.

        • abb on 11/10/2019 - 08:54
          +1

          Because it's part of the role.

          As long as that was clearly identified upfront in the job offer, sure.

          But travel time is definitely work time. My employer gives me time off in lieu for travel outside normal hours, my previous employer would just straight up pay me for the time in transit (up to 8 or 12 hours per 24h period, I forget the details).

          • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:07
            -2

            @abb: Yep, if it's upfront then there's really no argument. If it was lumped on then OP needs to talk to his employer.

            My current employer does not consider travel time to be work time, but this is stated clearly in the contract. Don't like it, don't take the job. But they are flexible and are happy for me to fly during business hours if need be.

        • one man clan on 11/10/2019 - 09:06
          +4

          You're a stooge to the man

        • boostpak on 11/10/2019 - 09:59

          FiftyCal no it's not part of the job. If it is then you would have a high salary to therefore allow your hourly rate to be good. Working 50 hours a week on the same salary you would at 38hrs a week isn't right. Your hourly rate would diminish heaps. I value my time and my hourly rate is what matters not just salary.

          • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:10

            @boostpak: If it's what you signed on for, then yes it's part of the job. If you're getting a high salary then great. Similarly if you sign on for a job that states you need to wear a chicken costume and poo into a diaper, then you're getting what you signed on for.

            There are also other benefits to consider. Fresh grads are worked to the bone especially in fields like accounting, where they are often expected to work 60+ hours a week just so that they can get ahead of their peers, while being paid hardly anything. Hell, interns get worked to the bone and get paid nothing just so they can say they have the experience.

            • boostpak on 11/10/2019 - 10:58

              @PCHammond: then their hourly rate would be piddles and you have to factor in your weekly average work hours to your salary and figure out your hourly rate to work out how much you are getting paid

  • PCHammond on 10/10/2019 - 23:06
    +22

    No overtime? Welcome to the world of salaried positions.

    If it's part of your job it's part of your job. If you knew about it before hand then you have no leg to stand on. If it's a new thing then you have some room to negotiate with your employer.

    I fly almost weekly and sometimes I wake up at stupid hours. The other day I had a 6am flight and I had an event on the previous night that meant I only got to bed at 12am and I had to bring check in, so I got to the airport 45mins before the flight. Part of the job. It had to be done so I did it. I've got 2 suitcases of different sizes (1 carry on and 1 check in) that live in my foyer because they get used on an almost weekly basis. Both are pre packed with essentials so I just throw whatever clothing I need for the trip.

    If you want to be paid by the hour and dictate working hours, then you can always go find a different job. Sorry, as someone who travels often for work, I have not much sympathy. You should know what you're getting into before you accept the position. I'm lucky where my employer lets me fly up the day beforehand for most trips, but honestly sometimes I fly on the morning because I'd rather spend the night with my family.

    • peanut48 on 13/10/2019 - 10:58

      Ditto. I felt like OP at the start but swiftly realised my salary and position offset the time spent on business travel.

  • Randxyz123 on 10/10/2019 - 23:28
    -5

    Can you offer to cover the hotel and go the night before?

    • PCHammond on 10/10/2019 - 23:32
      +15

      Never ever spend your own money on your employment.

      • afoveht on 11/10/2019 - 00:02
        +4

        Never ever spend your own money on your employment

        but also

        I have to work extra hours or whatever, then I do it.

        Do you not see the contradiction?

        • trex on 11/10/2019 - 00:18
          +1

          I agree with FiftyCal. The extra hours is just part of the job which should (hopefully) comes with the salary. So if one already works the extra hours (or even travel during weekends or public holiday), one should never have to spend their own money to cover the hotel costs too.

        • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:11

          One has you spending money, the other has you not spending money?

          I've never spent my own money for the job. My employer always covers all costs. If you spend your own money, then your salary has effectively been reduced.

          • afoveht on 11/10/2019 - 18:28
            +2

            @PCHammond:

            One has you spending money, the other has you not spending money?

            Can you work for free for me too?

      • Donaldhump on 11/10/2019 - 07:14
        +1

        What about petrol to work and clothes

        But people seem to have no problems spending their time

      • Stopback on 11/10/2019 - 09:44

        But you should spend money on your own self care, if that helps your mental state and employment

      • Daabido on 14/10/2019 - 06:37
        +1

        Block-quote Never ever spend your own money on your employment.

        Hi teachers. The only profession that steals from home to take to work.

  • GUYANDSON on 11/10/2019 - 00:07

    Part of it, I've done regular flying and monthly. If it's once a month I don't particularly care, the weekly flights were the ones I asked to be flown in the night before or be given appropriate consideration (finishing a bit earlier/not on my game for the day).

    It's shit but it is part of the job.

  • bcarp on 11/10/2019 - 00:48

    Before you start complaining of not being paid overtime, for your hours, etc, are you on a salary or a wage?

    • Decorot on 11/10/2019 - 00:53

      salary, same coin getting in every month

  • Decorot on 11/10/2019 - 00:51
    +7

    lots of good points here! be the yes man and all that. i think i feel a bit comforted now.

    why in the world i'd use my own time to fly on a sunday? that sounds even worse

    Perks: flexibility, work from home, not much pressure usually, these trips are the exceptions where i have to work like a rat.
    i think $40 allowance is good enough, i eat like a pig and don't spend much more than that, but it's good to hear someone else is getting 150 just for dinner that's incredible!
    i stay in airbnbs not hotels which i don't particularly lover or hate

    some times i give myself a hire car and no one complains, under the assumption that i have a car back home i should have a car when working, does that make sense?

    salary is pretty low? 60k/yr for a technical team leader and trainer role, i do love the business and their mission though and they've sponsored me, i do have gratitude but i know there are blokes getting 90k/yr for not doing much more than i do.

    i feel under-valued but stuck in my comfort zone, much better than the old days when i was stuck in an office in sydney cbd but i feel like i used my engineer diploma as toilet paper

    not being paid overtime: that's just the business policy, i get that time in lieu if i'm not too busy to do so (which i usually am), i tend not to raise it as my manager probably thinks this travel time is not more than my obligation to accept

    in the overall picture it's not too bad, but i do get upset by the fact they clearly don't give a shit

    • spal on 11/10/2019 - 07:47
      +10

      Thanks for putting in further details to add to the perspective. Honestly, I feel that you are seriously under paid for the role. I don't think that you will find anyone in technical and training roles with leadership responsibilities for $60K.

      The way I see it, you will burn out or you will get the experience and then move on to a job which would pay at least twice.

      In the interim, have a look at your employment contract to see how travel and work time are to be managed. These individual contracts are good, but you employer still cannot pay you below the award rates. Maybe do some research on your industry, awards, speak with Fairwork and then go to your employer. Keep this information under your belt, and raise it only when you have another better job to go to. I suggest this, as obviously getting relevant experience is important for you at this stage. Your employer is exploiting you, you use them to gain relevant experience. Unless, the business is a start-up and you are also getting paid in stock options.

      $40 per day is very low, another sign of exploitation. Truck drivers have the lowest ATO per diem rate, which too is nearly a $100.

      If you are on an employer sponsored visa, have a look at your occupation classification. A sponsoring employer cannot pay you less than award wages for the nominated occupation. If you have come to Australia as an engineer, you may need to be on higher wages otherwise the employer is breaching your visa condition. But again, do all the research but don't do anything until you have an alternate plan lined up.

    • nomoneynoproblems on 11/10/2019 - 08:32
      +6

      Honestly, unless you're a grad or pretty new to the industry, you're getting taken for a ride. $40 is dinner alone for most places and is well below industry standard and let's not get started on your salary. Can't do much about travel, but in my last role I made a point to fly during business hours or close to and expected time in lieu for anything outside that. But if you love your job then that's what matters and I'm actually jelly.

    • abb on 11/10/2019 - 08:57
      +10

      60k/yr for a technical team leader

      This is the real crime. Look up advertisements for similar roles and start submitting your CV.

    • vetopower on 11/10/2019 - 10:11
      +6

      You are getting massively underpaid for your role and for the travel expectations placed on you. The very low reimbursement for meals is another indication that you are being exploited. Time to start looking for a new job.

    • PCHammond on 11/10/2019 - 10:17
      +2

      I used to loathe flying on a Sunday, but nowadays I do it just so I can get a good nights sleep. I like sleep. Also the hotel rewards points are nice when it's holiday time.

      60k seems really low. Nowadays alot of fresh grads are getting 60k for many industries. It's a hard one if they are sponsoring a work visa, since very few companies do that anymore. People on work visas are often shafted on pay because the employer knows that they have no/minimal choice-either work on lower money in Australia or leave Australia.

      I think that you really need to have a discussion with your manager. If it's part of the JD and contract, you are out of luck really, but if its not there then you can at least start negotiations.

    • PAPower on 14/10/2019 - 22:32

      You definitely should be on incentive based because 60k isn't good…I'm in the exact situation just like you work & salary wise, sponsored and shit (I guess for migration purpose) and it's not fun at all but I have incentives.
      The way I see it is if you can move from being a 'cost centre' to being a 'profit centre' then you'll have a slice of the profit…maybe it doesn't work for a 'technical role' but try to think and act that way, you don't know what you gonna get.

  • axxian on 11/10/2019 - 01:02

    Honestly - its just part of the job.

    I've been catching 7am flights to Melbourne/Adelaide on a weekly basis. As i have a family i choose to do daily trips - which means i leave the house at 5:30am and get back at 8pm and some days even 10pm (cancelled flight etc).

    My only thing I can recommend is try and book a flexi flight back - and if you have done your work - ask to leave early. From there hopefully you can catch a slightly earlier flight back if you're not required to be there for the whole day.

    40/day does seem low though - but if that's treated as a per diem - you can get away with spending less and saving a bit of coin I guess. For me - its all about expenses and keeping receipts :-S

    • casey2 on 11/10/2019 - 14:13
      +5

      "As i have a family i choose to do daily trips - which means i leave the house at 5:30am and get back at 8pm and some days even 10pm"

      Ummm, do you see said family?

    • wordplay on 11/10/2019 - 22:08

      Seems crazy to fly adelaide to melb and back daily, how often are you late due to cancelled/delayed flights?

    • nikey2k27 on 13/10/2019 - 17:10

      i personally try and go for the week went need too. i hate flying but it part of work

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