• long running

Superhero $5 Per Trade ($100 Min)

669

Just stumbled across this. Looks like they are launching today. Will fill in more details as I find them.
(Also check out the OpenTrader thread. CHESS Sponsored. $5 under $2,500)

$5 flat fee on all brokerage
PayID deposit available at no charge
$55 transfer in/out fee

Free Account

  • Market Orders only
  • Data with 20 minute delay

Superhero Live - $108/yr

  • first 30 days free
  • Limit Orders available
  • Live Data

AFR Article announcing the launch:
https://www.afr.com/companies/financial-services/afterpay-zi...

The low-cost trading is possible, Mr Winters says, because they will hold members' shares in a single special-purpose Holder Identification Number, rather than having each member assigned a HIN on ASX's CHESS system.

Still trying to understand the difference this makes, particularly if they were to go under

Related Stores

Superhero
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Comments

  • +1 vote

    Fees are at the right price, instant deposit via PayID is great too!

    Will definitely be looking more into them.

    Thanks @render

    • +12 votes

      No fee is the right price

      With all this competition we are headed towards it.

      • +12 votes

        If you want no fee trading, then trading platform will need to figure out how to make money out of you indirectly.

        Robinhood has figured it out but what they do in USA is not applicable in Australia.

        •  

          How does Robin hood do it?

          • +3 votes

            @Nick K: They sell your orders to market makers, hence your orders aren't really processed at the best market price.

            •  

              @Cozzie: You always place market limit orders, you don't just press buy with the app, that is stupid.

      • +5 votes

        Unfortunately we only have one exchange in Australia, and they're happy taking a commission.

        It's not going to be fee-free for a while.

        • +2 votes

          We actually have more than one exchange, and have for some time…

          •  

            @odysseus: Yeah but who actually trades on the other ones… lol

            •  

              @KilaPinguino: A large number actually.

              A fair amount of trades are automatically put through Chi-X by retail brokers.

            • +1 vote

              @KilaPinguino: You might! Our orders are routed for the best price. If there's a better price on Chi-X, you'll get it.

    • +2 votes

      PayID doesn't mean instant transfer, Osko does. Some PayID has Osko but not all.
      PayID is just to replace BSB+Acc number.

      • +2 votes

        What payid doesn't use osko?

        • +2 votes

          Just recheck, now all PayID enable banks have Osko. It wasn’t the case in the past (last year maybe). Now PayID = instant transfer.

          •  

            @OrangeBJ: PayID is not instant. It can take up to 60 minutes.

            Now PayPal on the other hand…

  • -2 votes

    Looks like it does:

    How are my shares registered with Superhero?

    When you purchase shares through Superhero or other brokers, your shares are held on a Holder Identification Number (HIN). Shares held on a HIN are called Broker or CHESS sponsored holdings.

    At Superhero, your shares are held securely on a special purpose HIN on ASX’s CHESS system to safeguard all of your financial assets.

    • +4 votes

      a special purpose HIN”

      This is where I’m unsure. Are they doing something here to save costs? And is it the same as a normal HIN?

      • +4 votes

        Their provider is OpenMarkets (as is ours) and your shares will be registered on ONE HIN. With us, you receive your own HIN which has many benefits aside from direct legal ownership and participation in corporate events.

    • +11 votes

      From the AFR article https://www.afr.com/companies/financial-services/afterpay-zi...

      The low-cost trading is possible, Mr Winters says, because they will hold members' shares in a single special-purpose Holder Identification Number, rather than having each member assigned a HIN on ASX's CHESS system.

      It doesn't seem like a traditional CHESS holding to me.

      • +2 votes

        It's similar to what Vanguard does for their platform I think. Might be hard to consolidate any existing CHESS holdings and if you ever wanted to move your shares out to another provider in the future, might not be possible?

        •  

          No question mark needed. You won't be able to 'move' shares - you would need to sell them and rebuy them. Given it's a trading platform (not an investment platform) I can't see this coming up v ery often if at all.

          This is the case for many other platforms/frameworks - either you're "in" their framework or the framework is built around you (as a bespoke management). Clearly the low cost option from a transactional perspective is the former.

          • +1 vote

            @jason andrade: Their fee schedule clearly states you can move shares in and out (for a ripoff $55 per security lol): https://docs.superhero.com.au/guides/Superhero+Fee+Schedule+...

            Although their FAQ says "In the future we will allow you to transfer your investments at your existing broker to Superhero. Until then, you can transfer funds and buy new investments in your Superhero account."

            So go figure.

          •  

            @jason andrade: You can transfer out of custodian holdings without selling and buying back. I’ve done it. You don’t want to unnecessarily trigger CGT events. Personally I don’t want any more nominee nonsense because it means you don’t get personal ETF tax statements.

            • +1 vote

              @kipps: Can you elaborate? If I wanted to buy an ETF for free on SuperHero, then transfer out to my existing CHESS HIN, or transfer out any other way, how could I do this?

    • +2 votes

      With HIN you are the owner of the shares. But "special purpose HIN on ASX’s CHESS system" may mean its owned by Super Hero

      •  

        Their terms and conditions state that the shares are beneficially owned by you, but held in bare trust. You'd have to ask your tax advisor if there are any tax implications from that. But because it's held in trust, their failure would mean the shares would revert to you.

        • +11 votes

          After a long court battle….

          Yep I'll stick to a known entity

          It's not until you get screwed over by a company do you realise how easy it is for your hard earned to be taken

        •  

          You might want to do some research into how that's played out in the past where they are held in a single broker account…

      • +2 votes

        You don't get your own HIN. That's why it's so cheap. There are plenty of setups like this at the moment.

  • +10 votes

    PayID deposit is a huge benefit, speaking as a selfwealth user.

  •  

    interesting…. how easy is it to move from selfwealth? do I have to sell everything then buy?

    • +1 vote
      • +1 vote

        What if I just created a SelfWealth account just recently and don't have anything on it yet. Am I able to just create an account with them?

        •  

          I have accounts with many trading platforms.

          But I’m assuming you signed up to SelfWealth with a referral code. So take advantage of the free trades first.

          •  

            @render: Many thanks for your reply. Didn't actually get to use a referral code. I'm just starting out on this so I'm very weary with every single thing as it's real money.

            • +1 vote

              @monchee: I’m personally waiting a couple of days for the experts to weigh in on this particular one.

              Usually things are held under your own name, under CHESS with your own HIN. So even if the platform goes under, it’s still yours.

              They’re doing things a bit different to standard (in order to lower costs). Haven’t fully understood what that could mean if they go under.

              •  

                @render: I'm seeing that on r/ausfinance right now. Thanks again. Might wait it out a bit too before I fully commit. Cheers!

    •  

      However from their FAQ
      https://www.superhero.com.au/faqs

      Can I transfer existing holdings to my Superhero trading account?

      At Superhero, we offer a completely paperless experience. Unfortunately our peers are stuck in the past and still want everything printed and signed in order for us to complete a transfer.

      In the future we will allow you to transfer your investments at your existing broker to Superhero. Until then, you can transfer funds and buy new investments in your Superhero account.

  • +16 votes

    Interesting, but special HIN doesn't sound right.
    Sharing a HIN could cause so many issues if they went under

    •  

      Don't think that's always the case.

      Remember all those Nominees Holdings Pty Ltd (HSBC Nominees, NAB Nominees Holdings) on the share register?

      I read this article the other day while trying to understand what these holdings are - https://www.austlii.edu.au/au/journals/AdelLawRw/1975/5.pdf

      IMO, the banks hold shares for their institutional clients under one HIN, and the HIN operates separately to the Banks (e.g. if banks went down, I believe clients still keep the shares).

      This might be what they're doing?? (article said nominees holdings are less expensive, which sort of match "low-cost trading is possible")

      Anyone else shed a light?

      •  

        That is correct. Those Nominee companies are trustees for trusts. Reading Superhero's terms, they hold the shares in a bare trust with you as beneficial owner, so they are legally protected if Superhero goes under.

        • +2 votes

          The difference though is with those you're a client of a big banking corporate, so
          a) nobody expects it to fail
          b) if it does, you should be covered.

          Completely different from here with a small private startup with no protection.

      •  

        You can still participate in capital raisings if you are with a broker using this model.
        Don't think that you should neg a deal on this point if you don't know yourself.

        •  

          I listed many other points. IB is not that easy to participate under this same circumstance. Refer to the comment below.

          Seems like it's not CHESS sponsored which could cause complications with capital raisings and if something problematic happens to their platform. It also requires a monthly fee if you want conditional orders/market depth/limits. On top of this they also charge $55 to transfer shares in or out.

          Put a negative so people read up on this properly. I'd only look at this for trading, do not leave your long term shares here.

          • +1 vote

            @machej: I am with IB and participating in capital raisings is no problem.
            Many brokers charge to transfer shares - Commsec charges $54, ANZ charges $55,
            The monthly fee - people need to weigh up the pros and cons and see what they need/prefer.

            I won't be joining but it may suit some. Probably those with small account balances who want to grow a portfolio.

            •  

              @bohn: Why wouldn't they go with Spaceship if they have a small portfolio? Free up to $3k or something like that.

              • +1 vote

                @machej: Maybe they won’t more choice and control of their investment opposed to a fund with 200+ companies.

    • -3 votes

      Hi Jessie,

      You can think of us as a trustee/ custodial broker, like how banks hold shares on behalf of their clients.

      Superhero's HIN is set up to be separate from our business and will not be impacted by business operations.

      •  

        I was trying to wrap my head around your product and listened to the fintech australia podcast episode about superhero. I feel like I have a better understanding of your product and what your trying to do. I like how your trying to automate things more. One question I have which wasn't clear in the podcast is besides cost was another reason why you decided to only use one hin was so you could automate manual tasks through your own system? John winters briefly mentioned digitising things like share purchase plans.

        My biggest issue with your product is that you don't offer limit trades on your basic account. I simply don't see limit trades as a premium feature. Limit trades are insurance that you'll pay a price your comfortable with rather than leaving it up to the gods. I can understand why there is an additional cost for all the other features on the monthly subscription but can't wrap my head around that limit feature restriction and why its there.

        Here's a link to the podcast that I referred to above if anyone else wants to listen to it.

        https://tieronepeople.com/2020/09/13/john-winters-superhero/

  • +1 vote

    $100 minimum is great. When I was starting out the $500 min and $29.95 from CommSec was a killer

    • +14 votes

      I mean, sure $100 investment minimum is great, but then you're starting behind with a solid 5% in the negative at the very beginning (The cost of the trade)

      The lowest you would want to invest is $500, at least then you are only 1% down, and that will make for a far quicker return.

      •  

        I agree on the maths. It’s more the mental barrier. And the allowance for people who don’t have front up capital to keep contributing. It’s at least a foot in the door, although reading this thread the whole HIN thing seems like a pain.

        • +18 votes

          If anyone is going to invest $100, they're better off trying Raiz or Spaceship Voyager, at least there's no immediate upfront fees there

  •  

    "The low-cost trading is possible, Mr Winters says, because they will hold members' shares in a single special-purpose Holder Identification Number, rather than having each member assigned a HIN on ASX's CHESS system."

  •  

    Just an FYI for anyone curious.

    Sign-up process was a breeze, just done a small deposit via PayID and waiting for it to clear.

    Will update later on how things go.

    •  

      Any referrals?

  • +5 votes

    The $5/trade basic account only supports market orders, no limit orders

    • +6 votes

      yeah pretty important point combined with the lack of clarity around HIN/CHESS
      I'll stick with SelfWealth for now, having limit orders generally helps me save $4.50 a trade anyway

    • +1 vote

      That kills it for actual investors that have price targets. For traders it's a really good deal.

      • +1 vote

        except you can't currently amend orders, so no good for traders as well.

    •  

      It was already questionable for the $10 saving just to lose your own HIN.

      Adding this lack of limit trades is a deal killer. Neg to call this out.

  • +9 votes

    Dunno about this one, it sounds like they're deliberately confusing potential customers with respect to chess sponsorship. If you're willing to forgo chess sponsorship, there are cheaper brokers out there. Not being able to transfer between brokers easily and freely is also a bit of a killer..

    • -8 votes

      Hi Tzar,

      All shares purchased on Superhero's platform are held under a CHESS Sponsored holding.

      When we hold shares on the ASX, shares are held either under an Issuer Sponsored Or CHESS Sponsored holding. We are not creating a a new holding structure to hold your shares.

      Think of us as a trustee/ custodial broker. You will be eligible to participate in all capital raising activities and have the same right just as any other shareholders.

      • +3 votes

        I think where you're getting some flak here is that while what you're saying may be technically correct, it also does not match what long-term investors are actually looking for in terms of assurances by having their holdings CHESS sponsored under their own HIN. It's hard to justify investing with a brand new company without this type of assurance in place, and afaik it makes it much harder to move brokers.

        For another example of how a custodial arrangement created issues in the past, IG last year forced its members to divest from cannabis shares. The users did not have the option to transfer them out instead because of the structure.

        Having said that, on review $5/trade is competitive with or below the other custodial brokers with respect to Australian shares 👍

  • +29 votes

    Yeah, no thanks. The price is right, but I wouldn't risk my investments being held by a single HIN. There's nothing stopping them just closing shop and taking everything with them. It's like them sharing the same bank account and saying "Trust us".

    Nope nope nope

    •  

      Is this different to how the likes of IG do it under what they call “custodian”?

      • +2 votes

        I think it's the same - they've just added an extra layer of lipstick.

  • +4 votes

    $55 transfer in/out fee?

    • +2 votes

      $55 per transfer in or out.

      • +1 vote

        Outrageous How is this a deal?

        •  

          Don't transfer in and out then, just buy / sell on same platform.

  •  

    single special-purpose

    This already sounds "phishy". Given how the ex Nasdaq Bernie gained people's "trust".

  • +2 votes

    so, its basically like crypto.com, where you dont actually own anything in a technical sense.
    so if they go bankrupt, you lose everything?

    •  

      Would it be any different to a custodian model? Where the securities are held in a trust?

      Even if you are CHESS Sponsored and your broker goes bust there will still be an amount of time where you won't be able to deal until your securities are transferred to another broker (with the current broker's permission - which really would be a decision by the administrator appointed).

      •  

        but in the end the shares are owned by them, and it would just take longer?
        but here the shares aren't owned by you…

        • +3 votes

          The shares are beneficially owned by you, in a trust with them as trustee. It's a standard custodial model, same as the big private wealth firms like JPM, Citi, Merrill Lynch.

          •  

            @Kyanar: Except there's a massive difference in security between those larger forms and this small private start up.

  • +14 votes

    I would much rather pay the extra $3.00-4.50 for other brokers such as SWF where you actually own your shares. This central HIN model seems shady to me.

  • +4 votes

    Sounds like some great features for entry into stock market.

    $5 brokerage is much better than anything else out there, but people need to be mindful of the $100 minimum the brokerage is 5%, which dramatically increases the cost base

    Edit: The special HIN sounds like a fancy way to say they’re holding shares in custodian for everyone.

    Other brokers have a 1 HIN system too, it’s called custodian brokers.

  • +1 vote

    Shared HIN is scary concept. Trader would be fine if you want to short and make profit. Investor would feel worry since they build their assets that they cant own directly.

    • +2 votes

      Yes, sound like a "friend" that collects mates money by putting bets at the TAB, but thinks the bets are going to be put on a loser, and keeps the "profits" but not actually placing the bets… if it goes the other way (runs-away).

  • +6 votes

    Just use OpenTrader for the same prices - at least its CHESS sponsored

    • -1 vote

      $2500 maximum trade for $5 brokerage. No limit for $5 brokerage here if you are happy with market orders.

    • +1 vote

      Definitely looks like a decent option under $2,500

    • -3 votes

      Hi Shadowsfury,

      All shares purchased on Superhero's platform are held under a CHESS Sponsored holding.

      When we hold shares on the ASX, shares are held either under an Issuer Sponsored Or CHESS Sponsored holding. We are not creating a a new holding structure to hold your shares.

  • +4 votes

    Follow the 'WallStreetBets' subreddit for an idea of what RobinHood has done to trading in the US. It would be entertaining if so many young lives hadn't been ruined.

    • +1 vote

      They should really have a warning about gambling life savings :P Although it seems like a lot of these newer platforms don’t support derivative trading yet?

    • +4 votes

      lol still waiting for RobinHood to open in Australia like they announced …5years ago now?

      •  

        Any minute now!

        I'm glad I didn't sign up to their mailing list waiting for the drop. Would have just been flooded with spam emails ever since i'm sure

        •  

          actually cant recall any emails…probably a sign it was never going to come…..

      •  

        Given robinhood recently withdrew from UK market (they were about to launch) to focus on the US market only, think it will be a few more years again.

  • +1 vote

    What's stopping someone from purchasing the shares via Superhero and transferring onto a HIN such as CommSec to higher avoid brokerage costs?

    • +1 vote

      $55 transfer fee

      •  

        55+55 right?

  •  

    Seems like there’s been a recent influx of newer trading platforms looking disrupt the current brokerage trends! However, I’ve noticed that a lot of these basic accounts have that 20 minute data delay. I was wondering how this particular caveat affects trading, if at all?

    • +4 votes

      Depends on if you're day trading or investing. If you're investing and are happy taking current market price, just deposit funds and place an order that will fill at market price. If you're day trading you need current data to spot trends and place limit orders to buy and sell.

      •  

        Agree, good platform to day or swing trade when you are not planning to keep your portfolio for long.

  • +12 votes

    Seems like it's not CHESS sponsored which could cause complications with capital raisings and if something problematic happens to their platform. It also requires a monthly fee if you want conditional orders/market depth/limits. On top of this they also charge $55 to transfer shares in or out.

    Put a negative so people read up on this properly. I'd only look at this for trading, do not leave your long term shares here.

    • -9 votes

      Hi Machej,

      All shares purchased on Superhero's platform are held under a CHESS Sponsored holding.

      When we hold shares on the ASX, shares are held either under an Issuer Sponsored Or CHESS Sponsored holding. We are not creating a a new holding structure to hold your shares.

      Think of us as a trustee/ custodial broker. You will be eligible to participate in all capital raising activities and have the same right just as any other shareholders.

      • +3 votes

        Refer to my comment below. That doesn't instill confidence, instead it comes across as deceptive. BBY and Opes Prime also had a custodial arrangement for the beneficiary of their users. A self CHESS sponsored HIN is the only way to go for long term holdings.