Are Teachers 'really' Underpaid

Trying2SaveABuck on 01/06/2022 - 15:44
Last edited 01/06/2022 - 21:04

I hear this a lot i got 3 friends that are teachers and the biggest complaint they have is they have to 'do extra' work planning and they feel they dont get paid 'enough' - from what ive seen most 'well' paid jobs people are expected to do some unpaid over times ie Lawyers, Accountants etc

Until i recently looked into the remuneration i always felt they 'deserved' more money but i personally think they are 'fairly' compensated i have linked the Victorian teacher salary PDF 'class' room teachers earn $72k starting to $108k (>10 year experience) - Now teachers who are specialists/leads can earn just under 120k.

https://www.education.vic.gov.au/hrweb/Documents/Salary-Teac…

108k would put you in around the 90th percentile of earners which is the top 10%
https://povertyandinequality.acoss.org.au/income-calculator/

now my friends all report they do 'some' work during school holidays but overall there working year is 40 weeks a year plus a few extra hours for planning and marking. When you take in all the holidays into account, ill add this 'wage chart' is as of the end of 2020 so once the new EBA comes in they would probably get another couple % point bump on that.

I personally dont think that 'warrants' the under-paid mantra they push but i might be out of touch i feel like they're actually on pretty good money….

OZ-Bargain is a pretty 'progressive' place so i'd be interested to see what others think on here

Other thing to factor in is this is Victorian and there would be differences between each state

Poll Options

  • 467
    Teacher are Under paid
  • 684
    Teachers are Fairly paid
  • 122
    Teachers are Over Paid
Education & Work

Comments

            • jetblack on 03/06/2022 - 11:42

              @Punkmak: No, I agree 100%. It wasn't something I had considered but fully understand now its been pointed out.

              • BrettSh on 06/06/2022 - 11:02

                @jetblack: Yeah, sometimes the parent's separation can get ugly. I know in one case my, (teacher) wife had to deal with being physically threatened by the father of a student. This low-life was in a bitter custody dispute with his ex-wife and felt that his kid's teacher was overly sympathetic to the ex-wife. The department recommended she take a restraining order out against this bully-boy but, she felt that would just make things worse.

        • pkbkcomps on 03/06/2022 - 13:12

          What you describe is my Sister’s life too! Exactly!

    • jellykingdom on 01/06/2022 - 18:53
      +9

      Work smarter not harder…

      • whatwasherproblem on 01/06/2022 - 21:43
        +3

        Precisely.

        I think we often see that though. Only the ones that truly love teaching and love children (not that way) stick around. The rest realise that they can get much more pay in a different job where they'd be using much of the same skills and ambition, and/or a better work/life balance with less stress and better clientele, by simply abandoning ship.

      • Nereosis on 02/06/2022 - 15:15
        +3

        In NSW, the Department of Education provides no (read that again) specified time in school hours for any planning, grading, report writing, etc.

        How, as an individual teacher, are you supposed to work "smarter" when your literal job cannot be completed in the hours you are expected to work?

      • Freestyle on 05/06/2022 - 12:17

        Tons of people love bragging about working more than the standard 40 hours a week,

        its not that impressive, also just means you dont enjoy your time off

  • Caped Baldy on 01/06/2022 - 16:00
    +42

    You forgot to include raising the kids too and get abused by the parents.

    • duk242 on 01/06/2022 - 16:31
      +30

      Don't forget being abused by the kids too!

      • Kangal on 01/06/2022 - 21:59
        +15

        …and raising the parents

  • screensaver on 01/06/2022 - 16:01
    -1

    warrens is warrants

  • GG57 on 01/06/2022 - 16:02
    +20

    Shouldn't the poll only be open to teachers?
    It is irrelevant what the rest of us think about how much different professions earn.

      • Benoffie on 01/06/2022 - 17:29
        +21

        'Profession' - what a kick!

        Teaching requires a qualification in order to register thereby meeting the very definition of a profession.

        • skullster704 on 02/06/2022 - 07:44

          Plumbers and electricians also require a qualification to register, but are “trades”

          • MorriJ on 02/06/2022 - 08:51
            +3

            @skullster704: Only because trading children for money is frowned upon still though in some areas of our society.

          • Other on 02/06/2022 - 22:49
            +1

            @skullster704: trades are a profession .
            Well thats what I always thought.

      • orangetrain on 01/06/2022 - 18:12
        +10

        Private schools are paid by our taxes too. In fact, it was reported that private schools are getting more money than public schools.

        • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 18:49
          -3

          Just goes to show you that you shouldn't rely on 'reports'.
          Private schools are not even REMOTELY getting more than public schools.
          The issue is partly where the money is coming from - and partly deliberate disinformation by public school teacher unions.
          According to the ANAO the total funding by sector is as follows

                        Federal Govt  State Govt Total Combined Govt  Private Sources

          State Schools 2920 11269 14189 751
          Catholic 9359 2678 12037 4365
          Independent 7735 2455 10190 12839

          The third number is the one to pay attention to.
          So the funding clearly shows the government (at both levels combined) pays more to state schools by a fair margin than either non-government sector.
          The liars will tell you that because the Feds pay much more to non-government schools that they are somehow unfair. Truth is the state has always been responsible for primarily funding state schools, and the Feds tend to pick up the non-goverment schools.

          • IM-Cheap on 02/06/2022 - 08:19
            +2

            @Almost Banned: Table is Gross recurrent income for each student by funding source.

            Not clear in post.

          • smartazz104 on 02/06/2022 - 08:22
            +1

            @Almost Banned: Private schools should be getting zip…

            • tomfool on 02/06/2022 - 09:50

              @smartazz104: Private school parents pay taxes that go towards funding schools etc. So it makes sense that the taxes they pay should go towards their children's education.

              • Charmoffensive on 02/06/2022 - 10:28
                +6

                @tomfool: I don't have kids, does that mean I should get a tax refund on school funding?

                • Other on 02/06/2022 - 22:51
                  +1

                  @Charmoffensive: No. You should not.
                  You want to live in a nice society?
                  Well then pay up.
                  If you don't you can move to Somalia. Then literally you don't have to pay for things you don't need/want.

                  • Charmoffensive on 03/06/2022 - 13:21

                    @Other: Mate, that's my point. Arguing that private schools should get funding because "those parents pay taxes too" is the same as arguing that people without kids shouldn't pay taxes towards education.

                    I'm all for paying my fair share of tax into welfare and vital services such as health and education, I'm just less enthusiastic about subsidising private enterprise so that the CEO of a private school can give himself an even bigger bonus the next year.

            • Bren20 on 02/06/2022 - 19:31
              +1

              @smartazz104: Private schools are providing a public but privatised service, and should get public funding. It could easily be argued (but not by me) that every student should get the same subsidy from the taxpayer regardless of if they are public or private.

              I think the current arrangement is right, where the taxpayers provide funding at a lower level per student for private schools.

          • Nereosis on 02/06/2022 - 15:16

            @Almost Banned: "Just goes to show you that you shouldn't rely on 'reports'."

            How someone can write that statement unironically just astounds me.

      • darxtorm on 04/06/2022 - 08:42

        who hurt you mate?

    • happydude on 01/06/2022 - 16:30
      +4

      Really? If it's too much, too little or just right, we are the ones that pay them.

      • GG57 on 01/06/2022 - 16:38

        The government pays them (if at public schools), just the same as the government pays police officers, lawyers, and any number of other public servant roles.

        That is why the pay grades and bands/rates are public information.

        It doesn't really matter if you think they are overpaid or underpaid.

        • happydude on 01/06/2022 - 17:07
          +6

          I for one think that the decisions of government (particularly spending) should be scrutinised.

          I also do this thing called voting from time to time. I find that assessing how a government operates our essential services (such as education) to be one of the factors to consider when casting said vote.

          But you do you.

          • GG57 on 01/06/2022 - 17:10
            +3

            @happydude: That's fine.
            On what criteria do you make your assessment if teachers are paid the appropriate level of remuneration?

  • trustnoone on 01/06/2022 - 16:02
    +5

    I think the main focus of "teachers are underpaid" come from the US to be honest (not that I don't hear people complaining here) where I think its not just pay but also a very different environment to teach in (re healthcare, student environment, costs, etc). Its also typically one of the areas that are "good" to push from a politicians perspective (education, healthcare, transport?) which I think means it comes up a lot.

    • mskeggs on 01/06/2022 - 17:05
      +19

      This is true, but there is a growing shortage of teachers in Aus too.
      If we aren't able to improve workplace conditions, and won't raise pay, how can we attract more teachers?

      This is like the complaints that people won't pick fruit.
      Sure they will, but you might have to pay more than you hoped.

      I don't see any of the folks complaining here about holidays and short hours becoming teachers? They must be silly not to make the change.

      • fossilfuel on 01/06/2022 - 21:06
        +8

        Honestly I would be very satisfied with the job if there's a huge reduction in admin burden/load. There's too much documenting everything, paperwork, emails etc for the sake of accountability. Teachers are so focused on admin instead of teaching because if they don't document, it might cost them their jobs.

        The data driven curriculum needs to go. Teachers are spending too much time testing and documenting reading/maths ability weekly/fortnightly to see where kids are at. It's physically impossible to provide quality feedback/teaching while gathering data. The data is used to "prove" that the kids are progressing. It makes so much more sense to listening attentively to a student read and giving explicit feedback/correction. Or even doing synthetic phonics (spoonfeeding sounds) for a good hour.

        • joeyg4343 on 01/06/2022 - 21:42
          +1

          Honestly, all teachers want to do is inspire and teach at the highest level they can. The bureaucracy, pointless data and aggressive behaviour is what's terrible.

        • drprox on 02/06/2022 - 19:17

          Sadly this isn't just teaching. Australia is simply wild about regulation and governance.
          Plenty of professionals out there would prefer they could simply put their best foot forward for their clients but are bogged down in admin.

          • fossilfuel on 03/06/2022 - 20:01

            @drprox: You're absolutely right, there's just too much admin everywhere. I get that it's important to have some records but right now it's excessive, unneccessary and time wasting. Most records will probably be filled and filed away before it gets shredded/deleted in a few years time.

      • nobro25 on 02/06/2022 - 08:25

        Shortage of teachers??? Ha! I know alot of casual teachers who's looking for full-time employment. Problem is once you go FT you have your job for life unless you retire early or f- up too much and go on the news for it.

        There's a long queue of casual teachers waiting to get a full time teaching position.

        • mskeggs on 02/06/2022 - 10:13
          +5

          This is very untrue post COVID in NSW at least.
          A large cohort of older teachers filling out the casual pool have left, and there have been very few new grads because they haven't been able to complete prac placements.

          Our local high school has been unable to staff 150 periods so far this year.

        • itsme56 on 02/06/2022 - 10:34

          Yep there’s a lot of teachers on indefinite leave. So 50% of working teachers are all on contracts and unable to get a permanent gig. Turns people off.

        • jamesorion on 02/06/2022 - 14:53
          +3

          My partner is a teacher. We've been traveling around Australia for the past couple of years and she has been offered full time positions many times when only looking for a few days of casual work. There are teacher shortages all over the country.

          • netpenthean on 02/06/2022 - 16:30

            @jamesorion: well especially in the country

            up until covid, a lot of teachers would have to go to country to start, then they could get transfer to metro school

    • whatwasherproblem on 01/06/2022 - 21:45
      +2

      I think the main focus of "teachers are underpaid" come from the US to be honest

      Based on recent frequently occurring events over there, teachers in US schools ought to get hazard pay.

    • netpenthean on 02/06/2022 - 16:33

      *in the US, a lot of school funding comes from local property tax
      *if you live in a "bad" area, no property tax, bad schools… vicious cycle
      *in the US, school board positions are like elections, i can't even begin to imagine

      *US unions are weak, in some areas teachers don't get paid at all for holidays,
      *Many US teachers have second jobs just to survive - I don't think any Australian teacher needs to do this

  • Mechz on 01/06/2022 - 16:02
    +22

    What do you do for work OP? How much are you paid for it?

    Let's all judge how easy we think a job is and how overpaid those workers are without doing it every day for a year.

  • CrowReally on 01/06/2022 - 16:07
    +19

    TEACHERS HAVE HAD IT TOO GOOD FOR TOO LONG they should just stop whingeing and go to work like the rest of us yeah

    source: never worked in the industry, has no idea what he's talking about

    • Caped Baldy on 01/06/2022 - 17:25
      +2

      interacting with the general public sucks.

      I don't really support pay increases as that doesn't address the actual issues. There needs to be better support.

      When covid started each school had to set up docs and homework for students. It makes sense to me that this comes from the top. I'm aware of the syllabus but that only goes so far.

    • nobro25 on 02/06/2022 - 08:28

      Absolutely!!! Try working in a call centre at a Bank. Then go back to teaching is literally heaven and hell.
      Honestly I don't mind dealing with kids and two or four complaints from the parents.

      But trying to explain to people why their personal loan didn't get approved or why there was a late fee or overdraw fee on their account… Hell no!

  • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 16:08
    +21

    My mother is a teacher at the top end of the payscale (has been doing it for about 30 years) and the biggest complaint is the same as the others that there is an ever-growing mountain of seemingly uses admin and 'professional development' work. Also there is a common misunderstanding that teachers get paid for all their leave during school break, they aren't. It is deducted and averaged out over their yearly salary.

    • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 16:14
      -8

      Sorry - explain that to me again…
      Teachers' AREN'T paid for their leave during school break???
      Do you mean the paychecks stop coming in - because I can assure you that doesn't happen.
      So, they ARE paid for school breaks, and their annual salary is simply broken down and paid fortnightly like most wage and salary earners - BUT most wage and salary earners don't get all public and school holidays…

      • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 16:25
        +5

        Sure, can explain it again. The amount of time off they get during the school term breaks (apart from end of year which is compulsory leave time) is deducted from their total pay. They still receive a paycheck during that time due to that deduction. So yes they are paid during that time but they are not paid for that time. Make sense?

        • GG57 on 01/06/2022 - 16:27

          Here are the Victorian arrangements:
          https://www2.education.vic.gov.au/pal/annual-leave-teaching-…

        • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 16:36
          +7

          No, it still doesn't make sense.
          If what you are saying is true - and what Trying2Save says above is also true - then you are saying that teaching graduates who are paid approx. $70,000 pa are actually being paid either:
          1. $70,000 pro rata - so they are actually only getting approx. $63,000 gross as they are not being paid for the approx. 10% of the year that they are on school holidays, or
          2. When the Dept of Education says the starting salary for a teaching grad is $70,000 - they actually mean it is $77,000 because teachers never see that extra 10% which they do not get because they don't work school holidays,
          both of which are nonsensical.

          • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 16:41
            +1

            @Almost Banned: Ok, nothing more to be said then.

            • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 16:44
              +4

              @LanceVance: But there is something more to be said…
              Is it 1 or is it 2 - or is it the far more likely scenario I originally claimed that teachers have a flat annual pay that they get if they are employed at 1 FTE - and get a pro-rata percentage of that flat annual rate depending on what percentage of an FTE they occupy, and that flat rate is divided by 26 and paid fortnightly and does not have regard to school holidays because if you are on a full FTE and you turn up for work when required - the government doesn't care about when you are on school holidays as you are 1 FTE, being paid at 1 FTE rate, and you attend for work in accordance with your obligations as 1 FTE???

              • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 16:49
                -3

                @Almost Banned: I don't know exactly which scenario it is. Everything I know I said above which is directly from my mum who was worked in the profession for 30 years. Any more than that I can't answer.

                  • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 17:08
                    +1

                    @Almost Banned: Cool story bro, mother dearest isn't in WA so that is irrelevant. Have a nice day.

                    • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 17:21
                      -3

                      @LanceVance:

                      Cool story bro

                      Dude, seriously? YOU ARE TELLING THE STORY ABOUT WHAT YOUR MUMMY TOLD YOU!!!
                      I choose WA because that is the jurisdiction I am most familiar with. If you want to back up your nonsense fantasy that teachers aren't paid for school holidays with facts (other than 'Mummy says') now I have called BS, feel free to refer to the Teaching General Agreement in whatever jurisdiction you like.

                      • Nereosis on 02/06/2022 - 15:21
                        +1

                        @Almost Banned: I don't understand what is so hard for you to understand mate.

                        Teachers get paid (for example) 70k a year. That is taxed like everyone else. That is 70k (taxed) for the time that they work NOT for the holidays - it is just paid out fortnightly even over the holidays.

                        Whatever dumb way you want to calculate it doesn't matter that is how it works. If they were paid for holidays then they would get paid more.

                        Obviously, you're just a POS who thinks teachers are overrated.
                        Either, teaching is hard and underpaid hence why you aren't one or it's too easy and overpaid and you're too dumb to get into it.
                        Which one is it mate?

        • Freestyle on 05/06/2022 - 12:19

          They are either paid or not paid, stop trying to make this fking convoluted

      • doryappleseed on 02/06/2022 - 14:45
        +1

        Actually, if you aren't on a permanent contract, then yes - pay stops during school holidays.

    • trapper on 02/06/2022 - 15:50

      Also there is a common misunderstanding that teachers get paid for all their leave during school break, they aren't. It is deducted and averaged out over their yearly salary.

      Wait so a teacher on a $100k salary would only actually get $75k after their three months of holidays are deducted off and averaged out? is that what your saying?

      I don't think that's how it works.

    • waving on 01/06/2022 - 16:23
      +3

      There is already considerable casualisation in the workforce and in many areas there exists a shortage of teachers. I don't think it's a competition issue. The fact that a teacher in Brisbane, gets paid the same as a teacher in Weipa (bar maybe a 6k remote-living payment at best) which doesn't even cover transport costs I think is a major issue. I think their should be a proportionate loading or tax incentive equivalent (10/20/30/40% the further out you are), the more you can make.

    • DashCam AKA Rolts on 01/06/2022 - 16:31
      +2

      As casualisation/contract based teaching increased, graduate teachers, on average left the profession after 5 years. Despite the over supply by unis, there remains a chronic shortage of teachers in certain areas (Science, Maths), in secondary and general in remote areas.
      Graduates with Maths/Science degrees found stable employment elsewhere.

      • PensionerXXL on 01/06/2022 - 16:47

        not sure why they have schools in remote areas, surely a laptop and a free nbn connection is cheaper than setting up a school in kangaroovile and paying teachers etc - sure they miss out on some social aspects, but surely getting them all on a farm together once a week can fill that void, and we will know early on who from the group will be going for the royal flying dr's and we can fast track that, once one of them flips a tractor

        as for science and maths, meh shorten the week and start up a technical school for the greater regions to goto as a collective this should also stop these special teachers from copping abuse from eshays

        • DashCam AKA Rolts on 01/06/2022 - 16:54
          +1

          So you are suggesting people in remote regions, eg. ag/mining/indigenous communities aren't entitled to schools? Really, or trolling?

          • PensionerXXL on 01/06/2022 - 16:58
            +1

            @DashCam AKA Rolts: mining should self-fund to make the move for families more attractive over just a fantastic wage for one/two parents
            indigenous lmao nice try not touching that one with a stick

    • toniyellow on 01/06/2022 - 16:47

      The opposite would be a far better solution. Keep the pay the same, but have a lot more teachers (if you could find them).

      With a lower student to teacher ratio, the teacher can spend more time engaging with each student - better for the student, and the teacher will have more time to do all their marking properly (with actual feedback given so students actually learn, not just ticking boxes) and keep on top of admin

      At the moment if a kid needs help they basically need to get outside tutoring because the teacher doesn't have time to spend going over the same material again till they understand, they have to move on with the class.

      • PensionerXXL on 01/06/2022 - 16:50
        -5

        those costs of leave, annual/sick(& 'stress' LOL) already hinder full time, adding more is just ballooning costs
        strip it away, better base pay and let them tutor during holidays

    • jjjaar on 01/06/2022 - 16:56

      Lol why don’t they deserve job security? Also who cbf working in a system where you constantly have to hire new temporary staff. What an inefficient way of doing it.

      • PensionerXXL on 01/06/2022 - 17:03
        -5

        no, they dont deserve job security. in fact they should be rotated out after x amount of time so their teaching methodology does not become antiquated and out of touch with future learning needs/requirements. care to guess how many of these teachers with job security couldnt learn how to teach online during the pandemic?

        imagine being a teacher, but stuck in your ways and resistant to change…… id argue we need more people who can keep up, not a select few who slow everything down

        also whats that say about teachers who cant learn new things? :/

        • jjjaar on 01/06/2022 - 17:13
          +1

          So in your plan, who is going to teach all the children when there is already a massive shortage of teachers?

  • JoeBogan on 01/06/2022 - 16:16
    +24

    Easy for people on a bargain website forum to judge a profession on whether they are paid well it underpaid.

    I've got a few mates that are teachers and they work easily 50 plus hours most weeks as there's a lot more involved than any of could possible imagine. Even the 2 weeks off they get every quarter is basically spent creating lesson plans etc and a myriad of things ready for the following trimester.

    I've had a few mates leave the profession due to how stressful it can be.

    • zoombie on 01/06/2022 - 16:24

      I keep hearing this but never understood how/why there's a constant needs to create lesson plans. Admittedly, it's been a while since I was at school but I'm fairly sure that they use the same text book every year and the syllabus is more or less the same. Once in a while, they might change the textbook and/or syllabus but it's not an every year thing. So if those things don't change, why does the teacher needs to create a new lesson plan and not being able to reuse the old one?

      • JoeBogan on 01/06/2022 - 16:26
        +11

        One of the biggest time kills is creating reports for every student on now they are progressing through the syllabus, the lessons plans are tailored for those students from my limited knowledge.

        So you can't really reuse th same lesson plans as every child needs individualized plans.

        • lethological on 01/06/2022 - 16:35
          +6

          Your mates sound exceedingly passionate, working in private school environments, or both.

          Few teachers have the time, resources or ability, to run concurrent lesson plans for all the 20-120 kids they teach (depending on grade and subject).

        • nobro25 on 02/06/2022 - 08:38
          +1

          Wth? My teacher barely even knows my name let alone make a lesson plan solely for myself. Most teachers use the cookie cutter build that they set out each year. Just switch and swap questions with every other year to make test questions that look new.

          Really teaching in my experience is:
          1. Watching informative video. Class discussion, maybe write a small essay on what they have learnt.

          1. Reading a text book.
            A. Answer questions in text book.
            B. Have a discussion - write up a few paragraphs of the subject.

          2. Straight forward question and answer. I.e. for maths/chemistry/physics etc.

          3. Topics for in-depth group projects and presentations.

          4. Mock exams.

          Have never seen a teacher tailor a teaching class for any particular student.

          • Charmoffensive on 02/06/2022 - 10:48
            +2

            @nobro25: Glad we have the perspective from the massive sample size of 1.

      • LanceVance on 01/06/2022 - 16:28
        +8

        The impression I've gotten is that mostly useless bureaucrats in the education departments need to come up with new ways to justify their existance which is usually more initiatives and work for teachers to do.

      • jellykingdom on 01/06/2022 - 18:55
        +3

        THANK YOU!!!!! I KEEP SAYING THE SAME THING! Why do they need to keep inventing new lesson plans constantly????? It feels like 50% of their hassle is self inflicted (and according to teacher friends noone shares or hands down lesson plans, it's all new), and the other 50% is due to government interference leading to paperwork

        • U4333439 on 02/06/2022 - 07:17
          +1

          My understanding on this (not a teacher) is swapping grades. If you keep the same year group, the second and subsequent years are much easier. The first year is painful as there is no plan ready. In a well organised situation I'm sure you could reference the previous years plan, but I'm guessing these are fairly personal to teachers and part of the gig is making your own or extensive tailoring.

          • jellykingdom on 02/06/2022 - 08:30
            +1

            @U4333439: And see this is one of my exact comments to my teacher friends. It is the height of inefficiency (not their fault really, its the system) that lesson plans are not a) standardised, and b) available to everyone. We have a standardised curriculum but not standardised communal lesson plans, which of course they could then tailor to their needs if they wanted. It is absurd that they need to lesson plan constantly. I work in heavy industry, and I cannot even fathom how the manufacturing industry would function if we had to work in the same way

            It could be a reward-based system where your contributions to the lesson plans are acknowledged by the Education Dept (or whichever entity does that sort of thing) so you're always getting the "best" plans available

        • Nereosis on 02/06/2022 - 15:26
          +5

          I'll lay it out for you.

          You know how you and your best friend or brother/sister whatever aren't the same person? You actually have quite different brains, levels of skills in different ares, and learn at completely different rates?

          Now, times that by 25, then sprinkle in a few kids who are several years behind and one or two that are several years ahead.

          Now, grab that pre-made lesson plan for year 5 maths and give it a go. Oh, half the class can't get past the first question? Smarties 1 and 2 are already done? A quarter can work quietly and the other quarter have started scribbling all over the page? Now the quiet ones are distracted because Johnny (who can barely read) has started talking as loud as possible. Great lesson going on here.

          You need to make plans for YOUR class with the individuals you have. If you want all teachers to stick to pre-made lessons then you can't complain when your child doesn't get engaged and doesn't learn a single thing all year.

          • MrDixit on 02/06/2022 - 17:09

            @Nereosis: As a parent, you can see the impact of this, particularly for younger kids.

    • whatwasherproblem on 01/06/2022 - 21:48

      Easy for people on a bargain website forum to judge a profession

      Fun, too.

    • Freestyle on 05/06/2022 - 12:22

      how many fking lessons do you need to create? If you work smarter you'd just be editing a draft lesson plan you have to suit the students you got, not creating a brand new one every year, makes no sense

  • Muzeeb on 01/06/2022 - 16:17
    +8

    Those that are passionate about education and helping develop children - underpaid

    Those that teach because they aren't qualified for anything else - overpaid

    • AustriaBargain on 01/06/2022 - 16:22
      +1

      What if they teach because they aren't qualified for anything else, but they are very effective teachers. Only they wish they weren't teaching and wish they were a movie star or something instead.

    • PrettyBrokeTBH on 01/06/2022 - 16:43
      +5

      It's a job, not a passion. My builder isn't passionate about building houses, it's just his job.

      I'm not someone who boasts about my passion for teaching and other nonsense, but I still do a better job than 1/2 the teachers who post their classrooms on instagram and share their lesson ideas on tiktok. The idea that all teachers need to have this insane passion for helping children needs to go.

    • SF3 on 01/06/2022 - 20:59

      Problem is “standardisation”, it’s not how good you are, it’s the band they are in. So you are right imo, there should be correlation with the skills and paid, not just some generalised banding determining paid.

      Good ones stay around because they are “givers” and want the best for the students.

      “Here to collect pay check” types (not that anyone will notice and do enough to get by) also stay around because they got no where else to go.

      There needs to be some non pigeon hole way good teachers get a “bonus” even if it is not a direct pay raise.

      Problem with overall pay raise is the ”Here to collect pay check” ones are able to ride of others coattails to get benefits.

  • TheMindsetTraveller on 01/06/2022 - 16:17
    +33

    Teachers are sooooooooooo well-paid that 99% of us here won't even do the job. Just saying.

    • duk242 on 01/06/2022 - 16:34
      +10

      This is it - If you think teachers are overpaid, why not become one?

      • Almost Banned on 01/06/2022 - 16:50
        +2

        There are a number of jobs that are generally considered fairly well paid that people don't really want to do for a variety of reasons.
        Deep sea divers, artic fishermen, proctologist to give some examples…

        • mskram on 02/06/2022 - 12:10
          +1

          Are you saying teaching is as unpleasant as your suggestions?

          • Almost Banned on 02/06/2022 - 12:12

            @mskram: Not exactly - just that sometimes jobs are well paid but people still don't want to do them - or are unsuited to them.

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