According to a few news articles like: https://www.9news.com.au/technology/nbn-plans-to-supercharge…
NBN propose to upgrade internet speeds at no extra cost to the retailer. What do you think this means for us consumers? At the moment, I am on a 50/20 plan for $75 / month. I am hoping we finally see a reduction in internet costs!
Faster uploads would be welcome…
what do you use uploads for?
I didn't think shitposting required a faster upload speed.
100/40 has been my sweet spot due to ensure QoS Video Conferencing (I know ppl said video conf doesn't take a lot of bandwidth but experience wise, it matters) and multiplayer gaming although I must admit, it's probably more of a security thing.
@Clear: Just on this NBNCo are slowly taking the hint as more providers are getting access to higher download speeds without needing to be on NBNEE, as the new business speeds are 250/100 for around the $250 a month mark and then 500/200Mbps is the next one and then 1000/400Mbps, but even then these speed tiers are not cheap.
Cheaper then NBNEE though as the 1000/400 plan is around the same as 100/100 NBNEE.
So if you are running a home based business such as a video editing business or graphic design or something that requires higher upload speeds these new speed tiers are a winner.
A few providers have been offering them but more will be on the way.
@Typical16-bitEnjoyer: It's not that video conferencing per se requires 40Mbps, during the non-school holidays, we have a number of people WFH in the technology industry and we are finding 40Mbps provides that stability and QoS (40mbps = 5Mb vs 20mbps = 2.5Mb so 2x more stability). During school holidays when kids are streaming and multiplayer spree plus skype sessions would have tested the limit. This excludes any other devices that constantly uploads (cloud and stuff in the background) while you are still WFHing.
It does matter in my opinion.
And as per Clear, home businesses would benefit from it too.
@burningrage: What kind of SQM are you running? In my experience higher bandwidth doesn't stop bufferbloat- it just shortens the duration of high jitter when someone on the network transmits a large chunk of data (eg initial buffering of a video stream)
Having a CAKE or FQ_Codel configured means everyone in the house almost never experience high latency for latency-sensitive applications (even with a relativlely low broadband bandwidth). This makes a good user experience where ppl think the bandwidth must be high.
Video conferencing on Teams max out at 3-5mbps only so in theory even a lowly 50mbps connection can support 10 of these simultaneously. But the moment someone loads a video stream, the initial buffering will max out the connection bandwidth and causing high latency for video conferencing users.
High bandwidth won't help, but SQM will.
Read up about bufferbloat.
@Typical16-bitEnjoyer: Might just be that advertised 40Mbps max connections are more guaranteed to provide [whatever is actually needed] reliably than lower tiers?
what do you use uploads for?
uploading.
Self host cloud need faster uploads.
As others have already said, there's definitely a demand for increased upload speeds:
@Chandler: Yes you're right
If i'm out of my house and i'm VPN'd to home then …. my download speed off my mobile is my upload speed at home and thats .. 20
i had forgotten about that.
@Chandler: Higher upload speeds won't help in many of the options you listed i.e. gaming updates which only benefit from a faster download speed.
And many of these have very little overhead for upload speed required, i.e. video conferncing and cloud gaming, in those cases the upload would be well under 10Mbps and providing more won't improve performance. Latency becomes much more important.
@PeelThis: Yeah I noticed this myself after I wrote the comment!
Video conferencing and self-hosted services will use upload, with the latter being the biggest contributor, depending upon what you're doing, of course. If you're using a VPN to tunnel all your remote traffic through your home infrastructure, that'll use a chunk of upload (again, depending on what you're doing remotely).
Uploading gameplay to Youtube.
More and more people work from home 20-25 is very poor, its a minimum
@Baghern: Absolutely, a push for an increase in download speed will also help to put the pressure on NBN Co to increase the upload speed as well which will be a big improvement for many.
i used to care about uploads until i got my nas.
it can just upload in the background slowly over many days and i really dont care when it finishes.
and the router can do QOS so my day to day work is not compromised.
Faster upload should be the focus IMHO.
get things more symmetrical, even if it's only 2:1 ratio
Not sure why people question this, it's a totally valid point. With everything going cloud storage this is a must have. Other countries such as Singapore offer 1:1 download/ upload ratios for lot less than this nbn monopoly…
I've been on 100/40 for about 3+ years now just because of upload speed.
Yep, I'm on 250/25 and keep wondering whether I'd be better off on 100/40….
250/250 would be perfect for me…
I wonder if they will also upgrade the 12/1 and the 25/10 plans…
nbn didn't say. I guess they stay the same.
Which would impact the most vulnerable, the poor and the elderly.
@jv: And yet in my not particularly large circle of friends and acquaintances I can think of half a dozen who are working past retirement age, most of whom returned to work in some capacity after retiring.
I doubt it. So many Fixed Wireless and FttN users can't get any better. They need to keep the 50/20 plan for this same reason IMHO.
Or switch to a best effort charging scheme, so you can pay for what you get.
ie every mbps above 25mbps add 20c or something. Anything to encourage people to pay more without them feeling ripped off.
ie on my crappy FttN I was loathe to pay for 50/20 when my max line speed was only 30/8, but at the same time, I wanted to get the best I could. It was a half decent compromise when ISP's started adding the 25/10 tier at least, but I'd be pretty annoyed paying for a 500/50 service if my line was only capable of 75/25.
Most decent ISPs wouldn't let you order a service over 100Mbps if the line can only do 70Mbps or under. You would need to buy an NBNEE plan if you wanted faster speeds in that case. That is how NBNCo get around doing a lot of upgrades as they figure business owners will just pay out the money for an Enterprise plan. But not every business needs the enterprise plans small cafes that just use internet for a bit of email and to take payments as an example would get away with a 50Mbps connection.
As for personal users needing higher upload cloud storage is the big one if you have ever tried uploading several gig worth of files using an ADSL connection you know the drill.
Its painful and takes bloody ages.
Having teeth pulled would be easier.
Most decent ISPs wouldn't let you order a service over 100Mbps if the line can only do 70Mbps or under. You would need to buy an NBNEE plan if you wanted faster speeds in that case.
Which is just not feasible for private users.
If my line is capable of 70mbps, why are my options only pay for 50 or pay more for 100 (but only get 70)?
Why can't I pay for 70, at a price in-between the prices for 50 and 100 plans?
There is no actual reason, it's just not how NBN was set up (back when it was going to be 90% Fibre and therefore these problems wouldn't exist for 90% of users)
@ESEMCE: Given we are talking about government employees / public servants (profanity) knows what goes through their heads, if we knew that we would be living on Mars already or something. Or politicians wouldn't get away with as many lies.
The ABC show Utopia isn't meant to be an instruction manual for government but it comes pretty close to one.
Are they planning on upgrading fttn to fttp for everyone? All my family scattered around Qld have had the offer (but not Adelaide yet).
It's a bigger upgrade than moving from dialup imo.
I'm so happy to be able to choose what speed to purchase.
@SlickMick: The current FTTP rollout is meant to finish in December 2025 and leaves about 600k FTTN homes in limbo. nbn have said FTTP is the end goal in the fixed line areas. I reckon the remaining FTTN homes will get FTTP from 2026.
@SlickMick: They're doing it in selected areas nationally.
I'm in Adelaide and my area because available for upgrade in August 2023.
12/1Mbps is going away from all accounts its not even on our new price list at CPK Web Services as an option anymore. Where as it was previously I just didn't offer it.
Flip still offer it.
$39 per month.
Anyone who thinks you are getting more bandwidth for the same cost….. just consider someone on FTTC who can get a maximum of 100/20, seeing someone on FTTP getting 500/50 for the same cost. Ain't no way they are accepting that.
Upshot is expect these faster FTTP tiers to cost much more than the old tier, just so the scale looks sensible. They will dress it up, but in the end the crummy end of the NBN are just too expensive to allow the sensible end to be sensibly priced.
It's likely NBN will just delete the 100 & 250 tier so your base will be 50 then jump to 500.
I was paying for 100 and getting 10. The only remedy I could find was cancel and go wireless.
"Not accepting it" means finding an alternative solution, not changing what they offer others. (They could probably drop to a lower plan and remain on 100.)
Regional Australia are worthy beneficiaries of the NBN. Most other consumers are being out-played by price segmentation, where prices are differentiated based on willingness to pay. I'm cheap so currently pay for 12mbps down but I've seen my HFC line running at 477mbps.
Costs might go down for some e.g. if currently paying for 250/25, can "downgrade" to 500/50.
I'm on an intro deal that ends soon, and am undecided on whether to spend a little more for super-fast, or slow down and save some money.
Sounds like I might be able to have my cake and eat it too.
nbn prices on the faster speed tiers went down in December 2023. Change ISP a couple times a year to get the best deal.
Based on the email I got on Monday from iiNet on Monday our 1000/40 plan is reducing this month from $149.99 to $109.99 - service and inclusions are unchanged
That has nothing to do with this speed increase announcement. Your 1000/50 monthly costs are going down because of the new nbn pricing deal done in December 2023. iiNet could have given you the discount in January.
I prefer cheaper over faster. That said, internet access costs should be going down while speeds should be increasing. However, this is Australia; we cannot seem to do anything right in this country. The poor people on 50/20 plans are getting whacked with price increases, while the rich are getting price decreases and increased speeds.
The government owns the internet infrastructure; nothing is stopping them from lowering prices. Retail ISPs are just resellers; their markups are relatively low.
Nah RSP.s are not your friend
Mine is…
Their reps flirt with me on chat.
Well they are desperate to get out of the Philippines..
I'm fine with 50/20 for $59 for 6m with superloop.
At the end of the 6m i'll move to some other introductory period nbn provider.
6m with superloop.
At the end of the 6m i'll move to some other
6 minutes is not very long though…
that's what she said
you can call them up and ask (or threaten) for a discount offer for the next 6 months for superloop
or threaten
That sounds very over the top…
Do you have anger issues?
I hope not :o
maybe i should change my words: "threaten to leave"
@Shankskun: That sounds a bit better…
I had pictures of "A Current Affair" knocking on your door to explain your comment.
nice! thanks. i'll use that in 4 months
Makes sense. The very lowest tiers on fibre should be abolished completely tbh and higher tiers offered for the same price, or even a bit cheaper.
Thinking about the Channel 10 CEO admitting to the media that he doesn't even know how to install the Channel 10 app. Australia is lagging behind most other countries in the digital realm. We should all be taking these technologies for granted.
The very lowest tiers on fibre should be abolished completely
Why?
Many seniors just need it for VOIP.
What difference does it make if they get more speed for the same price?
Make two or more calls at the same time.
Why would it upset you, sorry "the seniors" if they get something better for the same price?
if they get something better for the same price?
They don't appear to be included in this offer…
Seniors plans are not listed.
They missed out last time too when the plan costs for the higher speed plans were dropped.
I've been finding 12/0.8 entirely satisfactory but would gladly accept a higher speed/tier for the same price
I remotely manage my elderly Fathers 12/1 connection via an Asus router app, I mean "I used to".
Once he came off an introductory 12 month 50/20 plan and dropped down to 12/1 the upload is proving too slow to be able to use the app with.
As the owner of a provider I can say that will never happen, too many older people who just use the Internet for phone calls and businesses such as cafes and bars that aren't on the net much only to place orders and take payments, that doesn't need high speed fibre at all. 25Mbps is fine for taking payments and being able to order more slabs and such.
Plus a number of other businesses tradies etc that don't need fast internet.
Also won't happen as NBNCo is focused on lining its pockets using money from other government departments hence why NBNEE is available in the middle of no where where everyone else can only get fixed Wireless.
They are focused on profit.
Suddenly ISP’s will require you to use their modem to get these speeds
Mine is better than anything they offer so I'd like to see them try to argue that
Why would they? Sure they'd try the upsell but this probably won't change much for them except a few website edits.
No reason why RSP's would do that. RSP-supplied routers are normally crap and most people aren't contracted with NBN services nowadays, so I can't see people buying a new router each time they switch RSP.
I'd have to get a new router every 3 to 6 months.
They can try to upsell more expensive routers, but they can’t force you to buy their equipment. Your FTTP NBN connection box already supports 1Gbps, that’s all what matters.
I'd love it if this happened. I hate that my HFC relies on this NBN-Co shitbox. If it fails, I'm at the mercy of NBN-Co to get their idiot techs out, confirm it's failed, then from what I've read it can take over 2 weeks to ship a replacement.
I'd rather just have an ISP modem fail and then go and buy a replacement the same day.
You are stuck with the HFC NTD. This isn't changing.
That feels like it'll be a lot of work along the HFC network. Upload speeds have always been a struggle along the copper network. Curious how close to the houses those upgrades need to run (and how many years that would take for full coverage), or if it's always just been a 'too pricey to upgrade the hubs' scenario.
I was thinking the same thing. But hopefully something comes out of the announcement.
They would be better off just ripping out HFC and replacing it with Fibre. I don't think HFC was even in the original plan it was going to be Fibre everywhere and Fixed Wireless in rural areas plus Satellite for the really remote areas only.
Very much agreed, I remember with the 'original' NBN plan that was something to look forward to. But now that we're here, gonna be a long time before HFC is pulled out of the ground - have to at least start with new builds getting FTTx.
Ill take any upgrade to my connection. I'm on 1000/50 HFC, I get weird issues sometimes, hopefully one day in the future ill get FTTP. Would love symmetrical 1gig or 2gig.
I googled a random NZ address in Wellington, They can get 4000/4000 fibre for $149NZD….wow. Now that's a speedy connection.
The same address can also get 8000/8000 for $280NZD if your feeling adventurous.
I can only dream of those speeds…..
Realistically what problem does 8000/8000 solve though, what is the tangible use case this unlocks?
Even 100/20 is overkill for the average person/household.
Likely some day there will be an actual requirement but there doesn't appear to be anything on the horizon.
I work in IT and from home and realistically all it would mean for us is faster Steam downloads and Windows updates.
I get what your saying, but you could say the same for cars in Aus. no car needs to go over 110Kph, but a sports car, heck even a Tesla can go from 0-200kph in an absurdly short time.
For me, Ive always believed having higher internet speeds, drags the bottom up. As to if my belief is true or not is another thing. swings and roundabouts.
also I just can't stand slow internet, so clearly I'm bias to wanting faster.
I wouldn't say that's a similar comparison at all!
Can defintely relate to the joy in having a fast accelerating vehicle.
Having owned a sports bike in the past, it served 0 utility compared to my slower car but was and absolute joy and plain ol fun!
Meanwhile me going from 50Mbps to 100Mbps I don't get any of those similar feelings, I go to speedtest.net and see the higher number. Cool! Lantecy/ping is the same though
Now how do I actually use that speed difference?
What can I do with 100Mbps+ internet that I can't with 50Mbps?
Well nothing fun, websites don't load any faster, can already use the highest bitrate for streaming services.
Gaming, nope no advantage or change to the expereince itself.
The only difference I'm aware of for me is large downloads over 1GB which doesn't happen all that much, so basically a shorter time waiting for something that normally just happens in the background and happens infrequently.
Going to 8000Mbps doesn't even gurantee that it will be faster for downloads either as often this is throttled by the CDN that you are downloading from or you reach some other limitation like your local WiFi speed or your desktop running a 1Gbps NIC.
IMO those speeds are more for servicing a 100+ people at one location all utilizing a fraction of that actual speed throughout that day, or businesses doing large data transfers from an office location.
Contrast that to when going from dialup to to ADSL/broadband in the 2000s
Wow everything is faster, websites load so much quicker
I can actually use youtube and stream music live
My latency is actually better, I can play games online
I can video call my family from my holiday in Bali over Skype, what a time to be alive
It just allowed so much more and I've been holding out for what that next jump is that these increased speeds unlock
I wholly agree. Most households would be fine on 25/10 but the retailers can readily upsell because so many customers believe faster (and dearer) is better. I'm sure the energy sector is trying to unlock this… premium grade electricity for rich people.
It means you get faster download/upload speeds if you have HFC or FTTP. These proposed new speed tiers are not final and might change. Your monthly nbn costs won't go down.
Side note: nbn have proposed to change the minimum FTTC to FTTP upgrade speed from 250/25 to 100/20.
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