Washing Hands in Home and Public Bathrooms

ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 10:35
Last edited 26/03/2024 - 10:56 by 1 other user

I've often wondered about this, but since COVID it has been on my mind even more.

We go to the toilet, and get nasty bacteria on our hands. Then we go to the sink, put our hand on the tap to turn the water on to wash our hands, and transfer some of that bacteria to the tap. After washing our hands thoroughly, we need to put our hands on the tap again to turn the water off. The bacteria is now on our hands again.

And how about public toilets? You wash your hands thoroughly, then dry them. But then you need to put your hand on the door handle to open it. And in the back of your mind, you know that handle has been touched by hundreds of people, some of whom didn't wash their hands after going to the toilet, and many of whom didn't wash them well enough. Sometimes the door opens outwards, in which case you have to put your hand on the door to push it open, but it's basically the same outcome.

Maybe we have resolved this in some toilets/bathrooms, but it seems like the majority are still like this.

I know Japan has mostly resolved this problem. Public toilets in Japan don't have doors. All sinks in public toilets have electronic sensors so you don't have to touch anything to turn the water on. And toilets in people's homes have a little sink at the back of the toilet that automatically runs water when you flush the toilet, so you can wash your hands without touching anything.

Anyway, just wondering if anyone has the same kind of thoughts, or am I seeing this from the wrong perspective?

Health & Beauty

Comments

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 26/03/2024 - 10:42
    +1

    bacteria

    i like goat brand hand sani from cwh doesnt dry out my hands like most soap and aggrevate my hand eczema- no rinse required.

  • try2bhelpful on 26/03/2024 - 10:44
    +15

    If you are really paranoid then use hand sanitiser once you are out of the bathroom. However, given you will be touching surfaces that people have also touched in a multitude of situations you will, probably, be using sanitiser all day.

    • DashCam AKA Rolts on 26/03/2024 - 13:43
      +1

      O.P. = bubble boy

      https://youtu.be/XlbKilkG8uY

    • Stopback on 26/03/2024 - 16:07
      -2

      hand sanitser doesn't kill all types of germs

      • try2bhelpful on 26/03/2024 - 17:21
        +5

        Nothing kills all types of germs. However between washing hands and sanitiser you cover a pretty wide range.

      • iminabrons on 27/03/2024 - 12:10
        +6

        Remove hands.

      • nobro25 on 27/03/2024 - 16:00

        Notice the disclaimer: kills 99.97% of bacteria.

    • TEER3X on 26/03/2024 - 21:50
      -2

      Sand hanitiser, it really should be called that, just has to be bad for you/your skin in the long run.

  • Guybrush57 on 26/03/2024 - 10:47
    +33

    Use the paper towel you used to dry your hands to turn the tap off.

    • Ughhh on 26/03/2024 - 12:44
      +13

      And open doors

      • Bystander on 26/03/2024 - 19:10
        +6

        This was the instructions on the wall of the toilets on the cruise I went on pre-covid. They had bins outside the toilets for the paper towels.

        Good idea IMHO.

      • lysp on 28/03/2024 - 23:13

        I went to a bar once, that had a little slightly folded metal plate attached to the very bottom right corner of the door.

        You could tuck your toe underneath it and use it to pull open the door without using your hands.

    • TEER3X on 26/03/2024 - 21:53
      +9

      I do that to open doors. You save a little bit of water in one hand, then turn off the tap with the other. Then rinse your hands with the saved water.

      And remember to always throw the used paper towel behind the door you just opened. That way, a bin will eventually (possibly magically) appear right by the door.

    • kiitos on 27/03/2024 - 07:50

      Paper towels are rare these days, being replaced with air dryers.

      • yakzilla on 27/03/2024 - 08:51
        +11

        I read that they were kind of awful in terms of blowing greeblies around the room, particularly with airborne stuff like Covid.

        • bomberswarm2 on 27/03/2024 - 12:40

          You read obvious paper company propaganda, they've been claiming hand dryers do that for decades ever since they realised the hand dryers and it's one time cost would put them out of business.

        • neonlight on 28/03/2024 - 14:06
          +1

          Agree air dryers are rubbish

    • SlickMick on 27/03/2024 - 09:35

      I was just told on the weekend that you can do that if you like (read: paranoid), but there is no evidence it makes any difference. No idea what the source of that research was though, so make of it what you will.

      Also something I learned recently, the washing part is supposed to be done with tap off. The water is only to wet before soaping and rinse when finished. I can't believe I'm missed that all my life. Water conservationists would hate me.

    • LFO on 27/03/2024 - 10:33
      +1

      Use the paper towel

      But … are those paper towels bacteria & germs free? …

      Maybe made from contaminated recycled paper?

      We are doomed!

    • Dalton on 27/03/2024 - 14:25

      I do this, but I also keep in mind that some of the almost invisible holes in the paper towel are massive compared to the size of bacteria.

  • bargaino on 26/03/2024 - 10:51
    +20

    Hygiene is a numbers game. You are covered in bacteria, and constantly breathing in airborne viruses.
    Washing is never perfect, which is why sterilisation is a different thing.

    But you can help by using the back of your hand to turn off the mixer tap. Or your left pinky to open the door.

    • Thrift on 26/03/2024 - 13:02
      +15

      left pinky to open the door

      But then the bacteria will get shoved right up your nostril!

  • Benoffie on 26/03/2024 - 10:51
    +4

    This is why I carry a small bottle of Aquim in my pocket. 100% agree on Japan's public amenities. Can't say the same for Korea though.

    • pjetson on 26/03/2024 - 16:11
      +2

      But wouldn't you then get the bacteria on your Aquim bottle?

      • ProlapsedHeinous on 26/03/2024 - 21:06
        +6

        Bacteria turtles all the way down.

      • smartazz104 on 27/03/2024 - 07:03
        +9

        That's why you have a second bottle of Aquim to clean the first one.

      • skillet on 02/04/2024 - 17:37

        You clean the bottle while you clean your hands.

    • Poor Ass on 26/03/2024 - 21:04

      soap on a stick lmao

  • Darayus on 26/03/2024 - 10:51
    +16

    Need to get some contamination to build resistance to bacteria and viruses. If you try to live a sterile life then you may be more prone to get infected since your body has not built any resistance.

    I feel gross when some ladies switch slippers with their heels on the station and place them right inside their branded handbags without any bags, don't know how much virus or bacteria they are transferring and contaminating their purses which may carry their makeup and hygiene stuff.

    Also placing their bags on the toilet floor and train floor is another gross compared with contamination against the door handle.

    • TEER3X on 26/03/2024 - 21:54
      +1

      They probably have super immune systems and iron stomachs because of those practices.

      • Meconium on 27/03/2024 - 09:40

        And filthy handbags

    • saltypete on 27/03/2024 - 09:06
      +1

      You don’t need a lot though. You don’t need the dose level when some dude with the skitters goes in and out in a rush, or Clem the COVID cabby does his thing.
      And you are right - women’s handbags are often pretty disgusting, particularly when they then stick them on an eating table.
      Washing will remove a lot of that pathogen load. Never 100 percent,- never sterile, but generally down to a level that our bodies are likely to cope with.

    • reactor-au on 27/03/2024 - 09:23

      Handbags probably about as contaminated as most smartphones (which keep people preoccupied in the bathroom).

      I disinfectant wipe my phone every few days, leave it for 15 minutes.

      • Che0063 on 27/03/2024 - 12:24

        You wouldn't want to use an alcohol-based wipe, as these will very rapidly (within 2 or 3 uses) completely wipe-away the oleophobic coating on screen protectors and phone screens that keeps fingerprints away

        • reactor-au on 27/03/2024 - 12:49

          Antibacterial wipes. I use a soft screen protector too.

  • Chandler on 26/03/2024 - 10:56
    +6

    Well here's something else to be on your mind! (sorry, maybe?)

    When was the last time you cleaned your belt? For most people - never. And this thing is always getting touched immediately after the toilet before hand-washing…

    👍 Have a nice day 👍

    • ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 10:57
      +1

      Bacteria doesn't live very long when it's dried out. Most of that bacteria on your belt would be dead.

    • Muzeeb on 26/03/2024 - 11:36
      +2

      While on the subject, why do some gents at the urinal undo their belt and drop their pants?

      Don't give me button up flies as an excuse because I have a few pants with button up flies and don't have to dop my pants to my ankles to take a leak.

      • Chandler on 26/03/2024 - 12:51
        +3

        Well I can say I've done something similar! When I was little, I surprised my dad and dropped my pants and proceeded to turn around to drop a deuce into a urinal! (one of the wall-mounted, single-user ceramic ones; not the steel trough type).

      • ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 14:32

        I think they inherited this behaviour from their 3-year-old self and haven't gotten around to questioning it.

      • pizzip on 26/03/2024 - 15:07
        +1

        It's a power move.

      • quikchip on 26/03/2024 - 20:33

        Helps get the last few remaining drops out.

  • 87percent on 26/03/2024 - 10:58
    +3

    people that bring drinks into the bathroom is the worse

  • DogeConomy on 26/03/2024 - 11:10
    +4

    But then you need to put your hand on the door handle to open it.

    Use a paper towel like a glove (where available) or bring one with you, then open the door that way, disposing of the bacteria infested towel afterwards in a public bin (sometimes the toilet doors take a while to close so you can run back in to throw it in the trash and run out again

    we need to put our hands on the tap again to turn the water off. The bacteria is now on our hands again.

    Easy, just use the paper towel method (after you've used 1 to dry your hands), or help clean up the bathroom by rinsing the tap handle/s.

    Sometimes the door opens outwards, in which case you have to put your hand on the door to push it open,

    If you're really that desperate to avoid germs, (gently) kick the door open. (there's a ton of germs on your shoes 24/7 anyways from being outdoors so it doesn't really make a difference, you'd get more germs from stepping in dog poo at the park)

    • kiitos on 27/03/2024 - 07:58
      +1

      I try to do all the above, but paper towels are becoming rarer these days in favour of air dryers.

      And swinging doors often open into the bathroom, presumably so you don't hit someone in the corridor outside, so while you can kick the door open when entering the bathroom, you can't when exiting.

      At least some public bathrooms do everything right - doorless, and sensors for water and soap.

  • Gdsamp on 26/03/2024 - 11:14
    +1

    i can go no. 1's handsfree. if the bathroom is one of those maze entrance (no door handles) surely this without wash is the cleanest option

    • ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 11:26
      +3

      That's pretty impressive. I think mine would be all over the floor.

    • ProlapsedHeinous on 26/03/2024 - 21:08
      +1

      Horses of courses

    • banana365 on 27/03/2024 - 15:47
      +1

      Why though? And, perhaps more importantly, how? Even wearing a kilt in the traditional manner, it's hard to go hands free without making a mess.

  • Sal in SA on 26/03/2024 - 11:16
    +2

    Copper / brass handles and toilet seats is the answer.

    • pegasusx on 26/03/2024 - 19:34
      +1

      Other than the look of the patina. I got handles for this purpose.
      It must be the uncoated copper /brass. Also some fungus / bacteria takes over 24h to kill

    • kiitos on 27/03/2024 - 08:00

      Didn't know this, so it's antibacterial?

    • reactor-au on 27/03/2024 - 09:24

      Guys now we know who stole all the Telstra cables that time

  • Shitforbrains on 26/03/2024 - 11:35
    +13

    I use my elbows to operate taps and doors (they have to be lever-type for this to work).

    Also, I avoid leaving the house where possible.

  • cloudy on 26/03/2024 - 11:52
    +2

    Most taps I see these days have sensors to trigger water flow, I even remember back in the 90s some places have knee operated taps. You use your knee to press the button and water flows.

    • SpainKing on 26/03/2024 - 21:45

      We still have those at one of the grocers I work at (in the chicken room which is a godsend)

      • banana365 on 31/03/2024 - 01:18
        +1

        Chickens have their own rooms? That's really sweet, but are their knees strong enough to operate the taps?

  • star-ggg on 26/03/2024 - 12:08

    Most public toilets I see now don't have doors.

  • ass3ts on 26/03/2024 - 12:11

    Have a small pack of tissues handy for door handles, taps, lift buttons, etc. A lot of people just walk out of toilets without washing their hands. One of the reasons why I avoid handshakes when possible. The Japanese got this figured out as well by bowing.

  • GordonD on 26/03/2024 - 12:24
    -1

    Common sense protect us from the germophobic. Please!

    Germs are a normal part of life. We have an immune system that has evolved to do that. Unless you have some sort of functional problem with it you have nothing to fear from normal quantities of the usual germs.

    Get over it.

    Excessive/obsessive cleanliness can result in your immune system not building the defences to protect you against what you'll inevitably encounter in life. You need to encounter germs so that you are protected against them in the circumstances where you can't avoid them.

    • ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 14:29
      +1

      I think you are only partly correct. In some respects this view is an oversimplification.

      You're right, bacteria aren't all bad for us, in fact many of them are good for us. And no matter how hard we try, we will still be exposed to bacteria. So I don't think that attempting to avoid infection is going to impact on your immune system in a negative way.

      The problem is viruses. There is no evidence that exposure to viruses improves your immune system. Sure, it may make you immune to the very virus you've caught. But most viruses go on to mutate into other viruses, which we can then catch. Furthermore, many viruses in fact depress our immune systems and make us vulnerable to other infections like pneumonia, or they can leave us with compromised bodily functions and permanent impacts on our health. On top of this, some viruses are permanent, and you will never, ever get rid of them. There is a long list of incurable viruses, and a quick Google will help with this.

      The idea that too much hygiene is bad for us and it is important to be exposed to germs (kids need to play in the dirt, etc.) is a bit of simplistic myth that we inherited from the 1970s. It is correct with respect to bacteria (to an extent), but it is incorrect if you take viruses into consideration. In fact, playing in the dirt with a cut on your finger can lead to infection with the tetanus virus, which is horrible and fatal. So, I think it's best to take a nuanced approach to this question. It is good for you to have some exposure to animals, because the bacterial exposure may be beneficial in the long-term. But, too much exposure can lead to horrible viruses, for example I have a relative who was very sick for 3 months with a virus that affects cows (and humans who come into contact with cows).

      • mrdean on 26/03/2024 - 14:58
        -6

        “Viruses are all around us, comprising an enormous proportion of our environment, in both number and total mass. All living things encounter billions of virus particles every day. For example, they enter our lungs in the 6 liters of air each of us inhales every minute; they enter our digestive systems with the food we eat; and they are transferred to our eyes, mouths, and other points of entry from the surfaces we touch and the people with whom we interact. Our bodies are
        reservoirs for viruses that reside in our respiratory, gastrointestinal, and urogenital tracts. In addition to viruses that can infect us, our intestinal tracts are loaded with myriad plant and insect viruses, as well as hundreds of bacterial species that harbor their own constellations of viruses.”

        “Viruses are not solely pathogenic nuisances; they can be beneficial. Viruses contribute to ecological homeostasis, keep our immune responses activated and alert, and can be used as molecular flashlights to illuminate cellular processes.”

        “Viruses are the most abundant entities in the biosphere. The biomass on our planet of bacterial viruses alone exceeds that of all of Earth’s elephants by more than 1,000-fold. There are more than 1030 bacteriophage particles in the world’s oceans, enough to extend out into space for 200 million light-years if arranged
        head to tail.”

        Principles of Virology 4th Edition. Flint, Skalka et al.

        Notice the conflation of "virus" with "bacteria" & "bacteriophages". Confusing the issue to hide the fact that virology is most likely a pseudoscience built on the legitimate science & study of bacteria which are real living organisms.

        Funny how out of the billions or trillions of viruses we encounter daily it's so very few that are supposedly pathogenic. Maybe the experts have got it wrong? Admitting it wouldn't be a good look would it? And it would shut off a pretty massive gravy train.
        Funny how antibiotics don't have an effect on "viruses" only "bacteria". Interesting eh?

        • ForkSnorter on 26/03/2024 - 15:05
          +1

          I was talking about harmful viruses, i.e. the ones that cause disease and are mostly transferred through exposure to other humans/animals.

          • mrdean on 26/03/2024 - 15:09
            -2

            @ForkSnorter: Yeah I know, hence

            Funny how out of the billions or trillions of viruses we encounter daily it's so very few that are supposedly pathogenic. Maybe the experts have got it wrong?

      • 1st-Amendment on 26/03/2024 - 18:36
        +2

        The idea that too much hygiene is bad for us and it is important to be exposed to germs (kids need to play in the dirt, etc.) is a bit of simplistic myth that we inherited from the 1970s

        It's not a total myth. There are some legitimate examples where too much hygiene has been detrimental to people's health (eg increases in asthma and peanut allergies)

    • outlander on 26/03/2024 - 19:16

      Germs are a normal part of life

      Normal life would be living in small tribes of a few hundred people, with only the occasional contact with a foreigner.

      Our situation is quite abnormal, compared to what we were designed for

  • Chandler on 26/03/2024 - 12:59
    +1

    On the topic on hand, the issue is mostly going to be due to many public bathrooms being built quite some time ago.

    Many public bathrooms I've used have a timed tap - you push down the tap and it runs for a short period of time. No need to touch afterwards. This could be an easy upgrade for any bathroom.

    Some public bathrooms I've used have the sink outside - so no touching any doors post-handwash. Some of the sinks have had hip/knee levers to run the water, so no touching there either.

  • mrdean on 26/03/2024 - 13:21
    -8

    Show me your sources, only peer reviewed $cience in credible $cientific journal$ accepted!

  • jv on 26/03/2024 - 14:51
    -1

    We go to the toilet, and get nasty bacteria on our hands.

    You can get nasty bacteria outside of toilets too…

  • oO0Dam0Oo on 26/03/2024 - 17:16

    Not to mention emergency departments… Gastro +++ (anal fibrillation)

  • outlander on 26/03/2024 - 19:28
    +1

    Yeah, pretty gross but there's no real way to avoid it. Germs are all over the place. Even with washing hands, most people don't do it right (needs to be 30 seconds, not just a splash) so it's limited in it's effectiveness. Like with masks, it's mainly works for the spreaders, to limit their infectiousness. But they don't tell people that that is the reason, because most people will only spend 1% of the effort if its about protecting strangers.

    Then there's aerosols, produced from things like flushing. For a public bathroom it's regularly being misted in small shit particles that you breath in.

    You start looking at all the vectors for transmission, and you see that it's overwhelming. You'd have to walk around in a bubble suit to really be safe. But the good news is that our immune systems have developed during some intensely bad spots in history, and are well equiped to deal with just about everything. Basically our immune systems are America, and the germs are Samali pirates on a little wood boat. Infact, in many cases these days our immune systems are so overpowered, that if it doesn't have a target to fight it will end up fighting ourselves, leading to autoimmune issues

  • inertia8 on 26/03/2024 - 19:36

    Japan solved it?? Not sure I'd agree there, as I'd estimate that half the bathrooms I used across the past two weeks in Japan did not have soap and some had nothing for drying hands. Presumably why there is plenty of pocket towels for sale everywhere.

    I'll agree some of their more modern bathrooms had good fully automated system's and didn't have doors but plenty had doors and handles to touch..

    In Aus, I think my favourite is the Dyson in-sink units that include the air blade dryer to blast any remaining filth back into the sink (and in your face).

    Anyway. Managed to survive without washing hands immediately (used sanitiser or another bathroom at next destination when the bathroom I'd just used was devoid of soap or drying apparatus).

    • belongsinforums on 27/03/2024 - 06:29

      Oh you just reminded me how Japan seems to be adverse to soap. Why oh why

  • trapper on 26/03/2024 - 19:47

    It is done to protect other people from you, rather than the other way around.

    Washing your hands won't remove every single bacteria and virus from your hands, but it will greatly reduce the number.

  • Ughhh on 26/03/2024 - 20:10
    +1

    There are little keyring tools/hooks you can use to open doors.

    Alternatively, let your brain rot and live in ignorance that viruses don't exist. Ignorance is bliss.

  • BuddhaBoy on 26/03/2024 - 23:44

    Yeah I think you are seeing this from the wrong perspective.

  • AustriaBargain on 27/03/2024 - 00:02

    When your hands are soapy, rub some of the soap around the tap, then when you turn it off the soap would have killed the bacteria on the tap.

    • Hangryuman on 27/03/2024 - 18:09

      I do this - I may spend 30 seconds at a washbasin as I learned from my father who was a GP/Surgeon and spent that long carefully soaping his hands and wrists before rinsing off. And so my preference for cleanliness is I usually soap up, clean and rinse off the tap and basin area, and walk away happy I can 'leave things a little better than you found it for the next person'

      Japanese toilets with the tap/small basin on top of the cistern are rare - in many visits to Japan I may have seen that twice and once was in someone's home - nice idea but leaning over the toilet bowl to wash your hands is probably not most people's preference.

      As for soap killing the COVID virus, I read you needed to have soap on your skin for 30 seconds for it to kill the virus - which I did - while watching most everyone else in mens' public toilets soaping their hands for approximately 1-2 seconds.

      As for bacteria transmission, yes our skin is covered in bacteria, much of it good, but I read that the main entry point is the thin mucus membranes inside the nose, and that the average person puts a finger in or on their nose very frequently without thinking - maybe every minute or so - that was for colds and flu virus.

      A lot of viruses might die within 30 seconds, but if you pick your nose within that 30 seconds - welcome to the flu club

      COVID virus transmission was apparently mostly airborne, so the concern was avoiding small enclosed unventilated spaces like cozy restaurants - thus we now have much more outdoor seating - like in this video from New York 'hot summer' 2021 - https://youtu.be/2xQ6bHktmnU

      • johnno07 on 28/03/2024 - 02:13

        If I saw a bloke giving a soapy tug to a faucet in the men's I'd probably give that sink a miss.

        • Hangryuman on 28/03/2024 - 19:41
          +1

          nice troll - but let's say you walked in a minute after I left, and saw a dirty tap and basin vs a nice sparkling clean one - let me guess which one you'd prefer to use then

          of course that's only after you've pulled your finger out … ;-)

  • OzBozo on 27/03/2024 - 00:09
    -4

    I hate public bathroom door handles . Its wet surfaces that are disgusting. You can allways turn the tap on , wash your hands then just leave the tap running and walk off 😄. F the business for installing that bull shit in the first place

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