Seems they are trying hard to sell their inventory.
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wait why did he get negs?
With so many incredible options coming out this year, it makes no sense to waste your money on a frankly dated Tesla.
Updated Xpeng G6, Zeekr 7x, Leapmotor B10, Aion V, BYD Sealion 7, Geely E5, Deepal S07 just to name a few. All of them are either cheaper and better, or slightly more expensive but with a significantly nicer fit out, competing with cars in a much higher price bracket. Most of them are just as smart, if not smarter - and you don't have to pay $10,000+ extra to access those features like you do with the Tesla. All of them give you a digital instrument cluster (a few with heads up displays too), 360 degree video feeds, and proximity and driving sensors that Tesla removed to cut costs - none of which this Model Y has.
Keep in mind all of this competition means there is going to be a brutal escalation of the price war that will only send second hand Tesla prices spiralling to even greater depths. Not all competitors will survive, and that includes legacy manufacturers - so choose wisely!
Well said, it's important to note the bigger price difference vs competition who seem to not lock out the autonomous features with a $10k upgrade
The word incredible is thrown around so loosely
Except I don't.
I work in tech and have been a car enthusiast for as long as I've been alive. I have a keen appreciation for nice things, and don't mind spending more if it means I get something better. The bang for buck that these entrants deliver is nothing short of incredible, regardless of what people want to keep telling themselves. Admittedly some on the list are better than others (my personal favourites are the Zeekr 7x, the updated Xpeng G6 and the Leapmotor B10 is also shaping up to be very promising as well), but they all deliver outstanding value - and will keep driving EV prices lower.
Chinese consumers have historically preferred Western legacy automakers and shunned domestic manufacturers - just like a lot of Australians still do, but in the last ten years, as legacy auto sat on their asses, Chinese manufacturers battled it out in a fiercely competitive domestic market to redefine value in nearly every segment. Chinese consumers in turn have moved away from legacy auto, to the point where sales are tanking so drastically that its affecting global bottom lines. Everyone from Nissan to Volkswagen point to the same reason that they've been struggling - Chinese cars that deliver better tech, better value, better features and better cars at a far lower price point than any of them can.
European luxury marques have been manufacturing in China for a while now. If you told someone ten years ago that a Chinese car would be stealing buyers from Porsche, you'd have been laughed out of the room - but that's exactly whats happening. Ford's CEO says he doesn't want to stop driving his Chinese car. Incredible enough for you?
@daft009: Highly recommend checking out the Xioami SU7, and Avatr's offerings, a higher end marque from Huawei, they all feel like concept cars - stunning on the inside and the out. Nio and Denza's wagons look great too - really digging Chinese marques pushing high performance wagons - far more fun to drive than an SUV, with similar levels of practicality! Sadly won't ever be as fun to drive as a car with three pedals - but Toyota and Lexus are working on EV's with simulated 6 speed stick shift transmissions, so there's hope yet.
None of the above marques have been confirmed for Australia yet, but all of them are on the cards, and some have made statements about wanting to enter our market.
@nussbuster: Its not flowery language, its a claim - I'll repeat it again to make it easier for you to process: The EV's I listed offer the best bang for buck in their respective price category, there's nothing from legacy auto that can compete. That's a claim, no flowers involved - can you refute it?
I also backed it up with:
Link to BMW building cars in China, demonstrating the shifting standards of Chinese manufacturing
Link to Chinese buyers cross shopping the Xiaomi SU7 with the Porsche Taycan, a testament to how those standards are stealing sales from cars that cost significantly more
Link to Ford's own CEO saying that he doesn't want to stop driving a Chinese carBut I guess all you saw was flowers (lol).
@poppingtags: What insight were you expecting? Me test driving the cars tomorrow is the level of insight you expected? I've driven 20+ EV models and the xpeng on first release but not the new ones and I know they're not all incredible but far from it.
.
and yes I own a chinese EV but doesn't mean they're all incredible, even a different model by the same brand can be bad.
Claiming BYD and Xiaomi are incredible EV just shows you have no credibility at all.I'd rather buy a Ford Mach E than any BYD. None of my family or friends want to even step into another BYD for a test drive and I did a whole roadtrip in one of those shit boxes.
@sunnyc: Oh well, if none of your family or friends want to step into a BYD, I guess that erases the fact that BYD is literally the best selling EV manufacturer on the planet? Ford's own CEO doesn't want to give up driving the Xiaomi - they're struggling to keep up with demand, the 1500Hp Ultra version sold out in 11 minutes the other week, car reviewers who've driven every car you can think of have been blown away by it and literally state that its better than Tesla at everything - but I guess you have more credibility than all of them?
All of the models I listed do offer incredible bang for buck, especially considering the state of Australia's new car pricing - it will reshape the industry, and give legacy auto a very rude awakening. You, your family and your friend's opinions aren't going to change any of that.
@poppingtags: and samsung is the best selling phone. Best selling means absolutely nothing.
Tesla has been best selling EV in Australian market for a while and doesn't stop the haters coming out of their cavesand regarding xiaomi
I mean you linked a video and I'm not sure if we are listening to the same words coming out of his mouth or you decided to cherry pick what you wanted to hear.
You should cherry pick a video that actually claims Xiaomi is actually better than a Tesla Model because the guy didn't even mention a model so what is he comparing to?
@poppingtags: all those chinese manufacturers are well behind Tesla still in tech and safety. They are making some great cars at a great price but they aren't quite in the same league as Tesla's yet.
@poppingtags: I believe in a world where petrol cars are for racing on a track, and ev's have full self driving so idiots don't drive on the road anymore.
if you want to race a car do it on a track not on the road. I appreciate nice petrol cars.
All of them have access to fast charging infra which always works.
I own the G6 and a Tesla Model Y. On paper the G6 is better for less but in practice the Tesla Model Y is significantly better to drive due to a better road feel, driver assistance features and smoother more intuitive infotainment (even considering the lack of android auto). I think in some ways you can liken the experience to early Android (Chinese EV manufactures) vs early iPhone (Tesla). Competition is good but worth at least considering and test driving Tesla's lineup. Also Tesla charging network is still a big draw card since it is cheaper for Teslas.
WTF they don't have android auto? What a joke.
@Buyingcrap: Hard agree, I will never be convinced that having a custom infotainment system is ever better than just adding CarPlay/Android Auto. Ridiculous stubbornness from an incompetent CEO.
@UltraMarineBlues: Have you tried it? The Tesla software is great, its the main reason I wont consider these cheap alternatives no matter how good they look. Once they match the usability of their software then I will consider it, but not a single review I have read says they are anywhere near close. Android Auto and Car Play is just an excuse for poor software.
@Buyingcrap: To be clear - its the Tesla that doesn't have Android Auto (or Carplay for that matter)
The G6 offers wireless Carplay and Android Auto as standard.
@Buyingcrap: Have you ever tried the Tesla infotainment? It’s great so Ive never felt a need for an alternative
100% especially when you do out of town driving.
if you drive in town only and not too far and only charge at home, other brands are ok.
I can't speak for most of these newer Chinese brands, but I test drove the Tesla Model 3 and BYD Seal last year on the same day, and the drive and dynamics on the Tesla were quite a bit more impressive, comparably.
Don't take my word for it. If you're curious, do the same before you make up your mind.
@mboy: European UBS engineers tested BYD Seal & discovered top engineering with 15% better value than Tesla & 30% better than any EU brand ;)
@taki: Don’t doubt it at all. But I was specifically talking about the drive and dynamics. The Tesla simply felt more enjoyable to drive imo.
@mboy: You're right, but from most of the comments on OzB, people care more about an EV as a self-propelled-mobile-phone. They'd be satisfied if it turns corners and doesn't rattle their teeth.
Yeah I wrote off Tesla for no Android Auto. Sending SMS with your voice still… What a joke!
I reply to WhatsApp etc with my voice.
I use YouTube music, not Spotify… Was only Spotify back when I looked in mid 2021.
BYD yep, a decent option.
The rest probably won't last.Cheaper & better? Doubtful. And before all the clowns come at me, I don't even have an EV.
Tesla is like Apple. Their products just work, and their software is the best compared to the other Chinese offerings.
Supercharging is by far superior thanks to Tesla's products too.
Deepal/Leapmotor and the other newbies won't last -> They'll try to flood the market, but we are so small compared to mainland China that they'll have no incentive to remain here.
You can grab a new Model 3 on a NL, with the $3500 lease incentive, then take the GST off and you have a pretty decent car at a better price than the reset.People need to separate the politics from the product. Musk is a nut, but Tesla make a decent car.
If you're really that precious to what a CEO does, you'd never buy anything.Yeah, but the Chinese EVs are very much getting there and offer FAR better value with ever-increasing quality and post-purchase support, not to mention their leadership isn’t literally fascists compared to Elon, who was indeed a hack that played the game of capitalism, underpaying the brightest minds and not knowing anything other than the Asteroids ripoff he made when he was 12.
All he has is capital and his overvalued companies.@FujinShu: I think Tesla being owned by Musk vs Others being owned by CCP kind of cancel out.
So what remains is just comparing the cars at face value.I think Tesla being owned by Musk vs Others being owned by CCP kind of cancel out.
I don't, the former has a choice the latter doesn't. Musk antics are his choice and he's done that freely.
The US is the new world enemy, not China.
That aside, you can always buy something electric from VW, Stelantis, the Ford E Mustang etc
@ruprectaus: I think at this point they are same-same.
The fact that China is overshadowed by current events in US doesn't mean that their goals have changed. Doesn't matter who has a "choice " - end of the day your money will cast a vote.
China is playing a long game and laughing its ass off as west is breaking apart and Russia is destroying itself. IMO China will pull ahead and start flexing its muscles much sooner because of Musk.
Choosing China over Musk , or vice versa is a false dichotomy@ruprectaus: You says that because US is on the everyday news. Wait untill you see the news where China drops the first bomb on Taiwan and suddenly you gonna start kissing US 's ass.
@FujinShu: Ugh. Compare the PRODUCT not the flag / country / CEO.
I'd argue no other Chinese EV has the some "value" / quality of product.
Leapmotor looks outdated and tacky AF, Zeekr is way over priced for what it is, Xpeng is decent.
BYD need to quickly add the BYD Seal 06 GT. That's one I'd consider.@Maz78: People are free to seperate the politics from the product, they're also free to withhold their money from companies they don't like - that's the free market in action.
Everything I've listed there, aside from the Zeekr 7x are literally cheaper than the Y, so there's nothing for you to doubt. I've also listed just a few points on why they're better than the Y in my original post.
Tesla, just like Apple, have a habit of putting form over function, especially in the pursuit of minimalism - the removal of turn signal stalks in favour of capacitive touch sensitive buttons on the steering wheel being a prime example, and just like Apple reversed course with their removal of ports on the Macbook Pro's, Tesla has just reinstated the turn signal stalks in their cars - but not the Model Y that is linked in this deal. It will be forever known as the variant with the infuriating turn signals. Also similar to Apple, they don't want to play nice with anyone else's systems - so no Android Auto and Apple Carplay (I say this as someone who is deep into the Apple ecosystem by the way).
This is purely subjective, and many people seem to like it - but I actually find BYD's designs incredibly tacky - exterior feels over-designed, the logo looks like something that a 13 year old boy obsessed with sci-fi would have come up with, and the interior of their older models are either a little sparse (like on the Dolphin vs something like the Aion UT that might be headed our way) or way over the top like the guitar strings and dumbbell inspired design of the Atto-3. Thankfully they seem to be toning it down with the newer releases. Their UI is also some of the worst from the Chinese manufacturers. That said, as the biggest player, they're not going anywhere, and their tech is genuinely impressive - God Eye for example, looks like it has great potential as an ADAS system and will be offered in some of their cheapest cars. The Seal 06GT is one of their nicer designs, hopefully we get a few more sports-wagons soon - Denza, Zeekr and Nio all have some great options.
I also personally think the Leapmotor B10 looks pretty handsome, and doesn't scream EV - just looks like a smart, practical non-coupe SUV. Really seems to be stepping up the intelligent driving + assistance systems too. This is expected to sell for under $40k, and I just don't think you can find a better car for the money - I suspect it will do very well here.
Of the marques I listed, I personally think that Deepal will the one that struggles and will likely fade away. The rest will likely remain in some form or another (I can definitely see a few of them merging into one another down the track too) - but like I said, good to be cautious, because they're not all going to survive.
Tesla has just reinstated the turn signal stalks in their cars - but not the Model Y that is linked in this deal.
I think it was just the highland model 3 that lost the stalks (stupid decision) and that model Y never lost them. One in deal should have stalks.
Honey!!!! 🍯
Luckily no one is forcing you to. Even in China they have a choice not to :)
Have a Tesla and have driven BYD atto and seal. Test drove the shark too. IMO Teslas especially the new variety are far superior in tech (even without FSD) and quality then BYD. Bang for buck not so sure but it honestly feels like Audi vs Skoda. To be fair you’d be happy as a pig in mud in either. Not sure about the other Chinese brands. Not sure if I’d trust them… no big reason to be fair tho.
Just gobbling up those CCP products.
Agreed
MY is a family car, which means multiple drivers may regularly use it. Tell me which one of the mentioned cars has the steering wheel column per-driver memory, and I'll consider it. Until then - no other gimmicky "feature" missing from MY is worth manually adjusting the steering wheel after every driver swap.
I don't know what gimmicky "features" you're talking about, especially coming from someone whose car boasts a feature list that includes making fart noises and putting on light shows, but perhaps they're essential for your family.
Not here to be your research monkey either, if you think an electronically adjustable steering wheel tied to driver profiles is the defining feature of your car, go out and look into which cars offer the same - many EVs do, including the upcoming Zeekr 7X.
@poppingtags: Why so much aggression?
Did I say that Teslas don't have gimmicky features? Did I say that the steering wheel is "the defining feature of your car"? It's not, but it's much more valuable than all the other features that you mentioned. I've been driving a Tesla for several years and concluded that I can easily live without the digital cluster/heads up display, despite I've had those on other cars. The front camera they added on the new MY was the only missing piece, and the way camera view is shown in Teslas is not necessarily worse, and in some situations even better, than the 360 degree view. I don't need any additional driving assistance features that are sold separately, they are not worth the money, but Tesla's free Autopilot works very well, and, judging from reviews, similar functionality in other cars in the same price range not that good.
I've done my research - no EV currently sold in AU in the price range of M3/MY has the steering wheel memory, including Zeekr X, which is the direct competitor of MY price-wise. According to the Zeekr's dealer I spoke to, 7X is only going to be available towards the end of the year and the price will be close to AU$100,000, so can't be compared to MY.
Comment of the month
HOLD THE LINE
Any-EV owners: have you cited battery-pack operating temp. & real-time, eg driving in 35°C + days. Brand & model pls, thanks
Most modern EV's have active cooling (and sometimes heating) for the battery-pack, using a 'heat pump' and multi-valve coolant lines to optimise battery temperatures. Driven both BYD Seal and Atto 3 in >35°C days with no discernible reduction in power.
Thanks for sharing.
Pls consider-> 'have you cited battery-pack operating temp. & real-time'.
As a potential-owner, I would like to FACTS-check & monitor EV ability to keep temp. below 30°C on hot days, eg the ability to turn-ON refrigerated-cooling while PARKING my EV @ home on hot-days 🤓.
The real test is the battery-health & hence driving-range loss: after 5+ yrs of ownership.
Many people are likely oblivious: https://batteryuniversity.com/article/why-mobile-phone-batte…
Li-ion DO follow law-of-chemistry & the challenge of active-BMS is to keep battery-cool in AU hot-summers: https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-808-how-to-prolong-…
@ab c: You can use an app like Car Scanner which connects to a dongle you attach to the OBD2 port to get extra information that is not always available through the UI. e.g. I can monitor individual battery cell voltage and temperatures.
Say no to Commie and Fascist
Explain why he is a Commie etc..?
Keep believing it's bots and agents son, day by day we get further away from the truth
Sure… Here is another one.
Alot of people recently discovered their allergies to Swasticars.
Self confused BOT. Fassicst is the far right which might be right for the oligarchs. Commie is derogarory term invented by the Fascist for the most Demcratic & Human system that only exysted in primitive form before the Btits invaded the Aboriginal lands.
According to Lenin, it will take 4 centuries from now for the people to mature & understand why it's the ultimate goal of human progress. Communi(sm) is the system for the global Commui(ty). Social(ism) is the transition that French planned, USSR tried, & China is succeding so far to beat the Capitalists (incl F……). For the confused, every1 else is confused in stereotyping :( I don't understand people that are aginst Social & Community values & real life ;)China is far from communist. Their Gini Coefficient are worse than Russia and way worse than Australia. Australia and it's social security programs make China look like a Fascist state.
@Creamsoda: China never declares as communist, neither USSR - both early developing socialist from ~feudalism (so great achievement considering China is now #1 in tech/AI).
There's Western bias how to interpret the data for differents systems. If the infrastructure & services are available/shared more fairly in China that matters more than the income distribution.PS. Anyway, Ukraine's GINI 25.63 (2020)#5 is much better than Australia's 34.33 (2018) #79, US 39.79 getting worse (2022) #132, UK 34.24 (2022) #77, China 36.67 (2020, 35.7 2021) #97 ;)
China’s model=> shared access to public goods, offers viable alternative, though it requires rethinking traditional frameworks like the Gini coefficient.China never declares as communist
why you repeating my point? Even with socialist matric Australia is better than China at socialism. Their dole payments are like 779RMB a month or $180AUD in cities and 615RMB a month or $130AUD in rural areas, those people on the dole are so dirt poor they pick up trash to sell to make ends meet. There is basically very minimal social security net this is why a lot of the mainlanders are so money oriented (Capitalistic).
China is basically failing bad at socialism (reflected on its Gini rating) so Xi did this "common prosperity" slogan that we heard about few years ago and went after the wealthy.
@Creamsoda: You don't pay attention to understanding the essentials of Social - China invests in public infrastructure (5G networks, rural healthcare clinics, universal broadband, high-speed rail)& shared services (affordable housing) address inequality in ways ¬ captured by income metrics.
Australia is going down in Social values in the last 37 years that I'm tracking (particularly since the Howard's gang took over with the guidance of Murdoch & their country un-intelligences ;)@taki: I do understand and Australia has been doing the same with better equality in terms of income and Medicare which is light years ahead of China. China has only been doing affordable housing in the city areas after "common prosperity" slogan was made by Xi not that long ago and unaffordable housing for the young was causing social unrest.
I'm an advocate for Australia to adopt a more transparent Nordic country political system with out revolving doors and legalized corruption. unfortunately we're more corrupt like the Americans day by day.
China invests in public infrastructure (5G networks, rural healthcare clinics, universal broadband, high-speed rail)& shared services (affordable housing) address inequality in ways ¬ captured by income metrics.
That sounds awesome. So why are you here?
And if tens of millions of people have to have died in the process, well that’s just a necessary cost of human progress.
@Landsmith: America and its hegemony have killed far more than 10 million people just for standing up to them.
Change is rarely a bloodless path, but a path of communism kills the least compared to capitalism; it’s just that capitalism’s death toll is in the poor countries that are under capitalist-sponsored coups and dictatorships.but a path of communism kills the least
Comedy hour rolls on…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_communist_…
@Landsmith: Avloid Western propaganda media to get trustworthy info that aligns to reality.
China’s investments in public infrastructure (5G networks, rural healthcare clinics, universal broadband, high-speed rail)& shared services (affordable housing) address inequality in ways ¬ captured by income metrics
This requires rethink’ traditional Western frameworks like Gini coefficient taht don't understand more advanced Social systems.@taki: Propaganda exists everywhere all the time advocating for different things.
It’s best to read a multitude of different media from different power blocs to thread a common line between all of them.@FujinShu: I read multitude of different experts in 10ish languages & I analyse them (Holistic Data Philosopher ;)
Englsih is the most convenient language for propaganda as the Techno-Feudalism is hosted on Western Media :(
@taki: Start by doing a google.com.au search on The Great Leap Forward, or Tiananmen Square, or Alexander Solzhenitsyn and the Russian Gulags.
@Landsmith: I know that Western propaganda. You need to understand the full picture & Cui Bono ;)
The history is getting rewritten as BRICS++ is taking the lead for the >85% of world population to stop the US/Western hegemony (UK is already done)@taki: In a western country one is free to hold beliefs that oppose western hegemonic thinking, such as yours. One can freely believe misinformation without political consequence. One cannot say the same for the said systems and governments under communist regimes. But I’m happy to look into your view, because I know I won’t be locked for performing a simple google search. I also know my search terms won’t be blocked.
Honda? Hyundai? where have you been??
Mainly VW
It seems unlikely Honda will survive
I think those down voting you are too myopic to realise that China and Chinese cars are actually communist lol.
They're doing a terrible job of being communists.
Halucinations are typical for Western sources. That's why DeepSeek is better & much cheaper than the Western biased models ;)
None of the car companies leadership currently has demonstrated Elons level of stupidity and so publicly as well.
Yeah being the richest man in the world and now a integral part of the world's greatest Superpower sure is stupid.
You mean the world's most militaristic warring Empire that's ever existed? Lets hope Trump can fix the warring part and start fixing it's own country for it's people.
no thanks