Hi all,
Saw on Pricehipster which is great. Almost pulled the trigger and realised I already purchased the Robot Coupe! Silly me.
1 x 12.5cm santoku knife,
1 x 15cm santoku knife,
1 x 18cm santoku knife
It's $99 delivered on the Baccarat website and $279 on most other retailer websites right now.
Make sure to use the code for free shipping.
Stuck with $10 shipping
You, my friend, are no longer stuck with $10 shipping.
No longer i do
Whoops, wrong code. It's SHIP35. Free shipping over $35. Deal updated.
Been same price with free shipping I'm sure it will happen again
So i should wait?
No new code go go go don't forget cashback
Shopback?
any other recommendation around this price range? Or this set really good of a deal to go with?
Buy a mercer off amazon for about $20 better blade.
Could get the chef knife, a santouku a bread knife and maybe a paring for $60?
Link?
https://www.amazon.com.au/Mercer-Culinary-Ultimate-White-10-…
I paid $21 A week ago, it's big and sharp, cheap commercial knife.
Using it at work (use to be a chef now I'm a support worker.
@Slippery Fish: Great knife. Bought it in the States when I was there last year for 3 months.
We named it the Blade of Destiny.
As an FYI if anyone was wondering (https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/what-about-420j2-stainle…):
420J2 was never intended as a blade steel. Its used primarily because its very inexpensive.
Edge retention is on the low end of mediocre, but there are worse steels. none of those worse steels are blade steels though, and 420J2 has the worst edge retention of all steels commonly seen in blades.
I think its MAXIMUM achievable hardness is like 54 Rc. most 420J2 blades are 52 Rc or less; why would the company pay good money to harden a steel they only purchased because of its cheapness? The up side of this is that it is easy to sharpen….but unless the company actualy spent the cash to harden a "junk" steel, then you will likely only be able to get a toothy working edge.
It is VERY VERY corrosion resistant. It almost impossible to make it rust unless you let it soak in harsh chemicals for a long period of time.
It is very durable. Its low hardness makes it unlikely that a 420J2 blade will break, unless its design is structurally unsound.
In short, it is a poor overall blade steel, that has little business being used for knives, outside of a dive knife. MOST, but not all, knives made from it are of inferior quality.
So what's a top steel and what would be a great value for money steel?
Top Steel = Not Cheap.
If you know what lengths and types of knives you use most common, then research and just buy them separately. Knives Sets are mostly no good unless you go into the >$400+ range which they become decent. Then the >$1000 ranges is where they become good.
If you are a decent - good cook, then you will only really use 2-3 knives most often. My knives set is Mundial Knife Set (Bonsai) fully forged as a base, then I replaced some of them with (REAL) Japanese knives which uses either VG10 or VG-MAX cores for the ones i use the most often. For me, my most used knives are: Chefs Knife, Paring, Boning and Utility. Note most of them costed me >$100 each.
Hey mate, great post. I think I'll be good with just one quality chefs knife. Already have the Global set that's currently on sale @ Victoria's Basement. Could you tell me which one you use, i.e. specific brand? Thanks!
@driew: The next step up from global would be tojiro dp, after that you have to go visit the japanese knife store (chef armoury, knives and stones). Don't buy shun, miyabi or even the higher tier tojiro (tojiro pro), they all over priced.
I assumed you just a home cook, if you passionate about your cooking there's no shame in owning a really good japanese hand forged knife. Do your research, watch videos on youtube about japanese blacksmith, and lastly visit your local specialty japanese knife store.
Word of warning, hobbies in collecting japanese knife is a deep rabbit hole.
@[Deactivated]: I wouldn't say Shun is overpriced considering their excellent after service. Basically keep your receipt, and you have life time warranty on your knife. Getting a knife sharpened professionally can be quite pricey, upto $50-60 depending on what type of knife.
With Shun max you really pay is $20 to restore it to factory edges each time, and if they cannot restore the factory edge they will do a free replacement with a new knife.
Which is why i always recommend it to home cooks who cannot be bothered doing their own sharpening or is scared to.
@[Deactivated]: Thank you so much Jackfruit and Iplau. Yes I'm just a homecook and have only been cooking for less than a year. Just looking for one quality chefs knife so hopefully I don't fall into the habit of collecting them; that would be expensive!
@driew: haha, yup expensive habit. Every time i go to Japan i would buy one….. irresistible!
I have 1 Shun and most of my rest are local Japanese forgeries.
@lplau: I've decided to go with Shun due to their excellent service. I emailed them about their sharpening and they said they'd sharpen any Shun knife regardless of where you purchased it. I'm not too keen on sharpening the knife myself.
Sorry Jackfruit, I know from the comments that you don't like Shun and think it's overpriced.
Thank you both for your informative comments. You've really enlightened me into the world of quality knives :)
I wonder where global knives fall in line as far as steel quality go?!
Its not bad, but I don't really like the handles on them. At least it uses a "knife" grade steel unlike the crap that Baccarat uses.
Depends on how you use your knives, knives with better steels and harder steel, usually means its brittle. E.g. don't go chopping bone with it, as it will likely cause a chip or worse lose a tip.
Depending on how bad the chip is, you can sometimes re-profile the edge with a whetstone to remove it, just means you will remove quite a fair bit of material to make it go away….
If you want something with great warranty, (i know some people will hate it) go with Shun Classic (60-61 HRC) range, Shun has a brilliant service where if you can send in your knives and they will sharpen it for free (you only pay for shipping to them), if it is not able to be restored to former glory (e.g. too far gone), then they will simply replace the knife free of charge. Don't go chopping bone with a Shun Knife though, it will likely chip!
Good point, the other half chipped the larger global knives we have by cutting through bone.
Found a service through Robin's Kitchen (Whitfords WA) that would shape and sharpen damaged knives.
Best buy a cheap heavy cleaver from an Asian grocer if you want to cut through bone and save your good knives in the process.
@cristobaljames: Yup, I had to teach my other half to not scrape things off the cutting board using the edge. haha…..
Also got a nice cleaver for bones etc.
Also a tip for people who uses knife blocks to store their knives, either use a knife block which stores them flat '_'. If you don't have one however your's stores the knives vertically (e.g. |) the novice mistake is storing them with the edge down. I always store them upside down so the edge is not always being "pushed" down onto the wood.
I always paper towel dry my knives and putting them back in, don't leave them on the drying rack, as they may get damaged by other stuff which happens to collide with it.
Also, Never put them into a dish washer!
ShopBack with 6% cashback?
Not sure what is 'Japanese' about it apart from being a Santoku.. it's only got a hardness rating of 53 but would not be that sharp or stay sharp for that long:
https://www.baccarat.com.au/baccarat-id3-3-piece-santoku-kni…
You want at least an HRC rating of 58.. ideally 60+, ie Damascus steel. They stay sharper longer and can be sharpened more due to the actual steel having smaller particles. A real Santoku knife with an HRC60+ is seriously the only knife you want in the kitchen once you try one.
60+ ???
For the average user the knives would get brittle or explode in their hands
Most people dont even have or use a steel , let alone a sharpening stone
And this is why OzBargain raves about the Global knife set (HRC58), i'm personally not a fan of the set for the price, but its probably the most readily available stainless at that HRC grade. The point is, this knife set for the price is no better than the block set sold by ALDI for $20
But like I said, getting ONE VG10/Damascus (HRC60-61) Santoku in your kitchen set is all you need. All the other knives can be shit cheap ones.
Average rockwell hardness for a knife is 54-64 so I guess this being 53 it isn't particularly good
https://www.tableking.com.au/what-is-a-knifes-rockwell-hardn….
54-64 is a huge "average" range. The difference between 54 and 64 is beyond night and day. 54-60 IS a night and day difference.
HRC 64 is like "Blue Steel", the stuff they use to make samurai swords, the stuff that will cut through medieval plate armour. Theres videos of people cutting concrete steel reinforcement bars with butchers cleavers made of this and a mallet.
I'm currently using this knife at the moment, https://jp-knives.com/ks_kc-330/
Blade is made from Takefu Shiro-2 High carbon steel core / SUS410 Stainless steel HRC rating is advertised as(62-63) I assume this is a good HRC rating for price/performance? Or is there more to just the number of HRC?
I would love to upgrade to a VG10/Damascus in the future. However the price increase to VG/10/Damascus is so much more expensive, i completely do understand the premium price they charge for it with all the labour going into making the metal.
Any particular brand model of VG/10 Santoku knife do you recommend?
That is a good knife! A VG10/Damascus isn't an upgrade unless you like the 67 layer look. It's practically the same as a VG10 except the Shiro-2 core is harder/Sharper, but uses a milder stainless steel outer steel.
Real Damascus blades use a VG10 core, and up to 67 layers of VG1 stainless either side of the core.
If you were to 'upgrade', it would be for size to a Santoku or Gyuto, and if you are a chef, anything with a 2.2mm heel width or less because you can generally sharpen them at a narrower angle at the blade if it is hard enough.
I don't recommend any particular knife/brand. I just love sharp knifes for the kitchen. Personally, am waiting for the right opportunity to upgrade to the one knife to rule them all in the kitchen, a ZDP189 (65-67HRC Stainless) Gyuto.
Thank you so much for your insight. I'll admit when i ordered that knife, i really didn't do too much research on the types of metal and hardness of it. I simply ordered it cause a lot of people were ordering it haha. So far it's held up very well for my usage, stays sharp for a long time before needing to sharpen again. Only gripe about it is having to needing to dry it ASAP after washing or else it will rust due to carbon steel. But i've gotten used to doing that anyways.
Are you a fan of German style knives or mainly just Japanese knives?
@MysticalWok: No problems. I take it you are a chef based on your name?
I'm no chef btw, I personally just like the Japanese styles more so (don't get me wrong, I love German quality stuff) because of the culture and the details and technique with the traditional forging processes as well as overall design with balancing and handle making, it's an absolute craft! ie this:
https://japanesechefsknife.com/collections/sukenari-zdp-189-…
VG10 is the best I've personally owned/used, and you know how big a difference your knife is compared to an off-the-shelf. You can't sell this to people as they will never understand until they try it themselves, it sells itself.
Damascus layering, however, is more of a style and should technically make the knife cheaper as it means the whole blade isn't made of the good stuff, but also adds the benefit of compromise (ie, stainless outer layer in the case of VG10 Damascus) so it makes it suitable for household use, yours is totally good for a commercial kitchen.
@MysticalWok: Really, it depends on how you like to use your knives (or for what specific purpose you're using them). I prefer a rocking action, so I quite like European style chef's knives with their pronounced curve. My Wusthof Ikon has being going for years and is very comfortable to use and fairly well balanced, with a decent weight to it.
If you like santoku style blades though (and prefer the quick up and down dicing action), I can recommend the tojiro flash DP. Decent hardness at 61, holds an edge for a long time and also has a pretty comfortable handle.
Hmm some good knives on that site how about this one? I think I'm going to take the plunge.
@4foxache: Would make a fantastic all-round knife for the household as it is full stainless and forged. These will supplement and outlive an existing cheap set you may have
Both Santoku and Gyuto are considered "Chef Knives" and are good all-rounders, but the Santoku is just taller but perfectly fine unless you were trying to cut/shape some intricate stuff
What do U think Kiwi Knives? I bought 3 for $12 and seem to be doing the job v well. Thanks
@stockastics: Have never heard of them, but I just a quick search and this thread explains a lot as to where it sits.
https://www.reddit.com/r/chefknives/comments/be7a17/testing_…
At the end of the day, if it works and does the job then it's good. Japanese/German knives aren't for everyone, but as i said above, once you feel the laser like cutting prowess of a good knife (that you will keep for years), you will never go back to a cheap disposable set.
The one thing that is so difficult to explain/illustrate is that, no matter how sharp any knife is, it can only be sharpened to the degree of how small the actual particle matter is of the particular steel used (think, sharpening the edge of sandstone versus wood, the sandstone will never be as sharp regardless how crazy an angle you attempt to grind it).
And an absolutely sharp knife isn't for everyone as it depends on what you cook/prep in the kitchen. For example, I can slice any meat, quite thinly and effortlessly with a VG10, I can even slice of the annoying slippery layer of membrane under ribs so that i can also marinade the underside properly etc etc etc
@dsp26: @RB260483 Do you recommend any particular knife sharpener? Do you only use stone? Or are those scissor knife tools ok to use, and if so, any particular one?
@KingPhil: Nothing beats a 'proper' whetstone block, I find and have tried this technique (incl. oil soaking).. quite soothing. But unfortunately, this requires a great degree of muscle consistency to maintain your grind angle (8° to 12° for a good hard knife):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t39rhQs6Hqc
https://www.hocho-knife.com/king-combination-grit-waterstone…
However, I've resigned myself to using this with additional levels of grit up to 6000, but now get mine professionally sharpened:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32986856805.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32799710449.html
Also, for anyone else interested in a great entry-level quality Japanese knife, www.hocho-knife.com have a sale ending today and have the cheapest "Iseya I-Series" I've seen advertised.. plus you get free shipping after AU$250 and 5% discount with code FT25P.
@dsp26: Just out of interest who do you get to sharpen your knives? I wouldn't want to attempt it on a good knife myself and potentially botch the job
@4foxache: Disclaimer: Am biased on this because mine is after all a Japanese knife, prefer someone who hand hones and polishes. You can send yours in to get done, but obviously works out cheaper if you send a bunch at once.. and this is why I have a cheap set of ALDI Croftons I sharpen myself while I wait:
https://www.saitoknives.com.au/sharpening-service/
There are a couple of well-rated local ones like Wicked Edge, have only heard great stuff but have never tried, but purely preference not to as they use a low speed 7000grit mill. IF, I had a set of Globals or Wusthoffs, i'd send them all to this guy as he has an 8-blade minimum policy and is more accessible location-wise:
http://www.awickededge.com.au/
@dsp26: Thanks for sharing your expertise @RB260483
What do you feel about
https://www.houseofknives.com.au/products/furi-pro-asain-kni…
Thanks,
VP
BTW, is it your DOB in username? 26 Apr 1983.
If it is, not a great idea, IMHO.
@darkmattersunB6c0MV: That knife is similar to jamie oliver branded knife, get tojiro dp if you want something decent. Dont buy shun or miyabi or even tojiro pro. Give your local specialty japanese knife store a visit.
@darkmattersunB6c0MV: Thanks for the tip. just changed handle!
I personally have no opinion on it as have never used it and prefer to get a Japanese knife from Japan, or German from Germany, etc (kind of like not eating at a Chinese Restaurant if the chefs aren't Chinese, etc).
But if this information is correct (Furi are HRC52), I personally wouldn't pay that much for a set as for that retail price, the HRC56-58 Global set is a better buy beyond the marketing and celebrity endorsement.
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/294682#comment-4486807
Knives can retain its edge sharp for a long period RELATIVE to usage, especially if you don't home prep often (I do 3-4days a week), and my $20 ALDI block set of about the same HRC will stay sharp for only 2-4weeks max used against a bamboo chopping board (instant blunt when used on stone/glass chopping board). Sharpening properly is a pain in the arse and is time-consuming because it's not like you can watch TV while doing it.
Cutting quality and longevity is dependent on material + forging method and should be the only way to determine how much you should pay for one. Everything else like handle design, balance is almost a bonus but does matter.
I have these and you're right, they don't stay sharp for long.
https://www.robinskitchen.com.au/product/baccarat-id3-6-piec…
am i reading this one right? does it come with the 20 piece knife set also?
Those knives are the Sabre model which is low/ordinary/budget quality
Thanks op.
Be careful buying these cheaply made Chinese knives from House and Robins Kitchen, there's nothing Japanese about them, the steel is crap and the RRP they put on these things is a joke. Don't fall for it.
https://www.productreview.com.au/listings/baccarat-sabre-9-p…
oh man - i want ed to believe this bargain was worth buying…but no - thanks for the heads up
Same brand but different (cheaper) model of knives
Sabre is their budget range
A bit of steel snobbery going on here and sure, not lifetime grade sushi master grade quality blades but it's good sharp knives for $16.6 each. This is a decect deal!
I've got an id3 and very pleased for what I paid
That's what I was thinking. I figure if it cuts stuff for about 16.6 meals, I won't be complainingas it's only increased my meal price by $1. 😂
what is "Robot Coupe" ?
Bought this one a week ago with same price, very happy for what I paid.
These knives are about as Japanese as Paul Hogan.
In case sells out on website, also available for $60 delivered (instead of $50 as per this deal with promo code) on their eBay store
It's the same inventory.
You can also buy them from House.
Mixed up comments above i let this go..
Looks like can not purchase now..
Am currently using Furi knives, are they the same type?
Furi are quite a bit better than these "knives".
apparently slightly less harder steel than OP's set:
I can recommend KIWI Brand Thai Kitchen Knives, available from many outlets. Good quality and very reasonably priced.
These guys try to imitate Global knives so much that it gives the Chinese imitation a run for their money… But wait it's Chinese made too 😂
Almost pulled the trigger thinking it was a global knife.
No go for me even at this price.. Worth paying a little more for global
How much are they?
At least $129 from the previous deal
So how is that a little more?
So are knives so popular all of a sudden?
So are vinyl discs 😉
Baccarat is the brand under the parent company Global Retail Brands which also own House and sister retailer Robin’s Kitchen.
It’s not particularly quality or an exclusive brand and the RRPs are laughable. .
oh crap, see lots of up vote and just bought 1 then read the comments, damn
You've got some nice knifes for $16.60 each. As long as you don't compare them to stuff 500% more expensive you'll be happy
Give them as a gift, looks like you've spent a lot even if they suck. I really need some knives and $50 seems worth it. I'm not good to my knives and I don't do anything that requires particular precision, so something sturdy like this is probably good for me.
Available also on amazon, low quality good looking knives
I've just learned quite a bit from this thread and trawling through lots of past knife deals.. it seems most would-be-purchasers prefer aesthetics or brand name over actual cutting prowess and material quality/longevity. I think most households have gotten used to getting a new cheap set every year or two
How is this compared to the similar ikea 365 set?
https://www.ikea.com/au/en/p/ikea-365-3-piece-knife-set-3045…
Ikea comes with 15yr guarantee so could be a better option for those who live close to the store ,
I just clicked on the original deal op posted and it's showing 404 so I'm guessing the deals finished now
These have a lifetime guarantee. Probably doesn't mean much though.
True, at the end of the day if they cut it's doing the job :P makes me wonder how bad this one would be .. $5
This is a product strategy (don't confuse it for marketing).
No one goes into an IKEA to buy cheap knives unless it was a "why not" purchase you happened to see and put in your bag/trolley. Now flip it, if you needed to go in-store just to claim warranty/replacement on a cheap knife set, you will walk out with other stuff.
Is this still valid? I get a "page not found" when pressing on the link.
For those Knife Sages out there, how do you store your knives if they're just single ones without a set block? I am keen on the global set, but intrigued by the idea of getting 1 or 2 kickass knives to supplement the basic ones I've had for years… Don't want them swimming around in the utensil drawer tho!
I also wonder about this. seems like it is crucial to store it properly for a longer lifespan.
magnetic wall hanger?
Hey Mod, can we please ban House, Robins Kitchen and its other forms from Ozbargain? Judging by the sheer number of complains about missing order details, the actual orders or customers receiving faulty goods, the Global Retail Brands screams scams to me. I placed an order last Tuesday and have yet to receive any order confirmation, though the money has for sure gone out. I have contacted them multiple times through various channels and there is NO RESPONSE.
I just bought this sentoku last week. Damascus in the title, 'this is not damascus' in the description. Classic aliexpress.
Thanks for the post and all of the comments. I learned a lot about what I should have bought.
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