![[Used] WD Ultrastar HC550 16TB 3.5″ Enterprise SATA HDD WUH721816ALE6L4 $239 Delivered @ Metrocom](https://files.ozbargain.com.au/n/42/831342.jpg?h=fbeeb51f)
Hi clear this 16TB Enterprise drive. They are used, wiped and all tested. 3 Months warranty as usual.
Pack of 4 x 16TB for $929 delivered.
Also got 18TB in same model for $299 delivered.
Pack of 4 x 18TB for $1,169 Delivered.
Cheers,
Jun
[Used] WD Ultrastar HC550 16TB 3.5″ Enterprise SATA HDD WUH721816ALE6L4 $239 Delivered @ Metrocom
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MarketingMetroCom on 14/02/2024 - 10:58 metrocom.com.au (3187 clicks)
Last edited 14/02/2024 - 12:10 by 1 other user
Last edited 14/02/2024 - 12:10 by 1 other user
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Thats an awesome price esp with 3month return to base. Thanks
How long should these last? Why is the enterprise tossing them after 2 years
Enterprise commonly cycle drives out so that they don't need to worry about failures solely due to lifespan. So not necessarily anything wrong with the drives (although I would suggest checking and burning them in anyway), you'll just have a little less of the lifespan to use yourself.
Burning them in? How can a hard disk drive be burnt in?
Applications like
badblocksthat will write data to every single block on the disk. If it has too many errors writing to the drive, it errors out and you return the drive as faulty. Takes time for larger disks (since your writing a lot of data, 16TB in this drives case) but means you know the drive is faulty now rather than in X days/months/years when you write data to those faulty block/s, which could then be outside of the seller's/manufacturer's warranty period.https://perfectmediaserver.com/06-hardware/new-drive-burnin/
I presume the phrase comes from writing data to CDs/DVDs where a laser "burns" data onto a disk. Obviously with hard drives there is no "burning".
@Chandler: Right, so what you're saying is that enterprise test the drives to find faulty ones, then return the faulty ones, which are now being sold to us (perhaps with a hopeful polish in between)? Cool, cool.
@Grazz989: No. I'm suggesting that purchaser's of these drives (or any drives, new or used; but especially used) should test the drives and return the faulty ones.
Doing it upfront ensures any faults are discovered within that "easy" return period. If you don't fully test the drive and the faulty blocks/sectors are towards the end of the drive you might not find out for months/years and thus after the easy return period, and also after you've written a lot of data to it.
@Chandler: I was being facetious. I was referring to the original question in this chain - 'why are these being tossed 2 years into a 5 year warranty and then sold to us'.
The answer is obviously that just about every single drive will have had an issue and has been returned under warranty as a result.
And then some process shrouded in mystery takes place and the drives are supposedly good to go again. But with a 3 month retail warranty. Out of 3 remaining years according to manufacturer's warranty. Of course the ACL guarantees a far more reasonable warranty period out of the retailer, but can't blame them from trying to weasel out of it (whoops, yes I can).
It's not a very good show of faith in the product being sold, is it mate?
@Grazz989: Not necessarily. Would need to ask the seller as to why they have the stock.
I wouldn't be surprised if what you say is the case, but I also would not be surprised if it wasn't.
Generally speaking, I believe it would be common for enterprise to replace perfectly healthy drives as part of preventative maintenance. Yes, they'll have backups and redundancy in place that a failed drive is not an issue, but if you routinely replace drives you shouldn't even need to worry about failures (and also have continuous coverage in terms of warranty).
Having said all that, it still begs the question why drives with 3-years of manufacturer warranty left are being replaced, if they had 0 or 1 year left of warranty I'd say the above is likely the case, but not even half-way through? You could be right that the drives have had maybe some minor SMART errors or such and got RMA'd. But then that should be disclosed, since the seller would be selling defective goods. Probably not malicious, but they do say that the drives are "tested" in their post: they don't say that they passed the tests…
All the more reason for purchasers to test their drives!
@Chandler: Oh come on man, really? 'Ask the seller'? Uhuh. May as well ask a Chinese manufacturer if they use uyghur slave labour or if their milk is unadulterated. Either way the answer will always be whatever is going to get the most sales.
I'm not sure why you made an argument then immediately tore it down yourself, but yes - no enterprise user would rma good drives, let alone ones less than halfway through their service life.
I'm confident that these drives are either refurbs that've had issues or they have had their smart data manipulated.
@Grazz989: Yes, ask the seller. If what they say impacted your purchase decision and is demonstrably false or untrue, you're entitled to a full refund under ACL.
I get your point that the answer will be what gets the most sales, but if you get that answer in writing then you are covered under ACL.
I did start my "argument" with "generally speaking". In these sorts of conversations I do like to give less specific information for people reading my comments. I also like to give people the benefit of the doubt, be devil's advocate (or give the opposite POV: it's not necessarily the devil every time), etc.
If they've had their smart data manipulated that's very dodgy. So rebirthing hard drives is a thing, eh?
Back to the original intent of my comment/s: properly testing/burning in should hopefully surface any actual issues, and if done immediately will be within most vendors RTB warranty period and worst case an easy argument for coverage under ACL in any case.
and is demonstrably false or untrue
But .. it's bloody not is it mate? So the whole point is moot. To say nothing of the fact that you need not ask to get your ACL rights anyway, because the page itself should state if they're bad drives - refurbed or not. That's your answer in writing beforehand.
I simply disagree with your general statement. Enterprise do not replace healthy drives well before warranty. Many wouldn't bother replacing them at the end of the warranty - they have resilient arrays to handle dying disks, and replacing early is just an additional cost. Besides which, the bathtub curve being what it is, fresh disk are just as, if not more likely to fail than the ones currently spinning.
Yes, it's been known to happen. Depending on the error, if it'll pass a test and the seller reckons the fault might not show til the end of the super short warranty, yeah some sellers would see an opportunity to make a quick buck there.
I certainly never suggested that immediately testing these risks if you buy one isn't the smartest move - it obviously is - I'm asserting that new or official properly recertified drives e.g. from East Digital with full warranty period are likely a far safer and overall more cost effective bet.
@Grazz989: We replace our RAID drives every three years as a preventative measure. Can't speak for any other organisations.
@Chandler: FYI badblocks doesn't like modern drives as the.number of blocks exceeds 32 bit even when setting 4096b blocks. The guy who wrote badblocks is aware and refuses to add 64-bit support saying it is no longer the best tool for modern drives. Do with that info what you want. Not sure what a better alternative tool is.
I usually get about 8-10 years out of HDDs. I've got drives that are even older than that but they don't run 24-7 or anything.
Listing describes "5 year warranty" - is this still valid/does the warranty carry on?
Hi mate unfortunately they were originally sold to a system manufacturer. The 5 years manufacture warranty needs to go thru them which we don't have access to.
So why does your listing still state it?
It's illegal to pass warranty on to the manufacturer. ACCC law states the retailer is responsible for warranty. They've been cracking down on this hard recently.
can you post a source on that? I've worked in retail and our policy always stated the customer has a choice of going through the company OR the manufacturer..
@ipiok: The difference there is "choice". What ONEMariachi is saying is that it's illegal for a seller to handball off all warranty issues to the manufacturer and say that they won't deal with them.
@ipiok: Mate. Try harder. There's a clear difference between it illegal for the retailer to 'pass' the warranty on, and the customer CHOOSING to deal with the manufacturer.
@Grazz989: Try harder? What are you even talking about. These are second hand goods, the same consumer laws do not apply.
@ipiok: Consumer laws absolutely apply to second hand goods. How are you so confident about something you clearly do not know about.
"Second-hand goods
Consumers’ statutory rights apply whether the goods are new, ‘seconds’ or second-hand. Depending on the circumstances, a consumer can expect these goods will meet the statutory conditions and warranties listed in this guide."Have a read before you start running your mouth on subjects you don't understand.
https://accc.gov.au/system/files/Warranties%20and%20refunds%…
@ipiok: If you don't like it, don't publically talk about things you don't understand. It's called being called out. Learn from it and grow up.
@ipiok: Choice is a big difference. I'm saying they can't force the customer to go to the manufacturer. IF the customer wants to deal directly with them though, they are free to do so.
JB Hi Fi got a massive fine a few years back for trying to do this, refusing refunds or repair for faulty products and telling poeple to go to the manufacturer if they had not bought their extended warranties. MSY had the same thing, where they were only providing refunds up to 30 days after purchase for faults and saying to go to the manufacturer after that point- They had to have a big banner on their website explaining it for a long period after wards.
If I was to hazard a guess, I'd say these were sourced overseas and availing the warranty is too much of a headache, so you just chose not to. If they were sourced locally, or via a company with an Australian presence, the ACCC would enforce your ability to utilise the warranty.
Now, given you haven't removed the statements about 5 year warranty from your product page, and specifying that the items are 2 years old, could possibly give a 'reasonable' person the expectation that a longer warranty would be applicable under consumer guarantees.If they were sourced locally, or via a company with an Australian presence, the ACCC would enforce your ability to utilise the warranty.
Metrocom is an Australian retailer, with an ABN and physical presence in Victroria. They're selling the goods, therefore they are responsible for them and the warranty. Where they source the product from is not relevant.
@ONEMariachi: My statement was about how the Metrocom rep said they are unable to access the manufacturer warranty, which maybe the case (or what I stated that they basically cbf accessing it).
They are selling the goods second hand and offering a 3 month warranty, that I am assuming they will honour. The area I am finding a bit murky to understand is if a non-private second hand seller needs to honour the manufacturer warranty or not. I'd appreciate any links you have to clarify that.Personally it seems strange that they can just state a 3 month warranty on an item which should have another 3 years, but I can't find definitive statements to back that up.
@Fybre: You can't specify such a short warranty period. Well, you can, but you're still forced to service a warranty for longer than that anyway so the only purpose it serves is to say 'we think the Australian public are stupid rubes who don't know their rights and we're openly going to fleece them'. And hey, maybe they're not far from the truth.
The ACL specifies that you get a warranty for the reasonable lifetime of that type of product. These periods are often just whatever the ATO says the lifetime is of a product, which they use for depreciation.
@Fybre: Consumer law states "reasonable amount of time". That's all. The manufacturer states these should last 5 years with Enterprise use. Which Metrocom are also choosing to advertise on their product page. Therefore it is a reasonable expectation that it should last that long. So if they have 2 years of usage, you should expect it to last 3 more years upon purchase, and they would be expected to honour that based on the standard interpretation of consumer law in the country.
Buying a hard drive and stating 3 months warranty is the retailer stating, "we only expect this to last 3 months". No person is spending $200 on a hard drive with the expectaiton it only lasts that long. It's ridiculous and will never hold up. Even if they don't have access to the manufacturers warranty replacement. Bad luck, they will need to refund or replace if someone chooses to act upon a drive not lasting to minimum guaranteed life time the product offers. If they can't do that, they should not be purchasing these things and selling them. That's the business decision they get to make. They don't get to decide on how the warranty is handled after though.
@ONEMariachi: Reasonable amount of time is pretty much the same thing as reasonable lifetime mate.
Like I said, it's a solid argument to cite the ATO depreciation periods.
Sure - 3 years is a reasonable period of time.
"Buying a hard drive and stating 3 months warranty is the retailer stating, "we only expect this to last 3 months"."
"That's the business decision they get to make. They don't get to decide on how the warranty is handled after though."
Absolutely, 100% agree.
@Grazz989: I wasn't responding to you. I didn't see your comment when I wrote mine. Apologies if there was any confusion there
That's the original spec sheet for the drive, it probably doesn't apply here
Under $15/Tb delivered in Aus is excellent.
I paid $12/Tb for HC530's from the last EastDigital deal, but I'd never seen anything refurb that low before and it doesn't look like they have anything but Seagates in stock now.
Have they been tested for bad sectors?
Yes they have.
And the test showed none?
How many, if any, reallocated sectors?I've bought a 10+ refurb drives and they all tested perfect, no weak or bad sectors. Hope this gives an indication.
How many hours on them? Can they be returned if they fail a bad blocks test?
yea hours would be nice to know
Decent price
It would be a lot of work to list the hours for each individual drive. I suppose he could list a range but there is only so much work he can do and keep the prices this low.
I've purchased 5 drives from Jun now which run in a NAS and had 0 issues in the 2 years I've had them. Your mileage may vary but I'm happy with my purchase.Just an average would be ok big difference between 500hr or 25000hrs
@macmanluke: I've bought 8 drives from these guys.
They had between 760 to 766h unload cycles on each drive.
17,400-18,000 hours per drive.
@metalslaw: So about 750 days running 24x7, I don't see any problems with that. I've had my 6TB Seagate Ironwolfs drives running for about 5.5 years now without issue.
CrystalDisk in the pics show 17813 hours, or 742 days.
So I guess around that range.
So I guess they've been used 24x7 in Enterprise environment. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing. Possibly means they haven't been constantly powered on/off which might help?
24/7 spinning is ideal for all hard drives, not just enterprise drives. It's the spin up/spin downs that is the most taxing thing on a hard drive.
I have a WD red with over 40k hours on them, 17k hours for enterprise equipment is not much.
also server rooms are (should be) aircon, and no kids and dogs spilling milkshakes on them like a home pc
I wonder if this is best case, worst case,or average case.
Need a few 18TB and prefer WD, but buying drives without seeing the actual SMART Data per is a bit of a lottery, or at least if they say "all drives between 10 and 15k hours), something that put a cap on the upper limit.
I've got two 10TB on my desk which I've wipped with about 20,000hr which I need to flog off on eBay, replacing them with 15-20K hrs would be a pointless.
Need a few 18TB and prefer WD, but buying drives without seeing the actual SMART Data per is a bit of a lottery,
If you can go for Seagate, ED have the Exos X18 18TB Factory Re-certified with 0 Hours for $290 w/ 3 year warranty
16 to 17k its in the photos so 2yrs basically
I bought 4 of these drives from metrocom about 6 months ago. Performed a badblocks test on all of them, which took 4 days (using a tool called bht). None of them had a single bad block. 12000-14000 power on hours. Still going strong 6 months later in my NAS.
new account to verify the trustworthiness a bit, fishy, no?
Eh I've bought more and also had no issues, all healthy.
So, these drives can be treated as typical 3.5" drives?
I am thinking of putting one in a 3.5" external enclosure to turn it into an external storage device.
Yep, regular SATA drives, however the controller on the external enclosure would need to support the drive size. I've never encountered it but I've heard or some that have say a 4TB drive in it , only recognising up to 8TB.
most enclosures/docks will not work with these
Volans VL DS10S works with my ultrastar 14tb
May I guess 99% of users here just just hd for light writes, so 17813 hours usage means has lots of life for you.
Write amount doesnt really determine the lifespan of a drive, they're actually rated for 550TBW per year. Ive had drives a couple of years start forming bad sectors only after 70TBW which isnt only equated to about 1-2 drive writes per year.
so my colleague mentioned bad sectors can pop up regardless of usage, may I know if this is true? (I mean, murphy's law still applies)
But I'm spinning them up twice a month, surely that'll mean it'll last at least a few years safely right?
Pretty much, some go earlier than others. Note bad sectors popping up is only a sign the drive might die, not set in stone. I got an easy store with bad sectors popped up and stayed that way for years. So even if they do crop up, doesnt necessarily mean the drive will die, some data loss might occur tho.
Yeah, obviously everyone needing 16TB of storage should be buying SSDs. /s
Can you post a 16tb SSD deal pls
Rated 2.5M MTBF, so 17k hours usage seems fine for me as a home user.
Thanks for the deal Jun, I picked one up!
Do these require the 3.3v mod? That is just for shucked WD drives right? sorry for stupid question…
These are used in the server, not external enclosure. They should work as direct SATA hdd.
I have the HC550 18TB drive and it required to use the SATA power adapter (as advised by the seller, SATA power splitter was included with the note it may be necessary, strangely to the order from Amazon US), so likely it may still require 3.3V mod.
These ones from metrocom don't need a 3.3v mod.
mods are only required for shucked drives as they manufacture doesn't want you to take it out of the enclosure and use it inside your pc
I used to think that myself but turns out that little "bug" is actually a feature and indicative of a data center drive.
Q: Why would you want this feature?
A: The Power Disable feature provides an easy way to power cycle a drive in order to perform a hard reset. This can be useful if a drive locks up for some reason, and you don’t want to send a technician to the physical rack and manually “unplug the drive” and then “plug it back in” in order to power cycle the drive. Now, a smart chassis can provide a management tool to do this function automatically.https://documents.westerndigital.com/content/dam/doc-library…
If you got an easystore white label having this issue, odds are its a data center drive.
Are these suitable for Synology NAS? Failure rate as a NAS drive Low/High?
Any comments on noise as wellYes they are enterprise drives meant to be on 24/7 not noisy same as most sata, noise normally comes with sas drives which i personally prefer
Depending on where your NAS is located the PWL sound every ~5 seconds can be quite annoying.
You should try a home lab with dell md3460 60 x hdd bays now thats loud. Lol
@Wayne7497: Yeah don't want to imagine that haha. Just thought I'd mention the PWL sound as some users running a NAS in the same room as there workstations etc may find it annoying or even think there is a fault with the HDD.
Sorry, i don't have exclusive with enterprise drives. Can you elaborate what pwl?
I am in the market for 18TB. I know the drives from East Digital are more expensive, but they come with a 3 year warranty.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/276186182413
Worth the extra cost?
Do you want the hassle of having to send back to HK for warranty?
I would get the local drives and take the risk that 1 of 4 might have issues.
Recently Warranty returns with East Digital have been going back to VIC with Return postage paid.
I am in the market for 18TB. I know the drives from East Digital are more expensive, but they come with a 3 year warranty.
If you can go for Seagate, ED have the Exos X18 18TB Factory Re-certified with 0 Hours for $290 w/ 3 year warranty
Are you looking at USD prices? Not seeing any 18tb that low on their eBay store.
Can you share a link?
@Spizz: Cheers mate, looks like free standard freight to Aus too.
$297 for NEW 16tb Exos if you don't want to go the factory recertified. Nothing even closer to that price on eBay. I guess the gamble is if you need to RMA it to HK.
East Digital were selling these for $216 delivered last week with a 3 year warranty. Express posted; got within 2 days, perfect working order.
USD or AUD?
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Bloody weapon Jun! Love your work.