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Eneloops on the agenda again. Available at these prices for Click & Collect, or add $5.95 for delivery.
Eneloop 8x AAA, 8x AA Chocolat $14.98, 8x AA Tropical $17.98, Charger & 4x AA $14.98 @ DSE (C&C)
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Nope, both are the new Chinese made Eneloops that are not as good as the old Japan made ones.
So basically only reason to get tropical, is if you want the colours?
Also can you share some information on the "old japan" ones. Because I've got some regular white, chocolate and black xx variants, and I feel like in my mouse (where i'm constantly changing them) the regular white seems to last the longest? Am i crazy?
my understanding is the colors incase you want to stay organised (chocolate in TV remotes, Tropical in Games Console controllers etc.)
I don't know if you are crazy and that's pretty subjective anyway, but the xx ones should last the longest in theory.
XX are not LSD, the white ones are. The benefits of the XX are its ability to deliver higher current compared the white ones, which a mouse will not require.
@Tuba:
XX Eneloops are LSD, and retain charge almost as well as the garden-variety.Current generation AA XX Eneloops, or 'Panasonic Eneloop Pro' as now branded, have a capacity of 2550mAh - formerly 2500.
2700mAh AA batteries - as offered by a few manufacturers, including, presumably until recently, under the 'Sanyo' (non-Eneloop) brand, are not low self-discharge.
@Tuba:
A phrase used poorly in that 'wiki'.
I'm on my phone and had to squint to even see it.When introduced, Sanyo didn't market them as LSD batteries, probably hoping to - ultimately, in time - gain that extra 5 to 10 percent retention to exactly match the performance of the lower capacity cells.
Non-LSD NiMH batteries - like NiCad batts before them - are very different beasts, losing up to 30 percent charge in a month. A bit different to the 25 percent loss in a year of XX Eneloops.
@Tas: As far as Im aware, XX dont retain over 5 yrs either. Their capability is improved ability to deliver amps and some capacity, not LSD. These are better in high drain devices.
@Tuba: As far I'm aware, XX Eneloops retain their charge for longer periods in a proportionally expected and ok way, relatively speaking, for what it's worth.
Also - for what it's worth - for all manner of tremendously exciting reasons unrelated to 500 milliamps extra initial capacity, and mainly related to hoarding tendencies and pretty colours, most people in most circumstances with most devices will indeed be very, very, happy with their regular Eneloops - even the slightly crappier quality Panasonic/Chinese-made ones.
@Tas: Its not the peak amps thats matters, its the sustained amps, XX have less sag. When they sag, as the normal ones do if pushed, they go under voltage. Of course XX sag too but they dont do it as easy as the white ones, ergo, better in high drain devices. But its true, it wont start a truck.
@Tuba: A complete misinterpretation of the capacity reference I made. I give up.
For your future reference: LowSelfDischarge NiMH batteries are chemically, structurally, fundamentally, different in design to batteries that lose virtually all their charge in a three-month span of time.
XX Eneloop / Eneloop Pro batteries are LSD batteries and in fact hold their charge better than most other brands of LSD batteries of even lower-rated, initial, post-charge, capacity.That was not lifted from a poorly-worded forum wiki.
Enough.
Not always true. Last pack of tropicals I received, a few weeks back, say made in Japan, production date 2013-08
Oh nice, you were lucky!
@Stevesie76: Yes, it came from a store so it may have been older stock. Probably have the newer stock in their warehouse.
@unity1: Ah ok, yep most people seem to be getting China ones from online sales going on the reports from here.
Is there a major concern around them being manufactured in China vs Japan? Im assuming it would be the same level of quality control and parts, just a cheaper workforce that would be the only difference, which if all things remain equal, should produce the same quality output. No?
Quality control is where people have doubt in for the Chinese made ones but not sure if it has been proved Japanese made are better.
Reality says somehitn else is wrong. Panasonic themselves recognise this as the batteries have different advertising characteristics. Japanese cells advertised as having 70% stored power after 5 years, the Chinese say 65%. Its not a change in policy as the Japanese cells still say 70%. Both are being made, some markets including Australia, now get Chinese made batteries. Eventually everyone will, but for now, while the try to get their act together, we are the guinea pigs.
Testing by persons who play with these things has shown they lose ability to retain charge much quicker than 1800/2100 cycles too. Not that Japanese batteries do the full 1800/2100 except under specific conditions, testing of Japanese batteries and Chinese batteries by the same person under same circumstances show the Chinese batteries fail considerably quicker.
candle power forums has a comparison here if you want more details.
tl;dr : Japanese eneloops will last longer (ie more charge/discharge cycles)@cold bricks: Well if you look at the test there's no difference until 300 cycles in, then after that there's no significant difference until 350 cycles in. Now I have to charge my Eneloops around every 6 weeks, so 300 cycles will theoretically last me 34 years. You're also paying 25% less for these compared to the Japanese ones.
People act like they plan to pass a pair of Eneloops down to their children as family heirlooms, but I just want to get a good 4-5 years out of them before I get newer more colourful ones.
@NoRotation: The passing of years will degrade them too. They dont have the same storage capacity after 5 yrs.
And no, I paid similar prices for Japanese Gen 3s at DSE before the Gen 4 was available anywhere, its just that we are part of the market Panasonic decided would test the Chinese facility and the effect on the brand. There is far more to making a battery than most people thjink. Its why Eneloops are often attempted to be copied, but never succeeded in doing so. It took 3 major companies, Panasonic, Sanyo and Fujitsu, via Twicell, to create and make the Eneloop.
Actually I paid under $40 for 2 x 8 packs of Rouge, and a dumb charger with 4 more white Gen 3s. I also bought 2 packs of Uomo for around $15 per pack IIRC, might have been under $10.
People act like they plan to pass a pair of Eneloops down to their children as family heirlooms
I thought OzBargainers treat eneloops as wealth and pass them onto next generations :)
Ive opened a new packet of the ones made in China and found 4 flat out of the 8. Hasn't happened with the previous Japanese made ones I've been using for the flashguns. Maybe just my bad luck?
Maybe cheap, but not living upto the good old Eneloops standard philosophy?
You'll get even more cycles if you don't charge/discharge them at 2A, which is actually quite an extreme scenario. It's certainly appropriate for accelerated performance testing, but not exactly in line with typical usage scenarios.
Still like a lot of people I am quite disappointed in Panasonic for diluting the Eneloop name.
@dealsfinder: I assume the reason why stock is so low is because uncertainty regarding the Aussie Dollar is leading OzBargainers to convert all their liquid assets into Eneloops.
So; which are better, Chinese made Eneloops, or Turnigy?
the japanese eneloop was superior but Chinese made Eneloops and Turnigy should be the same capability now but hobbyking shipping costs will kill it for the Turnigy AA.
However the turnigy AAA which is actually 40% cheaper than the AA might be cost effective compared to the chinese AAA eneloop provided you buy a whole bunch of them.@techno2000: Recently ordered some of the Turnigy AAA LSD from eBay - shipping wasn't exorbitant that I recall.
Check hobbyking and look for AU warehouse stock.
I ordered 10 x AAA for ~$18? USD delivered. On backorder though.
From memory the Tropicals have a higher capacity retention after 5 years. Again from memory, the tropicals were up to 70% while chocolat was only up to 65% after 5 years. Also I believe the Tropicals had higher total expected recharge cycles. The chocolats are 2100 times, the tropicals i dont remember were around 2400 maybe. Unless like others have said I may have had a japan made pack…
is this a personal comparison you have made….?
Yes I had a pack of each and it had the capacity retention and recharge cycles writton on the front. I've since chucked the tropical packaging out so cant be certain on the values but i know they were different… I haven't done any formal comparison testing on them though.
wow… Didn't realise tropical eneloops have been out for so long that you have been testing them for 5 years
Tropical is just a wrapper, they are just Eneloops inside. What changes is the Generation, and there have been 4 so far. 3 by Sanyo, 1 by Panasonic. And now the Chinese variant of Gen 4 also by Panasonic, so 5 Gens really.
cycles
Gen 1 - cant recall, I think 1000.
Gen 2 - 1500
Gen 3 - 1800
Gen 4 - 2100Tropicals have recharge count of 1800 times whereas chocolat has 2100 times. Both say upto 2000mah capacity on the packaging. So for a 5% charge waiting for 5 years I would go for the cheaper chocolat ones.
@soyea:
Don't believe DS's old stock photo of the Tropicals. Troppos are now also made in China with the exact same specs as the Choccos!
Can these be used for garden solar lights?
I wouldn't use these in the garden.
Use something cheaper.. I replace the crappy batteries that come with solars with these ones and they work well:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/16-AA-3000-mAh-Ni-MH-rechargeable…
Most crappy solar lights use NiCd, don't they? Not NiMH. Using NiMH in a light meant to use NiCD may not go too well.
I swapped my crappy solar light batteries for Eneloops, about 20 of them. No issues for just over a year now, all working fine.
I forget what the old ones were exactly, but they were 1.2v 800mAh and half had died within a year.
@KentT: Sounds like they might have been NiMH to begin with. Some solars are, some aren't. Not sure whether there is danger in putting NiMH batteries in a charging device not intended for them.
@KentT: No, worst case scenario is something goes wrong, catches fire, and you make headlines for setting your neighbourhood on fire… Next, Eneloops are blamed and banned forever (and some Ozbargainers make a fortune for sitting on unopened mint-in-box stock).
Not sure exactly.
All my solar lights came with these same crappy yellow batteries. The yellow ones die after 3 months and I replace them with these ones. I have only had one failure on the blue and orange batteries.
Thnx
Eneloop? WTF is an Eneloop? Never heard of them
:-)
sorry, negged before I saw the smiley
I evened it out for you with an upvote to @supabrudda.
@supabrudda: You serious? Never heard of Eneloops since you've been on OzBargain since 2010?
Oh I've never heard that JV fella either :-)
wish there are smart charger on sale. got few packs of these eneloop without charger…
Yeah me too waiting for deal on the quick charger
Opus BT-C3100 V2.1 Li-ion NiCd NiMh LCD Smart Intelligent Battery Charger from GearBest US$39.99. Enter promo code "OP3100" during checkout. Write "Please include EU (or US) to AU power plug adapter" in comment during checkout.
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/164696#comment-2292157
http://budgetlightforum.com/node/30515
http://www.gearbest.com/chargers-batteries/pp_71595.htmlGearBest free shipping = slow ship from China
Too bad about the drop in the value of the Aussie dollar.
That's expensive…
@dealsfinder: It's all relative. This is a good multi-chemistry multi-size multi-function smart charger.
Have a look at the Nitecore i4. Often around $20 delivered. Most of the Chinese online stores have them. Smart, without bells and whistles, will get the job done. Dont worry too much about power cords, older versions have the old figure 8 lead, no fancy stuff on it (its all built into the unit itself), so if youve got an old tape player about, then it likely has this type of lead too. The later version going by images has a pin plug, but again one that you should be able to find in Aus easy enough.
Benefit being its a good charger in that it uses advanced techniques for charging, has a good degree of safety but it will do li ions too.
Personally I will never own one of the Opus chargers mentioned above. Too long to go into why here but suffice to say while it has plenty of fancy features, the power puck needs to be upgraded to 10 amps to stop some alarming effects, but he unit still comes with a 3 amp one.
Curious to know, are the 'alarming effects' due to the 3A power puck or due to something else?
Predominantly the PSU. But it is a charger that does things normally reserved for $70-100 chargers, data and stats and testing capabilities so there has to be compromises made in that too. Ive read people talking of other odd behaviour, resulted from quirks in the cheaper circuitry.
@Tuba: Hmm, ok.
I've just been looking at the Opus BM100 and BT-C3100v2 reviews on candle power forums and they seem like reasonable bang for buck except they use pulse/burp charging instead of CC/CV charging. Though I'm not sure if that is a good/bad thing … too much info for my brain.CC/CV is excellent, but related to li-ion not nimh Eneloops. Constant Current(amps or milliamps)/Constant Voltage (volts). Basically the preset (via a switch or factory preset) current is applied until a preset voltage (again, either via a switch or preset) is reached, then voltage drops to ensure the battery never goes over its preset voltage limit. It continues to fall until only a tiny current is being applied, this is the trigger on the charger to terminate charging. Or something like that.
Nimh you want Delta V (volts), Delta T (temp).
A fella going by the handle of HKJ, does reviews on batteries, chargers and a number of electronics gadgets like drivers etc. He was not willing to call this a very good charger, he had reservations based on results of testing. A couple issues were fixed with tweaks of software, not hardware and the PSU was never upgraded to handle the spikes.
He notes that its good in that its packed with features, but falls short on delivery. After the tweaks, on the v2.1 he revised his rating to good. But commented on the PSU again, stated if you upgrade the PSU yourself, costs maybe $10-20 it will be very good.
But practice has shown some odd behaviour from the v2.1 over time according to owners.
Like I said, its an item at a price point that is too good to be true. I prefer to either spend more and get something of quality, or just get the nitecore I4 if on a budget.
Edit: I see your Ikea Ladda charger post below and the linked review, thats the dude, HKJ. That Ladda charger is a good charger, does all the right things, but the Nitecore I4 does too. And has individual LEDs to say not only when its done, but how far along it is with 3 leds for each slot.
@Tuba: thanks for the detailed info … yeh, the ikea charger was another that I was looking at that seemed to have reasonable reviews, can probably get it quicker if you live near a store.
at the rate that these sales keep coming up, you could just buy another set til the next sale
http://www.bunnings.com.au/varta-aa-aaa-lcd-battery-charger-…
It costs $29.95 but you get 4 AA batteries included so the charger itself could be said to cost around 20$.
It has a 3 year warranty and a usb charging option as well.
Out of this and the Nitecore I4. Which would be the better purchase?
No stock in SA……
Sold out for click and collect in the 10 nearest stores to me
Starting my addiction today
Needed some, pity delivery only.
No click and collect here either
The overnight charger price is changing to $39.98 in the shopping cart :(
Edit: The price is now back to $14.98
Any recommendations on an inexpensive smart AAA charger?
La Crosse have a good reputation. This comes from the US and has a US plug, but you just need to pick up an adapter (a couple of dollars) and it's good to go in Australia.
http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charg…Totally agree - very good for battery health and gives you a good indication of how well you are charging
This ikea smart charger seems reasonable for $19.95 link.
It charges at 1A for both AA/AAA batteries and uses -dv/dt to detect a full battery. Only thing is that there is only one LED indicator, so you won't know when one battery has finished charging, only when all four have finished charging. Review here
Anybody know how to pay with Wish gift cards on Dicksmith online? I am getting gift card number invalid message.
is DSE still part of the woolworths group's giftcards?
I think so. They have the option to pay with Wish gift card in payment options. It's just that it's not working for me.
interesting, I didn't know that. thanks.
The latest Wish gift cards dont have DSE on it anymore so i guess they arent accepted like the old ones but never tried before though.
Thanks OP. Bought one overnight charger+ 4 x AA Click & Collect
what's the normal price for that pack? i've only just started looking at batteries!
This is the normal price. No-one ever pays the full price for Eneloops :)
No Ozbargainers you meant?
I think he meant for Muggle-borned people
Oh C'mon! Not another eneloop deal!! I have more Eneloops to last many lifetimes :)
It seems to me that there are no better Eneloop experts than Ozbargainers.
Hoarders and addicts are not the same thing as experts. :)
does anyone have older eneloop batteries that they are willing to part with…
i'm looking for the glitter ones?
Why? These are $15.00 for 8 new.
yeah i'm a late starter to the eneloop craze and I want to back track and get some of the older ones to try and get as many different coloured eneloop batteries as possible. just for fun really
Glitters come up on ebay occasionally for~ $35
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Is there any difference between the choclate and tropical outside of the physical appearance?