• expired

50Pcs Face Mask, 3 Layers Breathable Earlooped $22.51 Shipped @ William Klein via Amazon AU

695

Saw a past deal sold out *$50 deal and saw amazon has similar mask for $25

Mod Update: Price dropped to $22.51

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Comments

  • One of the product reviews say…

    "Tinawells, great seller, great quality. I realised that people (William Klein) and (becextech) are selling fake ones. Look out for them! Check if the Tinawells masks sold by Tinawells. If you can’t stay at home, Please Ware A Mask!!!"

    It's also important to note this particular SKU is shipped and sold by William Klein. It's not handled by Amazon, just listed there.

    • Oh damn! Thanks for the heads up… Bought some off William Klein the other day…

      • I bought some three days ago, they were $27.95. They are $23.51 now.

        • Welcome to the way Amazon does things (though this is actually a third party vendor) the prices go up and down continuously.

          My tip is if you're after something which is a few dollars more than you really want to pay, save the item and monitor it regularly and it'll probably change price up or down over a month or so.

          • @philart: You can also set camelcamelcamel to email you an alert when the price drops to your desired price. No need to monitor it yourself - just set and forget!

    • Yeah, with so many fakes/rejects/seconds out there I'm more than happy to pay the extra for peace of mind. Buy from the manufacture or an Australian retail outlet, not worth the hassle with these imo. Even if you use 2 per day for work, it's the difference of saving like $15 per month for all that potential hassle, risk, and frustration of poorly affixed straps (all while supporting dodgy sellers). But I'm no tooth fairy.

    • Thats good to know. I took a chance on the Tinawells product and its finally on its way as I type. It should arrive by next wed.

  • All of these sellers are accusing each other of selling "fake" masks… Lol!!
    Another seller is RJDJ who is selling fake masks too.

    • always someone saying something is fake in these mask deals >:(

      • What makes a mask fake? I don't get it.. seems very Chinese like. Do they use the term fake because they're not Medical grade?

        • Yes, they are Made in China.

        • +12 votes

          What makes a mask fake?

          Spoke with a relative who is a doctor and wears surgical masks daily. There is no such thing as a "fake" mask, all of the claims of "fake" masks are from other sellers who are trying to tarnish competitors.

          Do they use the term fake because they're not Medical grade?

          Relative also told me there is no such thing as "medical grade", different masks are used for different purposes in medical settings (https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/quality/the-4-fs-of-me....)

          Surgical masks do not provide filtration, so it is not like certain masks "keep the virus out" and others "let the virus in".

          • @p1 ama:

            There is no such thing as a "fake" mask

            A mask is a mask, it is just the content might not protect you. Makes sense.

            • +28 votes

              @netjock:

              A mask is a mask, it is just the content might not protect you. Makes sense.

              As I explained in my previous message, surgical masks are not for filtration. There is no such thing as a surgical masks that "lets the virus in" and ones that "keeps the virus out". That's not how it works.

              The purpose of a surgical mask is to stop you from blowing a jetstream of air every time you exhale. When you wear a surgical mask, it reduces the velocity of the air you exhale by changing its direction sharply and dispersing it over a greater area. Hence, the air you exhale travels a smaller distance and away from people you are talking to, not towards them.

              To understand the concept, try to blow out a candle. The smaller the opening of your lips when you exhale, the faster the air comes out and the further the air travels. If you exhale with a fully open mouth, you'll find it quite hard to blow out a candle. A surgical mask makes this effect even bigger by quickly changing the direction of the air and dispersing it. Hence, when you are sick, you are less likely to blow viruses onto other people.

              • @p1 ama: People don't want to listen/learn. Probably gas to do with when covid started all the western medical advisors were saying masks were of no use. Oh how times have changed.

                • @tessel:

                  Probably gas to do with when covid started all the western medical advisors were saying masks were of no use. Oh how times have changed.

                  It’s because most medical advisors and doctors are academics. I’m also an academic, so I understand how they think. As an academic, you never want to make positive statements unless you can prove it.

                  When an academic says that “there is no evidence masks are effective”, they are saying they don’t know, not that masks are ineffective. The problem is that the general public aren’t used to these sorts of nuanced statements that you only come across at seminars and in research papers. They’re not saying masks are ineffective. (Failure to reject a null hypothesis is not an endorsement of the null - if you’re familiar with basic stats).

                  In hindsight, it makes sense to say that it probably can’t hurt to just wear a mask.

                  This is ultimately what happens when you put academics, who never want to say anything with conviction, in charge of public relations, dealing with a public who want to hear things in absolutes. The questions are different, the academics are trying to discuss whether masks are effective. The public want to know whether you should wear a mask. Given there’s no real harm to wearing a mask, even without any further evidence, i’d say the answer should have been yes from the start.

                  • @p1 ama: I think you’re hit the nail with communication context, as the majority of the public aren’t academics, therefore does not have implied meaning of things has from an academic standpoint. If an academic (people doing the press release) qualified their statement like what you had, it put things into perspective. Problem we are experiencing here is the spot fire has gotten out of control due to a lack of evidence of a forest fire, this covid thing started in Jan, it is July now 6 months has passed ☹️…

              • @p1 ama: For surgical masks this is true. The basic goal of them is to reduce the distance that particles from the wearer's breath will travel, particularly respiratory droplets. They don't prevent you breathing it in. The idea is that if everybody wears a mask, it limits the spread by somewhat containing the infected. Surgical masks are basically cloth masks.

                An N95 rated mask, on the other hand, will actually protect the wearer from other people. However, that requires it to be fitted well which most people won't do. It also doesn't really work if you've got a beard, etc.

                There's a good little summary here: https://www.mayoclinic.org/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449

              • @p1 ama: -The number of layers, the material, the "robustness" and the fit are all important even if "something is better than nothing" (something which is FAR from proven at this point).
                - Masks are NOT all the same quality. Problem is knowing which meets minimal standards. It's possible that many not officially "approved" are just as good, problem is we don't know.
                - Masks - of any sort - are just a small part of stopping the spread, along with isolation, social distancing, hand cleaning etc.
                - People with symptoms or who have been in contact with a carrier should isolate, not don a mask and mix in the community.
                - Surgical masks have not stopped doctors and health workers from contracting Covid19, although they may have helped somewhat.
                - Experts still disagree about the efficacy of masks for public use but anecdotal evidence is mounting that they help. Correlation ain't causation however.
                - Do the right thing and follow the best current advice.

                • @Possumbly:

                  -The number of layers, the material, the "robustness" and the fit are all important even if "something is better than nothing" (something which is FAR from proven at this point).

                  Shows that you don't have any understanding of fluid dynamics which I've already explained. The idea is not that "something is better than nothing", it's that masks greatly reduce the velocity of your exhaling breath, hence it will travel a much shorter distance and away from other people you are talking to.

                  • Masks are NOT all the same quality. Problem is knowing which meets minimal standards. It's possible that many not officially "approved" are just as good, problem is we don't know.

                  There is no central "mask approving" agency.

                  • People with symptoms or who have been in contact with a carrier should isolate, not don a mask and mix in the community.

                  Obviously.

                  • Surgical masks have not stopped doctors and health workers from contracting Covid19, although they may have helped somewhat.

                  Shows you have no understanding of what the purpose of a surgical mask is and have not read any of my previous posts. Surgical masks do not provide filtration.

                  • Experts still disagree about the efficacy of masks for public use but anecdotal evidence is mounting that they help. Correlation ain't causation however.

                  You're just making things up now.

                  • Do the right thing and follow the best current advice.

                  Wow, aren't you the modern day Einstein. Take a bow. Everybody clap. Wow.

                  • @p1 ama: I don't need to understand fluid dynamics pal. The theory about corona aerosol infection is still contentious in medical circles primarily because not enough data/tests/analysis has been available, although it's plain as the nose on your face that a carrier breathing heavily in your face is highly undesirable. Google is your friend.

                    There doesn't need to be a central "mask approving" agency - there are already standards which deal with layers, melt etc. Without standards/credible stamps manufacturers can sell substandard masks giving wearers a false sense of security.

                    The use of masks for Covid29 has little if anything to do with filtration. The efficacy lies - in theory - primarily in reducing aerosol from infected people (who may not know they are carriers) by placing a barrier between people.

                    Despite your ignorance, experts still debate the usefulness of face masks for the public, as any decent search will show you. This is slowly changing based primarily on anecdote and a 'better something than nothing' policy. Here's just one recent local comment you might want to absorb:
                    https://www.smh.com.au/national/how-a-chinese-restaurant-exp...

                    *"Professor Lyn Gilbert is chair of the federal government’s Infection Control Expert Group, an influential body that advises the states’ chief health officers. Associate Professor Philip Russo is deputy-chair, and president of the Australasian College for Infection Prevention and Control.

                    Speaking in their personal capacity as researchers, both told The Age and the Sydney Morning Herald they did not believe there was strong evidence airborne spread was a major transmission route for COVID-19.

                    “Wearing a mask is not as simple a solution that some people make out – and is unlikely to be effective on its own, irrespective of whether transmission is predominantly by droplets or sometime airborne,” said Professor Gilbert.

                    COVID-19 is spread by direct contact – being coughed or sneezed on. “If you’re that close to someone, you’ll get droplets on the other parts of your face. Even if you’re wearing a mask,” Dr Russo said. Most transmission happens in households, not in public spaces, he said.

                    Airborne spread “is not a major source of infection,” he said.

                  • @p1 ama: Good summary of recent Au developments re masks here: https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jul/22/austr...

    • I'm wondering what a fake mask is? Surely they're all masks, only some are better made or have better breath filters than others.

  • Camel3 says it was $15 21/07/2020

  • Assuming they are not fake, with a failure rate of about 50% it is more like 25+ dollars for 25 masks which is not a deal.

    Imagine how much of a scumbag you have to e to make fake masks during a pandemic.

    • Imagine how much of a scumbag you have to e to make fake masks during a pandemic.

      What exactly is a "fake" mask?

      • Fake is misleading. More like it does not make the grade and do the job it's certified to do. There are different level of protection of masks. Basic cloth DYI , Surgical ones, p2/n95 ones etc. Depends on certification from country of origin

        • +2 votes

          True, “fake” might not be the problem, what we don’t know is if the mask are already “tainted”

          https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/artic...

          I’m not suggesting any products listed here have this problem, just buyer beware.

        • Yes, I addressed this in my earlier post.

          Surgical masks do not provide filtration, so there is no such thing as a surgical mask which "protects you more" than another one. That's not what they're designed to do.

          They're designed (largely) to protect people you talk to and communicate with by preventing your exhaling breath from becoming a jetstream of air. It reduces the distance your exhaled air can travel by quickly changing its direction (hence reducing its kinetic energy) and letting it out over a larger surface area (hence reducing its velocity).

          Unless you're wearing a mask specifically for the purposes of filtration, there's no difference between wearing this, a DIY cloth mask, a commercial cloth mask or a "real" surgical mask.

          • @p1 ama: People are just trying to justify forking out $10 for a piece of reusable underwear by inventing some kind of rating in it.

            I hate Chinese "fakes" on many things but for this who cares. It blocks large drops, reduces direct spread of smaller ones, and you won't get fined. Granted crappy build quality like straps not attached and stuff is an issue.

          • @p1 ama: You're all wrong! ;) There are 3 Ply Masks, then there are Medical/Surgical 3 Ply Type IIR Masks.

            3-ply medical masks have an outward Bacterial Filtering Efficiency of 98% (BFE) according to standards EN 14683:2019+AC:2019, certified by an EU notified body.

            Surgical masks are generally speaking a 3-ply (three layer) design, with 2 sheets of “non-woven” fabric sandwiching a “melt-blown” layer in the middle. It’s the melt-blown layer that provides the filtering capability. A melt-blown material is also used in respirators, and thus you can imagine it’s more expensive and hard to come by recently, due to demand 1.

            The melt-blown fabric is made by melting a plastic, then blowing it from either side at high velocity onto a rotating barrel. Done right, this results in a fabric composed of tiny filaments 1.

            Masks on this deal are junk 3 Ply Masks, they have made no medical claims and biggest give away - they are non-sterile! But they are fine as a 'face covering'! But better yet, get a cotton 3 ply reusable one from your local tailor and the planet will thank you!

            • @Bargain4U:

              3-ply medical masks have an outward Bacterial Filtering Efficiency of 98% (BFE) according to standards EN 14683:2019+AC:2019, certified by an EU notified body.

              I agree with you, but this doesn't invalidate my point. According to the standards that you cite, it says:

              This European Standard is not applicable to masks intended exclusively for the personal protection of staff.

              In other words, surgical masks are not for filtration, which was exactly my initial point. The whole discussion of whether a particular mask protects you more than another mask is bogus unless you're talking about masks which do filtration.

              Masks on this deal are junk 3 Ply Masks, they have made no medical claims and biggest give away - they are non-sterile!

              Which is exactly what I am trying to say. It is not a "fake" mask because it's not purporting to be what it is not. It does not cite that it satisfies any particular standard, nor does it say that it is appropriate for medical use.

              But they are fine as a 'face covering'! But better yet, get a cotton 3 ply reusable one from your local tailor and the planet will thank you!

              Which is literally what I said in my last line. I'm not saying that these masks are good quality, they're probably not (which you allude to). But it doesn't change the fact that for their use-case as discussed in this particular thread, there is no real tangible difference with a "better" mask.

        • What if a so-called ‘fake’ mask is in fact better than the mask it’s faking to be? I’m certain this is a possibility, regardless of its country of origin.

      • Whole nations have built their economy with morals like this

    • +7 votes

      You may heard in the news “many” years ago, of fake eggs and baby formula, etc… seems like anything to make a quick buck with a lack of morals, being skeptical is totally reasonable in my opinion.

    • It's amazing at how useful a safety pin is. Office staplers can be handy too.

  • Bought one pack just in case

  • https://www.amazon.com.au/FACE-MASK-Layer-Pieces-SYDNEY/dp/B...

    This one is for $16 says from SYDNEY but reviews says from Taiwan. If you're willing to wait, then file a complaint to Amazon AU for Misleading advertisement, then demand a partial refund under the ACL, you could save some more $$$

    • If you're willing to wait until October, you can get a better price than this I'm sure.
      Not worth waiting 4 months for something mandatory/recommended to save a few dollars.
      Only on Ozbargain huh?

  • We have access to all the technology in the world and we can't manufacture something as basic as a face mask.
    So long Earth, it's been nice.

    • +10 votes

      We have access to all the technology in the world and we can't manufacture something as basic as a face mask.

      So how do you transform a semiconductor fab or a car manufacturing plant into a place where we can produce masks? Do the sewing machines and raw materials just pop out of nowhere? Do engineers and technicians just magically learn to sew masks overnight?

      It just seems that people who say things like this have never worked in supply chain management and no idea of how vertically integrated supply chains are and how most of the world works on JIT manufacturing which has little excess inventory and little capacity to scale up quickly when demand spikes hit.

    • It's not that we can't manufacture face masks, but rather under normal circumstances it's not economical for us to manufacture disposable face masks.

      • Especially when you can buy a box of them for $23.51 of which at least $7-8 must be postage. Then a cut goes to Amazon, the merchant and the shipper. I'm thinking the manufacturer might be getting a fiver a box.

    • +1 vote

      Benefit of hindsight.

    • My understanding is there's one factory in Australia, but they're flat out making masks for medical workers. They've significantly increased production to meet demand, but I don't believe they have enough left to sell to the public.

    • We can but it's all about cost (and capitalism):

      • Initial set up
      • Material
      • Cost of tools / machinery (plus depreciation)
      • Labour
      • Transport, storage and distribution

      Quality is a relative to the cost as the higher and more advanced your masks, the more expensive they get initially (especially if R&D is involved). No point creating and manufacturing a ultra high quality (filtering out 99.9% of aerosol particles), futuristic mask that is usable for 365 days straight if it you need to sell it for $1000 each to make a profit but people are happy to get by with a $0.50 disposable mask, as you will have nearly no demand vs competitors.

      The price and demand would also be relative to how dangerous people perceive this threat. IF COVID, for example, mutated (plz don't) and the new strain had a 60%+ mortality rate, the website of the company selling the $1000 would crash from people flooding in to buy it and these dubious masks would be 50x for > $10.

  • Doesnt matter if they are fake, any decent piece of fabric is good enough. If you are unable to blow out a lighter flame while wearing it, then its good enough. These surgical masks dont really protect the wearer because its not sealed like a 3M dust mask, its more of protecting others when the wearer talks/coughs/sneezes. Plus the corona virus is also able to infect through your eyeballs if you are not wearing goggles or plastic face shield.

    • Plus the corona virus is also able to infect through your eyeballs if you are not wearing goggles or plastic face shield.

      Come on! Don't start the panic buying of goggles and face shields yet.

    • I have n95 masks and I reckon I could easily blow out a candle cause the valve is one-way so it only seems to filter when i'm breathing in

      • Then it might well protect you but not others.

      • Pretty simple fix. Wear a surgical mask over this to protect others. This will also keep your valved mask cleaner if you intending on reusing it.

        If you have Coronavirus and wear a mask with a valve you will be greatly increasing the risk to the people around you.

      • https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-24/do-masks-cause-co2...

        Are masks with valves instead of filters useless?
        Dr Mullins says not all N95 masks have exhalation valves, but the ones that do are far less effective in limiting the spread of potentially infected particles.

        "The concept of wearing masks is more to stop transmission from unwittingly infected people, so asymptomatic people," he says.

        "Masks with exhalation valves will protect the wearer quite well, but won't stop an infected wearer transmitting."

        He says while most of the relevant government departments are listing advice that any mask is better than no mask, masks with exhalation valves should be avoided if possible.

        "The valve will stop some big droplets, while some big droplets will collect on the inside surface of the filter before they go through the valve, but it's not ideal," he says.

        "A surgical mask will limit droplet emissions more than a mask with an exhalation valve does."

        • Thanks this is helpful and a bit worrying, I hate to think I might have been putting others at risk, I was just using a mask like they said. Why don't the gov warn you not to buy ones with valves, all they say is "wear a mask"!

          • @Genepi: Wouldn't be too concerned if you're following social distancing and sanitizing advice. Aerosol transmission without close contact is still contentious in medical circles or rather the transmission rate from aerosol is. Current mask advice is based on anecdotal observation from other countries - basically anything is better than nothing. Potential problem with masks is that wearers don't follow instructions re single use/disposal/cleaning AND become complacent about social distancing and general cleanliness. Obviously masks are NOT a substitute for isolation for anyone with symptoms. Seems at least a few people believe otherwise.

    • A stretchy woollen tight weave scarf is better than most of these flimsy surgical type masks. They're basically made so a surgeon can operate without spraying the wound.
      Their ability to prevent breath and atmospheric air from passing around the edges is limited. A scarf forces the wearer to breathe through the weave. But regular cleaning would be essential.

    • Doesnt matter if they are fake, any decent piece of fabric is good enough

      I'm unaware of any scientific evidence for this comment. Care to share? Probably depends on what you mean by "decent" and "good enough". Good enough to reduce the possibility of infection spread /is anything better than nothing - debatable, but possible. Depends on how the wearer behaves (eg does it encourage people to relax regarding social distancing etc), what he/she does with the mask after use (re-wear or wash…).

      • https://www.nap.edu/catalog/25776/rapid-expert-consultation-...

        Like you said, it also depends on the user's behavior and handling of the mask.

        • Thanks. Can't read it. What did it say in a nutshell? That a barrier is better than no barrier so to speak?

          All okay, have access. I'll wade thru it.


          It's an ever moving feast and only one paper but this summary is interesting, if obvious:

          "The evidence from these laboratory filtration studies suggests that such fabric masks may reduce the transmission of larger respiratory droplets. There is little evidence regarding the transmission of small aerosolized particulates of the size potentially exhaled by asymptomatic or presymptomatic individuals with COVID-19. The extent of any protection will depend on how the masks are made and used. It will also depend on how mask use affects users’ other precautionary behaviors, including their use of better masks, when those become widely available. Those behavioral effects may undermine or enhance homemade fabric masks’ overall effect on public health. The current level of benefit, if any, is not possible to assess."

  • These won't arrive till August

  • Anyone care to explain what "CE certified" actually means? How does that compare to N95 or P2?

    • They are several standards for masks (EN-xxx for europe and GB-xxx for china). "CE" alone doesn't mean anything.
      - they are 2 types of surgical masks: 95% and >98% (for 3micron particles)
      - P2 can filter 0.3 micron particles at 95% (P1: 80% and P3: 98-99%)

      I don't think reusable masks are tested in Australia so be careful, it can be worst than cheap chinese 3-ply mask. In the US and in Europe, reusable masks have standards and are tested!

    • Don't trust CE certified or FDA approved. They are all fake. FDA doesn't issue certificate and you can find all these fake certifications for almost all masks produced there. Just copy and paste certifications.

      https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/07/16/8907764...

      https://www.occrp.org/en/coronavirus/the-players-and-the-pap...

      In Australia, generally brand names are more reliable, check online for their company and if they are medical supplier. Do they specify filtration rate, expiry date of the mask on the box, are they produced in a sterilized environment or are they protective or medical grade? Not common here but the ones sold overseas may state bfe, vfe and pfe on the box (Japanese standard on mask). Pay attention to bacteria and virus efficiency.

      Generally, >95% filtration 3 layer masks found in Australia is okay for general use. I bought some ASTM level 1 & 2 (US standard) as they are reliable. N95 is for medical use but hard to breathe.

      • Wrong. CE means the respirators comply with EN149:2001 standards and hold a type-examination certificate by an EU notified body as well as a factory production control certificate. BUT there are so many FAKES - look for the 6-digit code of an EU notified body stamped on them.

        • The 4 digit code is only for P2 P3 mask like CE 0158 (it means it was certified by Dekra Germany), stamped on the mask.
          In Europe, surgical mask have no digits but they need to follow standards so they can put EN-xxx and CE on the box.

        • The standard is real, but the manufacturers just print it on the box to sell masks, they aren't CE certified. Do you how many pop up mask makers in China? People who order these masks can even choose the design of the boxes for their stock, so they look like foreign made (Japan/UK/Canadian). Paying for a reliable brand is just $30-40 more for 50pcs, why risk?

  • Be aware that seller William Klein is seller fake masks. Not Tinawell. Received all 50Pcs masks in a single plastic package, not the one showed on Amazon contained in a box.

    • Be aware that seller William Klein is seller fake masks

      Could be true but Microsoft used to ship OEM mice in brown boxes not retail boxes. Who knows? Getting a pretty box which doesn't block out virus is false sense of security.

      • But Microsoft never post picture of pretty box in their advertisement then shipping brown one. That’s called misleading…

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