Tesla, just dropped the price of an inventory Model 3 even lower, might be a good bargain to get before the:
stamp duty rebate https://www.revenue.nsw.gov.au/grants-schemes/electric-vehic…
and 3k ev grant ends: https://www.revenue.nsw.gov.au/grants-schemes/electric-vehic…
at the end of this year.
With the refresh model 3 2024 loosing the gear stalk and blinker stalk, this could become a high yield investment ;D
@mxlmxlmxl: There is some truth to your argument no doubt. No one wants to line up to charge during a public holiday weekend. Electrics are only good for city run abouts. Not for road trippin.
Cobalt story is less relevant as newer batteries don't have the rare earths. If you are concerned about Cobalt better throw your mobile phone away as well.
It's possible that solid state batteries could change the equation a little.
Either way world will have to readjust big time. Losers will pay.
Electrics are only good for city run abouts. Not for road trippin.
Do you own an EV and have you done a road trip?
@lazybones1987: Yes. I have. Numerous times. Watching drivers be anxious over a trip, wondering about the chargers, seeing one time them pay ahead to reserve a charging station…. On that same trip the petrol people arrived 6 hours before them.
Did the petrol cost more… For sure. Did I prefer the electric car drive excluding the charging, yes. Will this happen with masses, nope. Not a chance. Freaking stupid.
@lazybones1987: I do road trips on my RAV4. 1000km range. I don't even have to fill up once on some trips….
I stop for toilet stops etc when I want. With two drivers, I have unlimited range on my RAV4.
I don't need to own a EV to have an opinion on long charging times.
Todays grids can not service 100% EV cars. It can't in fact service 20% EV cars
"Probable grid impact based on case studies: if we use 250W per EV as the average demand at peak time and assume
1.5 million passenger EVs on the road at 2030 (in line with announced state government targets for 50% of new vehicle sales being EV by 2030), we will have an increase in peak demand of approximately 375MW, across the country.
This is on the close order of 1% of the combined peak demand across the NEM and the SWIS. For context, we note that weather driven year-to-year variations in system peak demand are routinely on the order of 10%." Source
@lazybones1987: Hahaha…. Sure. So states have had blackouts. We're being told most states will struggle this summer. But lets work on hypothesis and not reality whats happening today.
@lazybones1987: And also the linked source… Is a single person, for a council for EV vehicles, and is based entirely of estimates and hypothesis of numbers.
Most current cars range between 3000-7200 watts of power to charge. Not 250w. If charging at 250w they'll take days to charge. Back to my point, simple math and physics dictates this is bullshit.
@mxlmxlmxl: Yes they can take 7200w (or plenty more), but for what percentage of each week? 1-2% of the time. Hence the average of 200w (which is generous). The math is the math, EVs will not significantly affect the grid. I do a lot of km each day and mine is only plugged in a few hours per week, and mostly when my solar panels are covering it, so almost nothing from the grid.
Not to mention the reduction in killing 1500 African kids a year currently mining lithium and cobalt for just EV cars.
Most EV batteries are moving away from Cobalt in their batteries. Source
Phew… so you'll feel less guilty as you slowly kill fewer African kids… Great reply :/
Plus how disingenuous people like you try to win arguments with obfuscated bullshit.
The very first line "Makers of electic-vehicle batteries are reducing the amount of cobalt in their products in an effort to cut costs and avoid the stigma of buying a metal fraught with troubling labor practices. But cobalt demand will soar anyway, thanks to the sheer volume of rising EV sales."
See that… Cobalt demand will sore… so you crap answer is a lie. They are not moving away. They are reducing. But they will still use it and it will increase. But whatever lies you need to sleep to sugar coat an argument you're wrong about.
Battery powered cars are not the answer. Much like nor is wind. Solar, if it could double or triple in energy production is viable. But people like you hide behind tainted studies of one, with stats that even state it'll increase then lie saying moving away.
@mxlmxlmxl: And for context, this is all from someone who thinks Tesla's are good cars. Who was 13.6kw solar power at home at 18kw battery power backup. Who refuses to buy products unnecessarily wrapped with waste plastic and opts for plastic free options, who tries to walk more and use less fuel, who grows own veggies and actively does what he can to minimise pollution and waste. All whilst not buying into carbon bullshit, caring about the planet and everyone on it not bullshit carbon trading to keep countries in third world status.
No the solar powered perpetual motion EV is the future.
except if it's a rainy day.
Hydrogen is quite simply not the future, hydrogen buses were trialled in perth some 16 years ago. They were inherently frought with issues, not to mention hydrogen escaping at massive rates (there's a reason it never went mainstream). Ev is the only solution imho
Mate, you might want to get with the times and catch up on current tech and developments in this space & capability than reply on something that occurred 16 years ago.
If the technology had progressed we would've had them by now no?
how and how often and where do you guys with Electric cars, charge? I am so struggling to get an EV because of those 3 questions, being the 'where' is foremost! Imagine a day trip, in the middle of nowhere other than fuel stations….
Ampol & BP are installing stations at servos around Australia, otherwise home 🏠 or Teslas Supercharging Network
Yeah, no good for that type of trip. Just get a diesel with 1500km range and just enjoy your trip without having to drive from charger to charger.
EVs don't suit every use case.
I do wonder what happened to the option of towing a baby diesel charger? This was proposed in the beginning as a range extender to get EVs >1000kms. The idea was you rent one for a long trip.
The total clean solution is non-stop charging as demonstrated by in highway wireless chargers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BQUIRBMSWA
HAha this is funny. Wouldn't it be easier to just drive a diesel or petrol car? No towing unless you want to tow your horse or something.
All day trip just needs planning. Just like a normal car after awhile you know how many km it can roughly go before needing a charge. I always enter in destinations now as the prediction of usage is very accurate.
Have taken this down the eastern border no problems. Just need planning. In saying this, EV not that great going into remote areas yet.
You charge at home, you charge at a charging station and the rest is called planning….which the car does for you. If your driving 8 or 9 million km a week then petrol probably works out better, expensive to fill but quicker and easier. However I find everyone gives extreme examples (see above) when discussing charging.
Suddenly everyone needs to get from Sydney to Queensland but when you ask how often do you do that ? The answer is always once a year or every other year. Personally my days of driving anywhere over 6 hours are long gone. I'll spend the money on a flight, bus, train, helicopter, boat, UFO.
Yeah, if I pay $55k for a vehicle I need it to go on road trips etc also. I can't afford to have a Tesla for daily driver and another car for road trips. So road trips are relevant. Many Aussies road trip extensively during long weekends etc etc.
The last thing you want is to line up during a road trip during a long weekend for hours waiting to charge.
I cant imagine you need a separate car for road trips, seems a little extreme. Unless your doing huge road trips constantly in which you can either pay the ever increasing petrol prices or get a hybrid and get more KMs out of your car. Good luck.
Have a look at https://www.plugshare.com which lists all chargers available.
How and How often do you charge?
That depends on your use case and every person is going to be different.
In my case, I WFH and travel 50 KMs a day in day care drop off and pick up. I have a wall charger at home and I tend to charge the car when it dips below 50% or if I think I'm going to need more for a long trip.
There is a little bit of planning that you have to do if you are planning on doing road trips. But apps such as Plugshare, ABRP and Tesla's navigation system will help you with that. The number of chargers in the country is improving (albeit slowly). Companies like BP & AMPOL are rolling out chargers at their fuel stations.
At home.
Leave it plugged into the charger when its in the driveway. Apps can schedule it to only charge off excess solar energy. You dont ever need to think about it.
Before i had solar i would usually use paid chargers while I'm either at the gym or grocery shopping.
Hear this out. Most people are at work during day light hours. How would one charge from solar at home during these hours?
Does the car drive itself back home to do this?? ;)
They can charge on the weekends or overnight using an off peak plan for slightly higher cost?
Apply a little lateral thinking buddy
@SummerZero: Overnight using solar? Pls explain more…
I am aware you just plug it in at home at night.
@Naigrabzo: I'll spell out a couple of scenarios for you then….
If you are the 47% of people that don't drive to work then you can charge while you're at work and the car is at home. Solar is ideal for this as the only cost is giving up the feed in for sending back to the grid which is usually very low (<10c per kw mostly)
If you are of the 53% who do drive to work then you can charge using solar on weekends (again giving up <10c per kw), or switch to an off peak plan and you can pay a similarly low rate for overnight use from the grid.
I also mentioned using public charging infrastructure which you have ignored.
Feel free to ignore the economics of it and continue being a pain :)
@SummerZero: Hi why in the world would you charge if you DONT drive to work?? The car should be full.
I drive to work and I use my car during weekends for various errands.
I am not that keen on lining up on public chargers.
The economics are quite obvious. See here for the breakdown.
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/i-drove-an-electric…
Nah. Tesla owners all work from home.
Worth checking it out if contemplating buying an EV, I run a Facebook community page "Tesla Owners Australia" if you'd like to lurk or ask questions with over 40k members 🙂
is it full of teal supporters?
It is full of the dumbest people ever on FB. Every other post is about a tyre puncture and people just not knowing what to do/ how to repair it. The admins are absolutely hopeless at managing the crap that goes on. Don't get me started about Nathan.. OMG. Stay away from that group for your own sanity.
Now I wanna join it just to read dumb comments lol
@montorola: here is an example to tickle your fancy:
<<insert photo here of tesla tyre with a nail in it, about an inch from the side>>
Listing notes:
Guys, help please, what do I do? Photo shows the nail in my tyre and I don't know what to do. Has Tesla got a special kind of tyre that I keep hearing about? Who can fix this? Is this fixable? Do I need to replace all 4 tyres?
Comment 1: If you want to replace all 4 tyres then don't forget the spare tyre too
Comment 1 reply: My Tesla did not come with a spare, should I get one? How often will I need it?
Comment 2: That nail is in the side wall, it's totalled
Comment 3: Go to any tyre shop and they will plug it for you
Comment 3 reply: Oh No, don't plug Tesla Tyre, it is simply not safe, I am a car mechanic with over 75 years experience
Comment 4: I just got Tesla to attend with a flat bed truck and they took my car away, I will get my car back in a week with a fixed tyre and it will only cost me $869.
Nathan sounds like a Chad…..
Kek, have flat, what do
Smh
This year OzBargain Tshirt is teal colour…
Hi Nathan!
are you the owner of the page?
It's Nathan the Awesome!
Literally nobody cares.
Will this come with home Charger?
Not included, Order via the Tesla Website
So basically it's like iphone with no charger
Has wheels and can take humans places unlike an iPhone 🙂
next years model is double the price and has an usb c charger
Just did a test drive on the Model Y. The sales man said that the chargers come separately. $750 for the simple wall socket charger which takes (12 hrs + to charge the car to full) or the $950 fast charger (about 6 hours to full), but the fast charger requires an electrician to install the device and may cost an extra $1,000.
The wall socket charger is $550 and will take 30 hours
30 hours? You can force it to charge that slowly if you tell the car to. But normally the mobile charger plugged into a regular power point anywhere will get you from 20% to 80%, which is what you really should be doing for battery longevity overnight (about 15 hours) or use a 15amp power point (sparky can swap a normal double power point to a single 15amp one) in 9 or so hours.
I paid for a fast charger at my old place, but I didn't bother at the new house, just swapped a power point to a 15amp one (cost about $80) and we change two teslas from that one "slow" charger.
@dtpearson: Burying the lede with your 15A plug! The wall charger does 8A at 240V unless you do the 15A. Thats 2kW/hour. 67 kWh battery. 33 hours. I'm responding to the 12 hours to full charge comment. Not any way around that: edit also the LFP isn't the same for battery life. It wants to get to 100% once per week
Electrician will charge more than $1000.
I can't seem to get 55k to show, min 58k
which state?
prob QLD.
Yeah qld, I've checked other states and there are the 55k.
Will wait for upcoming model 2, hope it will be under 30K. Else will buy BYD seagull.
Model 2 is vapourware. If you have a working petrol car, HODL.
My prediction is that BYDs will have major mechanical problems in the coming years. Just like every other new car manufacturer did ….Remember the crappy hyundais we had to go through….
BYD != new
BYD is a 20 year old company though, and EV's are inherently simpler. A lot of the issues seem to be either panel gap or software related.
Yes, EVs are simpler, but battery management is still pretty tricky. The Chinese are the best at it, but there they are innovating so quickly and dropping prices so fast, that there is bound to be the odd issue.
@dtpearson: BYD are basically at the cutting edge of battery technology, though.
I'd be more confident in their abilities than probably any other manufacturer.
@Deviner: Buy one and see what happens to mechanical bits on the car….
The car is not just a battery. There are heaps of moving bits. It takes manifacturers years to perfect cars to specific markets. For example, I bet BYD dash boards will fall apart in a few years under Ozzie sun.
Don't think the BYD seagull is planned on being sold here.
Yeah, from what I've read it's not big enough to pass the safety tests.
Even the Dolphin needed to have the crumplezones entended to meet EU and AU crash standards.
So many people jump at the opportunity to buy an EV thinking they’re saving money and the planet, but haven’t even thought about designing our towns better so we don’t need to rely so heavily on private ownership of cars.
but haven’t even thought about designing our towns better
That is all rubbish because then you won't have inner city land explode in value. It is where most of the older generation old money is locked up. They expect young people to thank them for it when they pass it down.
Lol, I thought I’d heard it all…
So let’s continue to make people that live further out own and maintain a car just so they can participate in society because otherwise inner city oldies won’t have appreciating assets.
Right. I don’t really even understand you fully. What are you saying?
I agree! But no one wants to make that change (in town planning), or pay for that change.
Lol, I thought I’d heard it all…
That isn't very smart is it.
What have EVs got to do with town planning?
You could use that argument for literally anything anyone buys…?
You could use that argument for literally anything anyone buys…?
Then I challenge you to apply that to a loaf of bread. I mean cheap $1.98 white bread from Aldi.
You have a bright career lined up for you in sales.
I would argue that it is actually by design that we have to rely heavily on private cars. The people don't really have a say on that.
We absolutely do have a say.
Because I can buy a car, but I can't redesign my city.
Great answer.
It's a terrible answer. A response from someone who doesn't care. It's sad.
@giventofly: Anyone can care. But not everyone (and perhaps no single one person) can redesign a city.
I look forward to you redesigning Melbourne (which isn't too bad but could do with more public transport and fast rail). Let us know when your job is done.
p.s. I didn't neg you, but will give you a + for trying.
You can't be bothered getting involved? I've made changes to my local area by calling councillors. If you care, you would.
Making calls obviously not enough.
giventofly for PM? I think that's the only way you'll make mass-change
Designing towns? We'd need to redesign Australia to not need private cars.
redesign Australia? I think we need to re-terraform Earth to not need private cars
Drop to $39990 then we talk.
It would sell like hot cakes and we will be forever be in a line for pubic charging.
pubic charge sounds very painful.
I'll pass.
Yeah. You are lucky that you have the option….
Electric cars are so expensive.
It's because they charge a lot.
aren't Camry costing upwards of 50-60k now for medium spec?
@mxlmxlmxl: the whole carbon crap is a climate scam to begin with.
any serious look into the claims can be easily debunked.