Aged Care Nightmare - Goodbye Inheritance

I have been reading some posts lately about people stating they will be relying on inheritance to get their way through life, but today I have my story to tell you.

In the previous month my dad (70s) had a fall and is now bed bound. The hospital doctors are recommending he be moved to aged care.

Here is where the problem lies. I need to find a way to find $600,000 for the residential aged care deposit, or pay the daily fee which is the equivalent of $128 a day.

Guess what, my dad has instructed me not to sell the house at any cost. So here I am with the dilemma that I have to find a way to stump up $128 a day to pay for his care.

What have others done to prevent this scenario from happening? Or is the whole "waiting for inheritance" not a real reality?

Further information about me:

I don't have my own house sadly… So, I am regretting skimping on the stamp duty and waiting for the property to pass upon death at the $100 rate… I can tell you that probably in a majority of situations this transfer never even happens because a majority of people will go to aged care and be forced to sell their family home.

Looks bad right? I was pretty upset when he went to the hospital, but now I'm in an even worse position.

Comments

    • +2

      From personal observations, what the govt provides you for "free" is very different to what those who can pay get.

      The "free" stuff, it's basic survival.

      The ones who can pay, well they get an input into a lifestyle.

      Just one example:

      My parents have these 4 wheel ride on scooter type things that they can use for everything from transport to get somewhere - appointment etc, go on random excursions to get them out of the house, to taking themselves over to the local shopping centre where they can remain seated at all times and load up their goodies into their little basket thingy and saddlebags.

      They can then ride the thing all the way home right inside their kitchen where they can then unpack their groceries.

      They'll often take themselves on journeys, outings and over to the club for a meal and a punt on the pokies!

      Then there are/were my in laws. No super scooter for them, they got this walking frame thing they had to grip and move with them as they struggled to remain standing. Damn hard things to use one handed, so even if they could have shuffled over to the shops, couldn't let go of the walker to do any shopping.

      Pretty sure grandads at least had some wheels on his, but granny wasn't allowed one with wheels as it was too unstable for her.

      From mt perspective, getting old really sucks and apparently, it is also very expensive. However, just by observing our two sets of parents and the lifestyles they're able to access, I know I'll be doing my level best to accumulate enough money to sustain myself (and hubby), to do everything possible to avoid having to access what the govt may provide at no expense.

      Believe me, the "government funded" version makes me wonder if the poor buggers who must depend on it, wouldn't be better off dead.

      Damn well hope that my parents never need one (all my grandparents died in their own homes, so could happen), but if they do need a nursing home, I feel so grateful that they have the resources to enter one that they like.

      For the "free" ones, whilst there could be a small room for choice, the reality is, you pretty much get the first dingy one that becomes available, and there sure are some horribly dreadful, dreary looking ones out there.

      I'm grateful that the gov does provide care for those who need it, but you're fooling yourself if it's anywhere you'd be happy to see anybody you remotely liked, far less loved.

  • Your Dad needs a lawyer, ASAP.
    But not your lawyer.

    • Yes everyone should lawyer up. That will solve the worlds problems.

      Well… It'll solve the lawyers need for a 3rd jet ski problem.

      • -1

        No, not everyone. Just the parents being used for inheritance, by offspring skewed in that direction.

        • Sounds like the offspring are being used for the daily fees with the promise of some kind of inheritance at the end whilst the parent is refusing to sell their PPOR to pay the RAD. The parent in this situation can fix this by selling the house and paying the RAD.

          • @morse: I agree. Sell the place. Get the best ( independently mentally stimulating and conducive) )aged care he can for the money and if it runs out, Jr gets a second job or borrows. That's love and loyalty, in motion.

            • @Protractor: If the dad sells the house it sounds like the offspring won’t need to chip in much. But it sounds like the dad is refusing to sell.

              • -2

                @morse: It's a cake and eat situation with the offspring using the old man as a tug of war rope. If the father has no other kids, he should get a lawyer. One he can trust who acts in his interest. Not the sons.It is the father whose assets and welfare are the core objective.

    • Lawyer will tell the Dad the same thing as the aged care facility - the cost of admission is X, how you fund it is not our concern. OP just needs to understand that as the system bends him over.

      • Lawyer isn't the one fretting over an inheritance,though. And none of us know whether that's Dads true priority either. He probably has massive emotional attachment to the home, and an independent voice may be just the thing required.

  • +2

    Alternative:

    Stay at home and look after your relative, become a paid Carer (Centrelink? or whatever) and SAVE $600K + $128*365 + getting ripped off by everyone else around,

    Ain't easy but after the painful adaptation will become just like a job and then even proudness for the worthiness of the achievement..

    My humble opinion only.

    • -1

      $46,720 a year isn't much.

      • +1

        It's $46,720 pa plus the savings from not paying the daily fees

        OR

        $46,720 plus the capital gains (between now and Dad's passing) on the house and the savings on stamp duty

      • I can't think of a single person with common sense who thinks getting paid $46K a year to live with and support someone for a few years is a bad deal, if the reward is inheriting their home outright & that persons financial assets on top at the end of the time………….

        The average person works a much harder job for much longer hours for 30+ years of their life to obtain outright ownership of a house.

        • +1

          Plus … one thing is working for someone else (ironically perhaps as an employee in a retirement village), versus doing about the same but caring for a very close relative, your own blood and genes.

          Win win win situation!!!.

  • If you can't or don't want to sell the house, then rent the house out.

    Any shortfall for the $128 daily cost can be covered by his pension.

    or take a $600k mortgage on it, rent will pay the mortgage then.

  • There is a lot of information & support out there - but it is very confusing for a newcomer. A search for "carer helpline " or "carer gateway" should point you in the right direction - good luck, it won't be easy.

  • Yup, it's great isn't it.
    Ideally you were his carer then the principal home would be exempt.
    Also, as a close relative if you had been living there and got a centrelink payment it would be exempt also.
    Honestly, option one is the easiest to do and I hope people are aware of this.

  • +10

    So the dude is basically a property millionaire and you're asking why you can't extract money from poor people via the government to give him even more??

    He has an asset that he can sell if he wants to.

    Sorry you only have the $ signs in your eyes, but I thought the whole point of building up money/assets for retirement is so that you can afford to exist when you're old… so the entire point of him having his assets are so that he can sell them now.

    • This. Finally someone makes sense.

    • -1

      You are correct.

  • +4

    Interesting.
    Years ago, an inheritance was often an unexpected, unplanned windfall. Since parents have become expected to produce a decent inheritance, children have come to expect, rely and even need (as opposed to just want) a decent inheritance.

    Similarly, years ago, a house was affordable on one income. When two incomes became the norm, hey presto, the price of housing became such that two incomes didn't buy a better home, they are now required to buy pretty much any home. Same could be said for working multiple jobs - previously to get ahead, now to keep head above water.

    Society now also excessively rewards those who produce "nothing" (influencers, content creators, etc). I'm just hoping there are enough coming through the ranks to produce things that are actually needed (engineers, manufacturers, farmers, etc.) to keep the world going.

    I don't have solutions - just making (sad) observations. We seem to have lost our way me thinks. Idiocracy is meant to be a comedy movie, not an aspiration.

    • +1

      Not true at all. Inheritances, indeed large ones, have frequently been an expectation for hundreds of years. A number of Jane Austen novels are about this very issue,

      • +3

        Jane Austen novels were typically centred on the lives of landed gentry, aristocrats and other upper classes. Some of the key characters in her novels would have multi-million dollar incomes per year and tens of millions or hundreds of millions of dollars worth of assets in today's terms. Their lives and customs (e.g. expecting inheritance) were completely different to that of the majority of normal people.

  • If your Dad doesn't want to sell the house, how about mortgaging it? If the interest payments would be less than the daily cost, you might be better off. When he passes away, you'll get the capital back to extinguish the mortgage. Just an idea you might want to explore.

    Another option - rent the house and use income to pay the daily cost - beware tax though.

  • Enjoy life, money is great but can only get you so far.

    The great hulk kogan who recently passed away had everything, a career, wealth, family, and at 71 he's gone.

    So inheritance or not, enjoy your life even if it makes no sense.

    • great

      Yeah he was a great big…

      • -2

        Success that you appear to be jealous of.

        • +1

          I’m not jealous of Hulk Hogan. I feel sad for him.

          Steroids, opioids, other drugs and alcohol.

  • +1

    Get some knowledgeable advice. There are all sorts of traps. If you pay the rad the amount then becomes an asset against your father, which reduces his pension. Sometimes it's better not to sell a home. As I understand it the value is not included as an asset for two years (?). After the two years some of the asset is not included in the asset test I understand? If you rent out the house you may risk losing the cgt free allowance for a ppr. This could be worth hundreds of thousands extra tax depending on the house value. You need proper advice. It is worth paying for.

  • hi there,
    this video discussion with Services Australia 'Justin Bott' may offer some guidance → https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwVsI02vPjs
    reg's

  • +1

    This topic has been heavily on my mind and I can't stop thinking about it.

    Firstly, a nursing homes akin to the penultimate destination?

    As a person's health and abilities change, does it happpen that a person moves back and forward between requiring care within the nursing home, to periods of improved health which enables their needs to be met elsewhere in the community such as in their own homes, albeit with assistance provided through aged care support workers?

    I ask this because I did assume that once you went into nursing home, that was it, you are not getting out of there until you die.

    On the other hand, I witnessed my FIL spend months moving between hospitals, public palliative care wards within the public hospital to then be moved to palliative care within his own home.

    Followingnthis, he was released home as a normal old person, but soon got the ball rolling for both he and his wife to enter a nursing home.

    Whilst some provisions and modifications needed to be made to their home to assist their ability to stay there, granddad could sort of provide most care for himself, but he did start to struggle adequately caring for his wife independently, and whilst he was in hospital, she definitely could not have been left there alone, not even for half an hour.

    Are more people living longer these days because of advancements in science?

    Fo you think we are playing our own version of God by artificially extending the lives of people, sometimes decades longer than they were ever intended to live?

    • +1

      I wouldn't imagine, and in fact have never seen an example where, someone goes to a nursing home and then returns to their home.
      It's usually a one-way trip. Despite the efforts of staff, residents invariably lose both physical and mental ability.

  • There are financial Advisors that specialised in Aged Care.
    My understanding is it is means tested, if your dads partner is still living at the said house, then this is not included.
    If your dad is able to go Home. Then there is possibility of Support at Home packages where carers come in to attend to things required as assessed.

  • +1

    Aged care is unfortunately expensive. There would be cheaper options out there but if his home is worth a significant amount and his wife is not living there he will either have to sell it or stump up the DAP( interest on what the RAD would be).

    You will get the majority of the RAD back when he leaves care but ultimately things need to be paid for. Running aged care is expensive and as much as the residents pay it’s still %70 government funded on top of that.

    The assets would still be his for Centrelink purposes for 5 years after he gifts them too you so that’s not realistic.

    If it was my dad I would say sell the house pay the money and forget about the inheritance. He’s more then just a piggy bank.

  • Just put the house up for rent and pay the fees. Or sell and give the deposit which you will still get one day when he passes away. I don’t think the fee without deposit is that low. In any case let the property and use to pay the fees .

  • You are right not to want to sell the house. They are hard to come by these days. Either rent it out, or move in there yourself and redirect your current rent to the aged care fees. Take a flatmate as well if you need to.

  • +1

    I'm not sure if this will really help you but we've found any solutions and we've paid thousands to so called advisors who haven't given any good advise.

    We're being hit with fees daily higher than we expected as there is a lot of hidden charges, currently watching the savings account eroding away we honestly have no idea what happens when it runs out.

    Its a situation where you're just hoping for end of life before the money runs out. The government has no solutions to this and I don't know of any advisors that can offer any solutions. We had had to already front up the cash for the room, and they now want a huge amount more to put the second parent in next. We can't afford it, even if we sell all assets it will not cover them if they live longer than the government expects.

    Also should probably point out that the in home case options are horrifying, each time we visit we find massive damage, the last cleaners that came through put a hole through the wall and refused to pay to fix it.

    I wish I had more useful advise. accelerating toward early death seems to be what the government wants from the older generation.

    • +1

      so called advisors who haven't given any good advise.

      Classic Ozb

    • -1

      Now that's a nightmare aged care story. Sorry to hear your family and parents are going through this.

  • Probably too late for the OP, but may be of interest to others.
    I think there is something called "granny flat interest/arrangement".
    Your sole parent can gift you their PPOR without affecting their age pension.
    The when they move into aged care, they won't have the house as their asset.
    If they don't have any other significant assets or cash, then their fees will be much lower/none.
    Gotta do it early tho and pay a stamp duty, and may or may not be worth it.

  • Move into his house. Use your rent money towards his bills. When he gets better he moves back in with you.

  • It is me or is it odd that so many of the comments are about ways to "avoid" paying for aged care. If you need the service, you pay for it. If that means you need to sell the house, sell the house. If you actually have a house to sell, you've done well. Never understood the fixation on inheritance - if you need money, earn it yourself. So if the OPs dad needs money for care and has a house to his name, why is there a debate on whether he needa to cash out to get care??

  • No, waiting for an inheritance is not a thing.

    By the time your parents are gone, you should be well and truly established financially. An inheritance really skips a generation, and it is your children that could stand to benefit from your parents wealth.
    But if you managed to make a living without an inheritance, I'm sure your children should too.

    An inheritance isn't a right and it isn't a necessity. It's just what is left over when someone passes.

    That house is your dads, not your inheritance. If he no longer needs a house, but he needs aged care, then it's time for the house to go.
    You can have whatever is left when he's finished.

    If your dad wants to remain independent in his decision-making, let him decide how he's going to pay for his age care. He doesn't get to insist on keeping a house sit their idle and someone else pay for his accommodation and provisions.

    • Plot twist:

      Kid dies before his father.

      Kid won't be getting an inheritance even if there's anything left after father passes.

  • Can you pay the stamp duty and transfer to your name before he goes into the nursing home?

  • +2

    Goodbye inheritance? The fact that you already assumed it was yours says alot. Don't get any ideas about learning how to cook beef wellington it doesn't end well.

  • Rent the house (or move in and save your rent) plus age pension. Plus doesn't he have any super?

  • +1

    The rules are complex and illogical. You should see a professional that specialises in these things. Advice will probably cost you $1000 or more.

    If you do it right, he'll be in a good home and his estate won't go in fees. If you do it wrong, he'll be be in hell and they'll suck every last cent out of him.

    Also ask your doctors about home care packages.

    • +2

      This. Don't ask on OzBargain.

  • 128 sounds cheap. our local is 240+ minimum

  • +1
    • Don't sell the house.
    • Move into the house.
    • Don't pay rent and pay his aged care fees instead. ($128 is a VERY good deal, actually)
    • Use his Super for any difference between potential rent and the AC fees.
    • Problem solved.
  • You don't happen to live in the house? Family members who have lived in the place 2 years? (from memory) in a carer role can apply to make the property protected.

    RE: Aged Care, $128 sounds too cheap. There's usually 2 fees payable. An accommodation fee (a percentage of the RAD until its paid) $128 sounds right, and a basic daily fee of around $60. Daily accommodation fees aren't refundable later on, but the RAD is.

    If you and he can cop the hit of approx. 5-6k a month not refundable , you can keep the house. If his life expectancy isn't great, this may be an option. But for those whose relatives are expected to live a few years, the potential financial hit of not paying the RAD deposit over time is often enough incentive to sell their homes and do so.

  • -2

    Makes me wonder what the OP was doing for the last 30-40 years…

  • You need to put your dad's care first. Sell the house and pay for his needs from the proceeds, unless he can afford it out of his savings.

    Why are you not prioritising your dad's care over your own desire for a free house?

  • I work in aged care, pay now don't wait until New Aged Care Act rolls out in November - you won't be able to wait anyway. Goes without saying I am sorry for what you and your Dad is going through. Most comments on here already said it, but the refundable is just that, refundable, most providers have 2 weeks to refund the money back to the estate or your Dad if he discharged and still alive once they were given a written advice for moving out or probate (letter of administration from the estate in the event he passes away). Any day later than 2 weeks should incur interest back to the refundable monies - read the fine print and if it's a sizable sum then get a financial advisor - they range from $800+ if they worth any salt.

  • +1

    Hey OP. Sorry that you’re going through this and some of the harsh comments on here. I don’t have time to read all the comments since this post was from a while ago but some thoughts:

    • Does your dad have capacity for decision making? I.e is his cognition intact to the point he is able to make financial and lifestyle decisions that are in his interests? If not it might be worth looking at guardianship if he hasn’t already appointed your or someone else as his EPOA. Downside, if you force your dad into a position where he has to sell his house it may damage your relationship towards the end of his life.

    • have you looked into whether a reverse mortgage against the home cover the daily rate? If you are to be the sole beneficiary when he dies you’re effectively doing a reverse mortgage. If you’re not the sole beneficiary, and your Dad has capacity for decisions I would ensure either the other beneficiaries are contributing towards the daily fee or it is written into his will that you get a greater share of the inheritance when he passes away proportionate to what you spend in daily fees. Given your dad is putting you into this financial position through his choice not to sell his house it only fair that he appropriately compensates you for the costs you’re incurring.

    • presumably he has no other assets. In this scenario I thought the PPOR didn’t impact the pension for the first 2years living in a RACF (unless the rules have changed since I went through all this) and as such the pension will cover some of the daily fees.

    • can the house be cleaned out and rented out? Income pays some of the daily fees?

    Again, sorry that you’re going through this. Despite what others have said it’s not your responsibility to pay for your Dad’s care when he’s choosing to put himself in this position. You can choose to support him in this decision, but you don’t have to. No one else knows your family, personal situation or relationship with your dad. Consider what he would do if you literally didn’t have the money for the daily fee. Many people wouldn’t have the $ and then he would be forced to take responsibility for his own care.

    Not speaking to your situation at all, but I don’t think many of the people commenting on this post realise that not all older people are good people. I’m a health worker and see many families come through the hospital system before going into age care. Some old people are selfish and stubborn, others are flat out evil. I’ve seen families where the parents have been abusive (including sexual abuse) towards their children and are now expecting ongoing care and financial support from their offspring. Equally there’s offspring wanting to exploit older people for their cash and preventing them entering age care eg if they are living in the PPOR or accessing their parents pension. You do what’s right for you but at the end of the day, your dad should be considering the impact of his decisions on you and your family.

    • I’ve seen families where the parents have been abusive (including sexual abuse) towards their children and are now expecting ongoing care and financial support from their offspring. Equally there’s offspring wanting to exploit older people for their cash and preventing them entering age care eg if they are living in the PPOR or accessing their parents pension.

      So it goes both ways- there's bad parents and greedy offspring eyeing on easy money via inheritance windfall…

      • Yes, sometimes simultaneously.

  • shop around. dont bank on inheritance to fund your life.

  • Reverse mortgage.

  • +1

    You really need to get an independent assessment of your options. A free service offered by Centrelink is called the Financial Information Service. They are really good at cutting through the "noise" and providing you with a options. They will give you a written report outlining the financial ramifications of each option. Once you have the report, you could discuss it with your dad and move forward with a certain amount of confidence. Good luck

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